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Oil-rich Saudi Arabia accused of blocking Paris climate deal

By Strategist   2015 Dec 9, 2:07pm   8 links   11,920 views   37 comments   watch (1)   quote      

http://inhabitat.com/oil-rich-saudi-arabia-accused-of-blocking-paris-climate-deal/

Negotiators from developing countries have accused Saudi Arabia, a fossil-fuel superpower, of blocking progress at the Paris climate talks. “They are seeing the writing on the wall,” says Wael Hmaidan, the director of Climate Action Network International. “The world is changing and it’s making them very nervous.” Although specific rules have yet to be established, the climate talks present a breakthrough opportunity for a global shift away from fossil fuels. This prospect is concerning for Saudi Arabia, a nation that has built its powerful economy around its enormous oil reserves.

Comments 1-37 of 37     Last »

1   Strategist   2015 Dec 9, 2:12pm     ↑ like   ↓ dislike   quote    

I heard over the weekend the Saudi students who come to the US get about $100,000 in spending money per annum. They don't bother to take our jobs, but love to take our lives.

2   Bigsby   2015 Dec 9, 4:33pm     ↑ like   ↓ dislike   quote    

Strategist says

I heard over the weekend the Saudi students who come to the US get about $100,000 in spending money per annum. They don't bother to take our jobs, but love to take our lives.

Care to offer some proof for that figure? As far as I'm aware, they get a very generous package, including a monthly stipend of a little below $2000. If you know differently, then feel free to provide a link. You keep blathering about changing the outlook of Muslims. What better way than having their most intelligent young people studying abroad? They will be some of the most influential members of their society. If a good number of them leave with more positive views of the West, are more open to the West, etc., then that should be viewed as a very good thing (even to you). But instead, here you are throwing out false figures and putting a negative spin on a clearly positive thing.

3   Strategist   2015 Dec 9, 5:48pm     ↑ like   ↓ dislike (1)   quote    

Bigsby says

Strategist says

I heard over the weekend the Saudi students who come to the US get about $100,000 in spending money per annum. They don't bother to take our jobs, but love to take our lives.

Care to offer some proof for that figure? As far as I'm aware, they get a very generous package, including a monthly stipend of a little below $2000. If you know differently, then feel free to provide a link.

I have no proof. I heard about it. Maybe it is the rich Saudis who give their spoilt rotten kids $100K in spending money.

Bigsby says

You keep blathering about changing the outlook of Muslims. What better way than having their most intelligent young people studying abroad? They will be some of the most influential members of their society. If a good number of them leave with more positive views of the West, are more open to the West, etc., then that should be viewed as a very good thing (even to you). But instead, here you are throwing out false figures and putting a negative spin on a clearly positive thing.

I actually agree with you. Studying in the West will be an overall positive. I'm just pissed at terrorism right now, and therefore I mock Muslims.
I hope you are watching CNN this second. Ali Herschi was on, very very critical of Islam. What do you think of Muslim women who criticize Islam and Muslims a lot more than someone like me?

4   Tenpoundbass   2015 Dec 9, 5:57pm     ↑ like   ↓ dislike (1)   quote    

Paris Climate talks?

More like Paris Climate con.

Who's the Dick dressed like an Icecicle?

5   Bigsby   2015 Dec 9, 6:21pm     ↑ like   ↓ dislike   quote    

Strategist says

I have no proof. I heard about it. Maybe it is the rich Saudis who give their spoilt rotten kids $100K in spending money.

So you mean you were just peddling made up shite.

Strategist says

I actually agree with you. Studying in the West will be an overall positive. I'm just pissed at terrorism right now, and therefore I mock Muslims.

I hope you are watching CNN this second. Ali Herschi was on, very very critical of Islam. What do you think of Muslim women who criticize Islam and Muslims a lot more than someone like me?

I'm an atheist. I'm no defender of religion. They can criticize all they like, but such criticism should be reasoned and constructive, something which I don't recall seeing from you.

