I'm Proud To Rent!
By billdeegan Follow Wed, 20 Jun 2012, 12:05pm 4,590 views 63 comments
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DukeLaw says
....and which part of the 1990's was this?????
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Boulder Creek, CA
guruoracle says
ROFL sure you are.
I also find it amusing that after you bought you flipped into a tool.
guruoracle who has 12 comments said:
Why should I struggle and live a sh*tty life just to "own" a home?? I've done it before - twice in Dallas. I remember the endless trips to Home Depot where the people knew me by name and said I should get a part-time job there. Why would I want to go back to this again after struggling for years to scrape up a down payment just to make some greedy ole boomer or a bank richer?? Both my husband and I were born at the wrong time and the wrong place (NE Ohio). Why should I live a crappy life just to "own" a home? Right now we pay $2500/mo. (same rent for 3 years) for a 2,000 sq. ft home in Danville on a 1/2 acre. My landlord is great and we can live on one income if needed (my husband was out of work 1 1/2 years - no extra debt after he finally got a job!). I can retire early in 13 years and get the hell out of this crazy state where everything is overpriced. We all can't hit the housing lottery!!"
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Call it Crazy says
Sold the DC house in 05 and yes, I bought in 99. Rented for 6 years and just jumped back into the market.
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Los Angeles, CA
If this is the 'tha bottom' then the 6 years to bottom pattern from SoCal from last crash has repeated.
Prices peaked in 1989/90 then bottom was 95/96.
Peak Fraud was 06 now its 12.
It really looks like were bottomed as long as rates stay low, foreclosures take 3 yr avg, everyone gets underwater Refi, loan mods by the millions keep people from default. (all of these are here to stay IMO....even if Mit Or O are in the chair it wont matter)
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Madison, WI
Heck, I just can't swing the 3-5k property tax bill that comes with your average 100k priced fixer upper junker in the state I live in, I can rent a shared living space for that kind of money.
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PockyClipsNow says
Boy, that's a hell of a wish list...... (you forgot to mention JOBS..., ya know, the thing you need to PAY for the house)
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PockyClipsNow says
"Bottom" means prices no longer falling. I have news for you.... Housing prices are falling.
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Cash is what you pay to rent. If cash dramatically fails you could always line a nice cardboard box with it during the cold months. The banks are hovering just above junk status.
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San Jose, CA
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CaptainShuddup says
Wow South Florida sounds like quite a paradise. Transients, crack whores and pill heads? Even better reasons to buy!
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Umm and los Angeles is any different but with uglier beaches.
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Not really proud to rent,but really proud to rent when the same property needs twice the money to own!
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Corning, NY
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Stabilityfirst says
It probably needs more than a "little" TLC if you paid only $17k for it. ;-)
Housing is dirt-cheap where I live, but if you're paying less than $50k here it's definitely a "fixer-upper."
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wthrfrk80 says
That's what I was thinking too... I wonder what size trailer it really is...
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E-man says
I'm starting to think pat.net has jumped the shark. The folks that are left make Roberto and you look like housing bulls...
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tatupu70 says
I thought you were also part of the "Bull Squad" here???
Don't worry, everyone hopefully can learn to put down the kool-aid and back away from the table... All in time...
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Call it Crazy says
I know you do. Because anyone who doesn't think housing will go down 90% from peak is a permabull, right?
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tatupu70 says
Absolutely not... I doubt housing will drop 90% from peak but I definitely believe it's not done dropping. Actually, I hope it would level out, this would prevent a lot of pain for a bunch of people.
But looking at the facts, the economy, the job situation, the trends, the population, our government, etc. and it all points to more of the same... the housing market will continue to drop, how far and for how long, I have no idea....
Anyone who is a permabull really needs to get out more and take off the rose colored glasses...
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Call it Crazy says
Well that would makes sense considering housing prices are falling.
The reality is prices are still at the inflated levels of 2003. And remember.... the flat line is 1996 prices. Prices still have double digit percentages to fall yet.
Whats the hurry?
