patrick.net

Hold on, are you defending the bikers?

If I was riding with a group and someone in the group terrorized an innocent driver then brake checked them on a bike only to be hit, I would RIDE AWAY AS FAST AS I COULD from this group of sociopaths and never return.

The idiot who wound up paralysed instead parked and walked in front of said SUV as others in his group tried to break into it. Only sad part of the story is, it wasn't the rider who brake checked the SUV who was paralysed. That would have been better karmic justice!

Every single one of those bikers should be in prison right now getting raped in the ass. Or have their faces eaten by Apocalypsefuck. They ALL stopped; they ALL blocked the SUV from moving; therefore they are ALL guilty of harassing that family, and if there were any justice in this world, they would ALL suffer the consequences. Bare minimum - they should ALL have their driver's licenses permanently revoked.

I have heard that a number of bankers and mortgage brokers ride motorcycles on the weekends.

Now I believe it.

Driving alongside a vehicle is not a crime. Hitting someone and fleeing is.

It gets down to how neurotic or perhaps obstinate the person is. How their beliefs and fears trap them into a situation that causes then to harm others.

Would every person react as George Zimmerman did? No. His belief system and fears caused him to do what he did.

Would everyone react as the driver did? No. He was likely a neurotic, fearful doofus or perhaps reactive fellow who should have just chilled out, pulled over, and let the bikers pass.

Blurtman said: Driving alongside a vehicle is not a crime.
This incident clearly points to government overreach. To wit:
1. State laws that require registration of motorbikes for operation on highways.
2. State regulations that require licenses for motorcyclists.
3. The states attempt to restrict the peaceable assembly of motorcyclists in Times Square.

egads101 says

Blurtman says

Driving alongside a vehicle is not a crime. Hitting someone and fleeing is.

the driver stopped. You can see that he is actually stopped for quite some time. one biker ran over and pulled his door open others were beating on the car... then he took off, he appears t which given the circumstances, was completely logical. He appears to be driving on slashed tires as well, which given that he had stopped at the crash is also uncalled for. Put the entire gang of biker scum in jail where they belong.

Did we watch the same video?

The video shows nothing except one biker Inexplicably slows down right in front of the SUV, then the SUV barreling through the bikers, hopping over at least one bike and speeding away. The bikers give chase, catch up and pace the SUV. Finally the SUV gets stuck in traffic whereupon the bikers start wailing on the SUV.

The tires were not slashed, if they had been they would have been nothing but rim at the end of the video (and its unlikely the SUV would have gotten far very fast on slashed tires).

I've been waiting for this opening....lemme gas up the engines!

Blurtman says

Would every person react as George Zimmerman did? No. His belief system and fears caused him to do what he did.

Blurtman says

Driving alongside a vehicle is not a crime. Hitting someone and fleeing is.

It gets down to how neurotic or perhaps obstinate the person is. How their beliefs and fears trap them into a situation that causes then to harm others.

Would every person react as George Zimmerman did? No. His belief system and fears caused him to do what he did.

Would everyone react as the driver did? No. He was likely a neurotic, fearful doofus or perhaps reactive fellow who should have just chilled out, pulled over, and let the bikers pass.

You nitwit. They were harassing a man and his family. I would have run more of them over without hesitating.

egads101 says

New Renter says

Did we watch the same video?

The video shows nothing except one biker Inexplicably slows down right in front of the SUV, then the SUV barreling through the bikers, hopping over at least one bike and speeding away.

the bump occurs and the driver stops before 19 seconds. he doesn't drive over the bike and away until 38 seconds. during those 20 seconds, statements given by the wife and another witness report that the bikers began pounding on the car and trying to open doors.

ROBERTA!!

Let's take this opportunity to join hands and call the OP a moron!

egads101 says

New Renter says

Did we watch the same video?

The video shows nothing except one biker Inexplicably slows down right in front of the SUV, then the SUV barreling through the bikers, hopping over at least one bike and speeding away.

the bump occurs and the driver stops before 19 seconds. he doesn't drive over the bike and away until 38 seconds. during those 20 seconds, statements given by the wife and another witness report that the bikers began pounding on the car and trying to open doors.

