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  ThreeBays   ignore (0)   2019 Feb 10, 11:57am   ↑ like (0)   ↓ dislike (0)   quote   flag        

B.A.C.A.H. says
I just could not make it pencil out. I kept the money in my FDIC insured bank deposit, not sure what to do...


Makes sense. My friend got his installed about a year ago. We penciled the return at 17.1% of invested capital per year. That seems darn good for a tax free return in this current environment. With my tax rates, $3000 dividend is only $1500 after-tax.
  ThreeBays   ignore (0)   2019 Feb 10, 12:34pm   ↑ like (0)   ↓ dislike (0)   quote   flag        

B.A.C.A.H. says
I have some friends with rooftop solar. If they care about the environment, or they want to have a Status Symbol on their rooftop, or if they want to provide economic stimulus for the jobs they provide, then God Bless Them All, Mister Scrooge. But, "INVESTMENT?" Hahahahaha!


What's funny? Yes you can care about the environment and be better off economically too - unless your solar friends are the kind of come-to-your home high pressure types where half of your installation cost goes to pay the middle men.

Investing in stocks the risk is certainly higher than the sun shining, and I would bet that you have a lot more capital in your taxable dividend yielding stocks than I have in my roof solar.
  ThreeBays   ignore (0)   2019 Feb 10, 1:55pm   ↑ like (2)   ↓ dislike (0)   quote   flag        

B.A.C.A.H. says
Folks rationalizing to me, what a Savvy Investment they made on their rooftop, sounds so much like folks rationalizing the Time Shares they have. Only once did a Solar Homeowner, a retiree in the Walnut Creek area, share with me any downside. When I was considering getting one a bit more than a decade ago, he said he was overall pleased with it . He also told me that he noticed a loss in efficiency / generation of it over time. He said if he went up on the roof and washed off the dust and bird poop he'd regain MOST of the lost capacity. As it turned out, they sold the home and moved to Vegas, "Sunk Capital" on his rooftop.


I shared some real examples with you that you might find useful, take it or leave it.

Our situation was pretty simple. We spent $1800 a year on electric. I already went around with a Kill-a-Watt to cut what I could, and I have a gas dryer so that wasn't even included, but charging the car was included. We also did not have AC at the time, but the temps were getting damn hot in SJ. Adding and using AC would have added $400~500 more I would guess but we wanted to do it, so we went ahead and installed AC, plus a $12k solar system with 25 year warranties on all the parts. I nearly installed it myself since it seemed like an interesting project but in the end just went with an installer that seemed reasonable. Now we don't feel bad to use the AC when we feel like it, and our PGE electric cost is just the minimum delivery charge, which is $120 a year. The economics looked good. We considered the risks of moving, etc. That's a very individual thing to determine.

You can always argue that you could sweat instead of getting an AC.

It's very individual and YMMV. As mentioned, my marginal tax rate on investment income is also a factor. Fed + CA + NIIT = 50.1% tax. If I calculate $2100 savings on PGE, I would need $4200 in dividend income to equal that. $4200 dividend, $12000 investment. Pretty good. Oh, but it's a depreciating asset. Suppose I needed to sell the home, and oh crap nobody wants to give $0 for my solar (even though it's worth $2100 per year...). At a minimum, I can recoup capital gains taxes on the cost basis - so $4,356.

I talked to our neighbors that got their system installed for $0 from SolarCity and they were happy they were saving a few cents on their rates. We talked about the economics and buying outright instead of getting a PPA. Buying worked out better in the long haul, but they said if they had $10,000 to spare they would spend it on a better truck rather than solar. Fair enough. To me that's spending more money on electrons and on a truck I don't need. Most people don't think of all the financial details, or just don't have the wherewithal to be in a position to plan for the long haul.
  ThreeBays   ignore (0)   2019 Feb 10, 8:39pm   ↑ like (0)   ↓ dislike (0)   quote   flag        

B.A.C.A.H. says

Ahem, the federal rate on Ordinary Dividends is 15%. If you have a high income, 18.8% with the Obamacare surtax. The top California rate for most of us is 9.3%. 18.8 + 9.3 = 28.1%. Not 50%.


Thanks, you're right. Well, Ordinary Dividends are taxed like regular income - but what I think you meant is Qualified Dividends which are taxed at 15% or 20% depending on your income level.
  ThreeBays   ignore (0)   2019 Feb 11, 1:17pm   ↑ like (0)   ↓ dislike (0)   quote   flag        

There's a dangerous amount of truth in this OP.
  ThreeBays   ignore (0)   2019 Feb 11, 8:38pm   ↑ like (0)   ↓ dislike (0)   quote   flag        

So Hircus says
OccasionalCortex says
Yeah, so? We'll just walk away when the time comes. Sucks to be the People's Bank of China, eh?