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wthrfrk80 says
It needs 15,000 worth of work and we are very pleased with that. Its OURS and it will be very nice once completed. We have alot of really good deals in Tennessee right now. We made an offer the same day it hit the market. It was a blessing just waiting for us after 3 years of looking and refusing to compromise. The owners live in New York and wanted it sold. It was just a blessing in disguise. We decided along time ago to stop worrying about what "PEOPLE" who dont pay our bills think. If everyone could just live the way they really want to, the housing crisis would be better off. We refuse to keep up with Joneses anymore(been there, done that, gotta t-shirt!) The joneses are now in FORECLOSURE! Our humble abode will be paid off in 1 year and at 3700 square feet, that's not bad.
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Call it Crazy says
Its not a trailer, but even it is, so what??? Alot of people live in Trailers and if it provides shelter and a place of refuge, that should be all that matters. Some people don't care about that kind of stuff and they choose to travel, etc. That's why the majority of the "RENTERS" are in the position they are in right now. "Big hats, no cattle". I'm very pleased with my home buying decision. We will own it in a year! I feel very blessed and priviledged to finally be among this group and to be able to travel and live debt free. Alot of people lost homes in the last 7 years, you would think we as a people would finally "get it".....46 million people are living in poverty right now. Honestly, I dont give a d@ about what you think!
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Corning, NY
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Stabilityfirst says
I wasn't trying to "knock" your purchase. I just find it amazing that you could get much of anything for that cheap unless it needed MAJOR repairs.
I'm actually jealous! ;-)
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Stabilityfirst says
That's great... I'm in the same boat to be blessed and priveledged to be able to travel and be debt free as a RENTER!!! Plus, I got a pile of equity money in my pocket from the sale of my last house that won't vaporize as house prices continue to drop....
Oh, and I won't be spending $15K of my money on a depreciating asset as well as lose multiple days and weekends being a slave laborer...
So, I'm happy that you're a new home owner... Good Luck!!
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Denver, CO
CaptainShuddup says
The places that I choose to rent are different than the places you have chosen to rent. Aside from the uncertainty I have had to deal with recently (which I gather is not all that common) I have had a great experience renting. There are advantages to owning to be sure, but there are also plenty of downsides. It comes down to personal circumstances and preferences in most cases. It happens that I can't afford to buy the type of house that I want in the area I want, but I can afford to rent (for a lot less money and commitment, I might add), so I do. I could overextend myself, move to a less desirable area, or (maybe) buy a house that I don't really like. None of those are as appealing to me as renting where I am...Renting isn't paradise, but it sure beats owning given my circumstances and preferences.
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Go ahead rent.
http://www.financialsense.com/contributors/ron-hera/fifteen-fundamental-problems-with-fiat-currencies
"Throughout history, schemes have been attempted whereby currencies that cost virtually nothing to produce, and that have no survival value, have been substituted for commodity money. Artificial money, known as ‘fiat currency’ has putative “value” simply because it is declared to have a value by a government or central bank. Fiat currency schemes replace the survival value of commodity money with subjective value and substitute a mere medium of exchange for natural commodity money. Modern currencies, including the U.S. dollar, the British pound, the euro and the Japanese yen, are all fiat currency schemes. As a practical matter, a fiat currency unit is worth whatever it can purchase but it is not a standard by which value can be measured because its purchasing power is unstable. In fact, there are several fundamental problems with fiat currencies."
"7. Economic Volatility – Since fiat currencies are loosely coupled to physical economic activity in the objective world, they tend to become increasingly de-coupled and eventually “un-tethered” over time. An economy is the aggregate of millions of independent, individual human actors and there is no way that those responsible for a fiat currency can guess the correct quantity, although they can recognize incorrect quantities after the fact by their consequences, e.g., credit booms, recessions, large-scale price bubbles and economic collapses, such as the Great Depression, which began only sixteen years after the U.S. Federal Reserve was established. Of course, economies can be volatile for many reasons. The effect of fiat currencies, however, is to greatly magnify economic volatility."
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Call it Crazy says
Not really. Economy had been improving for the last 2 years before Europe really hit the fan last couple of months. Job market has been improving for the 2 years. Population is increasing. Government incentives for housing remain the same. To what exaxctly do you refer?
