The Assault on Honest Debate


By Patrick   Follow   Thu, 11 Oct 2012, 3:57pm   5,618 views   50 comments
In Menlo Park CA 94025   Watch (1)   Share   Quote   Permalink   Like   Dislike  

http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/0307952010/?tag=patricknet-20

An account of how Juan Williams got fired from NPR just for publicly saying that he felt uncomfortable sitting next to obviously Muslims people on airplanes. He didn't even say it on NPR! Shows how political correctness stifles debate -- and how the right wing does it too, maybe even more so.

« First     « Previous     Viewing Comments 11-50 of 50     Last »     See most liked comments

  1. Bap33


    Follow
    Befriend (3)
    17 threads
    3,488 comments

    11   8:34am Wed 21 Nov 2012   Share   Quote   Permalink   Like   Dislike (5)  

    I'm pretty sure it has been anyone but conservatives that put legalized dope or male/male coupling on a ballot in California. So, one can't accuse the mythical right (which is actually just the "normal") of taking any action other than reacting. Kinda like Isreal has to react to the actions of the murdering thug arabs. Interesting how the left thinks Isreal should not defend itself, much like they hate to see Christians defend their convictions.

    Now, it is true that California conservatives did put Prop 187 on the ballot, and it passed, and an activist liberal leftist judge halted the vote of the people. I wonder, how the leftists in Cal would react if one of their pet props passed at the ballot box but was then halted by a court ... hmmm ... funny, that just aint happened. The left relys on court, not the right. The right gets beat-up in court due to the liberal bias and constitution revesionists that populate the court system.

    As for Political Correctness, the leftists can spew hate about Palin in the most crude of ways and get cheers and a raise, Imus can say nappy and almost get fired, Jimmy the Greek did get fired for saying an absolute fact. I can't find where a leftist was let go for spewing more leftist hate. Anywhere in America. THe left has no standards of behavior, other than hate Christians, hate straight white males, hate conservative values, hate right, hate good, hate honest, hate morality, hate Isreal, hate God ,... the left is the couldron of hate. Up is down in this world infected with liberalism and drug abuse.

  2. iwog


    Follow
    Befriend (46)
    393 threads
    20,829 comments
    47 male
    Lafayette, CA
    Premium

    12   8:55am Wed 21 Nov 2012   Share   Quote   Permalink   Like (1)   Dislike  

    CaptainShuddup says

    If you're not allowed to voice your opinion, then there's only one view.

    Since when have you voiced an opinion?

    A blind assertion is not an opinion unless you can explain why you think it is correct. Time and time again you've refused to give reasons for anything.......even why you thought Romney would be better than Obama.

    I don't know if it's fear of being wrong or simply inability to express yourself but I certainly hope it doesn't indicate a complete lack of support because then you're just echoing someone else.

  3. Dan8267


    Follow
    Befriend (17)
    1,074 threads
    13,793 comments
    Boca Raton, FL

    13   9:00am Wed 21 Nov 2012   Share   Quote   Permalink   Like   Dislike  

    CaptainShuddup says

    Obama is still president when I change the channel or turn off the TV.

    This is exactly why you should have protested when Bush and his cronies stole the election in 2000. Al Gore was elected by any proper counting of electoral votes. Had he become president as the votes said, then Obama would have never even been picked by Harry Reid to run for president.

    See, you could have had an Obama-free America. All you had to do was refrain from releasing the Bush/Cheney evil administration on the world.

  4. CaptainShuddup


    Follow
    Befriend (1)
    1,046 threads
    12,885 comments

    14   9:02am Wed 21 Nov 2012   Share   Quote   Permalink   Like   Dislike (1)  

    Bap33 says

    THe left has no standards of behavior, other than hate Christians, hate straight white males, hate conservative values, hate right, hate good, hate honest, hate morality, hate Isreal, hate God ,... the left is the couldron of hate. Up is down in this world infected with liberalism and drug abuse.

    Yes, they have discovered you can do a lot with a little hate.

