WatchI've been trying for quite some time to set up a manufacturing facility. I can buy everything I need to get started, the machines, the buildings, the electrical work, for under 100k.
Unfortunately, the immense prices of commercial real estate keep crushing my dreams. I cannot find a suitable piece of land for less than $1,000,000. Seeing how I make 5% of that a year, it would take me 20 years, just to buy the land, if I spent my money on nothing else.
I managed to find a cheap chunk of dirt about 1.5 hours from anything, but power is 30 miles away...
I could run this operation out of my home, but the F%^&ing HOA has a 'no businesses' rule.
We have good people with good ideas, who just can't afford a way to get started because of commercial real estate prices. This is why nothings coming back... The people who may do something to create jobs have their hands tied by the real estate robber barons. I'm sure the gov't is doing everything possible to inflate commercial land prices, making the situation worse.
Talk about business unfriendly... why are we propping up the existing monopolies and holding down possible competition? We need to give those who are capable the chance to succeed, or watch ApocalypseFucks vision of the future come true.
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Where are you looking? I have a company with 3 phase in central NY state and real estate is more reasonable.
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Beverly Hills, CA
Northern Nevada, Reno Area. There must be 2000 miles of land along I-80 or US 395
This is kind of my ideal location, 20 acres, close to home, with power, water and railroad access. cost = 3 million = 60 years of my labor
http://www.millerindustrialproperties.com/properties/details.asp?ListingID=267
This is what I have to work with, 40 acres, 1.5 hours from home, no power, no water, dirt road access. This one isn't mine but I have one like it.
http://www.bid4assets.com/auction/index.cfm?auctionid=502814&STI=1
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Bubble Bobble says
*Deleted* Just realized this is a commercial thread and not about surviving on junk land.
BB- Thank you for Bid4Assets - great site!!!
Some hilarious stories behind some of these properties... google "River Ranch Acres". Basically, a redneck haven where owners are chased off their own land, as it interferes with the anarcho-redneck commune of trailer livin' and tobacco chewin', 6 trailers hooked into one generator with some extension cords to power the bug zapper and the 13" B/W under the awning. Central Florida, boy howdy, 90F / 90% humidity, true Savannah/Swampland livin'.
Like the properties in DC and Dayton and Jackson, MS. Either total rubbish, inhabited by a gang of well armed heroin salespersons, or with god knows how much in back taxes that will probably be many times what you pay for it, which is probably why the seller wants out.
1oz Silver Coins by a private mint with little collectible value ("Generic Silver Round") being sold for $130+S/H, a 400% markup.
But there may be a gem in here somewhere. Nothing like buying a $300 piece of land for shits and giggles. :)
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47 male
Lafayette, CA
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Bubble Bobble says
It's not the government, it's the aristocracy. Capital assets are hoarded because there's no incentive not to. Productive land is simply banked for decades or even generations later.
This is EXACTLY why the economy is just like a Monopoly game. Once all the properties are owned, prying one out of someone's hands is very expensive if not impossible.
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Bellingham, WA
iwog says
And of course, Monopoly itself was originally intended as a teaching tool about the evils of landlordism.
"The object of this game is not only to afford amusement to players, but to illustrate to them how, under the present or prevailing system to land tenure, the landlord has an advantage over other enterprisers, and also how the single tax would discourage speculation."
http://www.adena.com/adena/mo/mo05.htm
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Rent Seeking behavior blows. It encourages laziness and speculation; and punishes actual productivity and innovation.
It's not just about land anymore, now they are trying to make ideas into property - not just the limited rights to protect and reward innovators, but permanent, multi-generational revenue streams.
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Redwood City, CA
Just curious. You said "HOA" won't let you run a business.
I'm unaware of any "HOA" properties that are 20 acres in size.
You said you could run this out of your house, yet you need 20 acres if you run it somewhere else?
