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Does a house need to be listed on MLS and shown to prospective purchasers in order to complete a short sale?


By FMR Tenant in Foreclosed House   Follow   Mon, 8 Nov 2010, 12:29pm   1,256 views   22 comments
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We are renting a house that is in the foreclosure process. Meanwhile, we made an offer to purchase it, but the bank did not entertain the offer. The Landlord says that it has to be listed.

Does it really need to be listed on MLS?
Does it really need to be shown to purchasers?

We plan on making an offer.

We don't want any house shoppers coming into our house.

Background on our story is outlined in previous posts.

Thank you.

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  1. Mark_LA


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    1   12:55pm Mon 8 Nov 2010   Share   Quote   Permalink   Like   Dislike  

    Wow, you still don't get it. Just leave, or continue renting while minding your own business. The short sale/squatting/foreclosure are the loan owners' (legally, some might call him homeowner) problem, not yours.

    Look up a different rental or look for a home on the MLS that's marketable, this is ridiculous that you're trying to insert yourself between the bank and the deadbeat owner. The deadbeat owner is legally entitled to receive rent from you & to evict you if you don't pay. It's legally his house until the bank forecloses. His mortgage problems are none of your business.

    If you don't like it, move out, per your lease agreement that you signed and agreed to.

  2. FMR Tenant in Foreclosed House


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    2   1:02pm Mon 8 Nov 2010   Share   Quote   Permalink   Like   Dislike  

    Mark, I'm not sure why you don't get that we actually do want to purchase the property. I also don't know why you seem to think that a short sale is not a viable option for us (if that's what you mean by "inserting" ourselves "between the bank" and the owner), or "ridiculous" to use your word.

    What I do know is that you didn't answer my question!

    I never said I wasn't going to pay the rent.

  3. Mark_LA


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    3   1:09pm Mon 8 Nov 2010   Share   Quote   Permalink   Like   Dislike  

    The owner is just gaming the system and plans to squat there as long as possible as a deadbeat. In order to do that, he'll initiate fake short sales, then cancel them, apply for loan modifications, then wait another year+ until the bank finally forecloses. In the meantime, you provide a nice stream of income for him from your rent.

    In order for you to continue to provide this nice income to him, he'll tell you what you want to hear: Yes, I'll install that new hardwood floor soon, yes, I'll submit your short sale offer to the bank, blah, blah...just keep the checks coming Mr. Tenant.

    Why in the world would he agree to a short sale if he has so much more to gain from squatting as long as possible, while collecting rent from you or another tenant?

    Now back to your question: yes, most banks require that all short sales or REOs be placed on the MLS to make sure it gets a proper market bid. That being said, a lot of realtards play games by listing the best deals (especially REOs) for one day or less, printing out the listing as proof for the bank, then taking it down immediately before any real offers come in. Or they'll place it on the MLS for a long time (especially short-sales), but never submit all the competing offers to the bank.

    This way, they fraudulently sell the best REO deals to their close friends who'll kick back a nice percentage for having exclusive access to a property.

  4. FMR Tenant in Foreclosed House


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    4   1:23pm Mon 8 Nov 2010   Share   Quote   Permalink   Like   Dislike  

    Thanks for answering my question - that is helpful, and love the term "realtards" -- did you coin it?

    If he must list it, I want to insist that it be listed for as little time as possible, even if the bank takes 3 months to get to our offer.

    We've thought that he might be gaming the system too, so your comments are well taken. However, foreclosure is imminent as the case has matured through the judicial system -- I believe that he doesn't want to be foreclosed upon because he would still be liable on the note (not sure if that's really the case with JPM in Conn.). He says he wants this property sold so that he can deal with the foreclosure on his primary residence -- maybe HAMP or JPM will not help him so long as there is an investment property in default, but not sure.

    To date, we haven't minded so much the delays because the market continues to fall (right?) and renting has been cheaper than owning. The next Case Shiller, etc. might smack owners and bankers around some.

  5. Mark_LA


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    5   1:29pm Mon 8 Nov 2010   Share   Quote   Permalink   Like   Dislike  

    tenant in foreclosed house says

    Thanks for answering my question - that is helpful, and love the term “realtards” — did you coin it?

    I wish I could take credit for it, but it's something i picked up from following these doom-and-gloom housing crash bulletin boards for the past 6 years or so.

    If he must list it, I want to insist that it be listed for as little time as possible, even if the bank takes 3 months to get to our offer.

    He can also request that the listing realtard clearly state that the home will only be shown to accepted offers & not to bother the tenants.

