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Metropolitan Phoenix expected to continue seeing rise in home prices


By iwog   Follow   Tue, 27 Nov 2012, 7:36am   5,177 views   65 comments
In Lafayette CA 94549   Watch (0)   Share   Quote   Permalink   Like   Dislike (1)  

http://www.therepublic.com/view/story/60f67b62c70b46b7afe08739233eb9e7/AZ--Home-Prices-Metro-Phoenix

PHOENIX — Real estate experts expect home prices in metropolitan Phoenix to continue to rise in the coming years.

The Phoenix area's median home price has jumped by 35 percent during the past year, though price gains in recent months have been smaller than earlier this year, The Arizona Republic reported.

Several experts are looking for metro Phoenix home prices to climb more than 10 percent annually during the next three years.

Matt Widdows, CEO of Arizona's largest residential-real-estate brokerage, HomeSmart, is bullish on a further rebound in home prices.

"I would say that in the next five to seven years, we will see (home) prices back to levels we saw in 2005," he said. "Many (Phoenix-area) homes dropped to one-third of their value in 2005, and I have no doubt that we will be right back to those levels."

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  1. Bigsby


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    26   12:51am Wed 28 Nov 2012   Share   Quote   Permalink   Like   Dislike  

    RentingForHalfTheCost says

    Bigsby says

    Your house prices nationally are not grossly inflated. In fact, they are more than affordable in many parts of the country. But of course, you choose to completely ignore that glaringly obvious fact.

    LOL. Thanks for the belly laugh.

    What do you find so amusing? How do houses rank now in terms of affordability? Inflation-adjusted prices? The prices nationwide have long since left the bubble. Prices in the BA are still high, but the BA isn't the whole country last I checked.

  2. Bigsby


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    27   12:59am Wed 28 Nov 2012   Share   Quote   Permalink   Like (1)   Dislike  

    Yup says

    http://www.zillow.com/homedetails/6001-S-47th-St-Phoenix-AZ-85042/7550862_zpid/

    This poor investor is about to drop his rent again. 26 days on the market asking 8% below "market rents". It is the holidays, they will go at least another month with no renter, in a market that is saturated with rentals. They will drop their rent again or give more concessions. I see they are already allowing small pets, soon packs of pitbulls will be allowed, as long as that rent gets paid. This investor is now stuck in the worst time of year to rent out the shit shack, and will be collecting ever decreasing rents for years. That or this investor will not rent this shit shack for the next 4 months in hopes for spring or summer demand. Poor investor.

    And if he does manage to rent it for $875...? If he put 20% down, then his monthly nut for a $45,000 loan (say at 4%) and 1.25% property tax is a breathtaking $277 + whatever his insurance would be. Hmm...

  3. Bigsby


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    28   2:19am Wed 28 Nov 2012   Share   Quote   Permalink   Like   Dislike  

    Yup says

    Bigsby says

    And if he does manage to rent it for $875...? If he put 20% down, then his monthly nut for a $45,000 loan (say at 4%) and 1.25% property tax is a breathtaking $277 + whatever his insurance would be. Hmm...

    If and when would be valid questions. I assume all cash no loan. The point is he has no renter in a flooded market during the worst time of the year to get a renter. In other words rents are coming down. Rents are coming down due to the very cash investor that are buying up these homes. When you do not have a mortgage to service you can keep dropping your rent, and you will. The investor will still brag that they are making a 9% return, and next year 7% and the following year 4%...... The glut of rentals and investors virtually guarantee lower rents and with that lower prices in the future.

    I think the point is more that he could slash his asking rental price and still make a very nice return indeed. Look at what his return is at $875! He'd make an absolute killing.

  4. Bigsby


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    29   3:15am Wed 28 Nov 2012   Share   Quote   Permalink   Like   Dislike  

    Yup says

    Bigsby says

    Look at what his return is at $875! He'd make an absolute killing.

    Except for the fact that he is currently making 0.

    And it's been a whole 27 days. Wow. Reduce the rent by a $100 and see what happens. Spend $277 and get $775. Seriously, what is your point? What are you trying to argue?

  5. uomo_senza_nome


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    30   3:15am Wed 28 Nov 2012   Share   Quote   Permalink   Like   Dislike  

    Very surprised AF hasnt commented on this thread yet.

    On his behalf:

    When the whole federal government has thrown everything it and the Wall Street psychopaths can muster to keep the bubble inflated, the cat may even blink momentarily.

