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Patrick.net is DOOMed


By LarryPatrickMaloney   Follow   Wed, 12 Oct 2011, 2:14pm PDT   20,132 views   198 comments
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I've been a fan of patrick.net, since 2006 or 2007? The early days.

I have seen a tragic downturn in the quantity, and quality of real estate postings over the past few months.

Every day, it's 70-80% of left leaning, political rhetoric.

If Patrick doesn't mend his ways, this site will not remain a haven for real estate watchers, and will pass away.

Cheers,

Larry

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Serpentor   Wed, 12 Oct 2011, 2:57pm PDT   Share   Quote   Permalink   Like (3)   Dislike (1)     Comment 1

is that a threat? lol. who the fuck are you?

do you have data that says traffic is down, or is down due to the political leaning of the website owner? This is his site, he can do what he wants with it.

he doesn't censor our opinions, you have no right to tell him how to run his site.

Patrick   Wed, 12 Oct 2011, 3:03pm PDT   Share   Quote   Permalink   Like (2)   Dislike     Comment 2

Welcome back again Larry! Didn't you swear you'd never read my site again several times now?

I'm flattered you think my super-leftist powers are capable of changing the world! If not, why keep protesting?

My dirty secret (shhhh) is that I'm actually quite the little capitalist, but little capitalists like me and you have no chance against the big ones who defeat the free market every day and get bailouts when they fail in their rigged market anyway. Their secret? Lobbyists!

You don't have a lobbyist for yourself, do you? Didn't think so. HTF are you going to get anywhere on a playing field that's tilted about 89 degrees?

To quote myself from another thread:

There is no fact that will be acceptable to him unless it also allows him to join the ruling class. His reality will be instantly sorted into acceptable facts which promote his tiny but non-zero chance of being dominant, and unacceptable facts which threaten it.

The American Dream is to join that ruling class, and so the ruling class is admired, and seen as worthy of imitation, especially their refrain about the "liberty" to join.

But the ugly fact is that the ruling class is IN THE WAY of anyone else joining. They already have that position, and they're not about to give it up.

America has the highest wealth inequality and lowest social mobility of any industrialized country. Most wealth in America is inherited, not earned. Look it up. The ruling class is permanent, with few exceptions. But those exceptions are critical for gaining the near-religious support of their servants.

The reasoning goes something like "I must protect the ruling class, because I intend to join them one day." But in protecting them from the free market, fair taxation, and labor laws, he makes it nearly impossible for himself to join.

BTW the site is doing fine. Email subscriptions and forum traffic are way up.

Patrick   Wed, 12 Oct 2011, 3:38pm PDT   Share   Quote   Permalink   Like   Dislike     Comment 3

Some good background reading and viewing:

http://sociology.ucsc.edu/whorulesamerica/power/wealth.html

http://www.kotlikoff.net/sites/default/files/The%20Role%20of%20Intergenerational%20Transfers%20in%20Aggregate%20Capital%20Formation.pdf

http://www.youtube.com/watch?source=patrick.net&v=rsL6mKxtOlQ#watch-headline

LarryPatrickMaloney   Wed, 12 Oct 2011, 3:51pm PDT   Share   Quote   Permalink   Like   Dislike     Comment 4

Patrick,

I read a posting you made, about why you are left.

The problem is, your premise is wrong. The ruling class of our country is not the Republicans, or the right, it is the left.

All those bail outs when to Obama supporters, and financial institutions that bribe Washington (yes Lobbyists ) to pass and bias laws for themselves.

Like Michael Moore, your anger is justified, but it's just misdirected.

The true populist road, leads back to the constitution, and people like Ron Paul.

Many of your views are shared by people like me, and other Tea Party members, but you have fallen prey to the massive lies the left has spewed upon the minds of American thought for three generations.

gameisrigged   Wed, 12 Oct 2011, 6:56pm PDT   Share   Quote   Permalink   Like   Dislike     Comment 5

Oh no! The left is spewing all over our minds.