  5. iwog


    Follow
    Befriend (46)
    393 threads
    20,829 comments
    47 male
    Lafayette, CA
    Premium

    15   9:02am Wed 21 Nov 2012   Share   Quote   Permalink   Like   Dislike  

    CaptainShuddup says

    Even though attendance in any church denomination has NEVER been lower, EVER!

    This is another lie, this time said with emphasis.

    http://www.toledoblade.com/Religion/2011/02/18/U-S-Canadian-church-growth-trends-persist-2.html

  6. iwog


    Follow
    Befriend (46)
    393 threads
    20,829 comments
    47 male
    Lafayette, CA
    Premium

    16   9:07am Wed 21 Nov 2012   Share   Quote   Permalink   Like (2)   Dislike  

    CaptainShuddup says

    Bap33 says

    THe left has no standards of behavior, other than hate Christians, hate straight white males, hate conservative values, hate right, hate good, hate honest, hate morality, hate Isreal, hate God ,... the left is the couldron of hate. Up is down in this world infected with liberalism and drug abuse.

    Yes, they have discovered you can do a lot with a little hate.

    I prove this statement to be totally false and there are millions more just like me.

    The only reason you believe nonsense like this is because Fox will run a news story on election day 21 FUCKING TIMES about a single black man suspected of being a black panther doing nothing more than standing in front of a polling station. (legally) Right wing media takes isolated examples of extremism, or even fake extremism, and amplifies them so people think they represent all liberals.

    Again most people on the right do not live in a reality based world and I dare say there are a billion easily proved examples.

  7. CaptainShuddup


    Follow
    Befriend (1)
    1,046 threads
    12,885 comments

    17   9:08am Wed 21 Nov 2012   Share   Quote   Permalink   Like   Dislike (1)  

    Dan8267 says

    Al Gore was elected by any proper counting of electoral votes. Had he become president as the votes said, then Obama would have never even been picked by Harry Reid to run for president.

    Nope! that's not how it went down at all. That was AFTER the Nader nation told the Left to go get bent for blaming us for not voting for Al give me a fucking break Gore. They spent a whole week blaming us, like we would have gotten off the couch if Nader hadn't run in the election.
    After that went no where they then started blaming the GOP for winning.

    NOW the fundamental difference between 2000 and 2012, the Republicans aren't calling for a recount, recall or any other Liberal concoction to silent the voice of those spoken. We're more dissapointed in the gullible poor and Hispanics for believing that Obama is going to do anything for them. They should have asked the youth.

    Even with the Liberal Victory nothing in Washington can get done with out John Boehner's permission. So tell me, who won?

    Gotta go Papa Boehner is calling.
    " Hey John can we have higher taxes on the top 1%?"
    "FUCK NO!"
    Well can't blame a guy for asking...

  8. iwog


    Follow
    Befriend (46)
    393 threads
    20,829 comments
    47 male
    Lafayette, CA
    Premium

    18   9:15am Wed 21 Nov 2012   Share   Quote   Permalink   Like   Dislike  

    CaptainShuddup says

    NOW the fundamental difference between 2000 and 2012, the Republicans aren't calling for a recount, recall or any other Liberal concoction to silent the voice of those spoken.

    Aaaaaaand the lies keep on coming. Did you forget Al Franken? The fact he was prevented from taking his seat in the Senate for 6 months thereby preventing Democrats from having a legally obtained super majority?????

    Again it appears almost everything you know is simply made up. You've gotten so bad it is becoming a fricken joke.

  9. CaptainShuddup


    Follow
    Befriend (1)
    1,046 threads
    12,885 comments

    19   9:15am Wed 21 Nov 2012   Share   Quote   Permalink   Like   Dislike  

    CaptainShuddup says

    NOW the fundamental difference between 2000 and 2012

    iwog says

    The fact he was prevented from taking his seat in the Senate for 6 months thereby preventing Democrats from having a legally obtained super majority?????

    I'm sorry was Al Fucking Franken on the 2012 presidential ballot?

