37 bogus arguments about housing
- Houses always increase in value in the long run.
Price is what you pay and value is what you get. The value of a house is
constant. It just sits there. You get shelter, but you have to pay property tax
and maintenance and the loss of alternative uses of capital. A house is a dead
asset. The price of a house rises with salary inflation, but house prices
cannot increase more than incomes in the long run. This is obvious if you think
about it. If house prices go up more than people can afford to pay, buying
stops, like it has stopped now.
For example, prices in the Netherlands are about the same as they were 350 years
ago, in terms of how many years of work it takes to buy a house. Warren Buffett
and Charles Schwab have both pointed out that houses don't increase in intrinsic
value. Unless there's a bubble or a crash, house prices simply reflect current
salaries and interest rates. Consider a 100 year old house. Its value in
sheltering you is exactly the same as it was 100 years ago. It did not increase
in value at all. It did not spontaneously get bigger, or renovate itself. Quite
the opposite - the house drained cash from its owners for 100 years of
maintenance, taxes, and insurance - costs that never go away. The price of the
house went up about as much as salaries went up, which is about the same as the
number of dollars printed by the Federal Reserve went up.
My grandmother always used to complain about the cost of milk. "Why, when I was
a girl, a gallon of milk cost a dime! Just look at how much people are
overcharging for milk now." I asked her how much people got paid back then.
"Oh, about $15 a week", came the reply. Hmmm, sounds very much like the
reasoning people use now when they talk about how much their father's house
appreciated "in the long run" without considering that inflation and salaries
rose a proportional amount as the Fed debased our currency.
I don't see any salary inflation in our future for years to come, and that's the
only kind of inflation that boosts house prices. Inflation in everything else
(food, energy, medical) just takes away from the money people have to spend on
- As a renter, you have no opportunity to build equity.
FALSE. Equity is
just money. Renters are actually in a better position to build equity through
investing in anything but housing. Renters can get rich much faster than
owners, just by saving the money that owners are wasting on mortgages, taxes,
and maintenance. Renters are getting paid to wait, both by the monthly savings
and by watching the value of their savings increase relative to housing.
- Owers are losing every month by paying much more in interest than they
would pay in rent. The income deduction does not come close to making owing
competitive with renting.
- Owers are losing principal in a leveraged way as prices decline. A 14%
decline completely wipes out all the equity of "owners" who actually own only
20% of their house. Remember that the agents will take 6% if they possibly can.
- Owers must pay taxes simply to own a house. That is not true of stocks, bonds, or
any other asset that can build equity. Only houses are such a guaranteed drain on cash.
- Owers must insure a house, but not most other investments.
- Owers must pay to repair a house, but not a stock or a bond.
- Renting is just throwing money away.
FALSE, renting is now much
cheaper per month than owning the same thing. If you don't rent, you either:
- Have a mortgage, in which case you are throwing away money on interest, tax,
insurance, and maintenance.
- Own outright, in which case you are throwing away the extra income you
could get by converting your house to cash, investing in bonds, and renting a
similar place to live for much less money. This extra income could be 50% to
200% beyond rent costs forever, and for many is enough to retire right now.
Either way, owners lose much more money every month than renters.
Currently, yearly rents in the San Francisco Bay Area are about 3% of the cost
of buying an equivalent house. This means a house is returning about 3% rent
minus taxes and maintenance, bringing the landlord's return down to 0%.
Landlords are loaning a house to their tenants at a 3% interest rate, called
rent. This is a fantastic deal for renters. When it is possible to borrow a
million dollar house for 3% yearly rent at the same time a loan of a million
dollars in cash costs 6.5% interest, plus 1.3% property tax, plus 1%
maintenance, something is clearly broken. Renters are enjoying an extreme
discount at the owner's expense.
If someone tells you that you are throwing money away, you can reply
"The landlord is giving me a huge gift. He's subsidizing me to live in his
rental. I'll take free money any day."
If someone tells you that you are "Not building equity", you can reply you are
not LOSING equity, which happened to millions of people, and is still going on
To add insult to "owners", their property is declining in value. Renters are
completely protected from the massive losses owners are experiencing. Here's a
great quote from
Underwater owner: "We would do it [pay the mortgage] if the equity was there,
but in a case where we're already so behind... Imagine that for five years, say,
we're gonna pay four grand a month and then we're just gonna be back up at what
we bought the house for. We feel like we're throwing away money."
