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kidnapper sounds a lot like patnet posters


By Kevin   Follow   Mon, 4 Feb 2013, 10:59am PST   4,288 views   141 comments   Watch (1)   Share   Quote   Permalink   Like   Dislike (1)  

http://www.nytimes.com/2013/02/05/us/boy-is-safe-after-alabama-hostage-standoff.html

I wouldnt be surprised if he was a regular here.

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thomaswong.1986   befriend   ignore   Wed, 6 Feb 2013, 1:34pm PST   Share   Quote   Like   Dislike (2)     Comment 102

Dan8267 says

There were no "German-American" camps

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/German_American_internment

German American Internment refers to the detention of German and German-American citizens in the United States during World War I and World War II. Unlike the Japanese Americans who were interned during World War II, these internees have never received an apology or reparations

thomaswong.1986   befriend   ignore   Wed, 6 Feb 2013, 1:39pm PST   Share   Quote   Like   Dislike (2)     Comment 103

Dan8267 says

Ludlow Massacre

pack your bags and leave CO if you didnt like what was going on.

thomaswong.1986   befriend   ignore   Wed, 6 Feb 2013, 1:40pm PST   Share   Quote   Like   Dislike (2)     Comment 104

Dan8267 says

Furthermore, I'm not equating those two things.

what do you call Auschwitz but an atrocity.. you have a different word you use ?

Dan8267   befriend   ignore   Wed, 6 Feb 2013, 1:46pm PST   Share   Quote   Like (2)   Dislike (2)     Comment 105

thomaswong.1986 says

no .. you are wrong. and you only give an example of confiscation of one piece of land due to the war which happen to been by Japanese owners. There was no wide govt policy which would indicate all Japanese property was confiscated.

You want more?

http://www.fear.org/RMillerJ-A.html

Lieutenant General John L. DeWitt, who directed the roundup of Japanese-Americans, said most victims "voluntarily" sold their automobiles to the U.S. Army--which was holding the cars' owners in custody. Cars not "voluntarily" sold to the Army were seized by the Army. The military then resold 1942 models to automobile dealers so they would have merchandise to offer (the auto industry having converted to war work).36 If victims drove to an assembly center in their cars, the vehicles were confiscated upon arrival.37 Farm equipment went for five and ten cents on the dollar.38 "It is just common knowledge," said one observer. The observer noted a scam in which a Japanese-American would receive a fake telephone call allegedly from the FBI, military, or police saying to pack for immediate departure; later in the day a buyer would appear on the victim's doorstep.39 "In the few days allowed the evacuees before their eviction, bargain hunters and junk dealers descended in hordes. The frightened and confused became easy prey to swindlers who threatened to 'arrange' for the confiscation of their property if they would not agree to a forced sale at the pittance offered."40 Governmental authorities outright confiscated assorted minor personal possessions; in February 1942 San Francisco's police chief said his department was holding 6,000 radios and cameras taken from Japanese-Americans.41 Such items did not have to be seized in raids; owners turned them in on demand. Berkeley's police chief noted, "In about 3 days I believe over 400 different aliens brought in property worth thousands of dollars. Some of it was very bulky."42

http://www.nps.gov/nhl/themes/JPNAmericanTS.pdf

Nihon Go Gakko (Japanese Language School) – Seattle, King County, Washington
Property Type: Places associated with exclusion
Established in 1902, this is the oldest functioning Japanese language school in the continental United
States. Located on the outskirts of Seattle’s Japantown, it consists of three buildings constructed
between 1913 and 1920. The language school was closed and the property confiscated by the Federal
government in 1942; school facilities were subsequently used for training Army Air Forces personnel.
Some Japanese American graduates of the school served with the armed forces, and helped interrogate
prisoners and translate captured documents. After the war, many evacuees returned from the camps to
Seattle but housing was scarce. For three years, twenty-seven families lived in the classrooms of the
language school. The Seattle Nihon Go Gakko was listed in the National Register in 1982.
Recommendation: This property should be studied for possible NHL designation.

http://www.sfmuseum.org/hist9/harvest.html

Of the 200,000 acres confiscated or sold under duress, the Wartime Civil Control Administration estimated, in April 1942, that nearly 43,000 acres were still available for new operators, and crops on 21 per cent of the total acreage subject to evacuation might be lost if substitute operators were not found soon. This would suggest that removal of the Japanese farmers was not in the best short-term interest of the United States and may have actually hurt the war effort.