Not shown in the video. The door opening incident appears to have happened later in the chase, not at the start (note the freeway sign visible when the driver flees after the door is opened but the sign is not visible after the driver plows over the bikes). The video does not show what happened between the bonk and the SUV flight. Its likely the bikers did exactly what the wife and witness say but its not apparent in the video.

The video DOES show the bike which was hit slow down in front of the SUV for no apparent reason. The rider appears to be attempting a pose for the guy with the helmet cam and was bonked for his trouble.

Foolish move.

Event the police are not saying whether the driver was right or wrong and they have a much better picture of the story than you or I.

Facebooksux says

They were harassing a man and his family. I would have run more of them over without hesitating.

"Harassing" is not an objective event. The more uptight, neurotic or fearful you are, the lower your personal bar is for "harassment." Hence the title of this post. If the bikers were driving in a group, surrounding the vehicle, is that "harassment?" If this frightens you, and you hit one of the bikers, and do not stop because of your fear, is that justified? If you do not stop, and continue on, then outraged citizens may decide to try to stop you. And if this further frightens you, are you justified in running over these outraged citizens?

Blurtman says

Driving alongside a vehicle is not a crime.

But reckless driving is. Speeding up to get in front of a vehicle and then purposely braking to impede it is reckless driving. False imprisonment is also a crime. Blocking a person's vehicle and preventing him from moving without a valid reason or consent is false imprisonment.

Blurtman says

It gets down to how neurotic or perhaps obstinate the person is. How their beliefs and fears trap them into a situation that causes then to harm others.

I'd say that his beliefs were well founded. You see what those asshole bikers are capable of at the end of the video. If a gang of thugs surrounds my car, slashes my tires, and tries to enter my vehicle, I'm not gonna stick around to see if they just wanted to swap recipes, if you know what I mean.

Blurtman says

Would every person react as George Zimmerman did? No. His belief system and fears caused him to do what he did.

Irrelevant. Zimmerman had the choice not to confront Trayvon. The situations are not analagous.

Blurtman says

Would everyone react as the driver did? No. He was likely a neurotic, fearful doofus or perhaps reactive fellow who should have just chilled out, pulled over, and let the bikers pass.

I'm thinking you didn't see the video, because that is not even remotely what the situation was.

New Renter says

Not shown in the video. The door opening incident appears to have happened later in the chase, not at the start (note the freeway sign visible when the driver flees after the door is opened but the sign is not visible after the driver plows over the bikes). The video does not show what happened between the bonk and the SUV flight. Its likely the bikers did exactly what the wife and witness say but its not apparent in the video.

The video DOES show the bike which was hit slow down in front of the SUV for no apparent reason. The rider appears to be attempting a pose for the guy with the helmet cam and was bonked for his trouble.

Um, no.

http://usnews.nbcnews.com/_news/2013/10/02/20783272-biker-injured-in-nyc-clash-with-suv-hires-celebrity-attorney-gloria-allred
The video, made by a helmet camera, shows Cruz cutting in front of the Range Rover, slowing down and gesturing at the driver before Lien apparently clipped his back tire.

Bikers then converged on the SUV and, police say, pounded on it and slashed a tire. That’s when Lien sped off in a panic, running over Mieses.

Obviously the sequence of events was clear enough to police to charge the biker with reckless driving and unlawful imprisonment.

What's the difference between a dead biker in the road and a dead snake in the road?

There are skid marks in front of the snake.

This whole incident makes me ill.

I have a current interpretation of what I saw in the video. It may be wrong, but from what I saw there is plenty of blame to go around on both sides of this incident.

For starters, the initial bump between car and motorcyclist could have been avoided by both parties. The SUV seemed to insist on driving at constant speed, and the motorcyclist insisted on slowing down. Both of these actions were serious mistakes. Insisting on your "rights" is rarely a good idea in vehicular traffic situations.

After this, the interpretation gets more uncertain. I cannot see what is occurring at the first stop (stop 1) of the car. It is difficult to establish whether the driver reasonably feared for his or passengers life in a manner that justifies running someone over. It is not entirely unreasonable for the motorcyclists to try and follow someone who may be considered a hit-and-run perpetrator.