Call it Crazy says
I agree. I don't know anyone here who is a permabull. I rented when the price/rent ratio was out of whack in 2006... Roberto sold all of his rentals, etc..
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tatupu70 says
Wow, I'm not even going to touch those ....
Put up the charts and data that support your statements.
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OK--here you go:
Notice the decline since late 2009. I'll grant that some of this is due to people falling off the rolls, but there has definitely been an improvement in jobs.
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And GDP:
Not as high as people would like, but much better than 2008 and 2009.
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Scottsdale, AZ
robertoaribas's website
I would have rented after I sold most of my homes in Phoenix, in 2005 and 2006. BUT with 3 big dogs, a cat, kayaks, all my power tools to fix homes, all of my cousins tools to fix cars... it would have been tough. So, despite feeling certain the market would collapse, I stayed in a home I owned in Tempe.
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ptiemann says
That home cost $230K, plus about $20K in rehab... mortgage was less than equivalent rent. At the very bottom it would have probably sold for $180K (it had gone up to nearly $400k at the peak...) today, it would likely sell for $230k again if I repainted and re carpeted it. so 7.5 years later, it is still lower in price in some sense... I refinanced it, and rented it when I bought my current home six months ago, it is cashflow positive by about $400 a month, and retires $250 a month in debt... THAT is why people don't always walk even when they are underwater, also, as claimed in another thread. It is 2.5 miles from ASU, and 2 of my cousins were living with me while doing their graduate studies at ASU.
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San Jose, CA
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Welcome renter nation. More power to renting if it makes financial sense to you. Why be tied down when you can be flexible moving at your own time?
Why buy now when ou can buy cheaper later next year? (no sarcasm). :o)
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Scottsdale, AZ
robertoaribas's website
why call me full of shit for keeping one home, and selling the rest/
If you weren't so stupid (aimed at the loser who keeps calling me a liar, full of shit, etc... not the rest of you), it would be easy to verify whether or not I'm full of shit... My name is unique, and www.maricopa.gov has all the records...
BUT as to why I didn't cash out my last home, I will explain that to you in simple terms, since you are slow:
1. I sold my north Scottsdale private residence home for $360K, pocketing a nice $160K increase in the 3.5 years I owned it, and I sold 4 other investment homes. That is a cash out, pocket the money, in case you can't understand it.
2. It is called hedging your bets. While I was reasonably sure housing would crash hard, the truth is, nobody knew for sure in advance, and quite simply, cashing out 80% of my investments, and keeping myself a place to live that I liked made perfect sense.
3. Both of my cousins entered ASU, and this home is easy bike ride to ASU. In fact, since they (and one of their girlfriends) rented rooms in my home, I actually have never paid a single cent of the mortgage ever... Heck, I've barely even paid the utilities!
4. Moving for those of you who live in a 3 floor walkup studio may be easy. Heck for many of the posters on here they could probably throw their stuff in the trunk of their dodge dart and drive to the new home! For me, 2 cousins + a girlfriend, 3 dogs, a cat, 3 kayak, a trailer to tow sandrails/rockclimbers, between us 10 bicycles, camping equipment, engine hoists, welding equipment, 1000's of pounds of car tools, all of my home remodeling tools, etc. etc. It took multiple trips with the biggest rental truck i could get, and several hired helpers. NOT something I'm going to do each year when a landlord decides not to renew a lease...
So please, more jealousy inspired insults...
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Renting is fantastic.
I'm renting a very large house in the Bay Area, to buy it would cost 3 times rent. LOL pretty typical for the expensive areas around here.
Been in it for 8 years, nice and stable. When the roof started leaking bad I just laughed. Poor landlord didn't though. Its in a slow slide area and when a retaining wall finally started tipping over too far I just laughed. Landlord didn't though... BIG BUCKS. Spacious wooden deck has started rotting in some spots, l just laugh...
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Scottsdale, AZ
robertoaribas's website
pazuzu says
If the mortgage on a 30 year loan is that much more than rent, then by all means rent! Far and away, that is the more intelligent course of action.