- There are great tax advantages to owning.
PARTIALLY TRUE. It's
true for high-income couples with expensive houses and big mortgages, but not
for modest-income couples in modest houses, especially if there is no mortgage.
Every married couple filing jointly automatically gets to subtract an $11,400
deduction ($5,700 for singles) from their adjusted gross income to arrive at
their taxable income. Alternately, you may add up modest deductions in
seven categories: Medical, Taxes, Interest, Charity, Casualty and Theft, Job
Expenses, and Other Misc. If the total of your expenses in these categories
exceeds the standard deduction, you can itemize them on Schedule A of your tax
return to reduce your taxable income.
Let's assume that your only deductible expenses fall into the Taxes and Interest
categories. Taxes mainly include the income tax you pay to the state (or its
sales tax) and the property taxes on your home or other non-investment real
estate. In a high-tax state like New Jersey, you might easily pay $7,200 in
property taxes and $200 in income taxes, for a total of $7,400. So the first
$4,000 of interest expenses just brings your deductions up to the standard
$11,400, without reducing your taxable income.
For a high-income couple, let's assume they can itemize their state income tax
of $3,400, contributions of $1,000, and medical expenses of $1,000. These
deductions use up $5,400 of the $11,400 standard deduction. So the first $6,000
of property taxes and interest save them nothing. After that, their savings
depend on their tax bracket, which could be as high as 35 percent.
For couples with modest incomes and mortgages, the first $11,400 of taxes and
interest save them nothing.
Evaluate your situation before making a buy-rent decision based on potential
income-tax savings. Be sure to consider the deduction limit imposed by the AMT, too.
Interest is paid in real dollars that buyers suffered to earn. That money is
really entirely gone, even if the buyer didn't pay income tax on those dollars
before spending them on mortgage interest. You don't get rich spending a dollar
to save 30 cents!
Buyers do not get interest back at tax time. If a buyer gets an income tax
refund, that's just because he overpaid his taxes, giving the government an
interest-free loan. The rest of us are grateful.
If you don't own a house but want to live in one, your choice is to rent a
house or rent money to buy a house. To rent money is to take out a loan.
A mortgage is a money-rental agreement. House renters take no risk at all, but
money-renting owners take on the huge risk of falling house prices, as well as
all the costs of repairs, insurance, property taxes, etc.
Even if you pay outright, you're still renting the house to yourself, losing
alternative uses of that money, and taking the risk of falling house prices.
Compare the cost of owning to renting.
- All real estate is local, so you cannot say anything about the national
FALSE. Lending is global. All loans are harder to get. This will
push prices down everywhere.
- OK, owning is a loss in monthly cash flow, but appreciation will make up
FALSE. Appreciation is negative. Prices are going down, which
just adds insult to the monthly injury of crushing mortgage payments.
- As soon as prices drop a little, the number of buyers on the sidelines
willing to jump back in increases.
FALSE. There are very few buyers left,
and those who do want to buy will be limited by increasing difficulty of
No one has to buy, but there will be more and more people who have no choice
but to sell as their payments rise. That will keep driving prices downward for
a long time.
- House prices don't fall to zero like stock prices, so it's safer to invest
in real estate.
FALSE. It's true that house prices do not fall to zero (except in Detroit),
but your equity in a house can easily fall to zero, and then way past
zero into the red. Even a fall of only 4% completely wipes out everyone who has
only 10% equity in their house because agents
will take 6% if they can trap the seller with a contract. This means that
house price crashes are actually worse than stock crashes. Most people have most
of their money in their house, and that money is highly leveraged.
- The bubble prices were driven by supply and demand.
Prices were driven by low interest rates and risky loans. Supply is up, and the
average family income fell 2.3% from 2001 to 2004, so prices are violating the
most basic assumptions about supply and demand.
The www.census.gov site has data for Santa Clara County for the years 2000-2003
which shows that the number of housing units went up at the same time that the
year units people
So housing supply in Santa Clara County increased 3% per person during those
years. There is an oversupply compared to a few years before, when prices
- 2000 580868 / 1686474 = 0.344 housing units per person
- 2001 587013 / 1692299 = 0.346
- 2002 592494 / 1677426 = 0.353
- 2003 596526 / 1678421 = 0.355
At a national level, there is a similar story in the years 2000 to 2005:
At a national level, there is 2.4% more housing per person now than in
2000. So national prices should have fallen as well.
- 2000 115.9M / 281M = 0.412 housing units per person
- 2005 124.6M / 295M = 0.422
A for-sale sign in a yard instantly increases the supply of houses on the
market. There is no need to wait for builders.
