WatchIf competition could be restored to the home buying process, transaction costs could be greatly reduced which would connect more buyers and sellers with deals. This claim to 6% ownership of all real-estate causes the market to be sticky, fewer transactions occur as a result. More sales would occur if there wasn’t a 6% barrier between the seller and the buyer, and the purchase price would be lower for the buyer as well.
The housing market would recover faster if home deals could omit this expensive middle man. People should not revert to realty offices when thinking of buying or selling homes. Individuals need to default to internet sites like Zillow.com or other housing sites in order to reduce the market collusion from realtors. The internet is a great device for competition! Now people need to realize that websites can be used to organize home buyers and sellers just like Amazon, Craigslist, or Ebay, without the expensive middleman.
Many people argue that buyers do not pay the fees to the realtor so they should not care if the realtor gets paid. Well due to the fungibility of money, the buyer could have bought the house for 94% of what they paid because that is what the seller was willing to accept for the house. This makes it obvious to see that the seller nominally pays for the realtor fees, but the buyer, in real terms, pays about 6% too much for the home. Not realizing that a realtor’s 6% could be negotiated is a flaw that must not be overlooked.
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YesYNot says
Plus, subtract any repairs, maintainance or replacement of roofs, HVAC, appliances, fixtures, carpet, etc. over that 7 years, and that $5K goes POOF!!! It becomes a negative sum game...
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Marietta, GA
For those of you who believe the value of a REALTOR is opening doors and shuffling paper and lament about the payment, you lack a clue about the value a REALTOR brings to the transaction.
Consumers benefit from a brokerage fee system where it doesn't cost any more to hire the very best. Most consumers do not evaluate and chose an outstanding REALTOR that can and does add value to the transaction exceeding the cost.
Think of it as a wedding, you can to select having it at a Ritz Carlton or a McDonalds. They use similar ingredients; butter, sugar, flower are the same at both. If the cost was the same which would you choose. The service, presentation, experience and taste will be different. In brokerage services the cost is almost the same, but most consumers do not choose the Ritz Carlton service for the same price as McDonalds, who is at fault, is that most posting here blame the REALTOR.
As a REALTOR none of my clients object to my service all refer me to their friends, co-workers and associates. All understand the value I provide to their side of the transaction. I suppose most of you would complain about an $18 charge for a burger at the Ritz or Mc Donalds. It appears the majority of those posting would object to a $3 dollar burger charge at the Ritz while still eating the burger.
Next time you need heart surgery, brain surgery, a root canal, or are charged with a serious crime try to save money find the cheapest, least experienced professional, or go on line and figure out how to do it yourself or have your unemployed brother/sister/cousin assist you then go on line and complain about your outcome and cost.
Clearly experienced professional representation has a value and that value is greater than its cost. If that were not the case and you could sell a home as easy as trading stocks, ordering books, or ordering travel, the market would have eliminated the ability to charge for those services.
I am a REALTOR, I use REALTORS when I buy and sell, I am an Attorney, I hire an attorney when I litigate or need contracts drafted, when I travel, I hire a travel agent to plan my trip; I pay premium prices to eat at premium establishments, in seeking medical care I go to specialists, not a veterinarian to save money. My goal is always to maximize the value of the service by getting the best outcome, not the lowest price. The lowest priced provider seldom produces the highest quality outcome. Think government contracting seeking the lowest price bidder, not highest value return.
If you had a bad experience, hired a bad REALTOR, made poor real estate decisions look in the mirror you will see the source of your problem staring back at you. It is not an industry problem it is a personal problem.
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Bwhahahahaha.
Look at the used house pimp's rationalizations and lies.
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Reston, VA
Bruce Ailion says
This is absurd. Realtors are used house salesmen and are on par with used car salesmen. Comparing a Realtor to a brain surgeon is like comparing a car salesman to a brain surgeon. Sure there are good car salesmen and bad ones. Neither of these job paths have anything to do with surgery.
Bruce Ailion says
My wife and I picked a crappy Realtor, because she was the fourth in a line of crappy windbags that we dealt with. We were very tempted to give up on the deal because of her. Was it our fault for going through with it? Maybe, but it would have been much harder to find a good Realtor than find the right house.
Bruce Ailion says
It is an industry problem when > 90% of Realtors are absolute crap, because the industry incentives cause this problem. The light at the end of this tunnel is that picking a typical house is about as complicated as picking the best flight from Washington DC to Chicago. The Realtor for these deals should be about out of the picture at this point.
We can certainly hope that they will eventually go out of business. The optimist in me hopes that these walking impediments to easy house transactions will be replaced by something better.