  10. iwog


    Follow
    Befriend (46)
    393 threads
    20,829 comments
    47 male
    Lafayette, CA
    Premium

    20   9:18am Wed 21 Nov 2012   Share   Quote   Permalink   Like (1)   Dislike  

    CaptainShuddup says

    I'm sorry was Al Fucking Franken on the 2012 presidential ballot?

    Oh I see how it works. The 2000 election is relevant but the 2008 election isn't. For some reason I thought you were making a sweeping generalization about how liberals seek to silence the vote, NOT critiquing the 2012 election itself.

    But of course that is exactly what you were doing and 2008 destroys your argument completely.

    Next?

  11. Dan8267


    Follow
    Befriend (17)
    1,074 threads
    13,793 comments
    Boca Raton, FL

    21   9:25am Wed 21 Nov 2012   Share   Quote   Permalink   Like (3)   Dislike  

    Bap33 says

    THe left has no standards of behavior, other than hate Christians, hate straight white males, hate conservative values, hate right, hate good, hate honest, hate morality, hate Isreal, hate God ,... the left is the couldron of hate. Up is down in this world infected with liberalism and drug abuse.

    On Christians

    Hating Christians who hate fags and others is perfectly ok. 2000 years of utterly disguising and evil behavior from the Inquisition to the Holocaust certainly justifies hatred.

    When Christians stop behaving so abysmally, I'll start to respect them.

    On hatred of the white man

    Granted I'm not a leftist, but you often use the terms left and liberal as if they meant the same thing, so... I don't hate straight, white men. Last time I check, I was a straight, white man. It's just that I don't hate gay, black men either. I don't see it as a zero-sum game.

    Now the left is certainly guilty of man hating and race-baiting. So I can't defend them on that. However, the right is also guilty of gay hating and racism. And really, aren't these things all the same thing, bigotry?

    On conservative values

    Conservative values used to mean self-reliance, putting back more than you took, and working hard and honestly. Today, none of these things is true.

    Conservatives promote corporate welfare and the largest socialist jobs program, the defense industry, which produces no wealth and in fact destroys wealth and global stability. Conservatives do not value self-reliance no matter how much lip service they pay to it. I, however, do.

    Conservatives are pro-pollution because it increases profit margins for corporations by shifting the costs of production from the corporation to society at large (something that Bap says should be consider immoral because it goes against the interest of the groups -- oh wait, that's gay sex). Polluting is the very essence of taking more than you put back. It diminishes the world.

    Consuming non-renewable resources like fossil fuels also diminishes the world and is taking more than you put back. A true conservative, by the old standards, would be very much against fossil fuel use.

    Finally, as demonstrated by Wall Street and the banks, conservatives most certainly don't believe in honesty or hard work. In fact, the conservative dream is to gain as much wealth while doing as little honest, hard work as possible.

    No, today "conservative values" is just code for bigotry against gays, all non-whites, all non-Christians, and all foreigners. That's why conservative values are a joke to everyone who isn't a conservative.

    On right, good, honest, and morality

    Conservatives have such a fucked up view of what these things are, it's no wonder that everyone else in the world has opposing ideas on this.

    On Israel

    I live in Boca Raton. Most of the Jews here vote democrat and are very left of what you consider the center. I hear Hollywood is full of liberal and leftist Jews. I don't think you have much ground to stand on.

    On god

    God doesn't exist. Therefore it is impossible to hate him. I can't hate Moby Dick for the same reason.

    On drug abuse

    The right likes to demonize any drug that isn't patented while letting horrible drugs go to market provided they result in corporate profits. The left simply wants to treat drug addiction as a medical problem rather than a criminal one. The right wants it to be a criminal problem in order to suppress minority votes. The right has no problem electing a coke-head president.

    Need I remind you of all the conservatives addicted to legal drugs like Oxycontin.

