Watchhttp://money.cnn.com/2012/02/09/news/economy/jobs_young_adults/index.htm?iid=HP_LN
The share of young adults with jobs has hit its lowest level since the government started keeping records just after World War II.
By the end of 2011, only 54.3% of those between the ages of 18 and 24 were employed
I had my own Van and about $2500 worth of Flooring tools, and was a subcontractor for 6 different interior decorators, by the time I was 19. I was one of the first down here, in south Florida to work as a free agent(if you will), other installers depending on one shop, Dolphin Carpet, Carpet Expo ect. for their day to day work. I used to sit home and take calls from decorators and and a Postman that sold carpet and tile to people in his Century Village route.
I was full of Piss and Vinegar, as the old people used to say about me. When carpet was slow, you find me at the FP&L pay station selling knock off Rolexes or knock off designer perfume to inner city patrons on their way to pay their bill. One thing for sure, you weren't going to find me behind a counter, or sitting in a chair waiting to be seen by the HR administrator, I was paving my own way. I knew where corporate America was heading, and what was in store for those dependent on the Corporate payroll.
I was raised with the emphasis on the ability to adapt and shift gears, and for god sakes don't be at the mercy of the company store ever. When life throws you a curve ball when you're playing football, then you better hit a home run or you will get tackled.
Somewhere along the way, that sense of independence and innovation got replaced with people longing to fit in the corporasphere, and those that are trying to be self starters. Their ideas are to play follow the leader. School for the last several decade has drilled individuality out of the kids. Oh it's fine as long as we're talking about fashion and disruptive behavior, that's encouraged. But the focus has gone from preparing kids for the future, what ever that future may be, and giving the kids the tools they'll need to get by, to a politicized next stage qualifier.
You're either headed to College and will chose a career in publicly traded company and are told you'll make high end 6 figure salaries right out of college. Hell they cut out the pay your dues part, these kids were told they are on the fast track. That's if they can afford an education that cost as much as the average High end sports luxury car in Monaco. The other group is destined to destitution and welfare, for the women, and the men folk are headed to prisons profit centers.
Let's take a moment of silence and mourn for the lost of the best system in the world and death of the American innovative entrepreneurial spirit, regardless of class, race, age, weight or education.
Be careful what you wish for.
You want change? You got it!
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Do you two need a Napkin? I'm sure you do, after a good Liberal Mental masturbation session like that.
Yeah that's it, I'm threatened by Obama, there's just no way in hell I could possibly think he's a rotten President, and he has distinguished him self from Bush time and time again over the last 4 years, and every thing he does, is spot on, and gets right to the point and provides relief IMEDIATLY. So it's just Honkey sour grapes on my part. (No don't cum yet I'm not done). I'm threatened because Obama took my job from me and gave it to a Black person. The Member of a group that has seen Unemployment the highest than any president in the last 30 years. now at a whopping 18% in many states.
I work from home some days for two companies at the same time.
That's $100 bucks an hour. Do you really think I have personal employment axe to grind with the worst president in history because of my employment status? He just happens to be black I can't help that, I'm not going to go easy on him just because he is. And if you want to be so juvenile to perpetuate the stereo type and bigotry by throwing the race card so selfishly to lend to your argument. Then you two are more ignorant than an Bass Boat owner named Scooter with two good teeth.
It's a shame, I thought we progressed past that, but I guess not, you two are showing your true colors now.
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iwog says
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The GOP says
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The GOP says
Why is he the worst president in history?
Oh that's right, you don't want to talk about it.
The GOP says
I did nothing of the kind. WTF is wrong with you?
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leoj707 says
From Wiki:
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bgamall4 says
OK, I should have said "It seems wrong to them that a black man with a Muslim name should be sleeping in the White House." I don't have a problem with it myself.
Yes, offshoring is probably more of a Republican thing, because they are the most devout believers that a global free market is always good for Americans, even when it's obviously costing American jobs. Democrats were traditionally on the side of labor and not capital. Though of course lately things are all twisted around, with Republicans claiming to represent the common man even while exporting their jobs, and Democrats being more popular on Wall Street.