The truth is that prices can rise or fall without any change in supply or
demand. The bubble was a mania of cheap and easy credit. Now the mania is over.
- They aren't making any more land.
TRUE, but sales volume has fallen 40%
in the last year alone. It seems they aren't making any more buyers, either.
Japan has a severe land shortage, but that hasn't stopped prices from falling
for 15 years straight. Prices in Japan are now at the same level they were 23
years ago. If we really had a housing shortage, there would not be so many
- Your calculator
says the house I'm interested in is worth far less than the asking price.
That's not very helpful in coming up with an offer. FALSE. It's very
helpful to be able to document that you could be paying much less to live in
the same location and same quality house, just by renting. It's a great
- It is hard to find a rental that is the equivalent of this home.
PARTIALLY TRUE. Sometimes there just is no equivalent rental available in the
same area. Placing an ad saying you're looking for a rental in that area in a
certain rent range is often enough to bring new rentals out of the woodwork
- Attractive areas will not follow strict economic laws of their worth. If
I keep bidding what a home is strictly worth, I will always lose to someone
who simply wants to live there, even if their money could be better invested elsewhere.
FALSE. You can't lose by winning. Renting the same quality house in the same
area for much less money every month than an owner pays is winning. Maybe
others get the intangible feeling of ownership, but you get the cash that they
- If you don't own, you'll live in a dump in a bad neighborhood.
For the any given monthly payment, you can rent a much better house than you can
buy. Renters live better, not worse. There are downsides to renting, such as
being told to move at the end of your lease, or having your rent raised, but
since there are thousands of vacant rentals, you can take your pick and be quite
happy renting during the crash. There are similar but worse problems for owners
anyway, such as being fired and losing your house, or having your interest rate
and property taxes adjust upward. Remember, property taxes are forever.
Some people want the mobility that renting affords. Renters can usually get out
of a lease and move anywhere they want within one month, with no real estate
commission. On the other side, if you can get a long-term lease, you will
probably find it worthwhile to repair the place to your taste. The average time
of owning a house is only seven years anyway.
It is cheaper to rent a house in a good school district than to buy a house in
the same place. In fact, children benefit in several significant ways from
living in a rental. Aside from having a choice of school district, kids in a
rental benefit from better parks in nicer neighborhoods, more living space, and
less stress in their parents' voice -- all because it is still so much cheaper
to rent than to own in bubble areas.
A fun trick to rent a good house cheap: go to an open house, take the agent
aside, and ask if the owner is interested in renting the place out.
Often, desperate sellers will be happy to get a little rental cash coming in and
give you a great deal. Sometimes they will rent to you for free ($0) as long as
you keep the place up and pay the utilities.
The biggest upside is hardly ever mentioned: renters can choose a short
commute by living very close to work or to the train line. An extra two hours
every day of free time not wasted commuting is the best bonus you can ever get.
- Owners can change their houses to suit their tastes.
FALSE. Even single family detached housing is often restricted by CC&Rs and
House Owner's Associations (HOAs). Imagine having to get the approval of some
picky neighbor on the "Architectural Review Board" every time you want to
change the color of your trim. Yet that's how most houses are sold these days.
In California, the HOA can and will foreclose on your house without a judicial
hearing. They can fine you $100/day for leaving your garage door open, and then
take your house away if you refuse to pay. There's a good HOA blog
- The house down the street sold for 25% over asking, and that proves the
market is still hot.
agents have been known to create the false impression of a hot market by deliberately
"underpricing" a house, especially in California. I personally have seen this
happen repeatedly. Say a seller's agent knows that house will probably go
for $400,000. He places ads asking $300,000 instead, a price lower than the buyer
illegal when selling toasters, but apparently not when selling houses.) The
goal is to first of all prevent buyers from knowing what a realistic price is,
and secondly to get buyers to blindly bid against each other. There are four
players in this game and three of them are against the buyer -- the seller, the
seller's agent and the buyer's agent.
