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US is an Orwellian state.


By FortWayne   Follow   Wed, 2 Jan 2013, 7:47am PST   1,030 views   20 comments   Watch (0)   Share   Quote   Permalink   Like (1)   Dislike (1)  

http://rt.com/news/oliver-stone-us-orwellian-022/

Now CA is a double whammy! Orwellian on both state and federal level.

I think under the disguise of sheep’s clothing he [OBAMA] has been a wolf. That because of the nightmare of the Bush presidency that preceded him, people forgave him a lot. He was a great hope for change. The color of his skin, the upbringing, the internationalism, the globalism, seemed all evident. And he is an intelligent man. He has taken all the Bush changes he basically put them into the establishment, he has codified them. That is what is sad. So we are going into the second administration that is living outside the law and does not respect the law and foundations of our system and he is a constitutional lawyer, you know. Without the law, it is the law of the jungle. Nuremburg existed for a reason and there was a reason to have trials, there is a reason for due process – ‘habeas corpus’ as they call it in the United States.

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Dan8267   befriend   ignore   Wed, 2 Jan 2013, 10:48am PST   Share   Quote   Like (7)   Dislike     Comment 1

Both argue that Obama is a wolf in sheep’s clothing and that people have forgiven him a lot because of the “nightmare of the Bush presidency that preceded him.”

Exactly. This says everything about the Obama administration.

Hopefully, history will judge Obama more accurately. He's every bit as bad as Bush. The only difference is which came first. Bush started the road to tyranny, but Obama has continued it doing things that Bush couldn't get away with yet. How exactly are these two idiots different?

What I hate about all the Republican Obama-haters is that they refuse to talk about the real evil policies of Obama because they want those policies to continue. Instead the Obama-haters make up crap like Obama being a socialist or a foreigner.

Dan8267   befriend   ignore   Wed, 2 Jan 2013, 11:01am PST   Share   Quote   Like (3)   Dislike     Comment 2

Once again, RT news is the only place that talks about the truth.

Kevin   befriend   ignore   Wed, 2 Jan 2013, 11:07am PST   Share   Quote   Like   Dislike     Comment 3

Dan8267 says

How exactly are these two idiots different

Social policy.

Tax policy.

Environmental policy.

They are largely the same on foreign, security, and non-tax fiscal issues.

Scagnetti   befriend   ignore   Wed, 2 Jan 2013, 11:25am PST   Share   Quote   Like   Dislike (1)     Comment 4

Dan8267 says

Exactly. This says everything about the Obama administration.

Hopefully, history will judge Obama more accurately. He's every bit as bad as Bush. The only difference is which came first. Bush started the road to tyranny, but Obama has continued it doing things that Bush couldn't get away with yet. How exactly are these two idiots different?

Jeeeez.....

I thought everybody agreed with increased drone attacks, the end of group protest, indefinite detention of terror suspects including American citizens, Assassination of American citizens, Illegal war declared through executive power, warrantless surveillance of citizens. Bush and Obama do.

Scagnetti   befriend   ignore   Wed, 2 Jan 2013, 11:27am PST   Share   Quote   Like   Dislike     Comment 5

"I was a constitutional law professor, which means unlike the current president I actually respect the constitution."

Barack Obama (March 2007)

Dan8267   befriend   ignore   Wed, 2 Jan 2013, 12:22pm PST   Share   Quote   Like (1)   Dislike     Comment 6

Kevin says

Social policy.

Tax policy.

Environmental policy.

Fair enough. But as important as those things are, they are utterly insignificant compared to issues like war, torture, habeas corpus, drone strikes against civilians, warrantless wiretapping, and increasing unchecked and opaque executive power.

Ironman   befriend   ignore   Wed, 2 Jan 2013, 12:43pm PST   Share   Quote   Like (1)   Dislike (2)     Comment 7

Scagnetti says

"I was a constitutional law professor, which means unlike the current president I actually respect the constitution."

Barack Obama (March 2007)

How can you tell when Obama is lying???

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-

-

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He opens his mouth!!

Dan8267   befriend   ignore   Wed, 2 Jan 2013, 2:07pm PST   Share   Quote   Like   Dislike     Comment 8

Call it Crazy says

He opens his mouth!!

True for all politicians.

But it's not the lies that makes Obama and Bush evil, it's the policies.

Kevin   befriend   ignore   Wed, 2 Jan 2013, 3:26pm PST   Share   Quote   Like (1)   Dislike     Comment 9

Dan8267 says

Kevin says

Social policy.

Tax policy.

Environmental policy.

Fair enough. But as important as those things are, they are utterly insignificant compared to issues like war, torture, habeas corpus, drone strikes against civilians, warrantless wiretapping, and increasing unchecked and opaque executive power.

I don't agree. These issues are very important -- certainly for the daily lives and futures of ordinary people.

I'm not happy with what Obama has (not) done with regards to the issues you mention, but I don't actually see an alternative in the current political climate.

I also don't see any real escalation over Bush. That he hasn't vetoed the renewal of these bills is shameful, but I can easily imagine a scenario where congress holds everything else hostage and then impeaches him for not enforcing it.

The American People want stuff like the PATRIOT act, sadly. Things could have been a lot worse -- look at the awful shit our government did during the Civil War or WWII. I can only imagine how much worse it could be.

FortWayne   befriend   ignore   Thu, 3 Jan 2013, 12:31am PST   Share   Quote   Like   Dislike (1)     Comment 10

Dan8267 says

Obama-haters make up crap like Obama being a socialist

Historically many ruthless dictatorships came to power using pretend mantra of social justice, often it was socialism or similar principles. Hitler, Mao, Lenin... all did that. Good intentions or not, resulted in tyranny, many not right away, but eventual tyranny. And most people associate socialism with these historic events, not to it's dictionary definition.