  6. FMR Tenant in Foreclosed House


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    6   1:33pm Mon 8 Nov 2010   Share   Quote   Permalink   Like   Dislike  

    Mark wrote:

    He can also request that the listing realtard clearly state that the home will only be shown to accepted offers & not to bother the tenants.

    _____
    So, this means that someone would have to make an offer before entering it? I don't see how that would actually happen.

  7. Mark_LA


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    7   1:41pm Mon 8 Nov 2010   Share   Quote   Permalink   Like   Dislike  

    tenant in foreclosed house says

    Mark wrote:
    He can also request that the listing realtard clearly state that the home will only be shown to accepted offers & not to bother the tenants.

    _____

    So, this means that someone would have to make an offer before entering it? I don’t see how that would actually happen.

    Here's a sample:
    http://www.redfin.com/CA/Los-Angeles/1661-S-Corning-St-90035/home/6787958

    This is a Short Pay. Do Not Disturb Occupants! Seller will look at no offers and take no back-up offers after Seller has accepted an Offer. All subsequent offers are to immediately be rejected by the Listing Agent per owner. Showings ONLY with Accepted Offer, Proof of Funds and Pre-Approval Letter. The property is being sold in its As-Is, Where-Is, Present Condition without any warranties or guarantees. $800,000 is the minimum offer. This sale is subject to cancellation of current escrow.

    Yes, there's no way someone would put in an offer before a showing, but that's to your advantage, isn't it: you already know the condition of the place since you live there.

    The clowns with the listing above previously had a copy that warned that police would be called if anyone called or showed up trying to see the house without an accepted offer first, but then later edited that part out. No kidding.

  8. FMR Tenant in Foreclosed House


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    8   2:07pm Mon 8 Nov 2010   Share   Quote   Permalink   Like   Dislike  

    Thanks Roberto and Mark.

    I believe the owner when he says that he wants to sell it for various reasons, including that it would assist in his problems with his primary residence that is also in the judicial foreclosure process here in Conn. with the same lender.

  9. a4adam


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    9   4:54pm Mon 8 Nov 2010   Share   Quote   Permalink   Like   Dislike  

    tenant in foreclosed house says

    I believe the owner when he says that he wants to sell it for various reasons, including that it would assist in his problems with his primary residence that is also in the judicial foreclosure process here in Conn. with the same lender.

    Maybe he wants to do so but the bank can still foreclose and boot you out.

    My wife and I tried to buy 4 different short sale properties over the course of the year. None of the deals went through. If he's talking about a short sale, you really are better off just moving out and finding something that isn't a short sale.

    Do yourself a favor and don't put all your eggs in that basket. Short sales are a huge PITA and you are way down low on the list as far as the bank and seller are concerned, whether you believe the owner or not.

  10. Katy Perry


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    10   6:09pm Mon 8 Nov 2010   Share   Quote   Permalink   Like   Dislike  

    OK Tenent I want to help you.

    First I own a property preservation business.
    we clean up foreclosed homes
    I get my work from a field management company
    the field management company is hired by who ever thinks they own the house you're renting. GMAC, Chase, Fanny, fready bla bla bla whoever.

    The First Part of this involves checking to see if any one is even in the house.
    had the house been empty (not occupied) we are told to gain entry and re key the house to the Banks keycodes.
    now the bank has the house back.

    that is what happened to you 100% sure. we have to take pics to prove it to the bank.

    so this one thing happening is what tells me this house is in the process of forcloser, not a short sale. (short sales,... real ones look different)

    There will be no short sale IMO
    the bank has already started it forcloser gears working
    the landlord can ride this out with or without you.

    what Mark LA said about the land lord "working it" is correct. 100 percent.

    Tenent you seem to be lagging hard on understanding you situation clearly. read all you can, ask tons of questions. get up to speed on this and you can really turn this into a big positive.

    you have more options than you may realize.

    But the one option you do not have is owning this house.
    why?
    because the bank is involved.

    you actually are the only one with any control at all. (I'm sure it doesn't seem like it .)

    ask for more advice here and you will get it.

    cheers

  11. FMR Tenant in Foreclosed House


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    11   6:07am Tue 9 Nov 2010   Share   Quote   Permalink   Like   Dislike  

    Thanks very much, Katy. My understanding is that one office at JPM is pushing the foreclosure in Conn. court and another office at JPM would entertain short sales. I understand that the two offices don't really talk to each other.

    As mentioned in previous posts, someone took pictures of our house and you said that it is the field management company. If true, then the bank now definitely knows that tenants are occupying the house. So what? and now what?