    The cat is certainly blinking.

    errc, good points on lower housing prices although you have to consider a wider spectrum (as Mark D rightly suggests) and you will start to see conflicting classes of people. Bankers want higher house prices to get their balance sheets in order, borrowers who have already borrowed for their house prefer rising home prices. Our very own beloved Central bank Chairman Bernanke has said that rising home prices increases consumer confidence and more spending.

    It is clear who the Government and the Central bank is concerned about. It is the debtor class. They completely ignore the rentier class. Oh, I forgot -- the banks ARE a part of the rentier class.

  6. lostand confused


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    31   3:17am Wed 28 Nov 2012   Share   Quote   Permalink   Like   Dislike  

    Mark D says

    why do you want prices to go down so the people who are underwater will be in even deeper? why do you want people to lose equity in the homes they have recently bought with the money they had saved up all these years? why do you want investors like iwog and roberto to lose money? simply because they worked harder and were better with money?
    this is a two way street.

    Because it is a govt pimped bubble and things are not in a natural equilibrium. I myself am not very happy with the bubble. I don't have any debt and haven't had any for a few years now. Decent investments and yet balk at signing up for 600-800k mortgage /price tag for the kind of house I want.

    Especially when you look at other places and what you get for your money. It is one thing if like errc said wages were going up or currency is collapsing, then it makes sense. But nothing is happening, except housing mania number 2. I will continue to sit it out-though now that I am getting settled , it is not just me anymore and that is why I am looking again at lower cost states.

    Now Phoenix is different, even with these prices, you can still get a good house for a decent price. But not here in coastal CA and they don't pay a good enough wage here to make a difference for the housing prices.

  7. tatupu70


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    32   5:23am Wed 28 Nov 2012   Share   Quote   Permalink   Like (3)   Dislike (1)  

    Yup says

    If you don't get my point, at this point, it is because you don't want to get my point.

    As far as I can tell, your point is that there is an apartment in a crappy location that is currently available for rent.

    How you can draw any conclusions from that 1 piece of data is beyond ridiculous.

  8. Bigsby


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    33   5:38am Wed 28 Nov 2012   Share   Quote   Permalink   Like   Dislike  

    Yup says

    Bigsby says

    Seriously, what is your point? What are you trying to argue?

    If you don't get my point, at this point, it is because you don't want to get my point.

    I realize that it is only one property, but I could link hundreds........

    Well what is your point? The house could be rented out for half of what they are asking and the owner would still be hugely ahead. The only conclusion to be drawn from what you posted is that if that house rents for anywhere near the asking figure (as in within 500 odd dollars), then $60,000 for it is a raging bargain.

  9. uomo_senza_nome


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    34   7:57am Wed 28 Nov 2012   Share   Quote   Permalink   Like   Dislike  

    The irrationality of the human mind applies equally to both bullishness and bearishness.

  10. RentingForHalfTheCost


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    35   5:37pm Wed 28 Nov 2012   Share   Quote   Permalink   Like   Dislike  

    Bigsby says

    What do you find so amusing? How do houses rank now in terms of affordability? Inflation-adjusted prices? The prices nationwide have long since left the bubble. Prices in the BA are still high, but the BA isn't the whole country last I checked.

    Prices are still too high everywhere. Free money is the cause and bank foreclosure manipulation. All at the expense of the tax payer. Houses depreciate in reality, they only stay stable or appreciated in a manipulated market. Wood rots, nails rust, piping deteriorates, wires go brittle, paint fades, carpet wears, any moving part in windows, appliances, doors wear. We are still in a manipulated market. We can't learn how to complete internationally for our wealth, so we create fictitious domestic wealth by pumping up a depreciating asset. It works until it doesn't. All I got to say. Good luck to you all.

  11. Bigsby


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    36   5:54pm Wed 28 Nov 2012   Share   Quote   Permalink   Like   Dislike  

    RentingForHalfTheCost says

    Prices are still too high everywhere. Free money is the cause and bank foreclosure manipulation. All at the expense of the tax payer. Houses depreciate in reality, they only stay stable or appreciated in a manipulated market. Wood rots, nails rust, piping deteriorates, wires go brittle, paint fades, carpet wears, any moving part in windows, appliances, doors wear. We are still in a manipulated market. We can't learn how to complete internationally for our wealth, so we create fictitious domestic wealth by pumping up a depreciating asset. It works until it doesn't. All I got to say. Good luck to you all.

