Another Welfare Abuse Example....Dems say 'Nothing wrong here


By AverageBear   Follow   Sun, 6 Jan 2013, 12:06pm   5,950 views   112 comments
In Boston MA 02110   Watch (1)   Share   Quote   Permalink   Like (3)   Dislike (6)  

....."Let’s not forget how the “scrubbing” began. Granny [LIZ} Warren’s daughter filed a lawsuit claiming the DTA hadn’t been proactive enough in registering the state’s assorted loafers and layabouts to vote for her carpetbagging fake-Indian mom. Then — bingo, the hacks located $274,000 for mailings, complete with post-paid envelopes for the gimme girls and guys to send back their voter registrations.

Have you ever gotten a post-paid envelope from the commonwealth? No, I didn’t think so. They’re not for taxpayers, just for the non-working classes to take part in a Democratic voter-registration drive."......

The Patrick administration has known about these appalling EBT numbers for months now. They were only released after this newspaper filed a Freedom of Information Act request. Which is the same way it was revealed that Lt. Gov. Tim Murray was doing 108 mph when he mysteriously crashed his state vehicle in November 2011."....

Guess what this revealed? Most likely, these fake welfare frauds are collecting from other states. Liberals here in Mass REFUSE to acknowledge welfare fraud, REFUSE to allow reform to uncover waste. This is what you get when democrats overwhelmingly run a 'one party state'...

...."Those 19,000 MIA’s collect — based on an average of $400 a month — $91 million a year. That’s the estimate of Rep. Shauna O’Connell (R-Taunton). But the governor Friday went into his best pooh-pooh mode.

“That may not be indicative of a problem,” he said with a straight face. “We’ll know when we do the scrubbing.”.......

http://bostonherald.com/news_opinion/columnists/howie_carr/2013/01/you_can%E2%80%99t_%E2%80%98scrub%E2%80%99_ebt_mess_dirty_rag

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  1. AverageBear


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    73   10:08am Fri 8 Feb 2013   Share   Quote   Permalink   Like (1)   Dislike (1)  

    Vicente says

    You are indeed an Angry Bear.


    Is shouting at strangers in a forum helping?

    -----------------------
    Vic, I didn't know you were so sensitive to CAPS. Sorry I hurt your feelings.....Sorry I didn't give you the warm and fuzzies in this thread.....

    Kevin calls me a 'heartless-dick', and you get your panties in a twist because I occasionally use CAPS. I wish I could make this shit up.....The pussification of America rolls on......

  2. AverageBear


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    74   10:59am Fri 8 Feb 2013   Share   Quote   Permalink   Like (1)   Dislike (1)  

    Vicente says

    Bear's thread is all about the small-timer little fish.

    -------------------------------------------------
    I'm not talking about the welfare recipients themselves. I'm talking about Mass state gov't changing it's policies to correct the EBT cash problem. I don't blame the recipients. I blame my state gov't....which leads me to my next question...

    Vic, you claim that I'm going after 'small potatos/chump change'. I'm curious. What percentage of my state budget would you consider 'chump change'?? 10%, 5%, 2 or 1%

    Give me a clear # that in your mind, is the thresh-hold that defines 'chump change'....

  3. Vicente


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    75   11:13am Fri 8 Feb 2013   Share   Quote   Permalink   Like (1)   Dislike (1)  

    AverageBear says

    Vic, you claim that I'm going after 'small potatos/chump change'. I'm curious. What percentage of my state budget would you consider 'chump change'?? 10%, 5%, 2 or 1%

    Mass. state budget approx 32 billion

    Your original article talks about 4 percent of EBT recipients it COULD NOT LOCATE! Is this all fraud? What do they mean by that? I dunno, the article doesn't say. Phoned every last recipient on a Sunday, sent out cops looking for them? Did they investigate 19,000 cases and prove fraud? What? Well maybe the "article has been archived" thing and the shortness of it means whatever you read I cannot see.

    Worst case every single one is fraud, 91 million dollars is probably far less than people spent on buying double whipped soy lattes in Mass. Starbucks. So yeah it's penny ante bullshit. Shit you spend 5 million just on the ADVERTISING BUDGET for your state lottery, and a more useless and wasteful and inefficient agency than state lotteries I cannot imagine.

    I doubt grocery chains would care much about enforcement of your proposal. Game it out, what's the downside for the grocery chain for being permissive about it? They sell alcohol and cigarettes to obvious minors that's a BFD. They sell some food to "the wrong person" well they've still sold food and who gives a shit? Gift cards don't carry ID data. Unless you want a new type of card that IS a state-issued ID? Frankly I don't get how this works without being either ineffective CYA BS or an additional cost to the retailer.