Surprising to most people, we don't owe much to China.




Most of our debt is owed to ourself.


$8 trillion owned by Fed & Government?

  ThreeBays   ignore (0)   2019 Feb 12, 10:40am   ↑ like (0)   ↓ dislike (0)   quote   flag        

Tenpoundbass says
I bought a 12 X 20 Tuff Shed for my backyard with my Tax refund. That's on top of getting an extra $120 every biweekly paycheck.

The Shed will be great, insulated electric outlets customized windows and doors. I'm moving my Man Cave/Office/Studio out there. The family is growing and we need my room inside the house.

Thanks Donald Trump! Good looking out!


Sounds like daddy's not too good with the numbers. Next time adjust your W4 to withhold less.
  ThreeBays   ignore (0)   2019 Feb 12, 2:37pm   ↑ like (0)   ↓ dislike (0)   quote   flag        

So he got the message, gov shutdown Bad?
  ThreeBays   ignore (0)   2019 Feb 13, 11:03am   ↑ like (0)   ↓ dislike (0)   quote   flag        

I'll just drop this here.

Driving 10 year old ICE car
Depreciation $1500
Maintenance $1500
Insurance $1000
Fuel $2000
TCO = $6000 / year

New 2018 LEAF SV w/ tech package
$500 down + 300/month - $2500 CVRP rebate - $800 PGE rebate = $7700 for 3 years, so ~$2600/year
Lease $2600
Maintenance $0
Insurance $1000
Fuel $400
TCO = $4000 / year
  ThreeBays   ignore (0)   2019 Feb 13, 9:10pm   ↑ like (0)   ↓ dislike (0)   quote   flag        

ForcedTQ says
2018 Leaf @ 3.75 m/kWh: $400/yr = 6,976.74 miles/yr @ $0.215/kWh


The older car I was using as reference didn't get 30MPG, more like 22MPG. I factor 10c per kWh, which is what you can get at night with EV rates. $400 / 0.1 * 3.75 = 15000 miles/yr. Let's not mention that many big employers offer free charging.

ForcedTQ says
Taking money from other taxpayers/ratepayers to finance your new car just causes taxes and rates to rise, and is fucking THEFT!


So does billions of subsidies to oil companies and car companies, and write-offs for other shit. I don't really give a crap if you don't like this particular tax benefit.

  ThreeBays   ignore (0)   2019 Feb 13, 9:42pm   ↑ like (0)   ↓ dislike (0)   quote   flag        

ForcedTQ says
Where exactly are you taking delivery of electricity? PG&E minimum EV-B rate for off peak is $0.12452/kWh. 12,046 miles/yr, if you limit your charging to 11pm to 7am. You're getting free electricity to charge your vehicle from work? Bully for you!


Yeah. I gave you realistic figures. 12k miles is what I do per year. Average price of gas in 2018 was over 3.50 as well.
  ThreeBays   ignore (0)   2019 Feb 14, 8:28pm   ↑ like (0)   ↓ dislike (0)   quote   flag        

B.A.C.A.H. says
Dude, where are you buying your gas? Are you buying 87 octane or 91?


87, from Moe's stop is pretty cheap. I was quoting average Bay Area prices.

ForcedTQ says
But we must pony up over $2k for the extra meter for the privilege of the EV rate.


You don't need a separate meter, just EV-A plan.
  ThreeBays   ignore (0)   2019 Feb 14, 8:40pm   ↑ like (0)   ↓ dislike (0)   quote   flag        

ForcedTQ says
It's not hard to understand this stuff, I get it quite well. Cherry picking data during a period of ownership and saying, well fuck, I didn't have to deal with it, while disregarding what will happen to resale price due to depreciation is ridiculous.


It's why I said lease. I've owned 3 EVs. The first was an old LEAF, with a cost of $160 a month inc tax. Practically almost a free car after factoring in savings on fuel. Why lease? New tech which would be obsoleted soon. Degradation over the long haul. HOV stickers expire after a few years.

Tesla is not going to be obsolete so soon, so that's worth buying if you're in the market for luxury cars.
  ThreeBays   ignore (0)   2019 Feb 15, 9:23am   ↑ like (0)   ↓ dislike (0)   quote   flag        

Rin says
So in a two year bear market toilet, you've just expanded your holdings from a meager 500 shares to almost 600. That's like being able to grow a business by 20% by doing 0 work for it. Even investing in a McDonald's franchise can't compete against that.

And since no bear market lasts forever, eventually, you'll get back to $82 per share but with many more shares under your belt and a greater equity stake plus dividend payout.