Yes, the buyer's own agent works against
the buyer, because there is no commission if there is no sale. There's a saying
in Las Vegas: "There's a patsy in every game, and if you don't know who the
patsy is, you're it."
If you want to prove your agent is not on your side, ask to see houses "for sale
by owner" or houses listed by discount brokers. If the agent cannot make a
commission, you will not be told about the house.
There is a way around the conflict of interest inherent in being a buyer's
let the seller's agent be your agent too, just for that one house he's
trying to sell. Then the seller's agent has a big motive to lower the price,
because he will get double the commission if you buy it rather than some buyer
with his own agent.
Note that you are free to bid far lower than
the asking price. You might be pleasantly surprised to find out how desperate
the sellers are. Another good reason to start low: you can easily raise your
offer, but it's awkward to lower it. A suggestion from a reader: have all your
friends bid extremely low for the house before you, then your own low bid will
seem more reasonable.
Another suggestion for dealing with underpricing:
Get over it, and just beat them at their own game: Beat out all other bidders by
bidding unrealistically high, and just be sure to have your offer contingent
upon financing & house inspection. Since the bank won't finance you above
the appraised value, you're then in a very strong position to re-negotiate
the price far lower during escrow. The other bidders will be long gone.
- I was lucky that my agent told me to increase my bid by $50,000.
Otherwise I would have lost, because my agent knew about a secret bid
$40,000 above mine.
FALSE. Your agent gets paid nothing if you don't buy
the house, and he gets more if you waste more money by bidding too high. It is
unwise to take at face value "secret" information that costs you money.
- The MLS proves things are great.
The MLS (Multiple Listing Service, a private network of databases controlled by
real estate agents)
is a used-house sales tool designed to restrict access to critical market
information to prevent the free market from working efficiently.
I have been told that all sorts of funny things happen in the MLS. For example, if a house just
doesn't sell, that agents can remove its record in the MLS so that you cannot
see that it failed to sell. Then the house comes back on the market at a lower
price, and unsuspecting buyers think it's on the market for the first time.
Their agent can "prove" it's a new listing by showing the MLS record to
the buyer: "See, here's the listing date, just came on the market. Better hurry
and buy it, this one is hot."
There is no government agency checking that the MLS shows true transaction prices.
Furthermore, the MLS will not list any house for sale by owner, and will resist
listing property for sale through a discount broker, or bank-owned property, or extreme discounts from
builders, or many other cases where you could save huge amounts of money. Those
cheaper prices are often not in the system, because if you save money, they lose
money. Even if some cheaper properties are listed, your agent is not likely to
tell you about them if they require more work on his part, or get him a smaller
- I'll just amortize the commissions and other transaction costs over 30
years and they'll be OK.
The average length of ownership is seven years, not thirty. That means the 7% or
so that you'll pay in commission and closing fees comes out to about 1% per
year, and that's actually a lot of money. You may think you're different and
will actually stay put for 30 years, but statistically you're not, and you
- Rich Chinese (or Europeans, or Arabs) are driving up housing
FALSE. The percentage of US houses bought by rich foreigners is
tiny. Furthermore, American housing is clearly a bad investment at this point.
Foreigners can just wait and watch American housing continue to fall, and then
buy for much less in a few years. Rich foreign investors are not dumb enough to
buy into a badly overpriced market, but your agent is hoping that you are.
Patrick.net reader John H. points out that when the Chinese property bubble
implodes, there will probably be sales of property in California and
British Columbia to cover their losses at home.
- Local incomes justify the high prices.
Most bankers use a multiple of 3 as the maximum "safe" price-to-income ratio. We are well
beyond the danger zone, into the twilight zone. The price to income ratio is
still around 10 in the SF Bay Area.
- Prices were always way beyond equivalent rent in San Francisco (or whatever expensive town)
Price to rent ratios were normal in San Francisco and other the other expensive
towns in 2000. That ratio more than doubled by 2005. See page 34 of John
Talbott's excellent book called "Sell Now!"
- Higher-income people can afford to spend a larger portion of their income
on a mortgage, so your 6% rule of thumb does not apply to them.
Even if you can spend more than 6% of the purchase price each year on a mortgage
and other costs to own a house, that does not mean you should. In fact, gross
rents are almost always less than 6% in richer neighborhoods, making it an even
worse deal for the buyer in these places. The renter living in the same quality
house next door loses far less money per month.