  12. upisdown


    Follow
    Befriend
    1 threads
    1,618 comments

    22   9:41am Wed 21 Nov 2012   Share   Quote   Permalink   Like   Dislike  

    Dan,

    You left out how the white, male christian is oppressed and being screwed over constantly by an unfair and unjust system or society.

    In other words, you left out the right's resorting to the victim when they get called out on their BS.

  13. Bap33


    Follow
    Befriend (3)
    17 threads
    3,488 comments

    23   3:54pm Wed 21 Nov 2012   Share   Quote   Permalink   Like   Dislike (1)  

    I am not pro pollution. But, the fact that I (my on-line personage) was tossed into the line of fire with a big red target on my back for sharing a conservative view, does not indicate a hate filled leftist/liberal montra of hate at all ... not one bit ... parish the thought.

  14. Dan8267


    Follow
    Befriend (17)
    1,074 threads
    13,793 comments
    Boca Raton, FL

    24   4:58pm Wed 21 Nov 2012   Share   Quote   Permalink   Like (2)   Dislike  

    upisdown says

    Dan,

    You left out how the white, male christian is oppressed and being screwed over constantly by an unfair and unjust system or society.

    In other words, you left out the right's resorting to the victim when they get called out on their BS.

    Christians are favored by the law and court systems, and that is clearly wrong.

    Whites aren't discriminated against by the police, but white skin won't save your ass from the prison industry. Whites are discriminated against under Affirmative Action, and that is wrong. Just because most CEOs are white doesn't mean most whites are CEOs. Most whites have no privileges. Ditto for male vs. female.

    Men are severely discriminated against in the family court system. It's barbaric how men have been treated in that court system for the past 40 years. This is the prime reason that marriage rates have declined so much.

    Yes, the right does whine about b.s. that doesn't reflect reality such as Obama being a socialist, their guns being taken away, the war on Christmas, etc. However, there are quire a few violations of civil rights that white men experience. Civil rights ain't a black/white issue, it's a human issue. In order to protect your rights, you have to protect everybody else's.

    And the greatest threat to civil rights come from bureaucracies and corporations who don't care about anything but money and power. Skin color and religion mean nothing to those monsters. A simple typo can and has resorted in Swat teams barging in at gunpoint on innocent people. A data entry error could send your ass to some secret foreign torture dungeon courtesy of Uncle Sam.

  15. Dan8267


    Follow
    Befriend (17)
    1,074 threads
    13,793 comments
    Boca Raton, FL

    25   5:01pm Wed 21 Nov 2012   Share   Quote   Permalink   Like   Dislike  

    Bap33 says

    I am not pro pollution.

    So then, like me, you believe that all of the following should be banned:
    - coal production and use
    - fracking
    - offshore oil drilling
    - transportation of oil by ship

  16. Bap33


    Follow
    Befriend (3)
    17 threads
    3,488 comments

    26   9:45pm Wed 21 Nov 2012   Share   Quote   Permalink   Like   Dislike (2)  

    nope, I do not agree with all of those limitations as presented.

    If you are being dramatic, then don't exhale. If you exhale you are polluting.

    man changes matter into energy. That is what the matter's value is.

    I do think Tesla had free energy figured out. Anti-gravity too. But, nobody seems to be going that way since the Nazi's stopped reverse engineering the saucers they found.

  17. Kevin


    Follow
    Befriend
    41 threads
    2,655 comments

    27   2:40am Fri 23 Nov 2012   Share   Quote   Permalink   Like (2)   Dislike  

    In the entire history of the world, there has never been so much government control over individual families, their livelihoods, how much they are supposed to spend and even how much time they get to spend with their own kids. How they are supposed to raise their kids is now determined by the government -in case one party disagrees.

    'cept for the entire 5000+ year period where we had slavery, serfdom, and various forms of dictatorships ruling the world.

    Bap33 says

    If you are being dramatic, then don't exhale. If you exhale you are polluting.

    Only according to the EPA, and they're just using a loophole in the law to try to deal with a problem. Excessive CO2 is a problem, but CO2 itself isn't a pollutant. The activities that Dan mentioned all result in a lot of very real pollution though, such as oil and other things that are bad for humans to consume getting into the water supply or sulfur getting into the air.