I'm not directly familiar with this strategy, but how does it compare to just holding the market?
  ThreeBays   ignore (0)   2019 Feb 16, 11:43am   ↑ like (0)   ↓ dislike (1)   quote   flag        

Gas should be $10 a gallon to pay for the environmental cost, and accelerate the switch to EVs and renewables.

I think this could be possible in 3-4 years, not all at once but starting, as EV prices reach parity with ICE. The Auto industry will make the switch to EV and will be happy to endorse these hikes as well, to get people to buy new cars.
  ThreeBays   ignore (0)   2019 Feb 18, 3:15pm   ↑ like (0)   ↓ dislike (0)   quote   flag        

Quigley says
Elgatouno says
Pelosi didn't surrender to Trump.


She proved that she would rather let Federal employees become homeless slaves, let people on welfare starve, and let the nation burn before she would give Trump the tiniest bit of a win.

And they say that Trump is deranged.
Fine leaders you people pick!


Can't you say exactly the same thing about Trump?
  ThreeBays   ignore (0)   2019 Feb 19, 9:00am   ↑ like (1)   ↓ dislike (0)   quote   flag        

MrMagic says
the Boomers saved, scrimped and put money away to pay for their bills in retirement


ROFL... almost spilled my milkshake.
  ThreeBays   ignore (0)   2019 Feb 19, 9:18am   ↑ like (0)   ↓ dislike (0)   quote   flag        

Boomers should embrace real Nordic capitalism:

√Ąttestupa (Swedish for kin/clan precipice) is the mythical practice of senicide during Nordic prehistoric times, where elderly people are said to have thrown themselves, or were thrown, to their deaths. According to legend, this was done when old people were unable to support themselves or assist in a household. Though there are many places in the Nordic countries that are said to have been used as √§ttestupa, it is now thought that the notion of √§ttestupa is a persistent myth.
  ThreeBays   ignore (0)   2019 Feb 19, 11:18pm   ↑ like (2)   ↓ dislike (0)   quote   flag        

GM stock hasn't been going anywhere for a while and now they're in a down cycle. I don't really expect much gain from here. 4% dividend is good if you're retired, not before.
  ThreeBays   ignore (0)   2019 Feb 19, 11:30pm   ↑ like (1)   ↓ dislike (0)   quote   flag        

Buying 4 to 6 years ago sure beats renting today.
  ThreeBays   ignore (0)   2019 Feb 20, 12:15am   ↑ like (0)   ↓ dislike (0)   quote   flag        

That's exactly why most British people dislike Trump.
  ThreeBays   ignore (0)   2019 Feb 21, 2:52am   ↑ like (0)   ↓ dislike (0)   quote   flag        

Patrick says
Of course the ETF also fell by 10% to compensate. I got a check for my 10%, which you might think makes it all fine, but then I owed tax on that.


Seems pretty normal, paying a dividend instantly reduces the value of the stock. Without that one could just farm stocks that are about to pay dividends and then sell.

From a tax point of view the dividend would be a wash with your capital loss.

Dividends are just less tax efficient in general.
  ThreeBays   ignore (0)   2019 Feb 21, 4:37pm   ↑ like (1)   ↓ dislike (0)   quote   flag        

LoL, way to troll Hillary.
  ThreeBays   ignore (0)   2019 Feb 21, 8:24pm   ↑ like (0)   ↓ dislike (0)   quote   flag        

Is there any reference to Japan using this trend as justification for more coal plants? Nope, there is not.

This is little more than an opinion piece, from a clearly biased source, based on cherry-picked data. Here's the long term trend from the data which they referenced.

  ThreeBays   ignore (0)   2019 Feb 21, 8:56pm   ↑ like (0)   ↓ dislike (0)   quote   flag        

Tenpoundbass says
This one is a Goddamn lie there isn't even any data for 1975 as the earliest UAH Sat data is from 1992
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/UAH_satellite_temperature_dataset


Oh really? Where does it say that?

Here's some reading comprehension for you. Wikipedia says "Each set has data back to December 1978".

Their website with data back to 1978: https://www.nsstc.uah.edu/climate/

  ThreeBays   ignore (0)   2019 Feb 22, 9:39am   ↑ like (0)   ↓ dislike (0)   quote   flag        

Tenpoundbass says
ThreeBays says


The Troposphere just expelled the built up trapped heat, and brought us the Polar Vortex and a Hate Hoax.
You should expect a downward trend from here.


Just ignore that your "facts" were busted, and spew more unscientific garbage.