- You have to live somewhere.
TRUE, but that doesn't mean you should
waste your life savings on a bad investment. You can live in a better house for
much less money by renting during the crash. A renter could save hundreds of
thousands of dollars, not only by paying less every month, but by avoiding the
devastating loss of his downpayment.
- Newspaper articles prove prices are not falling in my
FALSE. The numbers in the papers are not complete and have
murky origins. Those prices are "estimated" from the county transfer tax and
making that tax public record is optional. A buyer who does not want you to see
how little he paid has only to ask to put the transfer tax on the back of the
deed and it will not show up on computer searches of the deed, which show only
the front. Others voluntarily pay more tax than they have to, in order to
inflate the apparent price to fool the next buyer. At a tax rate of about $1 per
thousand of sale price, as in San Mateo county, you have to pay only $100 extra
tax to make your purchase price look $100,000 higher.
Even though you can in theory go to your county building and get sale
price information, in reality the county will give it to you in a painfully
slow and inconvenient way. For example, in Redwood City's county building there
are PC's where you can look at data for any particular house, but you cannot
print, you cannot save to a floppy disk, you cannot email data out. All you can
do is write things down manually, one at a time. And that's how real estate
interests like it. Your elected representatives are serving them, not you.
Supposedly impartial sources like Dataquick are paid for entirely by people with
a large financial interest in "proving" that prices are not falling.
This makes it unwise to take their numbers at face value.
For the obviously biased sources like
real estate agents, you
should assume that their sales price numbers do not include the effective price
reductions from "incentives" like upgrades, vacations, cars, assumed mortgages
and backroom cash rebates to buyers.
- My appraisal proves what my house is worth.
FALSE. "An appraisal in its
typical residential real estate form is little more than a comparative analysis
conducted by someone with no skin in the game offering confirmation that other
lemmings are paying too much for their houses as well." -from an article on
Amazingly, government house price measures
do not include houses with jumbo mortgages. This excludes well over half of all
houses in California. So the government can report a slight price rise, but
fail to mention that prices actually fell for the other 60% of houses in
- Foreclosures destroy neighborhoods, so we should stop foreclosures.
Empty houses destroy neighborhoods. Houses remain empty only because
the prices are too high. "Anti-foreclosure" programs just keep prices too high,
and keep houses empty. In areas where there are jobs, if prices were allowed to
fall enough so that salaries can easily cover the cost of owning, people would
move in and take care of the houses. In areas without jobs, the first priority
should be jobs.
- It's not a house, it's a home.
FALSE. It's a house. Wherever one lives
is home, be it apartment, condo, or house. Calling a house a "home" is a
manipulation of your emotions for profit. Don't let them push your buttons.
A house is a wooden box that sits out in the rain and slowly rots. No one
would buy in this market if they really thought about how much pain it's going
to cause them in the long run. That's why they sell you a home, not a house.
- If you don't own, you're a failure.
FALSE. Maximizing your savings
and escaping the slavery of debt is success. Most people have a hard time
understanding this, but they do understand cash. You could show them your
bank statements to prove you're way ahead of the game as a renter, but then
they would probably just ask you for a loan!
The use of the status card is another well-known button that agents push to
trick people into making foolish purchases. Don't let them do it.
- Property in the San Francisco Bay Area is a luxury good, and so will be less affected by
FALSE. Most San Francisco Bay Area mortgages are ARMs,
and ARM loans are not taken out by the rich. People on the border of bankruptcy
take out ARMs because they can't afford fixed rate loans. The rich don't have
loans at all.
Many of these ARM loans have exceptionally deadly repayment terms, and so are
known as "neutron mortgages". Like the neutron bomb, they destroy people, but
leave buildings standing. They are also known as "suicide loans".
- House ownership is at a record high, proving things are
FALSE. The percentage of their house that most Americans
actually own is at a record low, not a high. We do have a record number of
people who have title to a house because they have dangerous levels of mortgage
debt, but that is no cause to celebrate.
- Rents could shoot up, making it a better deal to buy.
FALSE. Rents are
limited by the money people actually earn, not by how much they can borrow. Try
walking into a bank and asking for a loan to pay your rent. For rents to shoot
up, salaries would have to shoot up first. Salaries are not likely to rise at
all given the current unemployment rate.