Shit like this happened all over the country. Do a Google search. Better yet, educate yourself by going to a museum with an exhibit on the Japanese-American experience during WWII.

Ignorance is not a form of patriotism.

Dan8267   befriend   ignore   Wed, 6 Feb 2013, 1:48pm PST   Share   Quote   Like (2)   Dislike (1)     Comment 106

thomaswong.1986 says

Dan8267 says

Ludlow Massacre

pack your bags and leave CO if you didnt like what was going on.

This post perfectly sums up why you are an utter asshole. Your not even worth arguing with. If your attitude towards the gunning down and burning alive of innocent American men, women, and children is leave Colorado if you don't like it, then your opinions don't count for shit.

Kevin   befriend   ignore   Wed, 6 Feb 2013, 2:00pm PST   Share   Quote   Like (2)   Dislike (1)     Comment 107

Dan8267 says

IDDQD says

Dan8267 says

Not RT News.

You are aware that it's fully funded by Russian federal budget?

Yes, I'm also aware that the news is true, accurate, and far better than anything on American T.V. Like it or not, RT News in Washington is extremely good news regardless of where its funding comes from. You cannot say the same about Fox, CNN, or MSNBC, especially fucking Fox.

Just because you agree with something doesn't make it "true" or "accurate".

Dan8267   befriend   ignore   Wed, 6 Feb 2013, 2:03pm PST   Share   Quote   Like (1)   Dislike (1)     Comment 108

Kevin says

Just because you agree with something doesn't make it "true" or "accurate".

Absolutely. What makes something true and accurate is that it corresponds to reality, unlike Fox News. And RT News does, at least every bit of RT News I've watched, and I've watch quite a bit of RT News America.

I know RT News is accurate and true because I can independently verify the news it reports. That's what so fucking great about living in the information age.

Now, if you believe RT News is lying about stuff, feel free to go through all the YouTube videos of RT News I've linked to and point out specific falsehoods. The Daily Show and the Colbert Report do exactly this same thing to Fox News every day.

thomaswong.1986   befriend   ignore   Wed, 6 Feb 2013, 2:15pm PST   Share   Quote   Like (1)   Dislike (1)     Comment 109

Dan8267 says

Ignorance is not a form of patriotism.

are you ready to post disclaimer on the German American internment camps ?

Dan8267   befriend   ignore   Wed, 6 Feb 2013, 2:26pm PST   Share   Quote   Like (2)   Dislike (1)     Comment 110

IDDQD says

Dan8267 says

Armed civilians have never, ever, ever worked in the entire history of America

Not even in Athens, TN in 1946?

At least this is somewhat close to an example, but not quite.

1. The "civilians" were all recent ex-soldiers who had access to the National Guard armory. Not exactly a civilian militia with only civilian resources.

http://constitution.org/mil/tn/batathen.htm

By borrowing keys to the National Guard and State Guard Armories, they got three M-1 rifles, five .45 semi-automatic pistols, and 24 British Enfield rifles.

2. The local jail was heavily out-armed by the GIs. The exact opposite would be the case today with even local police forces having assault weapons.

Three GIs - alerting passersby to danger - were fired on from the jail. Two GIs were wounded. Other GIs returned fire. Those inside the jail mainly used pistols; they also had a "tommy gun" (a .45 caliber Thompson sub-machine gun).

3. The national guard was never called in precisely because this was just after WWII and the "militia" was composed entirely of GIs.

Governor McCord mobilized the State Guard, perhaps to scare the GIs into withdrawing. The State Guard never went to Athens. McCord may have feared that Guard units filled with ex-GIs might not fire on other ex-GIs.

4. The federal government backed the GIs, not local law enforcement, because this was just an isolated, hick town with an obviously corrupt sheriff. This fact is made evident both by the lack of prosecution by the state and by Eleanor Roosevelt's own comments which basically stated that the GIs were in the right. But in this age of "the war on terror", would the federal government back up a militia going against local law enforcement? Probably not.

Nevertheless, I did enjoy this story and I wish the military and ex-military actually did stand up against local injustices like this and national injustices like the Patriot Act and the NDAA, but today they simply don't do this. And today even local law enforcement would be able to call in help from many other resources. Multiple SWATT teams would have responded to combat the GIs if this were to happen today.

Dan8267   befriend   ignore   Wed, 6 Feb 2013, 2:34pm PST   Share   Quote   Like (2)   Dislike (1)     Comment 111

thomaswong.1986 says

are you ready to post disclaimer on the German American internment camps ?