6   Strategist   2015 Dec 9, 7:03pm     ↑ like   ↓ dislike   quote    

Bigsby says

Strategist says

I have no proof. I heard about it. Maybe it is the rich Saudis who give their spoilt rotten kids $100K in spending money.

So you mean you were just peddling made up shite.

I never make things up.

Bigsby says

Strategist says

I actually agree with you. Studying in the West will be an overall positive. I'm just pissed at terrorism right now, and therefore I mock Muslims.


I hope you are watching CNN this second. Ali Herschi was on, very very critical of Islam. What do you think of Muslim women who criticize Islam and Muslims a lot more than someone like me?

I'm an atheist. I'm no defender of religion. They can criticize all they like, but such criticism should be reasoned and constructive, something which I don't recall seeing from you.

No criticism has to be reasoned and constructive on the internet, especially when criticizing terrorism and Islamic sharia laws. Those who support terrorism and sharia laws will not understand reason and constructive criticism. Humiliating them and treating them as the outcasts they are, is what will make them ashamed of being Muslims. Respecting their beliefs as some demand only encourages the extremists. The eventual goal is to get the followers of this rotten and dangerous religion to start differentiating between right and wrong. Humiliating and mocking their beliefs is just one prong of a multi pronged approach.
As a die hard atheist I fully understand that all religions have negatives and problems, but nothing comes close to what we experience today from Islam. 1.6 billion people who cannot contribute to a better world is a waste of human resources. We need every human regardless of their background to get the maximum possible education and skills they are capable of, to further their well being and the well being of all humans.

7   Bigsby   2015 Dec 9, 7:08pm     ↑ like   ↓ dislike   quote    

Strategist says

Those who support terrorism and sharia laws will not understand reason and constructive criticism. Humiliating them and treating them as the outcasts they are, is what will make them ashamed of being Muslims.

I'd laugh if I didn't think you were actually being serious.

8   Strategist   2015 Dec 9, 7:16pm     ↑ like   ↓ dislike   quote    

Bigsby says

Strategist says

Those who support terrorism and sharia laws will not understand reason and constructive criticism. Humiliating them and treating them as the outcasts they are, is what will make them ashamed of being Muslims.

I'd laugh if I didn't think you were actually being serious.

Here is the bottom line atheists and even some religious folks may all agree on:
We want a world that is peaceful prosperous and progressive, based on science, without the influence of religion.
Do you agree Islam is the number one barrier to that scenario? And how would you go about achieving that goal, wether or not you agree Islam is a barrier to that goal?

9   Bigsby   2015 Dec 9, 7:38pm     ↑ like   ↓ dislike   quote    

Strategist says

Here is the bottom line atheists and even some religious folks may all agree on:

We want a world that is peaceful prosperous and progressive, based on science, without the influence of religion.

Do you agree Islam is the number one barrier to that scenario? And how would you go about achieving that goal, wether or not you agree Islam is a barrier to that goal?

You are never going to get a world free of religion. It quite clearly appeals to the needs of a great many people, so it is a redundant point. You think that 'humiliating and treating (them) as outcasts' will stop fundamentalism. That is simply moronic. You may have noticed that they don't care what the likes of you and I say or think, and no doubt the sort of policies you would support would probably increase the number of people joining Daesh, so perhaps a little more thought and a bit less knee-jerk bluster would be a good thing.

10   Strategist   2015 Dec 9, 8:11pm     ↑ like   ↓ dislike   quote    

Bigsby says

You are never going to get a world free of religion. It quite clearly appeals to the needs of a great many people, so it is a redundant point. You think that 'humiliating and treating (them) as outcasts' will stop fundamentalism. That is simply moronic. You may have noticed that they don't care what the likes of you and I say or think, and no doubt the sort of policies you would support would probably increase the number of people joining Daesh, so perhaps a little more thought and a bit less knee-jerk bluster would be a good thing.

What's your solution?

11   Bigsby   2015 Dec 9, 8:25pm     ↑ like   ↓ dislike   quote    

Strategist says

What's your solution?