    Your explanation for why I will not be able to own the house -- because the bank is involved -- is interesting, but incomplete, so I don't understand why you think that. Short sales happen all the time and I think that a lot of them are houses that are in the process of "judicial foreclosure". Also, the landlord is fighting the foreclosure with all sorts of arguments, including foreclosure-gate-type arguments. The landlord has told us that he wants to avoid foreclosure and complete a short sale. We have no reason not to believe him.

  12. lurking


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    12   7:01am Tue 9 Nov 2010   Share   Quote   Permalink   Like   Dislike  

    tenant in foreclosed house says

    Also, the landlord is fighting the foreclosure with all sorts of arguments, including foreclosure-gate-type arguments. The landlord has told us that he wants to avoid foreclosure and complete a short sale. We have no reason not to believe him.

    How do you know what the landlord is doing? Are you listening in on the tele conversations? I doubt it. You don't know anything about what is being said back and forth because this guy is a deadbeat and is lying to you and the bank, but you seem to believe everything he tells you. As others have said to you, this is all BS but you are the only one that can not see it. I would like to know why you are obsessed with this piece of property. Are there dead bodies in the basement or under the house that you are afraid will be discovered or is there a minerals gold mine that only you know about?

  13. FMR Tenant in Foreclosed House


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    13   7:39am Tue 9 Nov 2010   Share   Quote   Permalink   Like   Dislike  

    Lurking, We like the neighborhood. Our 5-yr old son (and toddler) loves nothing more than to play out back and in adjacent yards and woods with the other nine neighborhood kids (this is quite special) plus we assume that the short sale price will be attractive. Also, school started in September and switching schools mid-year would be disruptive, if not traumatic for our son.

    How do we know what the landlord is doing? Connecticut is a judicial state, so all the motions and objections are public record.

    To the extent he has been lying to us (we have little reason to suspect this from him, who should care about his reputation in this close-knit community), causing delays, we've been ok with such delays it because (i) we'd have to pay rent or mortgage anyway, so even though he's pocketing it, we're not harmed (except for the general declining condition of the house) and (ii) we expect the housing market -- and the FMV of this house to continue to soften.

  14. Katy Perry


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    14   11:29am Tue 9 Nov 2010   Share   Quote   Permalink   Like   Dislike  

    Tenant

    Please do yourself and your family a favor and let this house go (in your mind.) This gives you the power.
    This is the time for you to get mad and stop playing nice.

    The short sale route is not an option no matter what the bank the landlord and especially the realturd says they don't really do shortsales like you think not these days. it's just a stalling tactic that they do. gets home borrowers to fix the place up and puts more money into the bank owned home. did i say stalling tactic
    you can't win with the Banks. your power starts with letting this one go and then you have all options open.

    There is really no logical reason the bank won't sell you the house.
    but here is a few

    No one at the bank cares.

    you're not an arms length transaction (you and your landlord could be working the bank) this is the real reason IMHO.

    no one at the bank cares.

    the system is not flexible enough to help you.

    Forcloser has already started.

    no one at the bank really cares (about you) again.
    no one at the bank cares (repeat in the mirror)

    I don't knee jerk to this but for some family's this is an option.
    Does withholding rent to your land lord help you or hurt you?

    If i where in your position (and i may be soon)
    I would look for and find another place. show you're landlord you've found a place ( this happens with a call from your (maybe new) landlord to your current landlord when checking to see if you're a good tenant.)

    BOOM!

    then start talking to current landlord about a rent decrease.

    no decrease, stop rent ride it out, and or just move (depends on your situation)

    do not work with you landlord( he doesn't own the house the bank does) only speak to the banks agents
    demand A cash for keys (CFK) offer from banks agents ( $1500-$4000) for you to move and leave the place in good condition at a specified date.
    this is paid by the bank. and is handed to you after an agents inspection , your key hand over, and a signature.
    you have rights remember (lease?) CFK! CFK!

    don't act so eager to move as far as the bank is concerned (remember CFK)
    pretend you're broke (personal hardship/ act stressed, you can't afford to move.)

    also at least try and get your deposit back from landloard (work both ends)

    Oh just because the bank has started its forcloser process doesn't mean a sheriff is showing up soon.
    They look at you being there as a free care taker/security

    you're in the drivers seat ( except for owning the house)

    remember CFK!

    also please
    Kept telling your story and posting it will help others so much!

  15. FMR Tenant in Foreclosed House


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    15   11:52am Tue 9 Nov 2010   Share   Quote   Permalink   Like   Dislike  

    Katy, thanks again for your thoughtful response.

    Note that Cash For Keys only happens after the Bank has taken possession.

    Another wrinkle is that our lease, which is terminable upon 2 months notice, prohibits listing of the property (really!). Should I hold him to that and invite an eviction notice? I don't want to be known in town as the squatter in the deadbeat's house. It also provides that we have the right of first refusal to meet any other bona fide offer.