I think you are right about the double standards in America. Often Right and Left forgives their own for the same crimes that they don't forgive others. Parties tend to criticize the other, but once in power do exact same things, steal, plunder, abuse power, take away rights when it's convenient. George Carlin put it best when he compared out rights to temporary privileges bringing up Japanese Americans during WW2.

I don't like the direction our nation has been headed for a while now, ever since the Patriot Act, the secret prisons that we only recently found out about, and CIA tortures.

edvard2   befriend   ignore   Thu, 3 Jan 2013, 12:43am PST   Share   Quote   Like   Dislike     Comment 11

Ahhh.... more McCarthy style talk just because a Republican didn't win the White House. Boo-Hoo....

FortWayne   befriend   ignore   Thu, 3 Jan 2013, 12:53am PST   Share   Quote   Like   Dislike (1)     Comment 12

And edvard as usual refuses to read anything past the headline.

edvard2 says

Ahhh.... more McCarthy style talk just because a Republican didn't win the White House. Boo-Hoo....

edvard2   befriend   ignore   Thu, 3 Jan 2013, 12:55am PST   Share   Quote   Like   Dislike     Comment 13

I read enough. Enough to to smell the BS. Enough to once again assert that if a Republican were in the white house, all of those who are currently complaining would probably be as silent as church mice.

Dan8267   befriend   ignore   Thu, 3 Jan 2013, 1:22am PST   Share   Quote   Like (1)   Dislike     Comment 14

Kevin says

I don't agree.

It all depends on what an individual's highest priorities are. As important as tax policies and environmental issues are, human rights issues trump everything by my values and principles.

Kevin says

I also don't see any real escalation over Bush.

There was a time when I could say that at least Obama hadn't introduced new evils, but when he started targeting civilians including minors for assassinations with drones and made it "legal" for the federal government to kidnap and kill a U.S. citizen without trial, I can't say that anymore.

Of course, I believe that Bush, Romney, and most of the recent Republicans presidential candidates, and some of the recent Democratic candidates would have done the exact same thing. Ron Paul and Dennis Kucinich being prime counter-examples.

Dan8267   befriend   ignore   Thu, 3 Jan 2013, 1:25am PST   Share   Quote   Like (1)   Dislike     Comment 15

Kevin says

The American People want stuff like the PATRIOT act, sadly

I'd say 1/3rd of the American people want a tyrannical government because they foolishly and incorrectly think that the tyranny will be levied only on other people, not them or their family.

About 1/3rd strongly oppose such measures, and the remaining third can be scared into accepting tyranny by idiot news broadcasters who hype up threats to gain viewers and ad profits. The media is largely the problem. Instead of acting as the fourth estate, they distort the reality of threats and empower bad government.

Kevin   befriend   ignore   Thu, 3 Jan 2013, 1:26am PST   Share   Quote   Like   Dislike     Comment 16

FortWayne says

And most people associate socialism with these historic events

Most *americans* associate socialism with these events.

But, well, Americans are poorly informed about global history.

Even if they were, there is only one thing that Obama has done since taking office that any person with two brain cells to rub together would label "socialist", and I'd be willing to bet most people making the charge couldn't identify it.

Dan8267   befriend   ignore   Thu, 3 Jan 2013, 1:28am PST   Share   Quote   Like   Dislike     Comment 17

FortWayne says

Historically many ruthless dictatorships came to power using pretend mantra of social justice, often it was socialism or similar principles.

Very true. Hermann Goering said it best,

Why of course the people don't want war. Why should some poor slob on a farm want to risk his life in a war when the best he can get out of it is to come back to his farm in one piece? Naturally the common people don't want war neither in Russia, nor in England, nor for that matter in Germany. That is understood. But, after all, it is the leaders of the country who determine the policy and it is always a simple matter to drag the people along, whether it is a democracy, or a fascist dictatorship, or a parliament, or a communist dictatorship. Voice or no voice, the people can always be brought to the bidding of the leaders. That is easy. All you have to do is tell them they are being attacked, and denounce the peacemakers for lack of patriotism and exposing the country to danger. It works the same in any country.

He also said

Education is dangerous -- every educated person is a future enemy.

It's important to understand how the enemy thinks.

Dan8267   befriend   ignore   Thu, 3 Jan 2013, 1:30am PST   Share   Quote   Like   Dislike     Comment 18

edvard2 says

Ahhh.... more McCarthy style talk just because a Republican didn't win the White House. Boo-Hoo....

I can't say whether or not FortWayne would be calling attention to these issues had Romney won, but I can attest that these issues are real and significant. The article in the original post is valid and accurate.

FortWayne   befriend   ignore   Thu, 3 Jan 2013, 1:31am PST   Share   Quote   Like (1)   Dislike (1)     Comment 19

Dan8267 says

Of course, I believe that Bush, Romney, and most of the recent Republicans presidential candidates, and some of the recent Democratic candidates would have done the exact same thing. Ron Paul and Dennis Kucinich being prime counter-examples.

That's why I think Ron Paul never gets a chance for nomination, no matter how popular he is, the owners of this country don't want someone opposing their totalitarian views.

FortWayne   befriend   ignore   Thu, 3 Jan 2013, 1:32am PST   Share   Quote   Like   Dislike (1)     Comment 20

Dan8267 says

I can't say whether or not FortWayne would be calling attention to these issues had Romney won, but I can attest that these issues are real and significant. The article in the original post is valid and accurate.

I'm not a Republican, registered as not affiliated to a party, usually vote Libertarian.

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