My solution? Come on Strategist, it is an immensely complex, multi-layered problem that is going to take cooperation from all sides to even begin to address. It's blatantly obvious however, that Trump's blustering nonsense isn't the answer. In fact, his plans would very likely make the situation worse.

12   Bigsby   2015 Dec 9, 8:32pm     ↑ like   ↓ dislike   quote    

Yeah, because in CIC's world a short post on an internet forum is obviously going to offer a quick solution to something that doesn't have a quick solution. Why not just get back to your crayons CIC and give your tiresome interjections a rest?

13   Strategist   2015 Dec 9, 8:40pm     ↑ like   ↓ dislike   quote    

Bigsby says

Strategist says

What's your solution?

My solution? Come on Strategist, it is an immensely complex, multi-layered problem that is going to take cooperation from all sides to even begin to address. It's blatantly obvious however, that Trump's blustering nonsense isn't the answer. In fact, his plans would very likely make the situation worse.

You have identified a lot of problems related to Islamic terrorism, but not having a solution will not give you the authority to oppose extremist reactions from the other end of the spectrum. So far the "nice guy" solutions have not worked, which is why I support humiliating those who support terrorism and the sharia laws.
Your arguments and the points you have made were pretty impressive. I urge you to introduce a possible solution.

14   Bigsby   2015 Dec 9, 8:43pm     ↑ like   ↓ dislike   quote    

Strategist says

You have identified a lot of problems related to Islamic terrorism, but not having a solution will not give you the authority to oppose extremist reactions from the other end of the spectrum. So far the "nice guy" solutions have not worked, which is why I support humiliating those who support terrorism and the sharia laws.

Nice guy solutions? Your country has been bombing the hell out of Muslim countries for the better part of 15 years. What has happened to the growth in fundamentalism during that period? And your solution is to ramp it up further? And you 'support humiliating those who support terrorism and the sharia laws.' How do you propose doing that, and what exactly do you expect the outcome of it to be?

15   Strategist   2015 Dec 9, 8:44pm     ↑ like   ↓ dislike   quote    

Bigsby says

Yeah, because in CIC's world a short post on an internet forum is obviously going to offer a quick solution to something that doesn't have a quick solution. Why not just get back to your crayons CIC and give your tiresome interjections a rest?

We need a quick solution. The average Muslims who have nothing to do with extremism are the ones who will take the brunt of an angry and fearful populace bent on discriminating anything that is Islamic.

16   Strategist   2015 Dec 9, 8:49pm     ↑ like   ↓ dislike   quote    

Bigsby says

Strategist says

You have identified a lot of problems related to Islamic terrorism, but not having a solution will not give you the authority to oppose extremist reactions from the other end of the spectrum. So far the "nice guy" solutions have not worked, which is why I support humiliating those who support terrorism and the sharia laws.

Nice guy solutions? Your country has been bombing the hell out of Muslim countries for the better part of 15 years. What has happened to the growth in fundamentalism during that period? And your solution is to ramp it up further?

Oh boy, and I thought you were smart. Islamic terrorism is worldwide. I don't need to repeat the facts, so stop blaming the infidels when Islam is the root cause of all terrorism.

17   Bigsby   2015 Dec 9, 8:50pm     ↑ like   ↓ dislike   quote    

Strategist says

We need a quick solution.

It doesn't exist. Your country is sporadically touched by terrorism. You've had one huge attack and smaller ones carried out by one or two people, in a number of cases from within a single family. How exactly do you propose finding a solution for that? You can't. That is the simple answer. You may never be able to. We in the West might simply have lived through one of the most peaceful periods in human existence, and things might go down hill from here in all respects - it's quite possible given the world's population, diminishing resources, massive pollution, climate change, pooling of wealth in the hands of a few, likely enormous future unemployment with the adoption of robots, and on and on the list goes. It's not necessarily a recipe for a particularly bright future.

18   Strategist   2015 Dec 9, 8:51pm     ↑ like   ↓ dislike   quote    

Bigsby says

And your solution is to ramp it up further? And you 'support humiliating those who support terrorism and the sharia laws.' How do you propose doing that, and what exactly do you expect the outcome of it to be?