To use your tortured restaurant analogy, using a Realtor is typically like paying $18 to eat a taco bell meat product that is 28% beef. There may be some super Realtor breed that can provide a Ruth's Chris steak for $18, but like playing the scratch off, you will likely end up with the taco.
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Bruce Ailion says
This struck me too. You cannot compare a Realtor to a surgeon. How long you had to go to school just to learn for your Realto's exam? Let's get real, you might have better people skills but there is nothing you are doing the typical person with average IQ cannot learn relatively quickly and do it on his own.
"Presentation..." what kind of presentation you are talking about? I don't need a presentation to show me the house. I saw enough of them to make my own decision. I only need from you an access to the house I want to see.
After assembling my first offer with a of Realtor, who BTW didn't know how to use a copy machine at her own office, I think I can handle the template and do it myself. What else do I need from you, negotiations, calling back and forth to the sales agent? Can't I handle it myself?
Most of these 'quality" agents don't even know how to handle todays’ market short sales or foreclosures. They are so used to regular sales that they don't want to deal with distressed properties transactions.
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Calling a realtor "professional" is like putting a suit on a pig.
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Realtors are to real estate transactions what arsonists are to architecture.
The NAR should be disbanded and every one of the transactions it participated in audited for fraud and every one of them that can be traced to Realtor® influence be prosecuted to the letter of the law and the guilty Realtor®s thrown out of helicopters over parking lots.
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A realtor is a financial sniper and a mercenary in the employ of himself and himself only, sweeping the countryside for opportunities to enrich himself on real estate transactions by any and all means excluding weapons play, not because of any moral objectives but because the other side may be armed.
The closest analogy to a Realtor®s point of view in real estate transactions would be a maternity hospital owned and operated by vampires. They know when the parents are due and will need their services. They know when the fresh load of untainted blood will arrive and they know where they can sink their teeth into the fresh victim.
I dunno if they're better described as financial arsonists or financial vampires.
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APOCALYPSEFUCK isFrank Sinatra says
lmao
You gotta wonder why one of these parasites would even bother writing anything on patrick.net no less reading. I mean seriously. Even their reputation on Main Street is lower than used car salesmen yet they come here as if we're the problem? Hardly. I'm stunned by their reticence or reluctance to even admit their lower than whale shit reputation. And that's just the first step. Getting one of these clowns to take a personal inventory would be a miracle in itself.
What clueless jack asses they are.
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You Lowlife says
Why do you insist on slandering whale shit?
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Mill Valley, CA
I'm surprised about the animosity towards realtors.
There's good and bad in any profession....and there are subjective likes and dislikes.
Take some time to discover the best for you - generally, anyone with less than 5 years experience should be avoided. If the agent has made it past that hump, they have the acumen to have built business despite the large obstacles in the way the first 5 years of business.
After that, it would seem to simply be a personality that suits your needs and wants.
For what it's worth, one of my best buds here in San Fran is a BIGGIE realtor....he's VERY successful (residential and commercial properties). He's a totally sharp, and unerringly honest, guy - with 4 great kids and wife. He set me up with his financier of choice and has given me choice advice the past few months while we've looked for a home. I cannot thank him enough for his input.
However, he's not our (buying) agent. Because I recognized my wife will be handling most of the house chatter and visits, we found one more suitable (for us). A totally buttoned up lady just down the street - unerringly positive and forthright - was our pick and I have to say it's been a fine choice throughout.
You have a choice - choice wisely in what's best for you - and take some measure of responsibility in the deal. If you're involved, it's your money (and or house), so make certain the end result is one that you are happy with.
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jsmarket says
C'mon now. After the last 15 disastrous, corruption plagued years regarding housing sales and you're "surprised"? I got news for you bud...... the animosity isn't just here. It's everywhere.
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Mill Valley, CA
You Lowlife says
I've found animosity often fills the void where responsibility should've been.
So, are realtors dramatically worse than they've ever been - or are people sloughing off their role and responsibility for any mess they may have been involved with?
If one has even 1% role in any decision, you could've changed the outcome. Instead, one whines about 'the others' poor habits. Social media such as Patrick.net, Facebook, and Blogosphere has made it easier than ever to shirk one's culpability.
It's your life - we all make good choices and bad ones - those that learn from both are all too rare.