    They aren't too high EVERYWHERE unless you think house prices have always been too high.

  12. David Losh


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    37   6:18pm Wed 28 Nov 2012   Share   Quote   Permalink   Like   Dislike  

    Yup says

    26 days on the market asking 8% below "market rents".

    Let's see, paid $60K, maybe, maybe paid in another $10K, and wants top dollar for rent.

    Well, you might be right, and he may drop the rent to $750, but his returns are still very impressive.

    Hey!? You know what? if you bought the place instead of that guy what would your mortgage payment look like?

  13. RentingForHalfTheCost


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    38   7:12pm Wed 28 Nov 2012   Share   Quote   Permalink   Like   Dislike  

    Bigsby says

    They aren't too high EVERYWHERE unless you think house prices have always been too high.

    The junk that is selling low in areas like Atlanta, Phoenix, Detroit is the majority of junk. You might be able to squeak out another 3-5 years if you are lucky, but in reality they need to be torn down. They look cheap now, but I'm sure in the majority of cases the owner has to inject a crap load of money to keep them going. I have many friends who tried to kick start a buy, fix, and then rent or sell. None of them talk about their efforts with much love. Just my experiences.

    By far the best way to get wealthy in this country is to be born to the right parents. ;)

  14. Bigsby


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    39   7:52pm Wed 28 Nov 2012   Share   Quote   Permalink   Like   Dislike  

    Yup says

    robertoaribas says

    they are going to drop... because you want them to drop! very good "thinking" there, mr mensa!

    robertoaribas says

    I think you see the problem. that shitty shack needs to be listed for $750 or less so by comparison. the 1 bathroom alone is a huge knock, the nature of being on the busiest road in south phoenix, they might have a hell of a time even pulling out of the driveway at rush hour... the fact that it is small as hell.... Simply put, the owner is being too greedy.

    BUT even if they rent it for $600 a month, they still make a fantasic return on their cash.

    So even after you admit that rents will drop, you say it will drop because I want them too.......amazing!

    I fail to see where he said that.

  15. Bigsby


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    40   7:54pm Wed 28 Nov 2012   Share   Quote   Permalink   Like   Dislike  

    Yup says

    I am not saying that the investor made a bad investment. I am saying that with all the cash buyers that have no mortgage they can and will drop their rents. If rents drop many of these investors will not be happy with their rate of return and the work that is required of a landlord. If you can get 10% from buying the S&P 500 and you are getting 12% with a rental, I will tell you that it is much easier to just buy the S&P and miss the 2%.

    And what is the rate of return on the example you posted if it rents for say $700 rather than the listed $875.

  16. Bigsby


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    41   8:50pm Wed 28 Nov 2012   Share   Quote   Permalink   Like   Dislike  

    Yup says

    Bigsby says

    Well what is your point? The house could be rented out for half of what they are asking and the owner would still be hugely ahead. The only conclusion to be drawn from what you posted is that if that house rents for anywhere near the asking figure (as in within 500 odd dollars), then $60,000 for it is a raging bargain.

    Are you reading impaired?

    MY POINT IS RENTS ARE GOING TO DROP IN PHOENIX.

    Do you get my point now?

    In your opinion. And so what if they do? Based on the example you posted, they could drop massively and the landlord would still be making an extremely good return on his investment. Do you get my point now?

  17. Bigsby


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    42   8:50pm Wed 28 Nov 2012   Share   Quote   Permalink   Like   Dislike  

    Yup says

    Bigsby says

    I fail to see where he said that.

    At least you can admit having zero reading comprehension.

    Er, no. You, however, completely failed to understand what he was saying.

  18. Mark D


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    43   9:45pm Wed 28 Nov 2012   Share   Quote   Permalink   Like   Dislike  

    Yup = Darrel/war/liarwatch
    time to ignore

  19. Mark D


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    44   9:52pm Wed 28 Nov 2012   Share   Quote   Permalink   Like   Dislike  

    lostand confused says

    Because it is a govt pimped bubble and things are not in a natural equilibrium. I myself am not very happy with the bubble. I don't have any debt and haven't had any for a few years now. Decent investments and yet balk at signing up for 600-800k mortgage /price tag for the kind of house I want.

    my questions were for errr alone. i don't have a problem with people who don't want to buy. i disagree with his line of thinking that rooting for higher prices automatically equates evil. it would easily backfire.