- You failed to factor in emotion. More houses are sold on emotion than will
ever be sold based on perceived value. They buy all they can afford plus.
Buyer emotion doesn't matter at all to the lenders, not on the way up or on the
way down. Most people will borrow as much as the possibly can. The limiting
factor is lending, not emotion.
- It's unpatriotic to talk about mispriced houses. It might drive down prices.
FALSE. Lower prices are better for America, especially for new
families. Aren't lower food and energy prices better for America? Housing prices
are the same: lower is better. Most Americans directly benefit by a decrease in
house prices. Only the banks benefit from increased mortgage debt.
If you own a house, lower prices have very little effect. If you want to sell
and buy another house, higher prices mean you'll just have to pay more for the
next house, while lower prices mean you will get a discount when you buy. If you
want to buy a bigger house, you come out ahead with lower prices.
- My wife will divorce me if I don't buy a house.
FALSE. She will
divorce you if you do buy a house and go bankrupt trying to pay the
mortgage. She won't divorce you if you rent a much nicer place than you can
buy, and then take her to Paris for a month each spring, which you can do just
by avoiding that suicidal mortgage.
If she's religious, you could also point out Proverbs 22:7: "The rich rule over
the poor, and the borrower is servant to the lender."
- My new baby needs a house.
FALSE. If you're pregnant and
desperately want to buy a house for your new child, that's a perfectly normal
feeling called "nesting". It is also the leading avoidable cause of financial
fatalities! You most definitely do not need a house for a baby. A baby is
utterly unaware of whether it lives in a rental or not. Babies also don't need
Your baby will do better if you're not stressed out about a mortgage. You have
five years before school quality becomes an issue, and at that point you can
more easily move into the best school district as a renter than as an owner.
Avoid debt and save your money so your child has a better start in life.
- I just want to own my own house.
TRUE, most people do. There's
nothing wrong with that. Buyers will get their chance when housing costs half
as much and they have saved a fortune by renting. House ownership is great -
unless you ruin your life paying for it. If you can save even just 10% on the
price of a house, you can retire several years earlier than you would otherwise.
If you can save 50%, then you can easily take a ten year vacation and still come
out ahead. Great quote from
"People want to buy a house, they want to have someone
tell them it is the smartest decision they are making in their lives, and they
don't want to hear about any downside risk."
Housing is the biggest expense in nearly everyone's life, far more expensive
than food, gas, energy, even more expensive than education or medicine. To
reduce the time you spend working to pay for housing is to increase the time you
have for everything else.
Cheap housing is good for us all! High housing costs take away from families'
ability to save for retirement, fund their children's education, travel and lead
a quality life.
How can we make lower house prices our official government policy? How can we
completely eliminate the mortgage interest deduction which drives up housing
costs and discriminates against renters? How can we wipe out Fannie Mae, Freddie
Mac, the FHA, and other agencies whose job it is to enslave Americans to
As reader Sean Olender put it: "Many people have forgotten that the number
one restriction on their future freedom to do what they want, when they want, and
to go where they want isn't the Iraqis, or Iranians, or North Koreans --
it's their mortgage lender."
What should you do?
First of all, both sides should avoid using agents, especially
Realtors(R), who are corrupting our laws in Washington with lobbyists. Agents suck money
out of the deal and monopolize the critical information of exactly how many bids
there are and at what prices. Your own agent or the seller's agent may be
bribed by another buyer to prevent your better offer from being presented to
the seller, for example.
Just find a property or buyer on your own, have the property inspected,
and get a real estate lawyer to draw up or review the offer. If you make an
offer, mail the offer to the seller yourself so that your agent or the
seller's agent can't block it. If you are accepting or rejecting an offer,
mail that information to the bidder yourself so that your agent or the
bidder's agent can't block it.
Agents have been known to
block offers that don't give
their own agency both sides of the commission.
Never sign any contract with any agent!
Agents try to trap you with a contract so that you cannot know for sure what is
going on or make independent decisions. If you don't want to sell a house
yourself or negotate a purchase, hire a lawyer or someone else by the
hour to do the work for you. You're likely to save many thousands of dollars
by avoiding commission fees.
Do not let any agent know your maximum price, or how much you are pre-approved
for. Pre-approval is used by the agent to see how much more they can extract
To find out the lowest price an owner might accept, you could "happen" to
wander by when the owner is outside and say: "I'd can't come near that price so I'm
not interested, but just curious, what's your lowest price?"
