patrick.net

Unless you are personal friends with them and plan to socialize with them, you are done, move on. They'll forget about it soon enough.

Thanks for the reply Ceffer.

I'm leaning towards that, but part of me feels like it's "ending on a sour note", and I'm basically giving them a silent F*** you.

In my business, I really hate ending relationships in this manner, and the OCD in me is leaving lingering doubt in my mind.

My understanding (I couldn't find an exact code on this) is that interior paint has an expected life of 3 years. Therefore, if you rent a place for longer than that, you don't have to pay anything for the paint. I know this is different, since they are just asking you nicely, but I would just say, "sorry, everyone has to repaint every few years, I gave you rent for 4 years, that should help ease your pain."

You don't owe them anything.

I agree don. The $200, I knew upfront, that was just going to go towards cleaning. I mean, a family of four, no matter how well you maintain a home, and how clean you try to be, it's simply going to take a toll after 4 years.

My friend sort of told me the same thing, "They got 4+ years of rent, and they can't foot a $950 bill to clean and fix things up?"

I guess you live and you learn.

I would not give them anything. They are douches for even asking.

You owe them nothing. Their financial "regrets" here are their own fault. If they wanted to nickle and dime you, they would have had all of the necessary work quoted and THEN discussed the rental deposit with you. Cutting the check to you on the spot was their mistake, not yours. It sounds like the RE agent is pushing them behind the scenes. Why is an agent involved at all? If they are selling, they can suck up the $950 because they are probably going to make a bunch of money. If they keep renting, I bet that they will get more than that $950 back in the first month.

It sounds like they were good landlords and you were a good tenant. And you agreed with the $200. By all said prior, that really is the end of the deal.

And if you provide more money, due to your feelings, what makes you think that they may not then ask for more. Unfortunately, by paying more money, it is a form of "admitting" that you do owe them.

I am the same way, but I think you still end on good terms and say again, that you appreciated all they did as landlords and also remind them that you hope they appreciated you as a good tenant, but unfortunately, you will not be able to provide any further monetary due to the contract between tenant and landlord.

Wish them great success and you may want to suggest they get a new realtor as he is apparently not aware of the laws. And if he is not aware of that simple law, how would he be in assisting your old Landlords in selling their home.

Keep it positive and you will have no regrets.

Just my humble opinion :)

Goran_K says

Thanks for the reply Ceffer.

I'm leaning towards that, but part of me feels like it's "ending on a sour note", and I'm basically giving them a silent F*** you.

In my business, I really hate ending relationships in this manner, and the OCD in me is leaving lingering doubt in my mind.

Goran, I think it was just typical Business "Nobody died from asking" in this case.

However, there are those who aren't "Just Asking" in the hopes you'll offer to help. I don't know why so many landlords get this idea that taking an apartment or other rental from "Good Tenant" to "Looking clean and sparkling for potential renters" is the last renter's responsibility.

Small stuff like a loose cabinet is "Usual and Customary Wear and Tear" AFAIC and what anybody would expect on a container that's been open and closed repeatedly for 4 years and isn't made out of Adamantium Mithril or whatever.

After 4 years, any interior paint job is going to fade and have dings in places. If you want it to look good to a potential rental, that's YOUR problem. Now if there was murals painted by you (or kid's painted hand prints or whatever) on the wall that would be another story.

I think this agent is their defacto property manager? He lives in the tract. That's my best guess. This couple owns a few properties in Irvine.

Irvine is like the Campbell or Mountain View of OC, so they are well off. They live in Corona Del Mar which is one of the most expensive zip codes in the entire country.

So it strikes me as peculiar that they would haggle or attempt to over $450.

Goran_K says

Irvine is like the Campbell or Mountain View of OC, so they are well off. They live in Corona Del Mar which is one of the most expensive zip codes in the entire country.

How many rich people get rich - don't pay for anything, ask everything to be paid by others, never give tips.

thunderlips11 says

How many rich people get rich - don't pay for anything, ask everything to be paid by others, never give tips.