Sure, white men can identify with Romney and Gingrich, because they are white men.
Anyway, arguing on the surface level of facts and reasoning just won't get us anywhere. It's really all about the emotional subtext, the fear of eroding social status among the white middle class and how "liberals" are contributing to that by electing a black president, providing health care for poor blacks and Hispanics possibly paid for by white people, granting marriage rights to gays, who not too long ago were not merely lower status, but could be jailed.
The rent-seeking 1% absolutely loves this stuff and encourages those fears as much as possible, because it distracts the white middle class from thinking about our unfairly low tax rates on the rich.
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zzyzzx says
STILL devoid of any discussion on what Obama actually did to cause any of this.
Yes folks, it's the right wing twilight zone.
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zzyzzx,
No president has direct control of the economy. The economy is millions (billions) of people interacting and making deals with each other.
We're going to be suffering from the "hangover" of the housing bubble mania for a long time. Japan had the "lost decade" and we will too, I believe, no matter who is in office. Might Romney be better than Obama? Sure. But there's no easy way out of the mess we are in.
A lot of people don't like Obama because of "social issues" that are near and dear to "the left" like abortion, gay marriage, etc. If you look at Obama's economic record, it's not like he's some far-left socialist. There haven't been any big tax increases, not even on the "super rich".
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You know what he did Iwog, stop it, we're asking for something positive he's done for his constituents. The only examples you can provide is the boone he gave to large corporations.
Obmama took all of the good parts of the Government, the parts when life kicks the shit out of you, and you're looking around for help. And gave it to the corporations. But he kept the bad parts, the part that will fine you, if you don't pay the man at the window, the amount they tell you are due.
You're not new here Iwog. You've been here for every Mental wedgie Obama has given me. I've provided you with a real time update. Your argument is "What has he done?".
Click on my moniker see my posts history and start reading.
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Patrick says
Yep. Isn't that right, Mr. Moneyworth?
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Patrick says
Well said.
Patrick says
I would take this one step further. I believe that the banks have a vested self interest in blaming everyone except the banks themselves. So they are at the forefront of media manipulation and getting people to believe that their loans, the cause of all this mess, were somehow not the cause. For the bankers, the borrowers were the cause. But of course anyone who has not been brainwashed by the bankers knows you can't borrow without a willing lender.
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Home prices not values have been falling. And that's a good thing.
As for everything else, that was a problem under Bush. Obama just made it worse by continuing Bush's policies.
So my response is: what change? We've been living under Bush for 12 years now, and no matter who wins (cause Ron Paul ain't), we're going to be living under Bush for 4 more.
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Dan8267 says
Pretty much. Hey, there's always Canada or Australia. Anybody know how to get an immigration permit?
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wthrfrk80 says
http://www.cic.gc.ca/english/
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The GOP says
That's a lie. I gave an extensive list.
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Patrick says
Wow, here's a perfect example that just arrived in my mailbox:
"GOP targets child tax break for illegal immigrants"
http://www.federalnewsradio.com/?nid=314&sid=2739793
The tax breaks for the very rich are even less justified and, oh, a THOUSAND TIME LARGER yet curiously unmentioned by the Republican Party.
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Dan8267 says
Just curious--how do you make a distinction?
How do you come up with a number for the "value"?
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iwog says
iwog says
I'm well aware of April Glaspie. although I have no clue where she is now. Supposedly saddam said he'd pull out if syria pulled out of lebanon (which kissenger supposedly green lighted when ford was in office).
I know that's a horrible way to decide who to vote for but also consider this. Are people voting for the party, the person or both? Personally I think any democrat would have won against mccain..Hillary would have won as well (I think she would have been doing a better job in retrospect)
But some of the hypocracy here is getting large. If Gingrich cares about spending by all means he should simply become speaker of the house again and block spending..that's what congress is for. The president controls foreign relations but yet obama is trying to block israel from bombing iran.
On state levels this gets all over the place. In mass the republicans wanted to make cfl light bulbs tax exempt from the sales tax. You know it would kinda make sense with the environmental angle...democrats blocked it! huh?!?