I do not think it is reasonable at stop 2 for one of the motorcyclists to open the SUV drivers door. They should have waited for the police. There is no way the SUV and driver would escape and not get stopped by police, eventually. Not to mention all the witnesses that no doubt could have written down or called in the SUV licence plate number.

At stop 3, it is clearly not necessary for the 2-3 motorcyclists to attack the SUV and driver. Vigilante behavior is ALWAYS wrong. Again, just wait for the police, get on your cellphone and report the position to 911.

There are some details that likely will be filled in in the next several days, including the time and content of 911 calls, as well as possible independent witnesses to, or video of, what occurred at stop 1.

Time will tell. I think some grave mistakes were made by persons on both sides.

Overall, both SUV driver and motorcyclists exhibited a stand-your-ground mentality that is becoming increasingly prevalent in the US. Mayhem seems to follow.

justme says

I cannot see what is occurring at the first stop (stop 1) of the car. It is difficult to establish whether the driver reasonably feared for his or passengers life in a manner that justifies running someone over

What part of, "Bikers then converged on the SUV and, police say, pounded on it and slashed a tire" didn't you understand? Just because you can't see it in the video doesn't mean it didn't happen.

The "mistake" was bikers being assholes. There is no reason for ANYONE to EVER overtake someone and slam on their brakes in front of them. If you want to engage in those type of antics, you deserve what happens to you. Period. Don't want to get hit? Don't pass someone and slam your brakes on in front of them. Duh.

Enough is enough. We need to take back the streets from these biker thugs. And eat their faces.

Not to fan the flames, but I do believe a larger context is needed for this discussion. Here's a link from the 2012 Hollywood Block Party ride to Times Square (this SUV incident is from the 2013 edition) . Think of it as a Critical Mass ride -- for motorcycles, unlicensed dirtbikes and quads.
http://www.youtube.com/embed/G_6hAorRKUw

"Never scare a little man, he may have to kill you."

Robert Heinlein (1907 - 1988)

EBGuy says

Think of it as a Critical Mass ride -- for motorcycles, unlicensed dirtbikes and quads.

Or think of it as an asshole parade.

Here is a slightly longer version of the video, which shows zero harassment at the start, up until the SUV hits the biker at 00:27: http://www.liveleak.com/view?i=319_1380522846

No harassment is seen until the SUV strikes the biker, breaking his leg, and then flees the accident.

I don't recall the DMV driving manual stating that it is OK to leave the scene of an accident if the vehicle that you struck did something you deemed to be unwise.

The police in NYC have a longstanding record of protecting wealthy criminals.

The criminal's wife uses the tried and true "save my baby" rationale, moaning about harassment and how they feared for their lives. Well, yes, if you strike someone with your vehicle and injure them, and do not stop to render assistance or at least exchange information, and flee the scene of an accident, folks may follow you and try to get you to stop.

Blurtman says

No harassment is seen until the SUV strikes the biker, breaking his leg, and then flees the accident.

If you watch the full video, you'll notice the tire coming off of the SUV on the freeway a couple of minutes after the inital accident. They surrounded him and slashed his tires in the beginning. If you were in that situation, you're damn right you would've hit the gas.

The guy who got run over did not even have a drivers license, or much common sense as I do believe the truck is bigger than the bike, and being a lawbreaker himself should have some kind of clue what people can be capable of.

Also, the guy who got hit by the SUV was looking backwards as the SUV bumped him - All I see in the video are a bunch of fools on bikes with several of them, obviously asking for trouble.

I'm not sure if the rally was lawful either.

everything says

All I see in the video are a bunch of fools on bikes with several of them, obviously asking for trouble.

Exactly. Why did they have to stop their bikes in front of the SUV after the accident? To block him of course. No sympathy for any of these guys.

Call it Crazy says

Try re-watching the first 30 seconds of the link you posted..

I did. What I see is a group of bikers passing an SUV on a road. That's harassment?

As I stated earlier, many people, like yourself, are trapped by preconceived biases and fears, cannot function normally, and react inappropriately, and we all suffer. And like yourself, they must insist that what they fear, or how their biases force them to see reality, is what reality is.