If you own an expensive house, sell now so you can actually keep some of that funny money that
appeared out of thin air. Otherwise, it will be painful to watch it vaporize
back into thin air. Investors in mortgage-backed bonds subsidized the increase
in the price of your house. Now they want their money back, and your challenge
is to prevent them from getting it. The only way is to sell before your
neighbors do. Time is not on your side.
If you can't sell without a loss, it's probably best to just walk away and free
yourself from mortgage slavery. It depends on whether your loan was "recourse"
or "non-recourse". In the latter case, the deal is simply that you can stop
paying the loan and give back the house at any time. It's perfectly legal and
moral according to the terms of the mortgage. Now that the government
has temporarily stopped taxing forgiven debt, you can do it without owing
anything! But talk to a lawyer and accountant first. If you refinanced, you may
have given up your non-recourse status.
A long-term rental with a multiple-year lease is a good way to get stability
with the economic benefits of renting. Many landlords are desperate, and you'll
probably find them quite willing to negotiate a long term lease. Make sure they
can't raise the rent much during the lease term, and make sure there is only a
small penalty for ending the lease early. Even if you sign a normal 1-year
lease, most landlords are happy to keep good tenants as long as possible.
If you want to buy, look around and see that house prices are falling. Why
hurry to buy into a falling market? Time is on your side. Save your cash and
buy for much less in the future. All your savings on the price of a house are
tax-free earnings! For Californians: buy after the earthquake, not before.
Good advice from reader Stephen G. Bishop:
Signing a 30-year commitment is absurd. Can you guarantee your income will be
uninterrupted for 30 years? It worked in the previous generation, when Dad
worked at the same factory for 40 years and retired. Those days are gone. 80%
of all mortgages are never kept to maturity. Triple the price of the property
when you add interest for 30 years in. It's only worth it if the property
doubles in value every ten years. Those days are gone.
Do not buy anything that wasn't built properly, no matter how cheap it gets.
Many foreclosures are houses that weren't built properly, and these houses tend
to be foreclosed over and over again. Lots of houses are ugly, but an ugly but
well built house is often the best deal.
The way to win the game is to have cash on hand when others
cannot get a loan. You do not want to be bidding your hard-earned savings
against people who are bankrupting themselves with debt. It will be time to buy
when lenders once again demand a 20% downpayment from everyone and get serious
about checking ability to repay. You'll know prices are reasonable when it's
cheaper to own than to rent the same thing. We're not there yet, not even close.
Find a nice cheap rental, invest your savings every month, and enjoy the show
Please tell friends about patrick.net, because people need to know the arguments
against buying a house.
And a little comic relief (illustration courtesy of Rick LaForce, RickL@ci.union-city.ca.us)
Annual income twenty pounds, annual expenditure nineteen six, result happiness.
Annual income twenty pounds, annual expenditure twenty pound ought and six, result misery.
--Charles Dickens, David Copperfield, 1849
To waste money is to waste that part of your life you spent earning that money,
and wasting life is the worst thing you can do. --Dan8267
Saying it is "good" for housing prices to rise is saying that it is good for
housing to take an increasing share of salaries each year, forever. There's a
limit, and it is somewhat shy of 100%. --Bryce Nesbitt
If you need a mortgage, you can't afford it. --Stephen G. Bishop
From anonymous: The Mexican Dream is to escape from debt peonage.
The American Dream is to get into debt peonage.
Lowering interest rates will help the housing and stock market for about as long
as peeing your pants will help when you have to go. It will give a warm feeling
for a minute.
Everybody hates house-agents because they have everybody at a disadvantage. All
other callings have a certain amount of give and take; the house agent simply
takes. -- H. G. Wells
Nick Naylor, in Thank You For Smoking: "99% of everything done in the
world, good or bad, is done to pay a mortgage. Perhaps the world would be a
better place if everyone rented."
From The Politics of Life by Craig Crawford: "Beware the boss who
encourages you to buy a house or new car. Mortgages and car payments enslave you
to the paycheck that your boss controls."
From Benjamin Graham, in The Intelligent Investor: "The outright ownership
of real estate has long been considered as a sound long-term investment,
carrying with it a goodly amount of protection against inflation. Unfortunately,
real estate values are also subject to large fluctuations; serious errors can be
made in location, price paid, etc.; there are pitfalls in salesmens' wiles."