Of course the other logic that could be invoked is this. If you think the other party is so wrong sometimes the only way to end the argument is to let them try. Just look at stem cell research. If it holds promise then the only way to find out is to try. Fund it a bit and give it a timeframe. If by the end of that time frame there is nothing then take away the funding and end the argument.
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The young airheads with tatoos, piercings, MTV and mush for brains got exactly what they deserved with Obama.
Obama is a useless clown and his economic stimulus was a waste that gave money to public sector union workers, which of course stimulates nothing, rather just puts off their eventual unemployment from falling tax revenues.
He did nothing to address the huge costs of illegal aliens and in fact wants to make them legal residents, although fewer than 20% of them have graduated high school in Mexcio. They're illiterates in two languages.
GM and Chrysler could have gone through normal legal bankruptcy which would have had no less negative effect than rewarding the UAW, stealing from the bondholders, and having Fiat end up owning Chrysler. Daimler tried to save Chrysler and decided it was a tar baby that was best left untouched.
If Obama isn't busy bowing and kowtowing to foreign despots and saudi royalty, he is calling Americans guilty for the problems of the rest of the world, even though history shows Americans were the saviors of the world at least 3 times in history.
Taking over and ruining our health care to make us all pay for those who are deadbeats at the expense of choice in our own insurance plans is a disaster that is just going to be realized next year when the whole mess starts to kick in.
Obama's a weird case, although he's not atypical for the type. He's confused about his racial identity. He was raised by an indifferent, crazy mother. He grew up in the garden spot of Indonesia with a muslim father. He split the dysfunction there and was raised by his *grandparents* instead.
He's a dilettante who has had the skids greased for him for being a mulatto and therefore his looks plays well on the liberal guilt of some people.
So, others who are 1. guilty liberals 2. non whites 3. losers looking for handouts 4. others who self-identify as "victims" (e.g. lesbian, gay, obese, addict, nuts, etc.) 5. foreigners usually voted for Obama.
It's going to be interesting to see if those among these above believe that they can do better in the future waiting for Obama to get any results from his absurd tax the rich plan to save our economy or someone who has actually had any executive experience and who won't go around attacking business, capital and success.
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clambo says
But what about the GIGANTIC costs of lowering the capital gains tax to 15% while productive people have to pay 35%?
That cost alone is so much larger than the cost of illegal aliens that it's comic. Like at least a trillion dollars, with no benefit at all to investment. No one ever skipped a good investment because of their marginal tax rate.
The key is this: you don't feel personally threatened by the very rich avoiding taxes, you feel threatened by illegal aliens.
And yet the tax evasion by the rich is costing you much much more.
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clambo says
Wouldn't the bondholders end up with 0% after a bankruptcy? You do realize that investors get paid LAST behind vendors right?
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tatupu70 says
The price of my belly button lint is $26 million. However, I'll let you pay only 10% down and the rest on a 30-year mortgage at 5%. If value and price are synonymous to you, this is a really good deal.
As for how I come up with a number, I'm a fan of the Case-Shiller Index.
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iwog says
That is wrong on so many levels. I mean, morally wrong, not factually incorrect.
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Dan8267 says
Stock and bondholders are invested in the company and should know the risks they take.
Vendors, suppliers, lease holders, and even employees hold contracts with the corporation and count on being paid to survive.
I'm not really sure what law justified the devaluation of the GM corporate bonds, but I do know that a bankruptcy judge holds tremendous power to rewrite nearly any contract or agreement in chapter 11. Although there has been a lot of ink spilled over bond holders getting screwed in the GM deal, I'm pretty sure they would have fared worse in a liquidation.
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iwog says
Exactly
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Dan8267 says
I'll pass on the belly button lint.
The Case Shiller is a nice overview of housing prices in general, but how in the world can you use it to determine the "value" of an individual house?
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The value of a home is what people are willing to pay for it.
So, selling price, not asking price.
It's certainly possible for homes to be over valued though. That's still the case in many parts of the world.
But lots of things are over valued.
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Kevin says
That's not true!
Most people are willing to pay whatever the banks are willing to lend them. So prices are determined by lending.
Whether that price is fair or not depends on the cost of your alternative, renting. How much it would cost you to rent the same thing for the same time period determines the fair vlue. Not lending.