  4. David Losh


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    76   9:22am Sat 9 Feb 2013   Share   Quote   Permalink   Like   Dislike  

    AverageBear says

    Specifically concerning Massachusetts?

    Massachusetts seems to have a real problem with the welfare system. I don't know why so much attention is being paid to it, but I'm sure there are politics involved.

    I did provide some links earlier, but will find the specifics.

  5. David Losh


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    77   10:29am Sat 9 Feb 2013   Share   Quote   Permalink   Like   Dislike  

    http://www.weeklystandard.com/blogs/over-60000-welfare-spentper-household-poverty_657889.html

    This one is cumbersome, but says: "Another concern is the entangled bureaucracy of welfare. Currently governors have to ask the Federal government if they can revamp their state welfare system. And the federal bureaucracy costs money. If you took the money spent for welfare and gave it to poor families it would amount to $25,000 a year for every family of four."

    http://www.leaderu.com/orgs/probe/docs/welfare.html

    This last one is a gem, that is dated, but clearly outlines the problem with welfare administration costs. This is our federal government at work driving up costs.

    https://oig.hhs.gov/oei/reports/oei-05-91-01080.pdf

  6. David Losh


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    78   10:32am Sat 9 Feb 2013   Share   Quote   Permalink   Like   Dislike  

    Massechusetts seems to be in the middle of the pack, but from the last report, or by all reports, it depends on how States spend the money they get.

    What may be the case in your State is that they don't spend enough on staffing to police fraud, because the money is spent on your Health Care system, which was the basis of ObamaCare.

  7. The Professor


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    79   10:56am Sat 9 Feb 2013   Share   Quote   Permalink   Like (2)   Dislike (1)   Protected  

    Total 2012 entitlement spending: $2,053,000,000,000.00
    Us Population: 313,914,040
    $6,540 in entitlement spending for every man, woman, and child in the US.

    We could give every family of four in the United States $25,000 a year and still come out ahead.

    http://www.heritage.org/research/reports/2012/10/federal-spending-by-the-numbers-2012

  8. AverageBear


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    80   1:33pm Mon 11 Feb 2013   Share   Quote   Permalink   Like (2)   Dislike (1)  

    Vicente says

    Worst case every single one is fraud, 91 million dollars is probably far less
    than people spent on buying double whipped soy lattes in Mass. Starbucks. So
    yeah it's penny ante bullshit. Shit you spend 5 million just on the ADVERTISING
    BUDGET for your state lottery, and a more useless and wasteful and inefficient
    agency than state lotteries I cannot imagine.


    I doubt grocery chains would care much about enforcement of your proposal.
    Game it out, what's the downside for the grocery chain for being permissive
    about it? They sell alcohol and cigarettes to obvious minors that's a BFD. They
    sell some food to "the wrong person" well they've still sold food and who gives
    a shit? Gift cards don't carry ID data. Unless you want a new type of card that
    IS a state-issued ID? Frankly I don't get how this works without being either
    ineffective CYA BS or an additional cost to the retailer.

    ---------------------------------------------
    Yeah, 91 million could build a few new bridges, or structurally repair 5-10, so I guess that's 'penny-ante shit' in your mind....Like so many other states, my particular state funnels it's gas tax to some nebulous 'slush fund', where it should be going directly to the maintenance of our roads/bridges...Same goes for lottery winnings ('for the children, aka education), litigation windfall from the tobacco giants (PSA education)... It's all a budgetary scam, but I digress...

    As for your argument about grocery chains not caring about enforcement. I didn't mention this, and I actually don't care. I'm sure the supermarkets would be loving the new business. BTW, they don't sell alcohol in this state, so I don't know where you are getting at. Tobacco sales? huh? Where are you going with this?

    Again, it seems you think I'm attacking the 'end-user' of the benefits. I'm trying to find out if my state has the brains to realize that giving EBT cash to welfare recipients can be improved upon. If ANYTHING coming out of a supermarket was going to the wrong persons, at least it's better than my tax dollars paying for booze/drugs/casinos/strip clubs.

    EBT CASH = INSANITY..

  9. David Losh


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    81   3:35pm Mon 11 Feb 2013   Share   Quote   Permalink   Like   Dislike  

    AverageBear says

    EBT CASH = INSANITY..

    it's the same as issueing a welfare check except the money can be tracked.