  20. marcus


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    45   10:05pm Wed 28 Nov 2012   Share   Quote   Permalink   Like   Dislike  

    iwog says

    Several experts are looking for metro Phoenix home prices to climb more than 10 percent annually during the next three years.

    This sounds like a sell signal.

  21. Bigsby


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    46   11:47pm Wed 28 Nov 2012   Share   Quote   Permalink   Like (1)   Dislike  

    Yup says

    Bigsby says

    And so what if they do?

    Most investors have some expectation for what kind of return they will get. If that return is much lower than they thought many investors sell. So what if they do? Do I really need to explain?

    And the point is that it would have to utterly collapse in the example you gave. A PITI of less than $300 and a rental asking price of $875 - are you seriously not seeing the room for profit in that even with a massive decrease in the rental price? The only thing that this points to is that the house appears to be much better value as a purchase than renting. As for whether the rents are dropping on it, well, as we don't know what it used to rent for...

    Yup says

    Bigsby says

    I fail to see where he said that.

    REALLY?

    Yes, really. You're clearly reading into it what you want it to mean rather than what he meant.

  22. Bigsby


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    47   11:54pm Wed 28 Nov 2012   Share   Quote   Permalink   Like (1)   Dislike  

    Yup says

    robertoaribas says

    Yup is a dumbass, and deserves to be called one

    I have operated 3 different nuclear power plants and the largest power system in the western united states. What about you? Oh yeah thats right you are a teacher...You know what they say about teachers. Those who can do, those that can't teach. I do, you teach.

    With that comment, I rather think you've proved his point.

  23. Bigsby


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    48   12:22am Thu 29 Nov 2012   Share   Quote   Permalink   Like   Dislike  

    Yup says

    HAHA you lied to everyone here HAHAHA. You posted this and you were buying HAHAHA. You are a liar, a teacher and a rat!

    Wow, a liar, a rat AND a teacher.

  24. Bigsby


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    49   12:27am Thu 29 Nov 2012   Share   Quote   Permalink   Like   Dislike  

    Yup says

    Yes I see the profit and never made an arguement that the purchase was not profitable.

    So what was your point? You can't say that rents are dropping because a price is listed below a Zillow estimate.

    Yup says

    Going by Zillow it shows $954/month as equivalent rent. I know that Zillow is not always correct though in my limited experience they have been close. They are only asking $875 and even liar roberto says they need to ask $750 or less.

    In my experience, Zillow is often inaccurate.

    Yup says

    Ok that is what he posted and you think I am reading into when I say rents are going to drop in Phoenix?

    Oh FFS, one example where you don't know what it rented for, what it will rent for or how accurate the Zillow estimate is, and where Roberto thinks it might go for $750 is
    a. not proof that rents are falling in Phoenix.
    b. not evidence that Roberto agrees with your premise.

  25. Bigsby


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    50   12:32am Thu 29 Nov 2012   Share   Quote   Permalink   Like   Dislike  

    Yup says

    I am not saying that at any of these rent prices the owner is not making money, he is. What I am saying is that owners in Phoenix are going to all be lowering their rents in competion for a limited number of renters and a massive inventory of cash buyer rentals, who can afford to drop the rent and still make lots of money.

    Who knows, but so what if they did? It still makes those kind of purchases an absolute bargain. Here you have a property with a PITI of less than $300 and a rental price of up to 3 times more. Rather a lot of room there. You were implying that this landlord was in trouble. Is he fuck. He has so much room to maneuver that it is almost comical.

  26. Bigsby


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    51   12:33am Thu 29 Nov 2012   Share   Quote   Permalink   Like   Dislike  

    Yup says

    Bigsby says

    Oh FFS, one example where you don't know what it rented for, what it will rent for or how accurate the Zillow estimate is, and where Roberto thinks it might go for $750 is
    a. not proof that rents are falling in Phoenix.
    b. not evidence that Roberto agrees with your premise.

    Whatever you say roberto

    Grow up.

  27. Bigsby


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    52   12:40am Thu 29 Nov 2012   Share   Quote   Permalink   Like   Dislike  

    Yup says

    http://www.zillow.com/homedetails/28233-N-Superior-Rd-San-Tan-Valley-AZ-85143/71697430_zpid/

    Another example this place is asking off the zillow chart low for rent

    Give it a rest. It's $47 below a Zillow estimate. So fucking what.

