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Permalink Like (1) Dislike Multigenerational Households On Rise; Boomerang Students Return Home; What's the Impact on Housing Demand?
http://globaleconomicanalysis.blogspot.com/2012/10/multigenerational-households-on-rise.html
Mish
Not aware of anyone else doing this math
But it was simple enough
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506 comments
Los Angeles, CA
1950's - '90s was false prosperity. Multigenerational households have been the norm for centuries. We're simply reverting to the feudal system.
There are still a lot of undesirable homes in exurbs and one-horse towns that don't need to be lived in. The impact this has on housing will have no impact on high fallutin' properties in Big Cities.
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This is Amereka,we don't understand no stinkin math. lol
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Also 5 to 6 late 20 somethings flopping together like a band of people usually from other cultures and countries. I say flopping, because this is different than roommate situations, where everyone has jobs, and the bills are split right down the middle.
Now this wouldn't be strange for a bunch of 17-college aged young adults. But historically by 21, young adults have been keen to get their own pad and their own space and pay their own way.
It's really strange, and if you invite one of those people over for a drink he brings the whole house of moochers in tow.
The other really weird thing about it is, I'm more concerned about their future than THEY are. As one of those folks told me...
"I hear you talk about how it used to be. But this is how it's been our whole adult life. For us this is normal, we were just getting in Jr. High School when Bush got in office. And our first election we followed with any interest was Obama in 08. We've never known a life where you're supposed to have a job, a car, and your own pad by time you're 21-24. "
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33 male
Fort Mill, SC
CaptainShuddup says
I see thoughts like this from baby boomers all the time. What you don't understand is your generations greediness has caused it to be this way.
Boomers were between 17 and 35 when Reagan rushed into office, cut taxes, exploded the deficit and basically pushed the snowball down the hill.
As that snowball grew and grew, taking out education, infrastructure, health care, and most of the middle class, you guys didn't give a shit. You got your good job out of high school or college and lived pretty high on the hog.
Now that the snowball has turned into an avalanche and is heading straight for social secuirty and medicare right when you guys are starting to need them, you want to "reform entitlements." But not for you, nor anyone over the age of 55. (Lets see, its been 32 years since Reagan swept into office, so that makes 55 year olds 23 in 1980. Yep, the tail end of the baby boom)
So let me get this straight:
1. You guys didn't want to fight in a war when you were kids, but when you were in charge you had no problem sending us into 2 wars.
2. You guys didn't mind increasing government spending while you were working because it might spur demand for your services, but now that you are retiring we should slash government spending.
3. You never wanted to pay for any of the stuff you wanted, in fact, you wore that Mastercard out. We aren't surprised you don't want to pay for it now...
4. You want us to cut everything EXCEPT the stuff you need, like Medicare or Social Security. And you'll cut that too, just not until after you don't need it anymore.
5. Because you wasted your savings chasing every "get rich quick" scheme in the book, be it junk bonds, tech stocks, or McMansions, or (now) gold, you can't retire - that would open up your job to us. We have college degrees but can't take your job selling insurance because your too busy playing golf and collecting premium checks from customers you have had for 20 years.
6. We know you don't believe in climate change but we notice that the tropical hurricane bearing down on New York City right now in near November seems a bit odd...
7. And we are the ones who are not concerned for our future?
Spare me, oldtimer. If YOU are concerned with MY future then you would happily pony up more cash. Don't tell me how concerned you are, SHOW ME. Pay up Grandpa.
Otherwise, shut up. Your kids are trying to fix this mess.
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33 male
Fort Mill, SC
Or in other words,
"We've spent the last 30 years stealing this from the poor and middle class. What? You want some of it back? Get out of my house you thief."
"CONSTABLE! Class Warfare!"
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I blame Michel Moore's phantom 1%.
You're really rich, first I'm not a baby boomer.
Second, last I remember, my Mom and Dad didn't have any voting power in Congress. Not in the 80's and most certainly not during Obama's first 2 years in office, when he had a filibuster proof administration. You can say what you want about the Baby boomers, but they didn't sit around blaming everyone else for their failures. And they knew how to throw a Bum out of office, they didn't keep a no good rotten son of a bitch around, because they felt the need to tow the party line. And they were Carter/Mondale delegates in 76. And Son, no body loathed Reagan more than my father did.