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You Lowlife says
It's the nature of a psychopath to have no empathic faculties. To a psychopath Jeffrety Dahmer was just dining in with new friends and acquaintances. If someone was lied to and defrauded by a Realtor® and his collaborating mortgage broker, well, what did he expect? You just have to assume every professional is a psychopathic liar, don't you? By this reasoning, the Realtor® exposes itself what is it: a monster of infinite malevolence. In any civil society, they'd be soaked with beef gravy and set out for starving dogs to eat - but we'd hate to victimize innocent animals. And there is the question of proportionality. That kind of punishment would be too good for destroying the lives of families forever and a day and setting the innocent on death spiral trajectories. Indeed, it is hard to imagine a punishment that would fit these crimes. The Realtor® point of view is always - 'assholes, it's their fault for believing what they're told and the wife deserved to see her husband blow his brains out in front of her. Better luck next life. Hahahahahahahahaha!'
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You Lowlife says
He'll be really shocked when he sees Realtor®s being thrown onto the Pyres of Justice along with the banksters and mortgage brokers.
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jsmarket says
Oh puleez.
NAR failed the public in every way possible. They're the problem, they've been the problem and based on their perpetual shirking of responsibility, they'll continue to be the problem.
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Reston, VA
Realtors are generally useless. They are currently enjoying a monopoly, so they can eke out a living while providing no real benefit.
Stating the above opinion isn't whining, displacing blame, or any crap like that. It is the pessimist that thinks we need a 6% Realtor tax to be able to buy and sell houses to each other. Any optimist would think that we can achieve such a simple task on our own much quicker than finding an honest Realtor.
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Fort Lauderdale, FL
jsmarket says
I wouldn't take what anonymous posters say too seriously. If they post like a 13 year old they just might be, or you may just be entertaining an immature unemployed adult living in their parents garage. People who can't get the system to work for them tend to hate the system they can't figure out how to make work for them.
Every successful investor I've trained either has a Realtor they work closely with or have gotten licensed themselves. Having to rely on services like Redifin for your MLS is going to severely impair your competitiveness.
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jsmarket says
Name one profession where every thing that professional says is 100% lies? It seems like you are clueless about the Realtor tactics. They are not even professionals. It is pathetic and down side of USA that here they make 6% of the sale price for doing nothing compared to other professionals where they have to work hard to earn.
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bubblesitter says
I can't name one. Except for realtor.
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Marietta, GA
Clearly when your only tool is a hammer everything looks like a nail. If the only REALTORs you meet are inadequate perhaps the quality agents are unwilling to work with clients with perception and attitude issues.
One skill REALTORs develop is an ability to quickly assess the character of the people they represent and negotiate with. A average to good agent would pick up your attitude and quickly conclude, NEXT. The good agents have as many clients as they want. Those potential clients with ignorant, intolerant, critical, dishonest, biased, unreasonable attitudes and perceptions are thrown back. They are not keepers. Eventually these potential clients will find an agent to work with, the ones with little or no experience and who does not know better to avoid those who do not value their service.
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Reston, VA
We weren't passed on by any Realtor that we spoke to. We just could tell that all four agents were not trustworthy. We also offered within 3 weeks and closed in another 3 weeks after seeing 3 or 4 houses. So any astute agent would have known it would be pretty easy money. We are happy with our purchase, b/c we knew what we wanted. But we were very disappointed with the quality of the Realtors. Maybe next time we will have better luck.
Any advice on finding a good Realtor? Are there Realtor rating services? If some agents are so much better than the others, is there a way to see who got ripped off by whom? The good agents should be raking the bad ones over the coals, huh?
ELC, is there some reason that you think Redfin's data is lacking? Redfin had all of the same properties available through the Realtor's MLS data, and updated data within two hours when our house changed status. What does a Realtor offer that Redfin doesn't?
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CBM says
"Facts"? like your "integrity" when NAR released false data every single month of the year for 5 years running? That's a fact and the truth. We know all about your "facts". Your problem is you conflate your "facts" with truth and then pass it off as truth. And of course the public doesn't expect you people to know the difference so I'll explain it to you. A fact allows you to be "right". However, being "right" and the truth are two different things in that you can be "right" irrespective of the truth. And getting to the truth is always a bumpy painful process that you people seem to do anything to avoid.
CBM says
BWHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!
We know all about your voluntary code of ethics.
It's hilarious when someone invokes the "code of ethics" when desperately attempting to defend these shysters.
CBM says
Really? Another lame, worn out excuse by you creeps? And how many times will you continue to mis-use this false assertion? The truth is MLS is a monopoly.
What a seething shitpot of jackasses you people are.
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APOCALYPSEFUCK isFrank Sinatra says
Exactly.
How many millions of lives have these people destroyed with their antics?
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You Lowlife says
Hehehehehehehehe! Seething shitpot of jackasses! Can I borrow that sometime?