Why do the buy side idiots ALWAYS fall for the FALSE CHOICE FALLACY????
Choice 1: Buy today, right now, this second.
Choice 2: Rent until you die.
Um, I'll take door #3: let prices fall another couple hundred $K on a home
like this, and buy it in a year or two. What did I win?
What the public believes, or can be induced to believe, no matter how wrong, is
reality to politicians.
Subsidies simply increase prices by increasing demand. Subsidies benefit the
first few recipients, but the sellers quickly catch on to the new source of
revenue and increase prices to negate that benefit for all subsequent
recipients. Ultimately, all subsidies flow directly to businesses as excess profit
at public expense. This is true especially for housing and health care subsidies, and
the businesses that benefit from these subsidies spend lavishly on lobbying and campaign
contributions to make sure the subsidies continue, in the name of the "public
good" even though subsidies are obviously a public harm. The true solution to
shortages is to increase supply of houses, doctors, or whatever. But
increased supply harms profits, so business interests squash all public talk of increasing supply.
Republicans think the rich are not rich enough, and the poor are not poor enough.
Just as an unobserved tree falling in the forest makes no noise, a big
beautiful home out in the lonely woods does little to increase status. The key
to appreciating status is to have an audience -- and there is no bigger audience
than that of our major cities and the playgrounds of their wealthiest
residents. -- John Talbott
They hang the man and flog the woman Who steals the goose from off the Common;
But let the greater criminal loose Who steals the Common from under the goose
Interest never sleeps nor sickens nor dies it never goes to the hospital; it
works on Sundays and holidays; it never takes a vacation; it never visits nor
travels; it takes no pleasure; it is never laid off work nor discharged from
employment; it never works on reduced hours. Once in debt, interest is your
companion every minute of the day and night; you cannot shun it or slip away
from it; you cannot dismiss it; it yields neither to entreaties, demands, or
orders; and whenever you get in its way or cross its course or fail to meet its
demands, it crushes you. -- J. Reuben Clark
It is better to get a poor interest rate than own a depreciating asset. -- Michael Surkan
I'll repeat that the best approach [to buying a car] is to use the Internet, have the car
delivered and avoid going to dealerships altogether. -- Edmunds.com
Everyone in Western Europe, Japan, Canada, Australia, Singapore and New Zealand
has a single-payer system. If they get sick, they can devote all their energies
to getting well. If Americans get sick, they have to battle two things at once,
the illness and the fear of financial ruin. ... And don't believe for a second that
rot about America having the world's best medical care or the shortest waiting
lists: I've been to hospitals in Australia, New Zealand, Europe, Singapore, and
Thailand, and every one was better than the "good" hospital I used to go to back
home. The waits were shorter, the facilities more comfortable, and the doctors
just as good. --Lance Freeman at escapefromamerica.com
The first truth is that the liberty of a democracy is not safe if the people
tolerate the growth of private power to a point where it becomes stronger than
their democratic state itself. That, in its essence, is fascism -- ownership of
government by an individual, by a group, or by any other controlling private
power. ~ Franklin D. Roosevelt
From Our Lot by Alyssa Katz: "The secret, he was learning, was to trigger
buyers' emotions, specifically women's emotions."
50 Ways To Leave Your Mortgage
You just slip out the back, Jack
Make a new plan, Stan
You don't need to be coy, Roy
Just get yourself free
Hop on the bus, Gus
You don't need to discuss much
Just drop off the key, Lee
And get yourself free
But, ah, think what you do when you run in debt; you give to another power over
your liberty. If you cannot pay at the time, you will be ashamed to see your
creditor; you will be in fear when you speak to him, you will make poor pitiful
sneaking excuses, and by degrees come to lose your veracity, and sink into base
downright lying; for, as Poor Richard says, the second vice is lying, the first
is running in debt. -- Benjamin Franklin in Poor Richard's Almanac
I don't think I'll get married again. I'll just find a woman I don't like and
give her a house. -- Lewis Grizzard
16 other offers? How can I know for sure that there is really even one
other offer? So you're telling me that I should base the biggest financial
decision of my life on the honesty and integrity of realtors?
Cashtration (n.): The act of buying a house, which renders the subject
financially impotent for an indefinite period of time.