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Beverly Hills, CA
thunderlips11 says
I'm not ruling this one out yet!!! Come the zombie apocalypse a sniper tower out on a field of sagebrush might not be the worst place to be.
thunderlips11 says
I looked into these, apparently the scam is to get drunken east coasters to sign up to buy these in the middle of the night and then when they don't complete the payments they sell it to someone else...
pkennedy says
I can run it in my garage, but it limits my top production to 1 machine and isn't very safe. I intend to scale up as money permits, so working from home would only be a first step towards getting something else...
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Whats holding back the economy is the government. Before under Bush and today under Obama. Easy money policy, hoping for inflation. Constant subsidies and spending more than we take on. It all adds up. Eventually someone has to pay the piper, it will be all of us.
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EMan says
Explain how any of that holds back the economy.
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Bubble Bobble says
From a garage to 20 acres is one hell of a big scale up. Seems like it could be done in steps smaller than 400 sq ft to 20 acres. I really can't believe this is the only option so you can't move forward. It would take years to increase to that scale. Growing the management alone would be a major undertaking, much less sales, production, accounting, warehousing, shipping, etc..
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Beverly Hills, CA
bob2356 says
Its not. But, across the board, I cannot find a reasonably priced piece of dirt labeled 'industrial'.
I can buy land in the Reno/tahoe industrial park for roughly $100,000/acre, doubling my required investment per acre.
http://www.lancegilman.com/
Heres a tiny little chunk of dirt, 1/3 of an acre, $150,000. I might as well work in the garage though, its not big enough. This is the most common type of properties I see, little empty plots in the ghetto that currently provide no value to anybody yet sell for more than a new 4 bedroom home on an equivalent lot.
http://www.millerindustrialproperties.com/properties/details.asp?ListingID=575
The other option is to rent out something. However, I don't have any working capital to speak of and am trying to get it up and running on a middle class salary, So I can't really quit what I'm doing and do this to pay the bills- there is no customer base at this point and it would surely bankrupt me.
I need storage for new machines and capabilities, parking, and material holding, room to paint. It may take years but I'd rather make a clean shift into 3rd gear rather than have to uproot the whole thing a couple years down the line.
I don't need 20 acres, but sometimes its almost as cheap as 2 acres. http://www.millerindustrialproperties.com/properties/details.asp?ListingID=706
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iwog says
Why, Iwog, it's very simple. Such an environment changes the perspective of businesses. In a normal economy in order to prosper businesses have to concentrate on improving their products/services. In this one they have to concentrate on improving their government relations.
After all there are only two socio-economic models:
1. one in which money gives you access to government
2. one in which government gives you access to money
The first one is surely unfair, but the second one is a weapon of economic self-destruction. We are already deep into the second one and keep digging.
Note: not all subsidies are equally bad. Subsidizing consumers (like giving them food stamp) is a minor evil as long as it does not influence their products choices. Subsidizing producers is a major one, because it completely destroys a fair competition. That's were we are now in lots of economic fields, like banking, health care, education, any government contracts and more.
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michaelsch says
You didn't explain how any of that holds back the economy. All I see is empty rhetoric.
How does the government giving people access to money SPECIFICALLY hold back the economy? You mentioned food stamps, then agreed food stamps don't make consumer decisions. Then you mentioned "subsidizing producers" without mentioning which producers you think are being subsidized.
Banking? The last time I checked banks and credit unions remain profitable although the largest ones still have a lot of toxic debt. How does subsidizing banks hold back the economy?
Health care? Last time I checked Medicare and Medicaid were similar to food stamps and didn't pay very well. How does this allow one doctor to destroy competition with another doctor?
Education? Seriously? K-12 has always been the exclusive domain of government (changing recently, there are actually MORE private schools now) and universities are doing just fine. You think USC and Stanford are suffering because of public Universities?
The huge majority of government contracts are in the military industry. The remainder is so small that it constitutes a very tiny fraction of the federal budget. I'd be happy to listen to any examples you have.
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A lot of banks have taken hold of the commercial real estate through foreclosures. They should be forced to liquidate those properties. The government is keeping them solvent while simultaneously allowing them to hold on to these properties and let them sit empty. A lot of people would consider opening up shop if they would simply let the inventory open up and stop trying to keep asset prices proped up. In doing so, they make it too expensive to buy, and too expensive to rent.