Taint Boil   Wed, 12 Oct 2011, 8:26pm PDT   Share   Quote   Permalink   Like (2)   Dislike     Comment 6

I check Patrick.net every day and I send a lot of traffic your way. Wink, wink via ZeroHedge. Keep up the good work.

pianist   Wed, 12 Oct 2011, 9:14pm PDT   Share   Quote   Permalink   Like   Dislike     Comment 7

I was attracted to your site because of my interest in RE, but became captivated by the political articles. However, as one who also comes from a "capitalist" persuasion, I might have dismissed your site as noise had I seen the left-leaning links ahead of RE news, as has been the case a few times. IMHO, today's (10/13/11) layout of links strikes a perfect balance for engaging a new visitor interested in RE, while at the same time giving us veterans some interesting "left-leaning political rhetoric." Thank you!

StoutFiles   Wed, 12 Oct 2011, 10:15pm PDT   Share   Quote   Permalink   Like (1)   Dislike     Comment 8

larrypatrickmaloney says

I have seen a tragic downturn in the quantity, and quality of real estate postings over the past few months.

Every day, it's 70-80% of left leaning, political rhetoric.

You could always build larry.net. There you could decide all the links and control all the forum topics.

bulletdodger   Wed, 12 Oct 2011, 10:17pm PDT   Share   Quote   Permalink   Like (2)   Dislike     Comment 9

(Exactly) what pianist said.

BD

Buster   Thu, 13 Oct 2011, 12:12am PDT   Share   Quote   Permalink   Like   Dislike (1)     Comment 10

Interesting thread. The way I see it, this thread mirrors the reality on the ground. Huge chunks of the 99% have been manipulated over the last 30 years to believe that they too can join the 1% if they play by the rules that they have cemented in. Problem is, the rules as they currently stand have warped beyond recognition what capitalism is all about. Now you simply have a system that rewards those who have with minimal to zero tax liability, no enforcement or watering down of financial laws and ethics, and public financial subsidization of the powerful when things go wrong but minimal wealth sharing when things go right. The body politic is finally waking up to the reality that they have helped create. They have consistently voted against their own self interests for 3 decades and the results are finally in. For full disclosure, and by any objective measure, I am in the 90-95% and I have never supported the likes of Larry or the right. I have never supported the corruption that exists on the right and to a lesser degree on the left or bs trickle down theories, etc. Follow the money and you will always receive the truth in return. The bottom 90% are 'doomed' unless they can turn this around quickly. It will not be pretty or easy trying to do so. This site may help lead the way back to rational and equitable playing fields. Keep on Patrick and site posters.

San Diego Renter   Thu, 13 Oct 2011, 12:17am PDT   Share   Quote   Permalink   Like   Dislike (1)     Comment 11

People have to be deprogrammed in this country. The left-right battle is a distraction - promoted by politicians and media, but counter-productive to almost everyone else. When it comes to crony capitalism, real conservatives are as offended as anyone. This is a fight that we all should be engaging in - on the same team (unless you happen to be on the Bush-Obama team).

http://www.capitalismwithoutfailure.com/2011/10/dear-occupy-wall-street-focus-on-people.html

Bunny Pumpkin   Thu, 13 Oct 2011, 12:53am PDT   Share   Quote   Permalink   Like   Dislike     Comment 12

Actually, I read it much less since Patrick turned into another Huffington Post knock-off. And I don't think he can stop this degradation... you gotta think for yourself, not parroting lefties.
I hope your business will take off, and also I hope they will over-tax you - maybe you'll finally wise up.

Sorry Patrick, but you off my bookmarks list - it was really good and original, but this site quickly turned into worthless propaganda megaphone...

PasadenaNative   Thu, 13 Oct 2011, 1:04am PDT   Share   Quote   Permalink   Like (1)   Dislike     Comment 13

Don't give in Patrick, I'm about as Left as one can get and I don't see this as a Lefty page by a long shot. All of us citizens who are educated and rational must bear the brunt of the Idiocracy....

PasadenaNative   Thu, 13 Oct 2011, 1:05am PDT   Share   Quote   Permalink   Like   Dislike     Comment 14

Oh, and Krugman 2012!

joshuatrio   Thu, 13 Oct 2011, 1:12am PDT   Share   Quote   Permalink   Like   Dislike     Comment 15

Patrick - you could be on your way to having the same type of fan base/similar site as drudgereport, or similar high traffic news sites where people come for certain types of news.