  10. gsr


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    82   4:36pm Mon 11 Feb 2013   Share   Quote   Permalink   Like   Dislike   Protected  

    David Losh says

    So the system works.

    Right now, it works even better for J.P. Morgan.
    http://www.thedailybeast.com/articles/2012/10/01/jp-morgan-s-food-stamp-empire.html

    Here is a nice nugget:

    With states paying EBT processors so much, one might think that these companies would be expected to tenaciously prevent and investigate fraud and abuse. But according to state officials and a review of a sampling of these contracts, they do not task EBT providers with aggressive fraud prevention. That job is left to states’ EBT fraud investigation units (which police recipients of benefits) and the Agriculture Department (which polices retailers). According to the USDA’s website, the federal food stamp program has “over 100” inspectors to police the nearly 200,000 retailers nationwide that accept EBT cards. For its part, the state of Florida has 63 positions allocated to police over 3 million EBT users. JP Morgan is currently involved in an eight-month pilot project with Florida focused on EBT fraud and abuse. The total staff? Just one JP Morgan employee and five to ten state employees, according to Florida officials. Moreover, critics, such as author James Bovard, say that under President Obama the federal government has tried (unsuccessfully) to thwart states like California, New York, and Texas from implementing commonsense anti-fraud measures, such as requiring those applying for an EBT card to provide finger images.

  11. Vicente


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    83   4:43pm Mon 11 Feb 2013   Share   Quote   Permalink   Like   Dislike (2)  

    AverageBear says

    As for your argument about grocery chains not caring about enforcement. I didn't mention this, and I actually don't care. I'm sure the supermarkets would be loving the new business. BTW, they don't sell alcohol in this state, so I don't know where you are getting at. Tobacco sales? huh? Where are you going with this?

    Then what's the point? Oh wait you don't actually care about this issue right. I suggest you stick with tried&true "starve the beast". Cut 200 million from the welfare budget and magically all fraud will disappear, because presto-change-o it must. I believe it's already been pointed out why gift cards are prone to abuse and difficult to audit. But none of that matters. Over & out.

  12. AverageBear


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    84   3:30am Wed 13 Feb 2013   Share   Quote   Permalink   Like (1)   Dislike  

    Vicente says

    Then what's the point? Oh wait you don't actually care about this issue
    right. I suggest you stick with tried&true "starve the beast". Cut 200
    million from the welfare budget and magically all fraud will disappear, because
    presto-change-o it must. I believe it's already been pointed out why gift cards
    are prone to abuse and difficult to audit. But none of that matters. Over &
    out.

    -------------------------------------------------
    Vic, you are projecting yet again. I'm merely asking my state to look at ways of improving how welfare can be better distributed to the needy. They refuse to acknowledge their piss-poor solution of just waving the 'magic wand' and throwing cash at the problem without thinking. You've stated that i'm concerned with 'enforcement' of those that receive the benefits(not true). The problem is 'upstream', not 'downstream'. i'm asking and suggesting that my state find a better way. I find it funny that we can track how $$ gets spent w/ EBT credit cards, yet in the same breath you tell me we don't have the ability to track how $$ gets spent with a store gift card? What nonsense.... I understand that fraud and giving the supermarket card to someone else is entirely possible. However, it would make me feel better knowing that at least this taxpayer's money is being spent (and limited to a supermarket) on food/diapers/household items (whoever does wind up using it), as apposed to drugs/bail/strip clubs/out of state casinos/etc...

    You seem happy w/ the current technology that we use for our EBT/cash solution, but somehow can't imagine a card that can be used only in a supermarket, WHERE IT SHOULD ONLY BE USED. Guess what, vic? It's the same fuckin' technology! We can track who should have the card, when it's depleted, when we can replenish it w/ more funds by the week, which store it gets used at, etc.... Why are you opposed to this solution? You are OK w/ tax $$ going to booze/drugs/casinos? Apparently so, and are too lazy to think there's a better way.

    You and others that defend my state's failed EBT solution have repeated the following ... 1) I don't like poor people 2) The cost benefits are 'penny ante shit', and 3) I want to end welfare altogether.

    If these are the best arguments to my solution, then that tells me you are desperate at best.

  13. David Losh


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    85   8:54am Wed 13 Feb 2013   Share   Quote   Permalink   Like   Dislike  

    Here's a gem from comment 89's link: "18 of the 24 states JP Morgan handles have been contracted to pay the bank up to $560,492,596.02 since 2004. Since 2007, Florida has been contracted to pay JP Morgan $90,351,202.22. Pennsylvania’s seven-year contract totaled $112,541,823.27. New York’s seven-year contract totaled $126,394,917."