I suppose a lot.

retire59 says

And if you provide more money, due to your feelings, what makes you think that they may not then ask for more. Unfortunately, by paying more money, it is a form of "admitting" that you do owe them.

Hmm. Interesting point. I do think that them handing us a deposit check after the walk through sort of shows it was final and done. Then contacting me 2 weeks later puts me legally in a good spot.

Yes that is correct; but if you were to give them more money, then it may be seen as "admitting" that you owed more money. Just a thought....

Tell her it's just the cost to be the Boss. Then wish her luck.

haha

The guy is in his 80s, and she's in her late 60s. I probably wouldn't be that colloquial.

Just curious how much was the deposit in the first place?

Yes, you are a fool if you think paying this will win you any karma points.

robertoaribas says

they are ass holes. After 4 years of a good tenant, I'd have even let those little things slide, and given you the entire deposit.

Plus, there is one walk through, and done. If you miss something then, too bad, so sad... If the cleanup was easier and cheaper, think they'd be calling to send some of your $200 back?

Yeah I agree, I wouldn't see $100 back if the cleanup only cost $100.

@Vicente: The initial deposit was $3,000. Not sure how they came up with that since I paid less in rent, but at the time, I didn't make any complaints, the neighborhood was just so nice and the rent really good. The $2,800 from the deposit is spent anyway. Wife went to Lowe's and went to town on appliances... :(

You don't owe them anything. As Roberto said above, you gave them 4 yrs of rent, were a good tenant, and even gave them $200 on top. Anyway, they owe you receipts for any work that has been done. I've been a landlord and the only time I dinged my tenants was when their dog scratched up my hardwoods, and split the cost with them to refinish.

Goran, I sympathize with you. In fact, I am thinking of reviewing my former landlord on ratemylandlord. I had a nightmare landlord and property mgr myself. Over four years, we gave them $182K in rent. Believe me, we were model tenants and left the place much cleaner than we found it.

Not only did they wait 3 yrs to fix the sewer pipe leading from the house that caused foul smelling water to drip into my office from the ceiling, but the property mgr left our house unlocked for 5 days after tenting for termites. My kid walked right in to the house when we returned home from vacation. We had an area rug that bled on to the carpeting and they went to Ikea and spent $300 on another rug to cover it up for the next tenants. They then tried to stick me with the cost after they agreed all was good. I threatened to take them to small claims court over all the issues we had and they then threatened to stick me with a carpet cleaning bill. Basically, a Mexican standoff that both of us let go. I still see the landlord and he irritates me.

I dont get a lot of landlords. I think we need a website that balances out their level of douchebaggery.

Arrange to meet them to hand over a check, then shit on their face instead.

zzyzzx says

Arrange to meet them to hand over a check, then shit on their face instead.

Ah, I see you've been reading the APOCALYPSEFUCK book of negotiating tactics. It's a favorite of mine.

Goran_K says

Thanks for the reply Ceffer.

I'm leaning towards that, but part of me feels like it's "ending on a sour note", and I'm basically giving them a silent F*** you.

In my business, I really hate ending relationships in this manner, and the OCD in me is leaving lingering doubt in my mind.

Send them $200 and walk away the bigger person. The walk through and shaking hands was the closer. They are opening it up again and you have to right to not listen. However, it is bothers you then cut them something and move on. That would make you feel much better the next time you happen up them in the city.

Write them a nice letter as well, saying how great renting from them was and how you appreciated how quick they jumped on any issue.

My 2 cents. Good landlords are hard to find. After you left they probably missed a few months of rent and under some financial stress until they get adjusted with new renters again.

Or NOT.

Pretty ridiculous. Sounds like their real estate agent made them do a bunch of repairs and improvements and is having them pass the bill on to you. New paint? HAH! They may as well cut to the chase and demand you pay their real estate agent fees, marketing fees, house depreciation, etc.

lol

My wife commented after the call: "Do they want us to remodel their kitchen too?"