What makes your site way better is that you have the link submission section. Not to mention, you can't stand realtards.

StoutFiles   Thu, 13 Oct 2011, 1:15am PDT   Share   Quote   Permalink   Like   Dislike     Comment 16

Bunny Pumpkin says

Sorry Patrick, but you off my bookmarks list - it was really good and original, but this site quickly turned into worthless propaganda megaphone...

Well, with your two comments you really contributed a lot. You will be sorely missed.

Patrick links to articles without any bias and lets people talk about whatever they want on the forums. What more do you want from him? Ban people for speaking their mind? If you're mad that the site is too "left", then go find a "right" site.

To me, it's just a housing site where the majority of people are annoyed about how the economy has tanked the past few years and how realtor business practices have been less than great. I don't look at it politically. We're all in this boat together.

bubblesitter   Thu, 13 Oct 2011, 1:20am PDT   Share   Quote   Permalink   Like   Dislike     Comment 17

It is about time to start not left leaning http://larrypatrickmaloney.net

TPB   Thu, 13 Oct 2011, 1:35am PDT   Share   Quote   Permalink   Like (1)   Dislike     Comment 18

This sites political discourse attracts the Stew pot for a hat crowd.

edvard2   Thu, 13 Oct 2011, 2:00am PDT   Share   Quote   Permalink   Like   Dislike     Comment 19

Actually I feel like there is a fair amount of political back and forth on here, which makes sense because real estate is a point of interest for everybody. People of differing political opinion are always going to debate and that debate is what keeps the traffic flowing. It all boils down to everyone trying to exert their opinion.

iwog   Thu, 13 Oct 2011, 2:05am PDT   Share   Quote   Permalink   Like (17)   Dislike     Comment 20

Most of the "leftists" on patnet would have been considered right wing Republicans 50 years ago.

I own a business, have employees, own handguns, and advocate core family values. I'm very much against communism and socialism, I don't believe in no-fault divorce, I cheered when Bin Laden was executed, I want stronger border controls, and I don't believe in affirmative action or special rights for minority interest groups.

Apparently that makes me an extreme leftist. Why? Because I think raising taxes on rich people to a fraction of what they were under Reagan is a good idea.

We don't really have left and right in this country anymore. We have constitutionalists who still respect the American government, and we have borderline fascists who want to tear it apart.

Patrick   Thu, 13 Oct 2011, 2:14am PDT   Share   Quote   Permalink   Like   Dislike     Comment 21

San Diego Renter says

When it comes to crony capitalism, real conservatives are as offended as anyone.

Reminds me of a great quote I saw recently: "Conservatism is a political philosophy; the farce currently performing under that marquee is an inferiority complex in political philosophy drag."

larrypatrickmaloney says

All those bail outs when to Obama supporters, and financial institutions that bribe Washington (yes Lobbyists ) to pass and bias laws for themselves.

You can see the biggest bribers right here:

http://www.opensecrets.org/orgs/list.php?source=patrick.net&order=A

I admit that list is more blue than red. So you'd be ahead if you agree to a ban on all private campaign money and have publicly funded campaigns instead:

http://www.getmoneyout.com/

madhaus   Thu, 13 Oct 2011, 2:26am PDT   Share   Quote   Permalink   Like (1)   Dislike     Comment 22

And it's time for a political put-down from the "Elephants good, Donkeys bad" wing of the FoxNews Party. Wheee!

Real estate sites as a whole are down a LOT from the bubblicious days. For more proof of this than you'd ever want, have a look at this article I did, The Decline and Fall of the Real Estate Bubble Site.

http://www.burbed.com/2011/01/02/the-decline-and-fall-of-the-real-estate-bubble-site/

Burbed traffic is definitely down compared to 2008. We always appreciate it when Patrick links to one of our articles.

CL   Thu, 13 Oct 2011, 2:36am PDT   Share   Quote   Permalink   Like   Dislike     Comment 23

larrypatrickmaloney says

Every day, it's 70-80% of left leaning, political rhetoric.

If Patrick doesn't mend his ways, this site will not remain a haven for real estate watchers, and will pass away.

Pure piffle. Don't let this thought occupy a single cell in your cranium.