    Bap33 says

    man changes matter into energy. That is what the matter's value is.

    You might want to revisit highschool physics.

    Bap33 says

    I do think Tesla had free energy figured out. Anti-gravity too. But, nobody seems to be going that way since the Nazi's stopped reverse engineering the saucers they found.

    ...or reality.

  18. lostand confused


    Follow
    Befriend (9)
    554 threads
    3,229 comments

    28   2:56am Fri 23 Nov 2012   Share   Quote   Permalink   Like   Dislike  

    Kevin says

    'cept for the entire 5000+ year period where we had slavery, serfdom, and various forms of dictatorships ruling the world.

    Nope that affected portions of the population. Dictatorships never went into family law and mandated how much time you spent with your kids and how much money you have to pay to the kid and the ex and force you to maintain them in the life they have been accumsted to.

    Slavery, war, kings were all part and parcel of our history-but never was there a system where the governemnt controls each and every citizen and determines what is good for each and every one of them and takes a choice away for everyone.

    Not only does an individual-or specifically males-in this country have no freedom in terms of family, we also throw more people in jail than any country in the world. Not even dictatorship come close to us.

  19. Bap33


    Follow
    Befriend (3)
    17 threads
    3,488 comments

    29   5:52am Fri 23 Nov 2012   Share   Quote   Permalink   Like   Dislike (2)  

    Kevin says

    Bap33 says

    man changes matter into energy. That is what the matter's value is.
    You might want to revisit highschool physics.

    when you burn a log, you change the matter into energy ... or, you can say you release the energy trapped inside the matter and seperate the matter into diferent compounds, or you can go google it and use that explaination, but what I said is what we do with matter to get energy. We use it. When we use heat, it was created by burning matter -- including El Sol.

    Gravity (dam power) and Windmill both rely on magnetics to exchange energy.

    You eat an apple, you use the matter and change it into energy.

    You shouldn't allow your hate to keep you from having an open mind about Tesla's works, or DiVinci's, or Moses' Ark.

  20. bgamall4


    Follow
    Befriend (11)
    1,270 threads
    8,140 comments
    64 male
    Las Vegas, NV
    bgamall4's website
    Premium

    30   8:53pm Sat 24 Nov 2012   Share   Quote   Permalink   Like   Dislike  

    Juan Williams schmoozes with the right continually. If you have scummy friends, it eventually rubs off!

  21. bgamall4


    Follow
    Befriend (11)
    1,270 threads
    8,140 comments
    64 male
    Las Vegas, NV
    bgamall4's website
    Premium

    31   8:55pm Sat 24 Nov 2012   Share   Quote   Permalink   Like   Dislike  

    Dan8267 says

    Hating Christians who hate fags and others is perfectly ok. 2000 years of utterly disguising and evil behavior from the Inquisition to the Holocaust certainly justifies hatred.

    When Christians stop behaving so abysmally, I'll start to respect them.

    Just because a person says he is a Christian doesn't mean that he is. State, sacral religion goes against a simple teaching of Christ, that His kingdom is not of this world. Anyone seeking to fuse church and state is not really a Christian. Dominionism is not Christian.

  22. Peter P


    Follow
    Befriend (5)
    131 threads
    19,811 comments
    Premium

    32   9:44pm Sat 24 Nov 2012   Share   Quote   Permalink   Like   Dislike  

    Dan8267 says

    And the greatest threat to civil rights come from bureaucracies and corporations who don't care about anything but money and power.

    No. The greatest threat to civil rights comes from the belief that money and power are evil.

    A perfectly greedy person has no prejudice.

  23. Peter P


    Follow
    Befriend (5)
    131 threads
    19,811 comments
    Premium

    33   9:46pm Sat 24 Nov 2012   Share   Quote   Permalink   Like (1)   Dislike  

    Poverty is not a virtue.