#deplorables
  ThreeBays   ignore (0)   2019 Feb 24, 9:24pm   ↑ like (1)   ↓ dislike (0)   quote   flag        

Price increases plus rising interest rates make it not only tough for new homeowners to buy, but also for owners to want to move.

Consider an owner that bought a starter home in the past decade, and had prices go up 50 to 100% since. Or a longer time owner with even larger increases. For this owner in CA, moving is very expensive and increases ongoing costs substantially. Majority won't want to move and sell right now, just ppl retiring out of major metros in CA, or those that are so rich they just don't care to lose a few hundred thousand on moving.
  ThreeBays   ignore (0)   2019 Feb 25, 4:21pm   ↑ like (0)   ↓ dislike (0)   quote   flag        

Free speech means being an ASSHOLE is not going to be prosecuted by the law, but it doesn't mean people, including companies, can't refuse to do business with you.
  ThreeBays   ignore (0)   2019 Feb 25, 9:30pm   ↑ like (2)   ↓ dislike (0)   quote   flag        

Instead of you" we should use "my right honourable friend".

The right honourable friend is correct, housing is a trap.

It must be said that my right honourable friend is uglier than a horse's arse.

See, respectful, and funny.
  ThreeBays   ignore (0)   2019 Feb 25, 11:44pm   ↑ like (0)   ↓ dislike (0)   quote   flag        

lostand confused says
You and your is so transphobic-it should be they and theirs!


My right honourable friend is mistaken. You and your are gender-neutral.
  ThreeBays   ignore (0)   2019 Feb 27, 11:10pm   ↑ like (0)   ↓ dislike (0)   quote   flag        

CBOEtrader says
4.6% is big money?


4.6/1.0= 460%, trader...
  ThreeBays   ignore (0)   2019 Feb 28, 8:04pm   ↑ like (1)   ↓ dislike (0)   quote   flag        

Great, all we need is to have longer government shutdowns to cause contractions, then reopen and boom - claim record winning!

It's like rewarding coders for the number of bugs they fix.

  ThreeBays   ignore (0)   2019 Feb 28, 9:15pm   ↑ like (1)   ↓ dislike (0)   quote   flag        

The new Model 3 Standard Range+ looks really good. Autopilot is also down to $3k now. That feature has made my commutes so much less unpleasant.
  ThreeBays   ignore (0)   2019 Feb 28, 11:06pm   ↑ like (0)   ↓ dislike (0)   quote   flag        

I've never bought used cars. I could save some money, but for me I don't like the trade off.

Cars expensive to run. Gas, insurance, taxes, maintenance, tires... you may spend $3000~4000 a year before counting any depreciation at all. Let's say hypothetically I can own a used car with $2000 depreciation or a brand new car with $3000 depreciation. All costs included, the used car saves 15 to 20% overall if we ignore that the used car may cost more to maintain.

For me personally, I'll pay the slight premium in order to get a new car, get more enjoyment from it, and take care of rather than risk getting a used model that may have been treated badly.
  ThreeBays   ignore (0)   2019 Mar 2, 9:18am   ↑ like (1)   ↓ dislike (0)   quote   flag        

Patrick says
The left, and the left alone, created Trump and got him elected.


What else stupid will the right do, that's the lefts fault? Isn't the right supposed to be the party of self responsibility?
  ThreeBays   ignore (0)   2019 Mar 3, 11:49pm   ↑ like (0)   ↓ dislike (0)   quote   flag        

Prius owners aren't going to be ambassadors for Tesla, that's a given. Tesla is already outselling the Prius, by a lot, so it doesn't really matter what a few think.. I expect EVs will continue to grow exponentially from here. All the automakers roadmaps are focused on EVs.


Who the heck uses the term "livery"? That's archaic.
  ThreeBays   ignore (0)   2019 Mar 4, 7:38am   ↑ like (0)   ↓ dislike (0)   quote   flag        

I want The Rock to run.
  ThreeBays   ignore (0)   2019 Mar 4, 3:46pm   ↑ like (0)   ↓ dislike (0)   quote   flag        

Yay, people suck at estimating their taxes!

Since markets tanked near the end of the year I would expect people to have overestimated their gains. Also, if you have a big refund coming then you want to file early.
  ThreeBays   ignore (0)   2019 Mar 4, 10:31pm   ↑ like (1)   ↓ dislike (0)   quote   flag        

Tesla has hit the $35k price point, reduced the price of the very popular Auto pilot feature, and are unveiling the Model Y this month. I'm tempted to buy.
  ThreeBays   ignore (0)   2019 Mar 11, 4:05pm   ↑ like (3)   ↓ dislike (0)   quote   flag        

Now he's paying for dinner to look normal, and not even getting any.
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