What is the alternative to your "leftist" truth? Post an article with disproven political rhetoric posing as economics? Some Ayn Rand fantasy or Ron Paul R3volting whatever the fuck that means?) Spare the job creators?!?!!?!?

Pure piffle.

Patrick   Thu, 13 Oct 2011, 3:37am PDT   Share   Quote   Permalink   Like   Dislike     Comment 24

madhaus says

Burbed traffic is definitely down compared to 2008. We always appreciate it when Patrick links to one of our articles.

2008 was the peak for distinct IP addresses per day visiting the Patrick.net website as well, at about 18,000 per day. Now it's about 12,000 per day on the website, but the email subscribers to the links went from nothing to about 9,000 per day. So overall a gain, but a shift away from reading the links on the web to getting them by email. The number of comments per day on the forum has also grown strongly for the last 3 years, after going back and forth at first:

The site is usually 1st in Google for lots of terms like "housing market news" or "housing crash" but has a high bounce rate, like 53%, so 53% of people who get there from Google immediately go somewhere else. Not sure why. Maybe because it's too much text.

On the other hand, the people who poke around the site usually stay. The site has a very high loyalty, with the majority of readers visiting every day.

Of course I'd like to improve all that.

PockyClipsNow   Thu, 13 Oct 2011, 3:40am PDT   Share   Quote   Permalink   Like   Dislike (1)     Comment 25

Well the first 3 years of this site half the posts were preoccupied with 'are we in a housing bubble?/ if so when/how far will prices crash'.

Well if you live in flyover things are probably near bottom.

The policitcs is interesting because the dem/repubs all want to 'make housing only go up' and make us all debt slaves to banks. Yes even the democrats! Obama is the bailout king version #2 - and has said 'we need to put a floor under house prices' even BEFORE he was elected.

Of course the main difference between Obama and Bush is ....nothing. Still fighting the same wars and the Feds still raid the pot houses in CA. WTF has changed?

edvard2   Thu, 13 Oct 2011, 4:03am PDT   Share   Quote   Permalink   Like   Dislike     Comment 26

I'm not a SEO or specialist but to me the reason why RE sites still attract people is because real estate and housing is as much an emotional, social issue as a financial one. The symbolism behind owning a house has more meaning than the house itself and when we can't have one or easily buy one then the gut reaction is that its unfair. This is especially true in the Bay Area where despite the higher salaries professionals who "should" be able to buy a house can't or won't because suddenly doing so starts to lose rationality. Its also because a lot of people here feel that they "should" be able to buy a house yet they can't and want to know why- an answer they will probably never fully receive.

Many of these sites I feel are used as people to either justify their thoughts, plans, or reasons for buying, not buying, or otherwise. Its a sort of reassurance. It boils down to the same basic questions:

" Houses are expensive here.... should I buy?" or- I'm frustrated that I can't afford or can't rationalize buying a house here but that's ok because I'm a rational person and thus I am smarter for not doing so."

The other reason that RE sites are a draw still is also because during the bubble there was a perhaps irrational and highly believed line of thought that there would be a crash and instantly we would all be able to scoop up houses we rightly deserved at prices we could easily afford because we had all been soooo smart for staying out of the whole mess. Yet that didn't happen and for all practical matters the Bay Area is as expensive as ever, prices barely budged in any of the central locations and people are still happy as clams to plunk down half a mil for a POS. Not much has changed and this probably makes a lot of those who were counting on the crash to bring down prices disappointed. As long as places like the Bay Area have irrationally priced housing sites like these will probably do just fine.

Patrick   Thu, 13 Oct 2011, 4:18am PDT   Share   Quote   Permalink   Like   Dislike     Comment 27

Patrick says

but has a high bounce rate, like 53%, so 53% of people who get there from Google immediately go somewhere else. Not sure why. Maybe because it's too much text.

Say, what if I put some new piece of cheesecake on the home page each day? Just to get attention from the men at least, and lower the bounce rate. Actually, I've read that women also prefer to look at good-looking women:

I could include a disclaimer like "She has nothing whatsoever to do with this site. She is there just to catch your attention."