If I move out of the country in a few years, I may rent wherever I live. Why take on political risks, and the difficulties of foreign ownership? I may live in Chile for a year, then Argentina, then Italy... who knows...
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Excuse me...to the renter who keeps bragging about not having lost 100k to 200k in equity- You will NEVER HAVE EQUITY TO LOSE RENTING!!!!!! The equity will always go to your landlord, so what's your point??? I live in a southern state and just took advantage of the real estate market by buying a 3700 sqft home for $17,000 in a safe and very convenient neighborhood(it does need a little tlc), but it has tons of potential! After renting and putting up with other peoples properties and their bull, I am so blessed to be able to put roots down and own a piece of the earth- not to get EQUITY( which in time will be inevitable-dont you think???) but to have a stable dwelling for my family. There is nothing wrong with renting, if that's the best you can do-you are still paying for shelter, so I'm not putting renters down. However, they shouldnt bash home ownership either.
Oh and newsflash- with the economy being so uncertain and shadow inventory lurking- you renters putting down homeownership need to be careful and check the newspapers frequently lest your landlord becomes a victim of foreclosure- and poof, you are outta there- Still better to buy, even if its modest-its yours!
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RentingForHalfTheCost says
As long as you're happy with your decision, that's all that matters. Hope you enjoy your new pad.
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San Jose, CA
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ptiemann says
Ptiemann,
You see the trend of the dislike? You, Roberto and I all got 4 to 6 dislikes. We are the bulls in their eyes although we want to see stable to falling house prices. However, they just don't like our reporting on the ground. I guess it's best to stick the head in the sand. :o)
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Madison, WI
Living in a 900 sq. foot 3 bedroom house right now, the living room is empty, two bedrooms are empty, garage empty, I basically use the kitchen, bedroom, and bathroom only.
I'm paying over $100 a month in electric/heat, $40 a month for water, and $250 in property taxes, great deal, $400, but we finally sold the place, I think, whew. BUT, it's right next to a highway, even the PM2.5 is not bad, but present, along with rumbling trucks, gangsters pumping bass drive buys, bedroom is like 50 feet from the highway.
I just scored a two room rental just outside the city, heat, water, electric, plenty of storage, and a garage space included for $575 a month. I am so happy right now it's not even funny.
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We recently bought. But we rented for over 10 years and I rented an additional 8 years prior to that when I was single. So I'm no stranger to renting and I can definitely see and experienced its advantages. Everyone's situation is different. We got lucky because we were able to rent a large house with a yard for cheap and the LL never raised the rent. We did live with housemates, but that also meant rent was extremely affordable.
That said... the mantra that its "Cheaper to rent" isn't exactly as universally true anymore- at least not around here in the Bay Area. Had we needed to find another house like ours the rent would have been something like $2,500-$3,000. At that point buying became cheaper. So yeah- our house costs more per month than what we were paying in rent. But its the same if would have had to find a new rental.
Its funny how attitudes change and I feel like a hypocrite. But having our own house feels pretty damned nice. We saved money forever and its rewarding to actually have something to show as a result.
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edvard2 says
We recently bought too! We bought a fixer and now have over $100k of equity... We feel guilty too! We rented for over 8 years and I constantly find myself apologizing to my friends for owning a home! This is the first house we have owned in CA. After we refinance next month to get rid of PMI (because we didn't have rich family to give us a down payment!) we will have a payment which is lower than our rent. We live in a larger much nicer house which is in one of the better East Bay burbs. We could rent this house out for as much or more than our current house payment with PMI! I've looked on Craigslist and know how much rents are in the area. NO, I am not a troll and feel guilty after being a housing bear for years! I even put together a couple of meet-ups in LA for Ben's Housing Bubble Blog in '06 - '07. I was quite active on his blog for years and feel guilty about owning, but NOW it is better to own in certain situations. If you HAVE to live on the Peninsula or South Bay you will still pay out the ass for a house compared to rent, but here in East Bay there were deals earlier in the year. Now we are seeing the spring/summer bounce. I do expect prices to go down this winter, but I don't care since our payment will be lower than rent and I don't see rents going down significantly anytime soon.