Congradufuckulations. You googled every single thing I said and manage to find one incorrect statement. Yes, I did not know that German Americans were arrested and imprisoned without cause during WWII. Neither did you or anyone else on this site. It's not common knowledge, as opposed to the detainment camps of Japanese Americans during WWII, which is well-known because it happened on such a massive scale.

And yes, I would call the treatment of these German Americans deplorable and a crime against human rights. This, however, does not undermine any point that I have made including:

1. Japanese-Americans property and land was confiscated either out right or by strong-arming.

2. Japanese-Americans were never compensated for this injustice.

3. The imprisonment of Japanese-Americans and the confiscation of their property and land was due mostly to greed and racism.

4. Had the Japanese-Americans fought back with guns, they would have been slaughtered.

Dan8267   befriend   ignore   Wed, 6 Feb 2013, 2:41pm PST   Share   Quote   Like (1)   Dislike (1)     Comment 112

Vicente says

Because you know, the ravaging Mad Max hordes will target Idaho, it's obvious!

Not a terribly bad design for a zombie apocalypse, but the outer wall needs to be thicker, there needs to be a second gate pair at the other side for emergencies, the interior between the two walls needs to be partitioned into two sections (front and back).

Kevin   befriend   ignore   Wed, 6 Feb 2013, 2:57pm PST   Share   Quote   Like (3)   Dislike     Comment 113

Dan8267 says

Kevin says

Just because you agree with something doesn't make it "true" or "accurate".

Absolutely. What makes something true and accurate is that it corresponds to reality, unlike Fox News. And RT News does, at least every bit of RT News I've watched, and I've watch quite a bit of RT News America.

I know RT News is accurate and true because I can independently verify the news it reports. That's what so fucking great about living in the information age.

Now, if you believe RT News is lying about stuff, feel free to go through all the YouTube videos of RT News I've linked to and point out specific falsehoods. The Daily Show and the Colbert Report do exactly this same thing to Fox News every day.

Nope, sorry.

The problem with outlets like RT News, China Daily, etc. isn't that they lie -- it's that they only publish stories that support the narrative that they're trying to create. They commit lies of omission. It's propaganda 101, and the Russians and Chinese are experts at it.

The fact that they're state-run news agencies says everything.

I've worked for news organizations before. There was always some agenda, but it didn't come from any government official. Mostly it came from not wanting to alienate advertisers.

Lets say that there was a man who saved 5 people from a burning building, raised a dozen orphans, saved a stranger's life by donating a kidney, and runs a charity that builds schools in Africa.

The guy also once got arrested for public intoxication.

A news paper decides to publish the public intoxication story, but none of the rest. The public's impression is that this guy is a drunken asshole.

Did they lie? Nope. Did they tell the truth? Nope.

If you want a non-US news source that generally prints the truth (and the whole truth) without much obvious bias, try the likes of Al Jazeera, not RT News.

Yes, the big 3 cable news companies are shitty news in general, but they're just generic corporate news. There are literally thousands of other sources of news, and very few of them are as awful as the ones you're referring to.

By the way -- not that many people actually watch cable news. They get a lot of attention because they're, collectively, the single largest news source, but they're still tiny, with fewer than 5% of americans ever tuning into any one of those cable news channels. They're irrelevant.

thomaswong.1986   befriend   ignore   Wed, 6 Feb 2013, 3:25pm PST   Share   Quote   Like (1)   Dislike (1)     Comment 114

Dan8267 says

It's not common knowledge, as opposed to the detainment camps of Japanese Americans during WWII, which is well-known because it happened on such a massive scale.

was not an atrocity as you state.. and not a big deal since many were treated well enough given the times. the USA govt didnt butcher the JA as the Japanese and German Govts butchered their detained citizens. So your pathetic comments are worthless.

there was every reason to detain actual and suspected citizens and agents of foreign powers. may well have saved 10,000s of others since we already found spies and were attacked at both ends by foreign submarines. Worth it as history has shown Japan was a Militaristic fascist society based on their past history. Fact is they were and still are much more racists than western societies.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Japanese_spies,_1930-1945

Dan8267 says

1. Japanese-Americans property and land was confiscated either out right or by strong-arming.

2. Japanese-Americans were never compensated for this injustice.

3. The imprisonment of Japanese-Americans and the confiscation of their property and land was due mostly to greed and racism.

You think the Japanese Govt thought about this when they attacked Pearl Harbor and started WWII. Though shit ...