PockyClipsNow   Thu, 13 Oct 2011, 4:50am PDT   Share   Quote   Permalink   Like   Dislike     Comment 28

You should feature 'hottie realtor of the day'.
THEN IS REAL ESTATE RELATED! lol

The drawback is you will have to look at 350 fify seven year old ladies to find one hottie.

here is the link

http://www.realtor.com/realestateagents/?source=web

FortWayne   Thu, 13 Oct 2011, 5:05am PDT   Share   Quote   Permalink   Like   Dislike     Comment 29

iwog says

Most of the "leftists" on patnet would have been considered right wing Republicans 50 years ago.

I own a business, have employees, own handguns, and advocate core family values. I'm very much against communism and socialism, I don't believe in no-fault divorce, I cheered when Bin Laden was executed, I want stronger border controls, and I don't believe in affirmative action or special rights for minority interest groups.

Apparently that makes me an extreme leftist. Why? Because I think raising taxes on rich people to a fraction of what they were under Reagan is a good idea.

We don't really have left and right in this country anymore. We have constitutionalists who still respect the American government, and we have borderline fascists who want to tear it apart.

Except in action you do exact opposite. But hey, nice message though.

Patrick   Thu, 13 Oct 2011, 5:09am PDT   Share   Quote   Permalink   Like   Dislike     Comment 30

edvard2 says

I'm not a SEO or specialist but to me the reason why RE sites still attract people is because real estate and housing is as much an emotional, social issue as a financial one.

I think everything you said in that comment is true. But even if prices in the Bay Area are still way too high, interesting things are going to continue to happen, like the lowering of the jumbo loan limit, and that inevitable major earthquake.

PockyClipsNow says

You should feature 'hottie realtor of the day'.

THEN IS REAL ESTATE RELATED! lol

The drawback is you will have to look at 350 fify seven year old ladies to find one hottie.

here is the link

http://www.realtor.com/realestateagents/?source=web

Hey, they don't have a "search realtors by hotness" option! That's definitely an unserved market.

Buster   Thu, 13 Oct 2011, 5:11am PDT   Share   Quote   Permalink   Like   Dislike     Comment 31

LOL. Good idea Patrick.

B.A.C.A.H.   Thu, 13 Oct 2011, 5:29am PDT   Share   Quote   Permalink   Like   Dislike     Comment 32

larrypatrickmaloney says

If Patrick doesn't mend his ways, this site will not remain a haven for real estate watchers, and will pass away

Larry,
sounds like you need to make your own website.

gregpfielding   Thu, 13 Oct 2011, 5:57am PDT   Share   Quote   Permalink   Like (1)   Dislike (1)     Comment 33

It isn't conservatism or liberalism that is screwing everything up. It's corporatism.

Common Sense Citizen   Thu, 13 Oct 2011, 6:07am PDT   Share   Quote   Permalink   Like (1)   Dislike     Comment 34

I'm with Larry on this one. This blog started off so well circa 2006, which is when I started reading. Over the past number of years the leftist, nonsense propaganda that has crept in has been disgusting, and offensive at times. I'm not right wing republican either so don't start throwing those darts either. It's been really sad. So I've since taken to just subscribing to the blogs that provide useful, nonpartisan, real estate information. Patrick, you always talk about keeping you're site alive with donations. I would happily give had you not introduced so much political garbage into your site. I am a physician and we spend much of our training these days being "culturally/politically/religiously sensitive". You would catch, maintain, and retain a mucher wider base if you kept the focus of your site on what it started out as. Many of my friends that I initially turned on to your site have since stopped reading for the same reasons. Its obviously your site that you can do what you want with, and that is still part of what makes the US "ok". Just some suggestions. Take care.

Truthplease   Thu, 13 Oct 2011, 6:12am PDT   Share   Quote   Permalink   Like   Dislike     Comment 35

iwog says

Most of the "leftists" on patnet would have been considered right wing Republicans 50 years ago.

Exactly!

Common Sense Citizen   Thu, 13 Oct 2011, 6:13am PDT   Share   Quote   Permalink   Like   Dislike     Comment 36

PasadenaNative says

Don't give in Patrick, I'm about as Left as one can get and I don't see this as a Lefty page by a long shot. All of us citizens who are educated and rational must bear the brunt of the Idiocracy....