    Your State along with dozens of other constantly come up with high priced solution to combat fraud.

    How much is enough? How many more people do you want to hire to scan EBT transactions, let alone do immigration checks, get people into the office four times a year for intake, and issue IDs?

    How much is enough? That's the question.

  14. AverageBear


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    86   11:11am Thu 14 Feb 2013   Share   Quote   Permalink   Like (1)   Dislike  

    The hits just a' keep on comin'...... My state Gov't is run by a bunch of idiots. There's a reason why we are starting to call our governor 'Teflon Deval'.... Deval is hiring all of these mental midgets who can't even run a lemonade stand, and refuses to answer the tough questions (which rarely happens w/ our liberal state press/media)....

    http://bostonherald.com/news_opinion/local_coverage/2013/02/dta_glitch_led_to_ot_free_for_all

    ------------------------------------------------
    Taxpayers doled out a stunning $3.4 million in overtime to state workers to fix a massive, multimillion-dollar glitch in the scandal-plagued welfare department — a revelation critics say adds insult to injury as the state negotiates with the feds over how to pay back $27 million in food-stamp overpayments.

    More than 900 employees in the Department of Transitional Assistance — mostly caseworkers — shared in the $3.4 million OT bonanza between November 2010 and May 2011, the department acknowledged after a Herald public records request.

    DTA authorized the wages — an average of roughly $3,500 each — so staff could address a backlog of 30,000 clients whose eligibility had to be recertified after the agency overpaid food-stamp clients by $27 million in federal money.

    .“When it costs that much money to correct the problem, that’s an affront to the taxpayers of the commonwealth of Massachusetts, frankly,” said state Rep. Jim Dwyer (D-Woburn).

  15. Vicente


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    87   11:37am Thu 14 Feb 2013   Share   Quote   Permalink   Like   Dislike  

    AverageBear says

    i'm asking and suggesting that my state find a better way. I find it funny that we can track how $$ gets spent w/ EBT credit cards, yet in the same breath you tell me we don't have the ability to track how $$ gets spent with a store gift card?

    Please explain how this works.

    As currently implemented, they are CASH. I can hand you my card and you can spend it. Someone gives me a gift card to Jamba Juice or someplace else I never go. What do I do with it? I resell it to someone I know or I put it up on PlasticJungle. There is no identity attached to it. No audits are possible without identity being attached to a transaction entry.

    So you want to implement some different gift card system that does have identity & audit ability? How will that work, what will it cost, and who pays for it? Will retailers be required to implement a state-mandated solution for it out of their own pockets?

  16. David Losh


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    88   9:31pm Thu 14 Feb 2013   Share   Quote   Permalink   Like   Dislike (1)  

    AverageBear says

    Taxpayers doled out a stunning $3.4 million in overtime

    You cherry picked this article for drama.

    This is another labor dispute with the Union. Had the State authorized enough workers to adminster this program wthere wouldn't be a need to pay over time to correct the over payments.

    The people who suffer are the Food Stamp program receiptients.

    So in a time when the State needs more jobs the State refuses to hire because it might swell the Union ranks. Nice.

  17. AverageBear


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    89   1:49pm Tue 28 May 2013   Share   Quote   Permalink   Like (1)   Dislike  

    Massachusetts' Dept of Transitional Assistance (DTA) efforts to improve fraud/waste is "Flowing like peanut butter"......

    I'll stop bashing my state gov't (ie, gov. Deval Patrick and the state senate), when I see that they care more about the voting, law-abiding taxpayer, rather than the deadbeat cheaters...

    http://bostonherald.com/news_opinion/local_coverage/2013/05/audit_1164_dead_people_received_welfare_benefits

    • Auditors identified 1,164 cases where $2.39 million was paid in benefits from six to 27 months after the recipients had died.

    • DTA gave out another $532,000 to people either claiming deceased dependents or to 40 people who were being claimed by more than one guardian.

    • During the time the audit focused on, DTA did not verify self-reported Social Security numbers, leading the state to pay out more than $1 million to those using two numbers to collect and individuals whose Social Security numbers were being used by more than one person. It also shelled out benefits for an “extended amount of time” to people with an invalid temporary Social Security number.

    • Five regional DTA offices could not provide documentation for more than 30,000 blank EBT cards, raising serious questions in an agency where past internal probes found employees misusing blank EBT cards to access recipients’ benefits inappropriately.