I expect Muslims to realize what the rest of the world thinks of their barbaric religion, and hopefully have some good good rub off on them.

19   Bigsby   2015 Dec 9, 8:55pm     ↑ like   ↓ dislike   quote    

Strategist says

Nice guy solutions? Your country has been bombing the hell out of Muslim countries for the better part of 15 years. What has happened to the growth in fundamentalism during that period? And your solution is to ramp it up further?

Oh boy, and I thought you were smart. Islamic terrorism is worldwide. I don't need to repeat the facts, so stop blaming the infidels when Islam is the root cause of all terrorism.

My point seems to have flown right over your head. You want to ramp up the 'tough guy' approach as your solution. The US has bombed multiple countries and it has done nothing to reduce fundamentalism. And if you can't wrap your head around the fact that the approach works in the favour of the likes of Daesh, then there is nothing much to discuss with you. It has clearly inflamed the situation - there's a big difference between saying that and arguing that it caused it. Even you should be able to understand that.

20   Bigsby   2015 Dec 9, 8:56pm     ↑ like   ↓ dislike   quote    

Strategist says

I expect Muslims to realize what the rest of the world thinks of their barbaric religion, and hopefully have some good good rub off on them.

Oh, right, because nothing has been said about their religion for the last 1400 years. I see.

21   Strategist   2015 Dec 9, 9:01pm     ↑ like   ↓ dislike   quote    

Bigsby says

Strategist says

We need a quick solution.

It doesn't exist. Your country is sporadically touched by terrorism. You've had one huge attack and smaller ones carried out by one or two people, in a number of cases from within a single family. How exactly do you propose finding a solution for that? You can't. That is the simple answer. You may never be able to. We in the West might simply have lived through one of the most peaceful periods in human existence, and things might go down hill from here

I'm concerned about the whole world, not just my country. I am a human being first. Look what this evil religion Islam did to Yazidi women, while the whole world watched giving lip service. It makes me sick.
My solution to controlling Islam has been steadfast over the years:
A united world.
Kill every terrorist you can.
Puppet governments in every Muslim country.
Islamic dictators that go after extremists without mercy.
The same dictators drastically changing what children learn about Islam.
When they are ready for democracy, elections.

22   Bigsby   2015 Dec 9, 9:03pm     ↑ like   ↓ dislike   quote    

Strategist says

A united world.

Kill every terrorist you can.

Puppet governments in every Muslim country.

Islamic dictators that go after extremists without mercy.

The same dictators drastically changing what children learn about Islam.

When they are ready for democracy, elections.

Good luck with that plan. Ever heard of a country called Egypt?

23   Strategist   2015 Dec 9, 9:08pm     ↑ like   ↓ dislike   quote    

Bigsby says

Strategist says

A united world.


Kill every terrorist you can.


Puppet governments in every Muslim country.


Islamic dictators that go after extremists without mercy.


The same dictators drastically changing what children learn about Islam.


When they are ready for democracy, elections.

Good luck with that plan.

I know. Our politicians call Islam a peaceful religion. Bow before their Wahabi Kings. As for a United world against Islam.....Selfish individual needs are chosen before the common good. Nevertheless it's a solution.

24   Strategist   2015 Dec 9, 9:10pm     ↑ like   ↓ dislike   quote    

Bigsby says

Strategist says

A united world.


Kill every terrorist you can.


Puppet governments in every Muslim country.


Islamic dictators that go after extremists without mercy.


The same dictators drastically changing what children learn about Islam.


When they are ready for democracy, elections.

Good luck with that plan. Ever heard of a country called Egypt?

Yup. All of my posts applied to Egypt to a certain point. See, we have a solution.

25   Bigsby   2015 Dec 9, 9:14pm     ↑ like   ↓ dislike   quote    

Strategist says

Yup. All of my posts applied to Egypt to a certain point. See, we have a solution.