Kevin   befriend   ignore   Wed, 6 Feb 2013, 3:34pm PST   Share   Quote   Like (2)   Dislike     Comment 115

thomaswong.1986 says

You think the Japanese Govt thought about this when they attacked Pearl Harbor and started WWII. Though shit ...

What does the Japanese government have to do with how we treated American citizens?

JodyChunder   befriend   ignore   Wed, 6 Feb 2013, 8:39pm PST   Share   Quote   Like (1)   Dislike     Comment 116

Kevin says

There was always some agenda, but it didn't come from any government official. Mostly it came from not wanting to alienate advertisers.

This is exactly right. There are a few really truly great news resources out there, but I don't think agenda-free news exists anymore, if ever it did.

Dan8267   befriend   ignore   Thu, 7 Feb 2013, 12:21am PST   Share   Quote   Like (1)   Dislike (1)     Comment 117

Kevin says

The problem with outlets like RT News, China Daily, etc. isn't that they lie -- it's that they only publish stories that support the narrative that they're trying to create.

You mean exactly like every other news organization ever? In any case, RT News covers things that should be covered by other news outlets.

Kevin says

The fact that they're state-run news agencies says everything.

One can say the exact same thing about corporate-run news agencies. So, no it doesn't.

The thing about misinformation is that you should be able to demonstrate that it is misinformation as oppose to just saying the source is bad. If you need examples, watch The Daily Show. They demonstrate the misinformation of cable news, particularly Fox, is vivid detail.

In contrast, your argument that RT News is bad because it comes from the state of Russia is not a convincing argument. You should be able to show that RT News is bad with actual evidence that has nothing to do with where it comes from.

Kevin says

They commit lies of omission.

Lies of omission are the easiest lies to expose. For example, recently the entire Fox News propaganda machine took a sound bite from Hilary Clinton's testimony to imply that she was saying that there should be no investigation into what caused the security failure in the embassy bombing. Jon Stewart played the very next sentence out of Clinton's mouth which showed she was stating the exact opposite. Fox News is exposed as the propaganda machine targeting idiots that it is.

Again, go through every RT News story I've posted and point out the alleged "lies of omissions". This should be damn easy if what you are saying is correct. And if you actually do this, I will agree with you. But I'm not going to take your opinion at its face value since every independent check of the facts behind the stories of RT News I've ever conducted has confirmed the accuracy and completeness of the story.

I'm just calling them like I see them. I've got no stake in either side.

Dan8267   befriend   ignore   Thu, 7 Feb 2013, 12:26am PST   Share   Quote   Like (3)   Dislike (1)     Comment 118

thomaswong.1986 says

the USA govt didnt butcher the JA as the Japanese and German Govts butchered their detained citizens.

No one ever claimed that. That's a Straw Man argument.

And if you're counter-argument is, America isn't as bad as Nazi Germany, well, that's a weak ass argument that America does not commit any atrocities.

- America has committed genocide: the Native Americans.
- America has committed slavery for over 100 years under our country's rule.
- America has committed systematic arrest and sterilization of ethnic groups.
- America has targeted innocent, noncombatant civilians in war including children.
- America has used weapons of mass destruction including nuclear and chemical.
- America has violate the basic right of habeas corpus, a cornerstone of Western Civilization since the Magna Carta.
- America has tortured.
- America has used rape and sexual humiliation as weapons.

To say that the America government has never behaved tyrannically is ridiculous.

Dan8267   befriend   ignore   Thu, 7 Feb 2013, 12:28am PST   Share   Quote   Like (2)   Dislike (1)     Comment 119

Kevin says

thomaswong.1986 says

You think the Japanese Govt thought about this when they attacked Pearl Harbor and started WWII. Though shit ...

What does the Japanese government have to do with how we treated American citizens?

In petty and childish minds, the atrocities committed by one side excuse all atrocities committed by the other side even those committed against innocent citizens who aren't even affiliated with the first side.

Kevin   befriend   ignore   Thu, 7 Feb 2013, 1:13am PST   Share   Quote   Like (4)   Dislike     Comment 120

Dan, without even trying, you should have at least come across this:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/RT_(TV_network)#News_coverage

The stories that they choose NOT to cover says more to me about a news organization than the ones they do.

I don't know why you keep using Fox news as the baseline. Fox News is a hack company designed to cater to conservative americans. Nobody takes them seriously as a news organization. They're a step below CNN and MSNBC, and those are miles below actual news organizations.