    • Despite generating reports to help identify fraud, DTA did not use them, even though they revealed more than $15 million in EBT activity that auditors say “should have been identified by DTA and investigated.”

  18. AverageBear


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    90   1:51pm Tue 28 May 2013   Share   Quote   Permalink   Like (1)   Dislike  

    David Losh says

    The people who suffer are the Food Stamp program receiptients.

    Suffer? Yah. They suffer all right. They suffer at the nail salon, the liquor store, and "suffer" at the ATM machine before they use the 'state assistance' to fund their night out..... Please wake up...

  19. marcus


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    91   2:01pm Tue 28 May 2013   Share   Quote   Permalink   Like   Dislike (1)  

    The Professor says

    Total 2012 entitlement spending: $2,053,000,000,000.00

    Us Population: 313,914,040

    $6,540 in entitlement spending for every man, woman, and child in the US.

    You know this probably includes social security and medicare right (but not the money collected from everyones FICA and medicare payment).

    What a total crock.

    What about the years when more was being paid in to SS than "spent" on it.

  20. bob2356


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    92   6:06pm Tue 28 May 2013   Share   Quote   Permalink   Like   Dislike  

    AverageBear says

    My state Gov't is run by a bunch of idiots.

    You elected them.

  21. thomaswong.1986


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    93   6:41pm Tue 28 May 2013   Share   Quote   Permalink   Like (1)   Dislike  

    AverageBear says

    Massachusetts' Dept of Transitional Assistance (DTA) efforts to improve fraud/waste is "Flowing like peanut butter"......

    I'll stop bashing my state gov't (ie, gov. Deval Patrick and the state senate), when I see that they care more about the voting, law-abiding taxpayer, rather than the deadbeat cheaters...

    You notice how some here on Pnet are actually defending this waste and abuse ?

  22. thomaswong.1986


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    94   6:49pm Tue 28 May 2013   Share   Quote   Permalink   Like (1)   Dislike  

    AverageBear says

    ...."Those 19,000 MIA’s collect — based on an average of $400 a month — $91 million a year. That’s the estimate of Rep. Shauna O’Connell (R-Taunton). But the governor Friday went into his best pooh-pooh mode.

    Ever wonder you dont see private industry get stung by fraud salary and benefit payments ?

    Mass and many other states need to take a lesson on proper cash disbursement from private industries.

    Of course adopting corporate practices would not be looked kindly by the left, even though it works far better than govt.

  23. marcus


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    95   6:58pm Tue 28 May 2013   Share   Quote   Permalink   Like   Dislike (1)  

    AverageBear says

    Dems say 'Nothing wrong here

    Straw man

  24. AverageBear


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    96   7:35pm Tue 28 May 2013   Share   Quote   Permalink   Like (1)   Dislike  

    bob2356 says

    AverageBear says

    My state Gov't is run by a bunch of idiots.

    You elected them.

    No, my idiot neighbors elected them...

  25. AverageBear


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    97   5:13am Wed 29 May 2013   Share   Quote   Permalink   Like (1)   Dislike  

    David Losh says

    You cherry picked this article for drama.

    This is another labor dispute with the Union. Had the State authorized enough workers to adminster this program wthere wouldn't be a need to pay over time to correct the over payments.

    The people who suffer are the Food Stamp program receiptients.

    David, I can't fathom how you can defend the piss-poor status quo on how my state doles out the tax-payer $$ to dead-beats w/ complete ineptitude.

    Sooo, these are the people who 'suffer'? You mean those that spent $27 million (!) out of state, including $4.5 million spent in Florida, the Virgin Islands, and Hawaii. You equate 'suffering' with spending tax-payer $$ in Hawaii? Please explain....

    --------------------------
    Among the audit’s findings:

    • Nearly $2.4 million in benefits were paid to people who had been dead for anywhere from six to 27 months.

    • $120,000 was paid out to 42 of the departed, benefits that “began after the recipients’ date of death.”

    • More than $27 million in benefits were accessed out of state in a six-month period, including $4.5 million in such far-flung states as Florida, the Virgin Islands and Hawaii. Top cities where public money was drawn via EBT cards included Orlando, Myrtle Beach and Las Vegas.

    •  Over a six-year period ending in 2012, DTA reissued more than 147,000 replacement cards to 9,846 people, an average of 14 per person. Among those, 358 people were issued 30 or more cards, and one was issued 127.