What? Your points apply to Egypt and they STILL have a serious terrorist problem. Your ideas aren't solutions.

It's a belief system you are dealing with. You can't overcome that unless there is a sea change in the outlook of those drawn to fundamentalism, and you don't get that from brutality and oppression. When did Christianity suddenly change from the inquisition to most people paying lip service to it when it suits them? The answer is that it didn't. It was a long drawn out process over centuries. Whether there will be a change with the more extreme beliefs held by some in Islam I have no idea, but it won't happen at the end of a gun that is for sure.

26   Bigsby   2015 Dec 9, 9:19pm     ↑ like   ↓ dislike   quote    

Obviously you are the biggest troll on here CIC. Now jog on and play your childish games with Dan.

27   Strategist   2015 Dec 9, 9:26pm     ↑ like   ↓ dislike   quote    

Bigsby says

Strategist says

Yup. All of my posts applied to Egypt to a certain point. See, we have a solution.

What? Your points apply to Egypt and they STILL have a serious terrorist problem. Your ideas aren't solutions.

No, they work. We had Sadat and Mubarak, cold blooded dictators who kept Islamists in check. When foolish Obama decided not to support him, we ended up with the Muslim Brotherhood in control. Thank God for Israel bringing back a lesser of the evils dictator to power. We just don't learn from our mistakes. When the Shah of Iran was in charge, Iran was progressing, and the extremists were kept in check. Foolish Carter changed all that, and Khomeini came to power. It was no different when stupid Bush supported elections for the Palestinians, which resulted in Hamas coming to power. The same for Libya, Iraq, Syria and every other Islamic country. Muslims are not ready for democracy, giving them an opportunity to vote only brings the Islamists to power, who end up putting democracy in the grave.

28   Bigsby   2015 Dec 9, 9:29pm     ↑ like   ↓ dislike   quote    

Strategist says

No, they work. We had Sadat and Mubarak, cold blooded dictators who kept Islamists in check.

Yeah, tell that to the 62 tourists massacred in Luxor in 1997.

29   Strategist   2015 Dec 9, 9:30pm     ↑ like   ↓ dislike   quote    

Ironman says

Hey Strat, why do you waste your time with Bigs? He's the BIGGEST fucking Troll on Patnet. Tell him to go argue with Gary, that's more of his level!

I actually like some of the points Bigs and Bob seem to make. I'm helping them see the folly of their ways.

30   Strategist   2015 Dec 9, 9:34pm     ↑ like   ↓ dislike   quote    

Bigsby says

Strategist says

No, they work. We had Sadat and Mubarak, cold blooded dictators who kept Islamists in check.

Yeah, tell that to the 62 tourists massacred in Luxor in 1997.

Imagine all of Egypt as ISIS. Going back 18 years to present a terrorist act is a hell of a lot better than what is happening in Syria on a daily basis.

31   Bigsby   2015 Dec 9, 9:35pm     ↑ like   ↓ dislike   quote    

Strategist says

I actually like some of the points Bigs and Bob seem to make. I'm helping them see the folly of their ways.

I wouldn't waste your time trying to explain something to CIC. He's not interested. His only reason for being on here is to do his tiresomely repetitive little trolling escapades as you well know.

32   Bigsby   2015 Dec 9, 9:38pm     ↑ like   ↓ dislike   quote    

Strategist says

Imagine all of Egypt as ISIS. Going back 18 years to present a terrorist act is a hell of a lot better than what is happening in Syria on a daily basis.

And you think it's solely about Syria? If it wasn't Syria, it would be something or somewhere else. The US attacks and the attacks in the West aren't a product of Syria. And those attacks wouldn't have been stopped by your 'plan.'

33   Strategist   2015 Dec 9, 9:43pm     ↑ like   ↓ dislike   quote    

Bigsby says

Strategist says

Imagine all of Egypt as ISIS. Going back 18 years to present a terrorist act is a hell of a lot better than what is happening in Syria on a daily basis.