I am educated (MD with 5 years of post medical school education for a total of 13 years after high school, I'm sure that's more than you) and am not part of any idocracy. Just because someone doesn't agree with you doesn't mean they're part an "idocracy", unless, of course, that is how you define it, which you may.

bob2356   Thu, 13 Oct 2011, 6:37am PDT   Share   Quote   Permalink   Like   Dislike     Comment 37

Common Sense Citizen says

Over the past number of years the leftist, nonsense propaganda that has crept in has been disgusting, and offensive at times.

Gee, how did you miss all the rightist nonsense propaganda? There are just as many right wingnuts posting as left wingnuts. Use the ignore.

Common Sense Citizen   Thu, 13 Oct 2011, 6:40am PDT   Share   Quote   Permalink   Like   Dislike     Comment 38

bob2356 says

Common Sense Citizen says

Over the past number of years the leftist, nonsense propaganda that has crept in has been disgusting, and offensive at times.

Gee, how did you miss all the rightist nonsense propaganda? There are just as many right wingnuts posting as left wingnuts. Use the ignore.

I'm talking about the links on the right side of the page, not the forum stuff.

Patrick   Thu, 13 Oct 2011, 6:43am PDT   Share   Quote   Permalink   Like (1)   Dislike (1)     Comment 39

Common Sense Citizen says

the leftist, nonsense propaganda that has crept in has been disgusting, and offensive at times. I'm not right wing republican either

No one but a right wing republican ever says things like "leftist, nonsense propoganda".

Like Larry, you feel compelled to defend a ruling class that could not care less about you, because you hope to join them one day. And that hope blinds you to the fact that they are IN YOUR WAY.

Your income is probably mostly a high salary as a doctor, right? So you pay the maximum income tax. Their income is far higher and does not require your skills, and does not even require doing anything useful at all. They could be a blithering idiot with a giant trust fund. Their income is just from mere ownership and monopolization of land and other assets. And their tax rates are much lower!

How are you going to join them when:

A: your time is far more limited because you actually do something useful all day
B: your income from that productive work is lower than theirs
C: your taxes are higher than theirs

You will always lose ground to them until we have fair taxes. Meaning low taxes on productive work and high taxes on non-productive ownership and rent-seeking.

Common Sense Citizen   Thu, 13 Oct 2011, 7:07am PDT   Share   Quote   Permalink   Like   Dislike     Comment 40

Like Larry, you feel compelled to defend a ruling class that could not care less about you, because you hope to join them one day. And that hope blinds you to the fact that they are IN YOUR WAY.

Nope, absolutely not. I'm not hoping to join those that I detest. I despise gwb, I despise wall street, and I despise partisan politics in general. So you're wrong there. I'm actually totally fine with taxing the megabillionaires that are siphoning more and more money from the working class.

Your income is probably mostly a high salary as a doctor, right?

No there too, if you must know, I am decidedly middle class (maybe) in orange county, and currently my wife and I rent a 950 sq foot apartment. My family's household income growing up was $35k, and I put myself through all stages of my education......living at home and driving a 40 year old vw beetle.

So yeah there is a part of me that is all about personal responsibility and getting things done yourself, but I would be remiss to not see what has gone on with crony capitalism over the last few decades.

So you pay the maximum income tax. Their income is far higher and does not require your skills, and does does not even require doing anything useful at all.

Yes!!!!! I couldn't agree more which is what I noted above!!! Tax those that make millions more.......especially the finance bozos that provide zero use to us. Then we get to athletes and celebrities but I guess that's another argument entirely.

Their income is just from mere ownership and monopolization of land and other assets. And their tax rates are much lower!
How are you going to join them when:
A: your time is far more limited because you actually do something useful all day
B: your income from that productive work is lower than theirs
C: your taxes are higher than theirs

I do not expect to join them ever, and all of your points are valid.

You will never catch them until we have fair taxes. Meaning low taxes on productive work and high taxes on non-productive ownership and rent-seeking.

I don't disagree with much of what you say, but some of the one sided links You post were pretty egregious. Like I said, I have read your site since 2006 and it has been great, but I have reD much less over the last few years as have many of my friends.

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