    • In fiscal year 2012 alone, 42 percent of all the 859,000 active cards were reissued.
    ----------------------------

    http://bostonherald.com/news_opinion/local_politics/2013/05/dems_grave_errors_show_reform_needed

    You think I 'cherry picked' this article during the winter. Well it's gonna be cherry-picking season, because the link above will be on of MANY articles coming out..... If it weren't for the Herald's reporting, this wouldn't have put a fire under the asses of my Democrat-run state senate, and Democrat govenor. You know Deval Patrick, the one who wanted to raise our state taxes by $200 million while turning a blind eye to the DTA's waste/abuse/fraud. He is a lying idiot, who doesn't give a crap about the law-abiding taxpayer. He defends he illegal aliens (and their 'right' to low-cost state college tuition), the deadbeats, and the child-rapists of my state (Go ahead and google "deval patrick ben leguer" when you get a chance; both are real 'stand up' guys, eh?)...

    So while the Democrat-run Boston Globe carries the water, the Herald is doing it's job. I wish the 'paper of record' for New England would do the same.......

  26. zzyzzx


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    98   6:25am Wed 29 May 2013   Share   Quote   Permalink   Like (3)   Dislike  

    Vicente says

    So you want to implement some different gift card system that does have identity & audit ability?

    The welfare card should have the picture of the deadbeat on the card, so that the cashier can verify it.

  27. adarmiento


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    99   6:49am Wed 29 May 2013   Share   Quote   Permalink   Like (1)   Dislike  

    marcus says

    You know this probably includes social security and medicare right (but not the money collected from everyones FICA and medicare payment).

    From http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2013_United_States_federal_budget, the FY2012 budget was

    $3.8 trillion total budgeted
    $2.9 trillion in total receipts (income tax, social security tax, etc.)
    About $1 trillion deficit

    Top 3 categories
    $940.9 billion for Health and Human Services (Medicare, Medicaid, etc.)
    $883.7 billion for Social Security Administration
    $673 billion for Department of Defense

  28. marcus


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    100   7:04am Wed 29 May 2013   Share   Quote   Permalink   Like   Dislike (1)  

    Yes, exactly.

    If you don't say how much of that total 2.9 trillion in receipts is from SS and medicare taxes, then screaming about "omg look at how much we spend on entitlements" is little more than propagada to get the hillbillies and the t.wrong types all worked up.

    adarmiento says

    Top 3 categories

    $940.9 billion for Health and Human Services (Medicare, Medicaid, etc.)

    $883.7 billion for Social Security Administration

    $673 billion for Department of Defense

    Your numbers don't give the slightest indication of how much of the deficit comes from "entitlement" spending.

    But gaaaaaawleee, that sure is a big number.

    And we only just now resumed people paying fica taxes (social security), so the year you chose may be misleading, that is if you were to find and present the relevant information.

  29. adarmiento


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    101   7:58am Wed 29 May 2013   Share   Quote   Permalink   Like (1)   Dislike  

    marcus says

    If you don't say how much of that total 2.9 trillion in receipts is from SS and medicare taxes

    $959 billion in Social Security and other payroll taxes

    $1359 in individual income tax

    as per http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2013_United_States_federal_budget#Total_revenues_and_spending

    Even if Social Security and other payroll taxes was to increase by 50%, it would still be at least less than 50% less than the outlays for Social Security, Medicare and Medicaid.

  30. adarmiento


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    102   8:03am Wed 29 May 2013   Share   Quote   Permalink   Like (1)   Dislike  

    As far as entitlement spending, add to the below list also the USDA food stamp program and other nutrition programs as well as HUD's housing assistance. So the below only represents a portion of the total entitlement spending for 2012:

    1) $940.9 billion for Health and Human Services (Medicare, Medicaid, etc.)

    2) $883.7 billion for Social Security Administration

    The above 2 entitlement programs are 3 times greater than Dept of Defense spending.

  31. marcus


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    103   6:34pm Wed 29 May 2013   Share   Quote   Permalink   Like   Dislike (1)  

    adarmiento says

    The above 2 entitlement programs are 3 times greater than Dept of Defense spending.

    Still misleading.

    WE have a tax FICA, that is expressly for SS.

    We have another tax, medicare, that goes toward medicare.

    Up until fairly recently, the FICA incoming money was greater than outgoing. If you consider interest on the SS trust fund, it's probably still greater (but it's complicated by the fact that there was a FICA tax holiday for a while).

    If the SS surplus hadn't been given to the rich via tax cuts, we would be in FAR better shape than we are.

    For that matter, if Gore had been elected and had segregated SS money from the budget (his so called "lock box") we would have also been far better off.