So blow it out your OWS, confused, frustrated, misguided, no job, no prospect, and no respect Ass. Dodd, Frank, Reid and Pelosi will be along any minute now to help you out. After they call their financial planner and move their positions based on how they voted in the senate today.
But keep blaming the little old lady down the street, yeah that will fix things.
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33 male
Fort Mill, SC
CaptainShuddup says
You may not be a baby boomer but you sure sound like one. That being the case, none of the criticism I previously laid out applies to you.
Why are you offended then?
CaptainShuddup says
And as I was wrong to assume you were a baby boomer, your classification of me here is incorrect.
OWS: I agree with the central theme. I haven't smoked pot or camped in 15 years however.
Confused: Convinced.
Misguided: Well we will see, won't we. About a week until the accuracy of what "guides" each of us is verified.
No Job: Gainfully full time employed every week since college, over ten years strong.
No prospect: I will say I am currently more than 2 standard deviations above the median income and median net worth.
No respect: I believe I am a realist and I tell my boomer parents the same narrative above.
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david1 says
Well then what are you bitching about?
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33 male
Fort Mill, SC
CaptainShuddup says
My eyes are open wide enough to see how things could be better and should be better.
The primary reason for economic malaise in this country is income inequality. We have the wealthiest country in the world but it is only enjoyed by less than 5% of the population and only TRULY enjoyed by 1%. That is a problem - both morally and economically.
I know if more capital was circulating in the economy instead of speculating on wall street, or with commodities, and hoarded in real estate and bonds, the economy would perform better. This means more demand for goods and services, which means more jobs.
Gulfstream employs 11,000 people on yearly revenue of $11 billion. That is one job for every $1 million in revenue.
Target employs 400,000 people on yearly revenue of $70 billion. That is one job for every $175k in revenue.
Basically six times the jobs for Target demand vs. Gulfstream demand.
Why would we give tax breaks to help spur demand in Gulfstreams when we can get 6 times the return on investment by spending that money on programs to spur Target demand?
Why give money to those who don't need it when there are so many who do need it? Especially when giving it to those who do need it will help so many, while giving it to those who do not need it will help so few?
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Mountain View, CA
As efficiency increases, the cost of living should go down while the standard of living goes up. Instead, what we have is the contrary: the cost of living, thanks to rentier capitalism and their defenders, is going up relative to wages.
The more efficiency, the better. Just replace all repetitive tasks with machines, software, robots, etc. It will create a situation that the elite has to confront head on. The whole paradigm of "get a degree, find a job, buy a home, find a wife, produce kids, send them to Cupertino school district so that these kids can move up the ladder, rinse and repeat " will collapse. Should we confront such a scenario, one can use the fiat monetary system to the advantage of people: just pay wages to folks to do whatever they like to do, so that these wages can buy whatever stuff machines produce.
Sure, there are many obstacles to reach that state. Rentiers and their defenders don't stay quiet. They use whatever means they have to enslave the working population in the name of 401k, retirement, life insurance, home mortgage, etc. This can be solved if the educated public understands how money works. In today's world, the sheep is the educated, who bought either Austian garbage or neoliberal loanable funds theory crap.
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Premium
I gotta tell ya, moving out of your parent's house prior to being married with children, or 10+ years at the same job, is highly unusual everywhere in the world except the US and Canada.
Even wealthy kids from wealthy families don't move out to live single in most countries. Nor even live with roommates. Not even during college.
Not passing judgement, just saying that being out of your parents house by your early 20s is exceptional to North America generally.
EDIT: Raindoctor, 24k rant, dead on. I believe that most office workers spend 50%+ of their time not working, either inventing busywork for themselves or simply goofing off.
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88 threads
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El Cerrito, CA
Premium
Better take a look around folks. We have a real problem here. The human race is on the ropes. The low hanging fruit is just about gone. We have an exponential problem. The ship is going down and the officers think it's every man for himself while some other folks are still polishing their shoes. We had all better WTFU soon.
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3 threads
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Madison, WI
I would not get to exited about this. This country is so diverse, many different cultures are cool with family living together, this is an immigrant country, more coming in all the time. Also, demographically the workforce is changing, not going to bother to say why.
http://marginalrevolution.com/marginalrevolution/2011/06/the-great-male-stagnation.html
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Pleasanton, CA
I was out of my parent's house at the age of 17.