    Charity is as much a virtue as a fine painting is.

    Reflect on this.

  24. curious2


    Follow
    Befriend (4)
    118 threads
    4,508 comments

    34   9:48pm Sat 24 Nov 2012   Share   Quote   Permalink   Like (1)   Dislike  

    Bap33 says

    You shouldn't allow your hate to keep you from having an open mind about Tesla's works, or DiVinci's,

    Funny to see Bap write that, since he would have hanged da Vinci (note spelling) for "male/male coupling." Religious fanatics trying to kill everyone who doesn't agree with them, e.g. Bap69 saying liberals and gays are mentally defective and need to be hanged, are a much worse threat than NPR. That isn't to dismiss Juan Williams' legitimate point, but at least Juan remains alive and certainly has not been muzzled; he remains free to debate, unlike those killed by the Inquisition for heresy and those Bap and his ilk would kill if they ever get power again. If Juan becomes the target of a fatwah, or if Bap gets a chance to hang him, NPR may turn out to be the least of his worries.

  25. Peter P


    Follow
    Befriend (5)
    131 threads
    19,811 comments
    Premium

    35   9:50pm Sat 24 Nov 2012   Share   Quote   Permalink   Like (1)   Dislike  

    "Liberal" is just a label.

    e.g.

    I am a classically liberal neo-liberal. This earns me a "conservative" label in this country.

  26. Kevin


    Follow
    Befriend
    41 threads
    2,655 comments

    36   11:33pm Sat 24 Nov 2012   Share   Quote   Permalink   Like   Dislike  

    lostand confused says

    Nope that affected portions of the population. Dictatorships never went into family law and mandated how much time you spent with your kids and how much money you have to pay to the kid and the ex and force you to maintain them in the life they have been accumsted to.

    Oh, bitter divorcee. Sorry. I've never had a rational argument with one of these, so I won't bother.

    lostand confused says

    Slavery, war, kings were all part and parcel of our history-but never was there a system where the governemnt controls each and every citizen and determines what is good for each and every one of them and takes a choice away for everyone.

    This is true. There has *never* been such a system. I sure hope there never is!

  27. Kevin


    Follow
    Befriend
    41 threads
    2,655 comments

    37   11:37pm Sat 24 Nov 2012   Share   Quote   Permalink   Like   Dislike  

    Bap33 says

    You shouldn't allow your hate to keep you from having an open mind about Tesla's works, or DiVinci's, or Moses' Ark.

    Two of those people were brilliant men with brilliant ideas, one is a fairy tale for children. Making ridiculous claims about things that a legitimate brilliant scientist did is a terrible way to have a discussion.

    As far as the rest of your post...you have a very poor grasp of physics. I'm glad to see nothing has changed in the last 4 years.

  28. marcus


    Follow
    Befriend (5)
    208 threads
    7,726 comments

    38   10:42am Sun 25 Nov 2012   Share   Quote   Permalink   Like (2)   Dislike (1)  

    CaptainShuddup says

    NOW the fundamental difference between 2000 and 2012

    The difference is that Gore won the popular vote, and arguably won Florida.

    This time is no comparison. Obama wins the popular vote by about 3% and the electoral by over 100. What are you talking about ?

    You actually think that if it had been so close that Obama only one by one state, and that state was won by a few hundred votes that republicans wouldn't be crying out for a recount ?

    Wtf, man ? There are many thousands that are calling for secession !

  29. Bellingham Bill


    Follow
    Befriend
    80 threads
    3,301 comments
    Bellingham, WA

    39   11:27am Sun 25 Nov 2012   Share   Quote   Permalink   Like (3)   Dislike  

    marcus says

    There are many thousands that are calling for secession !

    to be fair, most signatories to the petition are liberals wishing the conservatives *would* GTFO.

  30. CaptainShuddup


    Follow
    Befriend (1)
    1,046 threads
    12,885 comments

    40   12:57pm Sun 25 Nov 2012   Share   Quote   Permalink   Like (1)   Dislike (1)  

    Just get Ben Bernanke to say there isn't a secession, and the whole business will be forgotten.