    Under Gore we probably would have had a post millenial long stagnation in the economy, with less war, and we probably would have avoided the bubble, the crash and the depression we've been in.

  32. marcus


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    104   6:36pm Wed 29 May 2013   Share   Quote   Permalink   Like   Dislike (1)  

    When the SS trust fund money is spent on SS benefits, republicans include that in the "entitlement spending" boogey man.

  33. adarmiento


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    105   6:41pm Wed 29 May 2013   Share   Quote   Permalink   Like (1)   Dislike  

    I agree that the Social Security fund should never have been used to finance the debt.

    But you cannot deny that the top two entitlement programs are 3 times greater than the Department of Defense budget. Tap dance around that, or keep throwing up straw mans as much as you want.

  34. marcus


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    106   7:35pm Wed 29 May 2013   Share   Quote   Permalink   Like   Dislike (2)  

    adarmiento says

    But you cannot deny that the top two entitlement programs are 3 times greater than the Department of Defense budget. Tap dance around that, or keep throwing up straw mans as much as you want.

    Defense comes out of a general income taxes.

    Social security and medicare have separate taxes, you can read right on your pay stub, how much goes to SS and how much goes to medicare. This is money that is supposedly put away for you, to get back in your old age as pension and old age health incurance (that you pay in to your whole woking life).

    That's not tap dancing. It's just facts. They may mean something different to you than they do to me, but still facts.

    Now, if you want to talk about how much more gets spent on old age health care under medicare, than what we paid in, well that's an interesting conversation to have. It essentially means we need death panels (ie people and policies for fair rationing of expensive end of life treatments).

    Probably plenty of other reforms to bring down health care.

    But comparing money paid out of what is essentially a pension fund, or money paid out of what is essentially a health plan you pay in to for your whole working life, to what we spend on defense that comes out of general income tax ?

    That makes no sense.

    I know, I know, too complicated. You know what you know. I'm tap dancing.

    Whatever.

  35. adarmiento


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    107   11:44am Thu 30 May 2013   Share   Quote   Permalink   Like (2)   Dislike  

    I am saying that out of total taxes, that the USA pays 3 times as much just on social security, medicare and medicaid than on the department of defense. And that does not include other social spending such as food stamps and education funding.

  36. AverageBear


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    108   9:40am Fri 7 Jun 2013   Share   Quote   Permalink   Like (1)   Dislike  

    Stay Classy, Massachusetts Democrats...

    Being asked to pay $800 for FOI request on DTA records that's already months old? Fuckin' SHAMEFUL! And the requester isn't some nobody. She's a Mass state rep. Stonewalling like crazy, these democrats. This data must have some really damning evidence.

    http://bostonherald.com/news_opinion/local_politics/2013/06/shaunna_o_connell_pays_info_ransom

    ---------------------------------------------
    Welfare reform crusader state Rep. Shaunna O’Connell delivered on her promise yesterday to fork over $800 for long-awaited records on bloated EBT balances, saying the pricey “ransom” was thanks to a surge of donations from fed-up constituents.

    O’Connell wrote the check and marched down the hill from the State House to the Downtown Crossing offices of the Department of Transitional Assistance to personally deliver the fee.

    “If DTA wants to hold these records hostage and make me pay ransom for them, then I’m going to pay the ransom for them,” she told the Herald as she embarked on her mission. “These should be public records. The public has a right to know.”

    .

    O’Connell is demanding electronic copies of all EBT balances over a six-month period this past fall and winter with balances above $1,500. She was told the records will be delivered within 10 days.

    Gov. Deval Patrick has supported the $800 price tag for the records, with officials saying the money will be used to compile the data.

    “We’re talking about taxpayers. They’re paying their taxes, they’re paying for fraud in this program, and now they’re helping to get these records,” O’Connell said. “I’m just going to pay this. I don’t want to drag it out anymore.”

    O’Connell can use campaign funds for political expenditures as long as it “not primarily personal” in nature, according to a spokesman for the Office of Campaign and Political Finance.

    “Campaign funds can be used to pay for a records request if it enhances their political future,” said spokesman Jason Tait, adding he couldn’t directly comment on O’Connell’s case.

    O’Connell said she launched her EBT project after a store owner in Pittsfield sent her a receipt showing a customer’s alarming $7,000 EBT balance.

    “Somebody who accumulated that much money shouldn’t be on welfare,” she said. “That’s fraud.”