Our company only deals with renters, or home owners, but never the property managers, except I will testify in court in favor of our client.

Way too many Real Estate agents went into property management when Real Estate sales went south.

This guy gave his clients bad advice.

You were there for over four years, you fulfilled your lease, and they are responsible for normal wear, and tear.

That's it, that's the law.

If after all this good advice you still feel bad about the issue, call them back and discuss the matter. Peace of mind is priceless.

I have a good landlord. I'm a good tenant. The relationship is balanced and keeps both parties happy. He put in a new AC unit three years ago, and hasn't raised our rent in four years. We pay our rent on time and rarely bother him with issues. Honestly it's been very pain free to rent here. I think landlords often appreciate good tenants. It's all too easy for them to get stuck with deadbeats or other riffraff. When they get good tenants, the smart landlords value them.

paint is usually considered normal wear and tear. you don't owe them anything.

You know what a good landlord is? My first landlord when I moved out to CA had a no pet policy so I we had to move out when the lady wanted a dog. Since I was a good tenant, he returned my deposit weeks before he had to, in full. His words, I was a good tenant, he wouldn't charge me for any cleaning costs. Sad to see me go, but understands our reasons for moving. Never bugged us about anything after that.

I would just give them extra $200 .... Since they were good landlords, they are old, probably could use a little bit money .... More for good faith and the world is small. I usually paid more than $200 when moving out ... But, usually paid after all the cleaning/fixing was done.

Goran_K says

haha

The guy is in his 80s, and she's in her late 60s. I probably wouldn't be that colloquial.

It's definitely tacky on their part. When we moved out of Archstone in 2011 they basically said that they will take care of cleaning the apartment and will take $150 of the deposit and not even worry about cleaning. Seemed like a fair proposal to me.

APOCALYPSEFUCK is Shostakovich says

Try this the next time they call. Pick up the phone and when they start whining shout in the phone, "BLOW ME!" and hang up. That should take care of these harassing calls.

APOCALYPSE, if I ever make enough money, I'd love to hire you as a PR consultant.

Sometimes you have to skullfuck somebody just to stay in practice.

robertoaribas says

Goran_K says

APOCALYPSEFUCK is Shostakovich says

Try this the next time they call. Pick up the phone and when they start whining shout in the phone, "BLOW ME!" and hang up. That should take care of these harassing calls.

APOCALYPSE, if I ever make enough money, I'd love to hire you as a PR consultant.

screw you Goran_K!!!

ApocalypseF is going to work with me, writing children's stories!

Technically, he'll be working for me, since you'll be my personal auto detailer in a few years.

:D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D

As a landlord myself, wear and tear is part of the deal. I expect to paint a place every 5-10 years or so, and I have cans of touch up paint for every unit for after every move out to take care of scratches (almost all my units now have the same wall colors now so I only have to have 3-4 colors). If they didn't build that into their cost model, they shouldn't be landlords. You owe them nothing and they are total jerks for asking.

If it were me, I'd tell them right to their face that it was extremely unprofessional for them to ask you to foot the bill for normal wear and tear items. Those are (or should be) built into the cost of the rent.

They didn't ask you to pay their property taxes too did they?

If someone does a good job at cleaning, even if they miss a few details, I don't even charge a cleaning fee. Getting the place ship shape after someone leaves is just part of being a landlord.

This would bum me out too. I wouldn't pay anything. Stories like these suggest being a landlord isn't just about how far you can walk your dog in the desert.

David Losh says

You were there for over four years, you fulfilled your lease, and they are
responsible for normal wear, and tear.

That's it, that's the law.

This. They are dumb, too.

As least in my state, I am obligated to send back the deposit within 30 days. So, I do no give back the deposit right away in case for any second thought.

FunTime says

This would bum me out too. I wouldn't pay anything. Stories like these
suggest being a landlord isn't just about how far you can walk your dog in the
desert.

No. Being a landlord is not for everybody and is not a cake walk, either.

Do not have the stomach? Keep it cash, other paper forms, or metal.