  31. curious2


    Follow
    Befriend (4)
    118 threads
    4,508 comments

    41   1:00pm Sun 25 Nov 2012   Share   Quote   Permalink   Like   Dislike  

    CaptainShuddup says

    Just get Ben Bernanke to say there isn't a secession, and the whole business will be forgotten

    LOL - let Uncle Ben print confederate currency and in 10 years their economy will burst and collapse!

  32. lostand confused


    Follow
    Befriend (9)
    554 threads
    3,229 comments

    42   1:16pm Sun 25 Nov 2012   Share   Quote   Permalink   Like   Dislike  

    Kevin says

    lostand confused says



    Nope that affected portions of the population. Dictatorships never went into family law and mandated how much time you spent with your kids and how much money you have to pay to the kid and the ex and force you to maintain them in the life they have been accumsted to.


    Oh, bitter divorcee. Sorry. I've never had a rational argument with one of these, so I won't bother.


    lostand confused says



    Slavery, war, kings were all part and parcel of our history-but never was there a system where the governemnt controls each and every citizen and determines what is good for each and every one of them and takes a choice away for everyone.


    This is true. There has *never* been such a system. I sure hope there never is!

    Wrong on both counts. I have never been married, though might finally settle down-found a nice woman who makes as much as me. The system is the modern family court system.

    But go on cast personal insults-when there are none to be cast and keep talking gibberish-because as usual you have no worthwile arguments.

  33. Bap33


    Follow
    Befriend (3)
    17 threads
    3,488 comments

    43   1:53pm Sun 25 Nov 2012   Share   Quote   Permalink   Like   Dislike (2)  

    Kevin says

    one is a fairy tale for children.

    are you suggesting there was no Hebrew named Moses that led away Hebrew slaves (a historical person) or just not a Moses that did what the Bible said (Ten Commndments, Ark, ect)?

    Kevin says

    As far as the rest of your post...you have a very poor grasp of physics. I'm glad to see nothing has changed in the last 4 years.

    Bap33 says

    Kevin says



    Bap33 says


    man changes matter into energy. That is what the matter's value is.
    You might want to revisit highschool physics.


    when you burn a log, you change the matter into energy ... or, you can say you release the energy trapped inside the matter and seperate the matter into diferent compounds, or you can go google it and use that explaination, but what I said is what we do with matter to get energy. We use it. When we use heat, it was created by burning matter -- including El Sol.


    Gravity (dam power) and Windmill both rely on magnetics to exchange energy.


    You eat an apple, you use the matter and change it into energy.


    You shouldn't allow your hate to keep you from having an open mind about Tesla's works, or DiVinci's, or Moses' Ark.

    ok, now this:
    http://www.ehow.com/about_6657743_burning-fuels-produce-similar-pollutants_.html

    A very green view of how matter is used to make energy. I must be using a term or something you do not like, but I really cant see your point. I will not be upset if you plainly explain your point about my view, and let me know what I said that is wrong.

  34. Bellingham Bill


    Follow
    Befriend
    80 threads
    3,301 comments
    Bellingham, WA

    44   2:16pm Sun 25 Nov 2012   Share   Quote   Permalink   Like   Dislike  

    Bap33 says

    I must be using a term or something you do not like, but I really cant see your point.

    As for the matter vs. energy thing, matter can store potential energy in its chemical bonds.

    Plants take the incident energy of photons hitting specific molecules in their leaves and transform water and carbon molecules into sugars, which have a higher embedded chemical energy than the constituent particles.

    When we intentionally rapidly oxidize ("burn") these sugars, this embedded chemical energy is released as radiation, which we perceive as heat and light at our human scale of understanding.

    But matter is conserved in this process, so matter is not actually turning into energy -- the atoms just come through it in a different, lower energy, configuration compared to how they were arranged before being burned.