You cannot show in the first 27 seconds of that video anything more than bikers passing an SUV on a road.

Check out a few more videos about this phenom.
Search "bikers take over highway". Well, here.
http://www.youtube.com/results?search_query=bikers+take+over+highway&oq=bikers+take+ove&gs_l=youtube.1.0.0.3317.12074.0.13605.19.16.2.1.1.0.365.2102.8j6j1j1.16.0...0.0...1ac.1.11.youtube.1y9q3Vr62D8

The existential nihilism of pack-running, 60 MPH wheelies, while standing on your tail light cannot be overstated.

Blurtman says

Driving alongside a vehicle is not a crime. Hitting someone and fleeing is.

It gets down to how neurotic or perhaps obstinate the person is. How their beliefs and fears trap them into a situation that causes then to harm others.

Would every person react as George Zimmerman did? No. His belief system and fears caused him to do what he did.

Would everyone react as the driver did? No. He was likely a neurotic, fearful doofus or perhaps reactive fellow who should have just chilled out, pulled over, and let the bikers pass.

The only thing the guy did wrong is not throwing it in reverse and zig zagging periodically. Fuck those lowlives with low IQs. The paralyzed guy had like 17 violations and no license. Yea, too bad.

Homeboy says

Um, no.

http://usnews.nbcnews.com/_news/2013/10/02/20783272-biker-injured-in-nyc-clash-with-suv-hires-celebrity-attorney-gloria-allred

The video, made by a helmet camera, shows Cruz cutting in front of the Range Rover, slowing down and gesturing at the driver before Lien apparently clipped his back tire.

Bikers then converged on the SUV and, police say, pounded on it and slashed a tire. That’s when Lien sped off in a panic, running over Mieses.

Um yes. You ever try to drive on a flat tire? Any flat would have been shredded within a minute the way that SUv was going. The driver would likely have lost control at some point.

Just because some reporter says something happened doesn't mean he's right.

Seems clear the SUV driver "stood his ground". I'm sure that will be the Fox News version without even going to look.

A bunch of bikers in a pack would never act like assholes would they? Nooope!

New Renter says

Um yes. You ever try to drive on a flat tire? Any flat would have been shredded within a minute the way that SUv was going. The driver would likely have lost control at some point.

Just because some reporter says something happened doesn't mean he's right.

Excuse me, does it say a "reporter" said that? No, it clearly says the POLICE said that. I don't understand how you can deny a fact that was reported in a legitimate news source, when you weren't there and it can't be seen in the video.

For all of you who don't know how to watch a video, let's clear this up.

Exhibit A:

Clearly, the man on the motorcycle has turned around and is looking back at the car, because his intent is to brake and impede the progress of the SUV. Watch the video. If you don't see that he is slowing down and looking back at the SUV, then you are quite simply blind. At this point in the video, he is staring right at the SUVs bumper. Any sane person would have realized he was getting dangerously close to the SUV, and would not have continued to slow down.

Exhibit B:

This is where the SUV has stopped, and before it runs over the biker. It is not possible to see what is going on in the vicinity of the SUV, because the camera is too far away from it. If you claim that you can determine what did or did not happen at that moment solely from watching that video, you are full of shit. Why is most of the motorcycle group stopped and crowded around the SUV? What you CAN see is that one of the bikers dismounts and begins walking back towards the SUV. My guess is the guy is not walking back there to invite him to a book club. What do you think?

Now, if you want to disbelieve what the police said because YOU didn't see it happen in a video where you can't even SEE what's happening, be my guest. Just know that we all think you're an idiot.

some people they had been victim of similar scams. this was done on purpose to collect free money. the passengers of a $80K car were targeted. only this time one scammer paid a high price.

they slashed the tire quickly as that has been rehearsed. who in their right mind would keep such a tool in their pocket? riding on motorcycle at high speed?

ThreeBays says

What is that nice biker in front of the SUV doing, looking back while slowing down? Maybe asking for directions? Wants to sell some cookies?

He'll be selling access to his butthole when he's in jail. Then he'll be asking directions to the infirmary.

