http://www.dailykos.com/story/2012/02/23/1067636/-Our-Taxes-are-Off-to-War-2012-Edition
Our Taxes are Off to War
By Dan8267 Follow Sat, 9 Jun 2012, 5:56pm 1,876 views 22 comments
In Boca Raton FL 33433
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I was having a good weekend until I read this.
@$^&#*#+*(~?
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Yeah, image how much we could improve our economy if we spent that military money on clean, sustainable energy, infrastructure improvements, fiber optics, municipal wifi, urban renewal, etc.
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Dan8267 says
Yes but that wouldn't protect the assets of the 1% or the deals they cut with their counterparts in other countries in order to prevent the public wealth from reaching the public.
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The defense spending of the US isn't about protecting the 1%, it's about making it so that Europe doesn't have to spend anything on defense.
If the whole world had to provide for their own defense, nobody would be offering public health care or retirement income.
Of course, if most countries provided for their own defense, we'd probably have a lot more war, too. It's been 80 years since the last time wealthy countries had to deal with war on their own soil, and that's a very long time by historical standards.
I give us another 20.
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Kevin,
If war comes to"their own soil" I hope it's not nuclear.
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Kevin says
Europe does spend on its own defense. And what would the U.S. be protecting Europe from? The Soviet Union? That's gone. The cold war is over.
And because of trade and the European Union, it's highly improbably that the British and the French are going to fight another 100 years war. Western Europe is pretty well united because of trade. And Eastern Europe is slowly but surely joining them.
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An associate told me of his experience in the Navy onboard an aircraft carrier. Shipping a hydraulic valve for a forklift would take two weeks. Shipping a new forklift would take one week. Solution; push forklift off edge of aircraft carrier, order new forklift.
Ashtrays FULL ???
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Ruki says
I disagree. Sewers perform a vital function. Without them we'd all die of Bubonic Plague. Yet, they don't make up 24% of federal spending.
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Also, anyone who thinks that we need to spend over 50% of our discretionary spending on the military doesn't get to bitch about taxes being too high or teachers and union workers getting paid too much.
We spend more on the military than all other discretionary spending put together.
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The military is a welfare program for the rich and a work program for the poor and career military people. We'd be better off spending a big portion of that on infrastructure. Better roads, public transit, and schools would pay a bigger dividend in quality of life & higher incomes.
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YesYNot says
I completely agree.
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Imagine how much we could improve our economy if the tax money which pores into the military went instead back to the workers who earned it?
What a novel concept. Here's how it works: (1) Reduce military spending (2)tax the people less (3) people have more discretionary income to spend (4) they spend it (5) the economy improves. Problem solved.
Honest Abe for President - 2016 !!
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Honest Abe says
If only it were that simple. For the record, I fully support reducing military spending by a LOT.
But it will be extremely painful. All that military spending creates a ton of good paying jobs and taking that money away WILL cause the economy to stumble. Anyone who thinks otherwise is a fool.
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tatupu70 says
Yes, but unfortunately those jobs don't produce wealth. They destroy wealth. If those people were doing something useful instead of just killing innocent children around the world, say they were rebuilding New Orleans instead, I'd wholeheartedly would support them. But since they are just fucking people out of life to make money, I say fuck them.
Most of those "defense" jobs are in regions that complain about people sucking from the government teat, social safety nets, and taxes. Let them see what it's like to have no social safety net when they lose their government teat. (And I've only worked for the private sector my whole life. So I've never been on the government teat.)
Somehow, I think that the idea of social safety nets will become more appealing to those people once they don't have cushy, guaranteed jobs that produce nothing useful for society. (Oh, and one last thing, I've never used a social safety net in my life either, but I sympathize for those who need it to avoid abject poverty.)
I'm all in favor of stimulus spending if and only if it is spent on something useful that has measurable returns to society. There are plenty of things that are useful that we could be doing instead of paying people to make bombs or build bridges to nowhere.
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Dan8267 says
I'm in full agreement. I just don't want Abe to think it's a simple matter to cut all that money and that it will have no consequences.
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Tatupu, agreed. Actually another problem would be if the military were cut WAY back, you'd have a lot of former vets looking for jobs that don't exist. In other words, the military provides "jobs" to millions of people that wouldn't otherwise have a job.
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Honest Abe says
The solution is that if people and the economy are dependent on government jobs, then the government should pay them to do something useful.
Welfare makes up only 12% of federal spending whereas the defense industry makes up 24%. Some people need welfare, but most are willing and able to work but can't find jobs.
So let's cut defense by 80% and reallocate that money and most of the welfare money to useful workfare in which we build up the infrastructure necessary for the 21st century. Things like
1. Nationwide fiberoptics
2. Smart power grids
3. Maglift highways and roads
4. Clean, sustainable energy
5. A nationwide curriculum for every field
6. Urban renewal
Just to name a few things.
There's no shortage of actual, useful work to be done. A recession, or worse yet, depression is simply the failure of capitalists to run the economy properly.
Best of all, the absorption of labor requires that the private sector pay better. And when the private sector gets off its ass and starts working, society can slowly and steadily convert public sector employees to private sector ones. But only if the private sector actually does its job.
And I have an idea of how to get the private sector to do its job. Make all those cushy public resources like the EM spectrum that are granted to private corporations contingent upon high employment and high wages. If a company like AT&T fails to provide this return, find another company that will and give it AT&T's spectrum. Now that's how you motivate capitalists, with revenue streams!
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Ruki says
Once again, you miss the point. Just because a function is vital, does not mean we have to devote an obscene amount of resources to it. Use common sense, man.
Ruki says
The federal government spends jack shit on education. The three big federal programs are the military, social security, and medicare. You have to address all three of these programs to reduce federal spending and the size of the federal government. To say otherwise is simply willful ignorance and stupidity.
You cannot have small government, low spending, low taxation, and no deficit while maintaining a massive empire! Get this through your thick skull. Small, effective government and empire are mutually exclusive.
It's like owning a McMansion in Florida and expecting your electricity bill to be small. It can't happen.
Why is Ron Paul the only Republican who understands this?
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Ruki says
OMG, you are Shrek! Welcome back!
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Ruki says
Seriously, stop getting your "facts" from Fox News.
The interest on the debt -- which is a terrible waste in my opinion -- is no where near defense spending. And we spend more on the defense industry than either social security or medicare.
And people actually pay into social security and medicare, they are not funded by the income tax like defense and they aren't discretionary spending.
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Ruki says
I've always contended that the people who know the least about what they are talking about argue the hardest. Ruki certainly proves that point with this one, big time.
Hey Ruki, there's this wonderful thing called google. Try it. Look up the breakdown of the budget. Then look into something called FICA. If ignorance is bliss then you are in a state of rapture.
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Ruki says
Yeah but it the fat soda drinkers and the aging boomers that are having to retire at 96 that are bankrupting this country.
Libs hate Granny, Mama, and fat people.
I mean besides White people that don't vote democrat.