And you think it's solely about Syria? If it wasn't Syria, it would be something or somewhere else. The US attacks and the attacks in the West aren't a product of Syria. And those attacks wouldn't have been stopped by your 'plan.'

US bombing is not the cause of worldwide Islamic terrorism, but the result of Islamic terrorism. Even Islamic countries go after the worst scum bags, but no one complains about the bombing they do.

34   Bigsby   2015 Dec 9, 9:47pm     ↑ like   ↓ dislike (1)   quote    

Strategist says

US bombing is not the cause of worldwide Islamic terrorism, but the result of Islamic terrorism. Even Islamic countries go after the worst scum bags, but no one complains about the bombing they do.

So what? Are you denying that it has inflamed the situation? And which Islamic countries have done the kind of bombing that the US has done? And even if they had done the same, you must be able to understand how they would create distinct reactions in the Islamic world.

35   resistance   2015 Dec 9, 9:56pm     ↑ like   ↓ dislike   quote    

Bigsby says

you must be able to understand how they would create distinct reactions

bigsby "understands" terrorism as a "reaction".

sounds damn near approving of it, no?

if so, i hope you get to enjoy terrorism up close and personal.

36   Bigsby   2015 Dec 9, 10:30pm     ↑ like   ↓ dislike (1)   quote    

And where did I say that? The reaction is one against outside (non-Muslim) nations getting involved in regional affairs. That is a reaction of all Muslims. That reaction is different when it is done by regional (Muslim) nations - hardly surprising. And I repeat - I said that the bombings (and wars) have inflamed the situation. There is an obvious difference between that and what you just claimed. But hey, it's becoming typical of the direction of this forum that you would post such a response.

Anyway, as you don't seem to read your emails, I'll ask you here (once again) to close my account - I have a habit of getting drawn back with it still working and as I dislike the developing tone of this place, it is best I stop posting.

Thanks for the housing stuff in the past. It's a shame I can't say the same for your highly distasteful final comment.

37   bob2356   2015 Dec 10, 6:43am     ↑ like (1)   ↓ dislike   quote    

Strategist says

US bombing is not the cause of worldwide Islamic terrorism, but the result of Islamic terrorism.

Really? The US has been bombing and shelling in the middle east since lebanon in 1982. When was the rise in world wide islamic terrorism? Britain was bombing in the middle east since 1920 and they specifically hit civilian targets. Hugh Trenchard chief of the RAF and believe or not Winston Churchill came with the idea of policing the empire "on the cheap" by bombing civilians to destroy moral. Iraq, Churchill stated, provided the opportunity to "carry out a far-sighted policy of Imperial aerial development in the future." Considering the amount of civilian bombing in WWII it was very a far sighted policy. BTW Churchill preferred poison gas as he considered it more human than bombs. http://www.worldfuturefund.org/wffmaster/Reading/war.crimes/World.war.2/Air.Control.htm

Western policy in the middle east since WWI has been to protect and exploit the oil. Do you think anyone in the middle east isn't aware of that? Do you think that there is anyone in the middle east that isn't aware that the US has been the number one supporter and enabler of the most brutal fundamentalist regime in the world that is the largest source by far of exporting terrorism? We are both paying for the terrorism and inciting it.

Strategist says

My solution to controlling Islam has been steadfast over the years:
A united world.
Kill every terrorist you can.
Puppet governments in every Muslim country.
Islamic dictators that go after extremists without mercy.
The same dictators drastically changing what children learn about Islam.
When they are ready for democracy, elections.

Funny, that's exactly what's been done since the 1950's. Who put all in all the puppet dictators over the years in the first place? How's it working out so far? Very interesting you said controlling islam, not controlling islamic terror. Possibly that's why your solution is actually part of the problem. "Strategists" in policy positions with no clue what they are talking about or doing have been trying to control islam for a long time. Now it's blowing up.

Maybe, more like very likely, a critical mass of anger and chaos has been reached and there is no solution. The west screwed it up and now there is no way to put humpty dumpty back together. It took 100 years of bad policy and exploitation to reach this point. I doubt if it can be fixed any quicker.

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