  28. Bigsby


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    53   2:17am Thu 29 Nov 2012   Share   Quote   Permalink   Like   Dislike  

    Yup says

    http://www.zillow.com/homedetails/1120-E-Country-Crossing-Way-San-Tan-Valley-AZ-85143/2125598367_zpid/

    $895 asking Zillow rent $1206 25% discount. Happy renting Phoenix

    What's a Zillow rent?

  29. Bigsby


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    54   2:22am Thu 29 Nov 2012   Share   Quote   Permalink   Like   Dislike  

    Yup says

    Bigsby says

    Yup says

    http://www.zillow.com/homedetails/28233-N-Superior-Rd-San-Tan-Valley-AZ-85143/71697430_zpid/

    Another example this place is asking off the zillow chart low for rent

    Give it a rest. It's $47 below a Zillow estimate. So fucking what.

    Look at the chart below the estimate $880 is the low on the chart. They are asking $795 an almost 10% drop in rent NOT INSIGNIFICANT!

    Oh FFS, give it a rest. So asking rents don't match Zillow estimates, whoop-de-doo. Why is it of so much concern to you that you'd trawl through Zillow finding rents that dont't match their estimate? It's sad and pointless. It doesn't matter what the estimate is. The only concern to a landlord is what his income is in comparison to his PITI. You started this nonsense by screaming blue murder over the fact that someone had a small discount on a Zillow price but completely ignored that his PITI was a third of that amount. It's just laughable what you are doing - you're just embarrassing yourself. And as for starting another thread accusing Roberto of being a liar just because you got in a huff with him...

  30. Bigsby


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    55   2:25am Thu 29 Nov 2012   Share   Quote   Permalink   Like   Dislike  

    Yup says

    Bigsby says

    Yup says

    http://www.zillow.com/homedetails/1120-E-Country-Crossing-Way-San-Tan-Valley-AZ-85143/2125598367_zpid/

    $895 asking Zillow rent $1206 25% discount. Happy renting Phoenix

    What's a Zillow rent?

    From Zillow "A Rent Zestimate is Zillow's estimated monthly rental price, computed using a proprietary formula. It is a starting point in determining the monthly rental price for a specific property."

    God, I know what it is. It's not a rent though, is it? It's an estimate.

  31. Bigsby


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    56   2:49am Thu 29 Nov 2012   Share   Quote   Permalink   Like   Dislike  

    Yup says

    I do not agree. I believe that investors have expectations. If you invested and expected 10% return and a year in you are down to 7% you just might take your profits and run.

    And yet the example you used to start your petty digs at Roberto was of a house with an asking rental of $875 and a PITI less than $300. What % return is that?
    Yup says

    Do you get that when a whole bunch of cash investors are buying low cost rentals thinking that they are going to make a killing, that when they start to compete for renters they will drop their rents because they can and will still make money even at much lower rents?

    Wow, so they will still make money at much lower rents (if or when that happens). Doesn't that run contrary to your screaming that they'll be DECIMATED? Seriously, I just don't get what you are doing. These people are buying cheap properties and renting them for far more than PITI. Even if the rents fall dramatically, people like Roberto will still be easily covering their PITI. Lucky them.

  32. Bigsby


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    57   2:54am Thu 29 Nov 2012   Share   Quote   Permalink   Like   Dislike  

    Yup says

    Bigsby says

    God, I know what it is. It's not a rent though, is it? It's an estimate.

    You asked a question like you didn't know am I supposed to read your Fing mind? Why do you minimize the information that you don't like? Getting historic rental price info online is next to impossible. Zillow has some data and you go nope not gonna use it, its not rent.....WTF /shrug?????

    God, it was bloody obvious. And what do you mean 'why do I minimize the information I don't like?' A Zillow estimate is not rent. It's a bloody estimate. I'm not minimizing anything except your reliance on Zillow. As I keep saying and am getting unbelievably tired of repeating, the only issue is what the property actually rents for compared to PITI. You and I don't know whether the price the landlord finally gets represents a rise or a fall in rent because it has nothing to do with the Zillow estimate and everything to do with what the previous tenant was paying.

  33. Bigsby


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    58   2:55am Thu 29 Nov 2012   Share   Quote   Permalink   Like   Dislike  

    Yup says

    I get that you don't get it. That is fine.

    And I get that you don't get it. That too is fine.

  34. Bigsby


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    59   3:08am Thu 29 Nov 2012   Share   Quote   Permalink   Like   Dislike  

    Yup says

    Bigsby says

    the only issue is what the property actually rents for compared to PITI.