Saying that somebody is no worse than / slightly better than Fox News is like saying that Stalin was an OK guy because at least he wasn't Hitler.

Vicente   befriend   ignore   Thu, 7 Feb 2013, 3:35am PST   Share   Quote   Like (1)   Dislike (1)     Comment 121

Dan8267 says

Not a terribly bad design for a zombie apocalypse, but the outer wall needs to be thicker, there needs to be a second gate pair at the other side for emergencies, the interior between the two walls needs to be partitioned into two sections (front and back).

Oh you can count on there being secret escape tunnels from the dozens of underground bunkers. If there's one thing you can count on with these folks, it's they like cellars and tunnels!

Problems are numerous. Castle and fortress designs were a good solution right up until the invention of explosives. At this point it's a huge waste of redneck money. But I suppose it's no dumber than some other things Uh-mericans spend money on.

I like pointing people to this Siberian family, to knock some of their survivalist fantasies down a peg:

http://www.smithsonianmag.com/history-archaeology/For-40-Years-This-Russian-Family-Was-Cut-Off-From-Human-Contact-Unaware-of-World-War-II-188843001.html

Dan8267   befriend   ignore   Thu, 7 Feb 2013, 4:03am PST   Share   Quote   Like   Dislike (1)     Comment 122

Kevin says

Dan, without even trying, you should have at least come across this:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/RT_(TV_network)#News_coverage

Wikipedia is worth than worthless. It's so full of misinformation and propaganda from both governments and corporations that a person is better off avoiding even looking at it. Wikipedia will steer you the wrong way even with its references on any issue where money, politics, or reputations are on the line.

If Wikipedia were around during the early 1940s, all references to the Holocaust would have been removed as not neutral point of view.

Dan8267   befriend   ignore   Thu, 7 Feb 2013, 4:11am PST   Share   Quote   Like (1)   Dislike (1)     Comment 123

Vicente says

Oh you can count on there being secret escape tunnels from the dozens of underground bunkers. If there's one thing you can count on with these folks, it's they like cellars and tunnels!

But no! That's exactly how the zombies always get IN a secure compound: through tunnels and sewers. That's exactly what you don't want.

It's much better to have just two entrances/exits that are far apart on opposite sides of a divider. Finally, have a nice Dirigible for those situations when the two exits are both compromised at the same time.

Vicente says

Problems are numerous. Castle and fortress designs were a good solution right up until the invention of explosives. At this point it's a huge waste of redneck money.

Yeah, I've been trying to get into the mind of the people who think that the minute men are going to save America from tyranny. The only explanation I can come up with is that they grew up on Westerns and they have a cowboy fantasy that they never got over. So they think that modern America is like the Wild West and the things that people got away with back then, like evading the law and living in the mountain, are still practical.

Meanwhile, reality has become as different from the Wild West as the Wild West was from antiquity. Government surveillance is everywhere. Privacy is dead. The capacity of the government to commit violence is beyond the wildest imagination of the cowboys. The asymmetry of power between governments and their civilian populations has grown exponentially over the past one hundred fifty.

FortWayne   befriend   ignore   Thu, 7 Feb 2013, 4:16am PST   Share   Quote   Like (1)   Dislike (1)     Comment 124

Dan, cops don't show up on time, they show up after the shooting is over and you and your family are dead. Another good reason to have a gun.

Might not save every life, but sure will save some. You know there are examples out there. These people can't even control their own officers from going around on shooting rampages, they sure as hell ain't touching my guns.

leo707   befriend   ignore   Thu, 7 Feb 2013, 4:26am PST   Share   Quote   Like (1)   Dislike     Comment 125

FortWayne says

Dan, cops don't show up on time, they show up after the shooting is over and you and your family are dead. Another good reason to have a gun.

No so funny of a story. The one shooting that I did happen upon while it was in progress I quickly turned and went the other way. I did see a cop at the end of the block and when I told him that someone was getting shot he said, "I know I am waiting for backup."

FortWayne says

These people can't even control their own officers from going around on shooting rampages, they sure as hell ain't touching my guns.

I think that the question here is not so much of whether or not you should own guns, but is stopping tyranny a valid justification for a right to own guns.

Hell, I can think of a lot of reasons why people should be able to own guns, and a couple of decades ago fighting tyranny might have been a valid reason, but no more.

Kevin   befriend   ignore   Thu, 7 Feb 2013, 5:16am PST   Share   Quote   Like (1)   Dislike (1)     Comment 126