    DTA spokesman Alec Loftus said in a statement yesterday: “We are glad that Representative O’Connell is paying for her request, so taxpayers don’t have to pick up the tab.”

    The Taunton Republican’s do-it-yourself probe comes a week after state Auditor Suzanne M. Bump released a scathing report showing DTA paid about $2.4 million to 1,100 dead people — and doled out millions more to live recipients collecting EBT benefits from Florida and Las Vegas to the Virgin Islands.

    Evidence of sky-high EBT balances could raise new questions at the scandal-ravaged welfare department, including whether such recipients even need public assistance and whether they are fraudulently holding more than one card.

    The payoff came as a committee of lawmakers dove into closed-door meetings to hash out a 
$34 billion state budget, with House-passed welfare reforms looming large in the negotiations.

  37. AverageBear


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    109   7:00am Sun 28 Jul 2013   Share   Quote   Permalink   Like   Dislike  

    yet another example of Welfare abuse. This time it's in NYC, where Welfare abusers are taking tax-payer $$, buying food here, and shipping it to other countries in barrels for profit. Not to feed poor people OUTSIDE of our country for free. FOR PROFIT....

    Any liberal on patrick care to defend our status quo, piss poor, job of managing our welfare system? hmm?

    http://www.nypost.com/p/news/local/isle_take_that_welfare_scam_VBsTspIxia2GA9o2oS505L

  38. bob2356


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    110   7:51am Sun 28 Jul 2013   Share   Quote   Permalink   Like   Dislike (1)  

    adarmiento says

    I agree that the Social Security fund should never have been used to finance the debt.

    What you actually mean, but are failing to say is, that SS funds should have never been used to finance defense spending since defense is over half the general budget if honest accounting were used.

  39. AverageBear


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    111   7:39am Mon 29 Jul 2013   Share   Quote   Permalink   Like (1)   Dislike  

    bob2356 says

    adarmiento says



    I agree that the Social Security fund should never have been used to finance the debt.



    What you actually mean, but are failing to say is, that SS funds should have never been used to finance defense spending since defense is over half the general budget if honest accounting were used.

    ie, has nothing to do with this thread (Welfare abuse/fraud).... SS is a different topic.....

  40. AverageBear


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    112   8:51am Wed 7 Aug 2013   Share   Quote   Permalink   Like   Dislike  

    EBT Fraudster threatens cop with VooDoo after crashing car....

    http://bostonherald.com/news_opinion/local_coverage/2013/08/what_the_hex_oui_suspect_charged_in_wild_crash_threatened_cop

    A Cadillac-driving OUI suspect — charged with running a Boston Globe delivery truck off Interstate 93 and onto the Leverett Connector — was carrying three EBT cards, mocked a cop “for paying for food when she gets it for free” and threatened to put a voodoo curse on him, according to a police report.“I questioned her as to why she had other peoples (sic) EBT cards and she 
began screaming that I was a ‘dumb (expletive)’ for paying for food when she gets it for free,” trooper William Koko­cinski wrote of Vivencia 
Bellegarde, 25, of Everett, noting she had her own electronic benefits transfer card and also the cards of two other people.“She repeatedly called me a racist and told me she was from Haiti and she was gonna ‘put voodoo on my white (expletive),’” Kokocinski wrote. “(She) told me to Google her name and find out who I was ‘(expletive) with’. She further explained that her name translated means ‘give life take life’ and she emphasized ‘TAKE LIFE’. She then shouted that she was ‘coming for all you white (expletives).’”A spokesman for the state Department of Transitional Assistance, which administers welfare, said in a statement the agency has been notified of Bellegarde’s EBT cards “and will take appropriate action.”“DTA investigates every
tip that it receives from members of the public or law enforcement, and refers cases to the auditor’s Bureau of Special Investigations for further action, which has the power to investigate potential criminal matters,” the statement said.Bellegarde, who is listed as unemployed in court 
papers, is being held on $10,000 bail on charges of drunken driving causing serious injury. Surveillance video of the 3:13 a.m. Monday crash shows a car slamming into the Globe truck, forcing it off the roadway and into a frightening 40-foot free fall. The truck came apart on impact with the Leverett Connector 
on-ramp below.The truck driver, Paul Healy Jr., 35, of Brockton, was taken to Massachusetts General Hospital, where he was in fair condition yesterday. He declined to comment yesterday through a family member. - See more at: http://bostonherald.com/news_opinion/local_coverage/2013/08/what_the_hex_oui_suspect_charged_in_wild_crash_threatened_cop#sthash.l62UFnZO.dpuf

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