Now it turns out there was an undercover cop at the scene who did nothing. Way to go! Could have stopped all that violence from occurring but chose to sit there with your thumb up your ass.

Oh, and the "victim" Mieses who got run over? He was named a habitual traffic offender in June, his right to drive was revoked until 2017, and he doesn't have a motorcycle license.

Homeboy says

Now it turns out there was an undercover cop at the scene who did nothing.

Just one? NO, try 5 cops right there in the thick of things!

http://abclocal.go.com/wabc/story?section=news/local/new_york&id=9274018

Homeboy says

justme says

I cannot see what is occurring at the first stop (stop 1) of the car. It is difficult to establish whether the driver reasonably feared for his or passengers life in a manner that justifies running someone over

What part of, "Bikers then converged on the SUV and, police say, pounded on it and slashed a tire" didn't you understand? Just because you can't see it in the video doesn't mean it didn't happen.

Did the police really witness the actions? Do you understand that the so-called police statement may have been nothing but a reference to a statement obtained from the driver of the SUV?

Vicente (above) refers to talk of undercover police officers being part of the motorcycle rally. But is the PARTICULAR statement made above attributable to such an officer, or some unencumbered witness, or is it just what the driver claimed?

I assume you understand that this makes a large difference whether the statement is from a independent witness or just a claim made by one the parties involved.

So these asshats liked to film their criminal behavior. Here's one page with footage. Please count all the moving violations, ignoring lane discipline, and plain idiocy:

http://oppositelock.jalopnik.com/the-footage-that-the-nyc-bikers-didnt-want-you-to-see-1435594427/1436603736/@orlove

I love horror stories with absolutely zero statistical significance for drawing conclusions about present-day life. Particularly good are ones involving stereotypes, with ambiguous footage or witness accounts that allow us to take sides with whoever we identify with, or hate the least, or according to our pet issues.

My dream headline: Imam of WTC Mosque Funneled Money to Black Anti-Abortion Activists

APOCALYPSEFUCK is Comptroller says

All motorists should assume that if they're near another motorist, they can open fire at any time.

Homeboy says

New Renter says

Um yes. You ever try to drive on a flat tire? Any flat would have been shredded within a minute the way that SUv was going. The driver would likely have lost control at some point.

Just because some reporter says something happened doesn't mean he's right.

Excuse me, does it say a "reporter" said that? No, it clearly says the POLICE said that. I don't understand how you can deny a fact that was reported in a legitimate news source, when you weren't there and it can't be seen in the video.

No I was not there. Presumably neither were you. The slashing cannot be seen in the video. The reporter quoted the police who themselves were quoting a witness or may have found puncture marks in the tire. Or the police may just be wrong, it wouldn't be the first time. A witness may have seen or thought to have seen someone attempting to slash a tire or perhaps a post-incident inspection of the car revealed slashed tires which may have happened at the end of the chase.

My point is that if these were normal tires which had been slashed the family would not have been able to drive away in the manner seen on the video.

Of course the tires may have been run flats. Not sure how easy it is to drive on a slashed run flat but if that is what allowed this family to escape we should all put run flats on our Christmas lists.

Especially you AF.

Let's drop the pretense and get rid of the transparent symbolism already. The zombies in the never ending series of movies and cable shows are Romney's 41%, the left behind. Folks too sick, lazy, easily victimized, and generally uncompetitive who need to break into your house and try to get at your stuff in order to survive.

In today's episode, a scraggly bunch of penniless pensioners, the foreclosed upon homeless and the foodstamp-less break into Jamie Dimon's sixth mansion. Pan to the master bedroom, where the circular bed holds a bevy of slumbering beauties - Nancy Pelosi, Barbara Boxer, and Diane Feinstein - exhausted after a marathon session of coke and bumping with Dimon.

"Say hello to my little friend!" snarls a grimacing Dimon, as he unleashes another RPG at the hapless crowd below, spattering the exotic Italian hanging tapestries with the blood and guts of the groveling takers. Meanwhile, across town, a group of lower class Hispanic and Negro bikers communicate their displeasure with the widening wealth gap to a paranoid yuppie couple.