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You Lowlife says
We'll when you count all the crappy notes that got bundled into MBS instruments and, what those have done, it's kind of hard to figure out who has been exempt from the fallout. Direct destruction, probably on the order of 10 million families. Every one of which should be hunting down the realty agents and mortgage brokers who fucked them. Can you imagine a jury that would not burst into applause upon hearing the prosecutors narrative of the victim's revenge?
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What a joke. Most of you clowns don't know the difference between shit and shineola. I mean really, pull your head out of your ass...what a bunch of under-educated windbags. If you ever want to do your own Real Estate transaction I welcome you...and I hope I'm the agent on the other end. You'd realize the value of an agent in a hurry. Most of you have an attention span of less than three minutes and couldn't negotiate a Real Estate transaction from start to finish if your life depended on it. You know what they say....Oh' wait, you don't know what they say do you.
If you prefer leaving a comment on this post, let it be known it will be for you and you only....as I will NOT be back to this waste of time website anytime soon.
Sincerely,
GoFuckYourself
REALTOR
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CBM says
Ha! Hahahaha! Hahahahahahaha!
Yeah, like this one:
Somerville Realtor charged with stealing $200,000 from clients
http://www.wickedlocal.com/somerville/news/x639962391/Somerville-Realtor-charged-with-stealing-200-000-from-clients#ixzz1xSsxEl00
Or this one:
Officer, Wife Accused of Bank Fraud
http://www.woi-tv.com/story/18681854/officer-wife-accused-of-bank-fraud
According to court documents, former police officer, now realtor Bobbi Jo Wojewoda and her husband current officer Lt. Wade Wojewoda lied about their income, having a rental property, and debt to income ratio to get a mortgage for a home on Oakwood Lane in West Des Moines.
Bobbi Jo also falsely inflated appraisals on other homes.
So, what does the code of ethics say? Rob the client but leave the client alive? Everything is great if you are mostly sure you can beat the indictment?
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San Antonio, TX
jvolstad's website
Because, as one Realtor told me, they like people. That's why they are in the business.
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jvolstad says
as another realtor told me, they like money. That's why they are in the business.
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EconPete says
Recover to what ? higher prices, thats not a recovery thats a bubble!
This is now the second correction we have seen over the past 30 years.
Has it sunk in that prices eventual fall and go back to some normality...
Too many people still think prices go up 10-30-50% year over year!
Its just crazy talk to think that ... like we need another nail in the coffin.
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I guess you hate everyone because every profession has criminals which is not indicative of an entire profession. Must be hard to harbor such venom for the world. Takes a lot of energy to be this angry.
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CBM says
Once again with the conflations and false equivalencies? I see a whole lot of truth telling and you call that anger?
The sentiment really is truth then. You guys really are stupid and unethical.
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FUCKAPOCALYPSE says
Good riddance jackass.
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The national association of realtors bribes politicians more then any other group of privilege buying scumbags, because they are the last line of defense to save American Homeownership for the populace. And the six hour certification course that the whores must take to enter the profession, is proof positive, that these freedom fighters earn every cent of the 40k on the sale of a 700k government subsidized shitbox. What the hell is wrong with you people? You should be giving realtors hand jobs of appreciation rather then sitting here posting all the lies and being filled with negativity. I mean, where would you be without heart surgeons, scientists, and realtors?
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FUCKAPOCALYPSE says
If you change your mind,you better come back with a new identity.
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Frankly I think your anger is displaced. Why no similar anger towards attorneys or politicians. You know, those "people" who are the real thieving, corrupt, lying, scumbags?
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Fort Lauderdale, FL
I agree. Recovery will be when home prices decline another 25%. More in some areas. We're looking for at least an 80% decline from peak prices. Then let it fluctuate in line with the land that's slowly appreciating tempered with the improvement on it that's depreciating. Artificially created supply and demand as well as cheap easy financing will only lead to trouble.
IMO a house is a home. It's not an ATM or a get rich quick scheme. Leave speculation to the stock market or the casinos. Laws need to be passed to prevent the greedy from taking advantage of people's desire to have a piece of the American Dream or pretty soon there won't be one.
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Honest Abe says
Frankly, attorneys and medical doctors are considered "professional" and actually know something.
You can stop with the false equivalency that realtors= MD's, JD's and engineers. Realtors are toll booth collectors and nothing more.
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Fort Lauderdale, FL
taka says
LOL. They're in the wrong business if they like the money!
http://www.realtor.org/field-guides/field-guide-to-quick-real-estate-statistics