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Patrick says
Good call.
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tatupu70 says
Just remember, you're passing on that belly button lint for the exact same reason people are passing on houses. The price is greater than the value.
tatupu70 says
Detailed knowledge of the housing market, the neighborhood, competing houses, the cost of rent, historical sales that pre-date the bubble. There's no single formula to use, you just got to learn your local market or get suckered.
I'd recommend checking the tax appraisal website of your county. You'll have to Google it, since every county has a different site. If you are lucky, the tax appraisal site will allow you to type in an address and get the entire sales history. That helps a lot for determining value.
It's amazing how prices doubled and tripled during the boom. I'd say the fair market price is what the house sold for in the 1990s. You may have to do a bit of extrapolating by comparing sales of other houses around that time if you don't have a sale in the 1990s.
In my opinion, the fair market price for most housing in south-east Florida (Miami to West Palm Beach) is about 1997 prices. I can't say what's fair market for other regions because I don't have local knowledge, and that's critical.
Here's a concrete example. I rented a house back in 2008-2010. The owner, a retiree, was trying to sell it for $385,000 back in 2007. He couldn't, so he rented it for two years to me at $1600/month. Generally, the rule of thumb is 100x rent is sales price, but that varies a bit depending on numerous things. So you might estimate the fair sales price to be $160,000.
Given that it was a 1970s house, 2 bed, 2 bath, I'd have say the fair sales price is a bit less than $100/sq.ft., but he ended up selling to to the daughter of the person who lived next door. She was willing to pay a bit of a premium to live next to her mother.
Here's the vital info:
Personally, I think she overpaid, but at least she didn't pay the ridiculous 2007 price. I'd say the real value of the house is $140,000
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Dan8267 says
Uh, OK. Not sure what that analogy is trying to say. People don't buy things that they think are overpriced? Wow--thanks for that pearl of wisdom.
Dan8267 says
I have to disagree with that. Fair market price is whatever anyone (really 1 person) is willing to pay right now. That's pretty much the definition of market price. Just because you wouldn't pay it, doesn't mean it's not the market price.
I do agree with Patrick that rental parity is a good way to avoid overpaying though. You just have to make sure you account for all the costs and savings in the calculation--Bill does a good job with his spreadsheet. It's a little tricky to estimate the present value of the savings when the house is paid off. Inflation, life span, etc.
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Market price is whatever the greatest fool is willing and able to pay. Fair market price is what informed buyers who are not under pressure can and will pay.
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Dan8267 says
The house sells to the greatest fool though... Fair market in your sense is an imaginary number.
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tatupu70 says
Not if there are a plethora of houses and few fools left. The fool can only buy one house.
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Sometimes when I'm in a foul mood I always enjoy reading the comments in the political section- especially those made on behalf of right-leaning folks, and always get a good hearty chuckle. You can't write comedy as good as this.
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Judith549 says
Not really - I feel that you're trolling & that your attempt has failed. FYI, anyone can lose weight if they starve themselves.
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Dan8267 says
Um, what's the logic behind someone "disliking" the above comment?
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Anyone who wines about Obama, bailing out/bankrupting Chrysler and GM. Should back up and remind themselves about the crap show that Paulson and Bush did with AIG. Flat out thievery, they didn't bankrupt the company, so all the executives still got their ill gotten bonuses, and Goldman and a bunch of foreign banks got 100 cents on the dollar for their loads of craptacular credit default swaps. I and my grandchildren just got the bill.
The whole euro/Greece bailout is a huge fiasco, but in allot of ways it's working out OK. If you lend money or a buy a financial product from a bunch of numnutz's you deserve to get pennys back on the dollar. It's called capitalism and a free market. The GOP go on and on about it, and they make me play by those rules but when it comes to their .1% buddies it's all bailouts, no bid contracts, and juicy earmarks.
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How fast we forget
What will Obama's 2012 campaign slogan read ?
CHANGE WE CAN BELIEVE IN - AGAIN ?
OBAMA has taken trillions from the coffers to fix real estate prices.
Is there a soul alive that ever believed that might be accomplished ?