Seems the Gen whatever crybabies forget the dot com rush. Every college student was a deluded prima donna fully expecting to waltz into a highly paid job with full benefits if they had a breath and a degree, and thought they should be multi millionaires by 30 so that they could "retire" with a coffee shop and party/club/travel for the rest of their lives. A few Microsofties did.
So these are the "wah wah, poor me" entitlement generation. No wonder they vote for Obama, just print money and rob somebody to get all the bennies for nothing.
At least the baby boomers knew what was ahead for them: work, earn, save, more work, earn save, raise hyperactive, spoiled brats with no attention span, more years of work, earn, save if lucky retire if the brats didn't rob you first and burn the bodies.
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Los Angeles, CA
Ceffer says
You mean have job handed to you
Ceffer says
You mean have false prosperity doled out to you
Ceffer says
You mean blow it on a midlife crisis, Sears card, and vacations to St. Martin
Ceffer says
Because your "60's generation" was so hip and cool
Ceffer says
Ride the gravy train . . . who wouldn't?
Ceffer says
You mean buy those 7-series you always deserved, cash-out refi the house to the hilt, and go on more vacations to the Bahamas
Ceffer says
While you were smoking, drinking, third-mortgaging, getting divorced, and blaming the young folks for your problems just like the "Greatest" Generation blamed you for all the problems of their world.
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Ceffer says
Me too, I foresee homeless SR citizen bums in half of these Jackasses futures. They can blame their own goofy ass for being so gullible for the Liberal agenda's steaming piles of Bullshit.
I'm still waiting for Harry Reid, Barney Frank and Nacy Pelosi and almost every other Liberal cochsucker in Washington, to knock on my door any minute now and apologize for making gobs and gobs of money by investing in banks they knew would make it, and shorting those they knew wouldn't from 2007-2009. You know and say something like...
"gee we have too much money, it's just not right, here have some. "
But attacking people that actually worked and saved for everything they have, and blaming and bitching about Old people that busted their asses, sacraficed all their life to have what they have now.
Well I say with an evil laugh, Karma has a very special place in Hell for Philistine.
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Los Angeles, CA
CaptainShuddup says
The previous poster was disingenuously "bitching and blaming" young folks--many of us who work just as hard or harder for less or much less.
I think you just got your own goat.
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Philistine you're probably older than 30, no?
I've noticed the lack of zeal in people 21-26 over the last 8 years.
I know so many young guys that work in places like Dunkin Donuts, Subway, and other corporate jobs, even retail. When I was that age, I didn't know any people my age that would be caught dead working for those places. Unless they took some related college courses, and were applying for upper level management or a job at the corporate level. But definitely not in the trenches with the deep fryer and grill press.
And had economic times got hard enough that they found them selves in that position, it would not have been a love story for the presiding President.
These guys are supposed to be going to school for something, or learning high paying trades where they get their own tools, truck and steady clientele someday. But even as I was leaving the flooring industry some 18 years ago, it was getting harder to do that. Back when I did all you needed was your ability and wherewithal to do the trade.
Now you need liability insurance, workman comp insurance, the supplies and materials are 5X more than they were when I did it. You bust your ass all week long and almost everything you make goes to paying all of those expenses on top of paying your help. You're the guy with the truck and end up making less than those guys working at the Company Store.
IT'S NOT SUPPOSED TO BE THIS WAY.
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Huntington Beach, CA
It's because your competition is getting subsidized. Think about it.
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Los Angeles, CA
CaptainShuddup says
Yes, but barely
CaptainShuddup says
Okay, I will concede that.
I do take issue that "young folks" are typically lumped together by The Baby Boomers--they often seem unaware that there was a Generation X that were raised by absent parents and had to grow up self-reliantly.
Now, my brother is 10 years younger--he is the one that moved back in with mom. To his credit, he has realized that college is a scam, but he seems to have no interest in doing anything with his life.
My assistant, on the other hand, is roughly his age and comes in early, leaves late, moves her whole life around to have this job, does work hard, and pays impeccable attention to detail. I am very sad what we pay her.
CaptainShuddup says
My step father tiled floors from his own van his whole life. I am reminded how at the end he had the same complaints you list here.
CaptainShuddup says
Well, for now it is a Sob Story, but it's boiling down more and more to be an Epic Saga that will stretch through many presidencies, as in, this could be the new normal: Decline and Languish of the Amerikan Empire.
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agreed...