    As for the old testament, I think beyond a certain point it's no more historical than the Mormon "bible" is. Where that point is is of course open for debate, LOL.

  35. Bap33


    Follow
    Befriend (3)
    17 threads
    3,488 comments

    45   2:45pm Sun 25 Nov 2012   Share   Quote   Permalink   Like   Dislike (1)  

    Bellingham Bill says

    When we intentionally rapidly oxidize ("burn") these sugars, this embedded chemical energy is released as radiation

    and I said, "or, you can say you release the energy trapped inside the matter and seperate the matter into diferent compounds"

    I think I grasp this pretty well .... but, this example is only talking about burning a bio source. We can burn rocks, that have no sugars, and release energy too. So, I just kept it simple. My bad.

  36. Bellingham Bill


    Follow
    Befriend
    80 threads
    3,301 comments
    Bellingham, WA

    46   3:14pm Sun 25 Nov 2012   Share   Quote   Permalink   Like   Dislike  

    Bap33 says

    We can burn rocks, that have no sugars, and release energy too.

    actually we're just rearranging the carbon-compound chemical bonds in fossil fuels, too. The organic matter that became fossil fuels was the product of photosynthesis, too, for that matter.

    "organic' techincally means carbon-based, btw.

    2H₂ + O₂ → 2H₂O exothermic reaction has no carbon in it, LOL. Thermite, and lime + aluminum are also non-organic power sources.

    As are electrical batteries like lead acid (lead + hydrogen sulfate), NiCd and lithium polymer . . .

  37. Bap33


    Follow
    Befriend (3)
    17 threads
    3,488 comments

    47   6:08pm Mon 26 Nov 2012   Share   Quote   Permalink   Like   Dislike (1)  

    now we are on the same page .... matter = energy, and energy = matter.

    matter is a compound of atoms that move around when they gain energy and when they lose energy.

    My dry cell Optima battery is really nice.

  38. Vicente


    Follow
    Befriend (8)
    270 threads
    6,057 comments
    Davis, CA

    48   1:55pm Wed 28 Nov 2012   Share   Quote   Permalink   Like (3)   Dislike  

    Juan's core polemic is pointedly ignorant horseshit.

    Look, he works for large entity which makes money. Whether it's NPR or it's Fox News, they own the microphone. You do or say something that offends your employer's sensibilities, you are history.

    You want absolute "free speech" without worrying about getting fired, then buy your own microphone.

    Pretending otherwise is like he's just discovered something everyone else has known since the beginnings of mass media. You think a reporter employed by William Randolph Hearst wrote any stories about the wonders of hemp?

  39. curious2


    Follow
    Befriend (4)
    118 threads
    4,508 comments

    49   2:03pm Wed 28 Nov 2012   Share   Quote   Permalink   Like   Dislike  

    Vicente says

    You think a reporter employed by William Randolph Hearst wrote any stories about the wonders of hemp?

    This question reminds me of a famous story about Hearst, which even Orson Welles acknowledged by presenting it in the movie Citizen Kaine. Hearst fell in love with a talented Vaudeville-type comedic showgirl named Marion Davies, and he pressured her to sing serious opera which seemed to him more dignified. A Hearst theater critic, who was also a drunkard, wrote a scathing review but passed out at his desk, missing his deadline. Hearst completed the negative review and ran it, then fired the writer for being drunk on the job and missing the deadline. Hearst was also famous for dinner parties at San Simeon where he invited people who disagreed totally about everything.

  40. Bap33


    Follow
    Befriend (3)
    17 threads
    3,488 comments

    50   3:02pm Wed 28 Nov 2012   Share   Quote   Permalink   Like   Dislike (1)  

    Vicente says

    You want absolute "free speech" without worrying about getting fired, then buy your own microphone.

    100% correct.

« First     « Previous comments    

Premium member Patrick is moderator of this thread.

Email

Username

Watch comments by email
Home   Tips and Tricks   Questions or suggestions? Mail p@patrick.net   Thank you for your kind donations

Page took 352 milliseconds to create.