    DUDE I am talking about falling rents which is completely applicable with the zillow estimates of rent. The zillow estimate looks at the local market to come up with the estimate. If local landlords are offering below the zillow estimate RENTS ARE DROPPING.

    You are talking about making money which they can do even if rents are falling. WTF I KNOW THAT.

    If you know that they'll still make money, then why are you screaming that they'll be decimated? And just because the asking rents YOU list are below Zillow estimates does not mean that rents are falling as I keep pointing out. They might well be, but you are not demonstrating that. Just post up a chart of yearly/quarterly rental rates in the Phoenix area. It's simple. Zillow estimates are just that, estimates. And a few examples from thousands demonstrates nothing except you cherry picking some examples to fit your argument.
    Look, presumably you had some purpose in trying to paint a picture of rapidly falling rents in Phoenix, but from reading this thread, it would appear that that purpose was to have a dig at Roberto. If that makes you happy...

  35. Bigsby


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    60   3:11am Thu 29 Nov 2012   Share   Quote   Permalink   Like   Dislike  

    Yup says

    JC professor lol pathetic MF you are and boy does it make you angry. I actually do something useful on this planet and you are a useless POS.

    This is what you were posting earlier. That is pathetic. He's a teacher. My wife is a university professor. If you don't think teaching is an extremely important profession, then you are a schmuck.

  36. Bigsby


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    61   3:16am Thu 29 Nov 2012   Share   Quote   Permalink   Like   Dislike  

    Yup says

    I am glad robertotheliar blocked me. He wont see how totally F'd he is going to be when the rental cash buyer market Fing collapses. Oh and way before that the cash buyer/cash out refi fools will be DECIMATED! Those with skin in the game, all cash buyers will feast on the cash out refi fools.

    I have no idea because a handful of Zillow estimates that are higher than asking rents demonstrates nothing. What if the asking rents are higher than current ACTUAL rents? Anyway, the obvious answer given the differences between PITI and rents is that yes rents will probably fall because if they don't, then anyone with enough spare cash in Phoenix should take it out of the bank and stocks and stick it straight into RE. They'd be an idiot not to.

  37. Bigsby


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    62   3:27am Thu 29 Nov 2012   Share   Quote   Permalink   Like   Dislike  

    Yup says

    Bigsby says

    And a few examples from thousands demonstrates nothing except you cherry picking some examples to fit your argument.

    I did not cherry pick. Rents will be dropping in Phoenix in my opinion.

    Fine, but did you really have to post all the shite and insults that you served up in this thread just because you think rents will fall in Phoenix? Seems to say rather a lot more about you than Roberto. I mean seriously, what was all that guff you were saying about how important your job is and how unimportant teaching is? Utterly laughable.

  38. Bigsby


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    63   3:28am Thu 29 Nov 2012   Share   Quote   Permalink   Like   Dislike  

    Yup says

    Bigsby says

    Anyway, the obvious answer given the differences between PITI and rents is that yes rents will probably fall because if they don't, then anyone with enough spare cash in Phoenix should take it out of the bank and stocks and stick it straight into RE. They'd be an idiot not to.

    Look at that we agree :-)

    I suspect that you and I would agree on very little.

  39. Bigsby


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    64   3:47am Thu 29 Nov 2012   Share   Quote   Permalink   Like   Dislike  

    Yup says

    Bigsby says

    I suspect that you and I would agree on very little.

    I bet we both agree that living in California is way better than living in Phoenix.......

    I don't know having never lived in Phoenix or even visited it. And there are plenty of shitholes in California...

  40. RentingForHalfTheCost


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    65   2:27pm Thu 29 Nov 2012   Share   Quote   Permalink   Like   Dislike  

    robertoaribas says

    RentingForHalfTheCost says

    The junk that is selling low in areas like Atlanta, Phoenix, Detroit is the majority of junk.

    you don't have a clue what you are talking about. MY HOME, bought just over a year ago, is 2300 square feet, 4 bedrooms 2.5 baths, 2 car garage and a pool in a spectacular neighborhood, for $230,000.... My mortgage is $1147 a month, and $260 goes to principal paydown... Is that the "junk in phoenix selling" you mean?

    Here are some pics of a home I bought for $80,000 1800 square feet in a gated community...

    Looks like lipstick on a pig to me. You can punch your way out of the wall in case of emergency, that must count for something positive. $230K is not chump change also. At the medium salary in the US, that is decades of savings. All for something that 6 people take 3 weeks to build. Stupid stuff all around.

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