    The only question I have about your advice is that you seem to be saying that short sales never happen. Is that what you are saying?

  16. vain


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    16   12:11pm Tue 9 Nov 2010   Share   Quote   Permalink   Like   Dislike  

    Tenant,

    You are in a poor position to assume that the bank will give you a good price. Reading how badly you want this house, they will tear you apart in terms of price.

    The short sale needs to be listed for 3 months. Whether it is really done is up to the agent. After the seller accepts your short sale, the short sale package needs to go to the bank. Your landlord needs to draft hardship letters, prove income, and etc; something I think he will not bother doing for you.

    Think about it. Why will he give up your income stream? You keep saying what your landlord says this and that, and you trust him. Just remember. He also said to the bank that he will pay up. What happened now? Best of luck in getting your deposit back.

    Either pay off his loan balance or move out. Do not assume you will get a good price for the property.

  17. Katy Perry


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    17   12:16pm Tue 9 Nov 2010   Share   Quote   Permalink   Like   Dislike  

    "The only question I have about your advice is that you seem to be saying that short sales never happen. Is that what you are saying?"

    no I would never put myself in that position

    I'm trying to explain that in your situation it will never happen. but you'll have to try anyways right?
    I'm trying to save you the trouble using my experience with my work, and friends and family in a similar position.

    you may not be able to take this advise, but please at least try to hear what I'm explaining.

    tenant in foreclosed house says

    Note that Cash For Keys only happens after the Bank has taken possession

    you have it backwards

    I have delivered CFK letters to owners and to tenents.

    why would a bank give you a CFK if they all ready have possession?
    that's the reason for the CFK to get possession at a said date and time and condition.

    after you leave with your check I rekey the house and put a lockbox on the door. A relturd shows up soon and does a BPO (broker price opinion)
    sign go's in yard it say "REO for sale"

    if you're not careful the landlord will get the CFK not you.

  18. Katy Perry


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    18   12:25pm Tue 9 Nov 2010   Share   Quote   Permalink   Like   Dislike  

    vain says

    You are in a poor position to assume that the bank will give you a good price. Reading how badly you want this house, they will tear you apart in terms of price

    very true, you are chum in the shark tank. you have no position, they will eat you for lunch.

  19. Katy Perry


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    19   12:29pm Tue 9 Nov 2010   Share   Quote   Permalink   Like   Dislike  

    Also hard to sell a house with an uncooperative tenant,

    I would ask for 10grand to break a lease and show a home for owner.

    That's my fee for working with the owner and realturds
    or good luck selling the house.

    but your house is in forcloser not being sold by owner so since you're the tenent with a lease agreement you're the one who gets the CFK unless your landlord somehow scams you out of it.

    You really should not listen to anything he says.
    get mad get angry, your getting screwed here
    this is not the time to play nice!

  20. FMR Tenant in Foreclosed House


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    20   12:48pm Tue 9 Nov 2010   Share   Quote   Permalink   Like   Dislike  

    Thanks Katy and Vain for the good advice.

    I meant to say that cash for keys only happens after the foreclosure is complete (not "in possession" as I had incorrectly stated).

    Yes we want to stay, but our 5 yr-old will get over it if we move out. We are also kind of not looking forward to another move, but will if we have to.

    We believe that prices will continue to soften, so we are not in a hurry, but we do want this over with soon enough.

    **I just wish the plutocracy would have let this market correct a little faster.**

  21. Katy Perry


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    21   1:04pm Tue 9 Nov 2010   Share   Quote   Permalink   Like   Dislike  

    tenant in foreclosed house says

    Yes we want to stay, but our 5 yr-old will get over it if we move out. We are also kind of not looking forward to another move, but will if we have to.
    We believe that prices will continue to soften, so we are not in a hurry, but we do want this over with soon enough.

    Ok Now you're starting to sound like you get it.

    you do have all the power (except for owning the house)

    yes Forcloser could be a year from now but get the CFK if you choose to ride it out.

    tenant in foreclosed house says

    We believe that prices will continue to soften, so we are not in a hurry, but we do want this over with soon enough.

    Yes , yes yes feel the power!
    good things to come.

    keep asking questions, and please try to help others with your info,..,.. after this is over you will be an expert.

    Things that people want to know

    how long (time)?
    how much? (cfk)
    what did the Bank/returd/agents say and what did they do.

  22. Katy Perry


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    22   1:30pm Tue 9 Nov 2010   Share   Quote   Permalink   Like   Dislike  

    **I just wish the plutocracy would have let this market correct a little faster.**

    Exactly!!

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