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Why will Obama not be truthful with Americans about terror attacks?


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2016 Jun 15, 8:03am   9,838 views  35 comments

by Blurtman   ➕follow (2)   💰tip   ignore  

Has Obama provided any evidence for his assertions that Trump's trash talk will endanger Americans? No.

But terrorists who have engaged in the mass murder of Americans are on the record.

"Dzhokhar Tsarnaev allegedly wrote that his actions were retaliations for the U.S. wars in Afghanistan and Iraq.

“When you attack one Muslim, you attack all Muslims,” the note said, according to CBS’ sources who were granted anonymity.

"In the last several years, there have been four other serious attempted or successful attacks on US soil by Muslims, and in every case, they emphatically all say the same thing: that they were motivated by the continuous, horrific violence brought by the US and its allies to the Muslim world - violence which routinely kills and oppresses innocent men, women and children:"

"Underwear bomber” Umar Farouk Abdulmutallab, attempted Times Square bomber Faisal Shahzad, attempted New York City subway bomber Najibullah Zazi and Fort Hood shooter Nidal Hasan as examples.

“If the United States does not get out of Iraq, Afghanistan and other countries controlled by Muslims, Shahzad said during his guilty plea. “We will be attacking [the] U.S.”

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2013/05/16/dzhokhar-tsarnaev-note-confession-in-boat-boston-bombing_n_3285203.html

Why can't the president speak the truth - that it is our endless war policy in the Middle East that is endangering Americans in the USA?

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1   FNWGMOBDVZXDNW   2016 Jun 15, 8:12am  

Blurtman says

“When you attack one Muslim, you attack all Muslims,” the note said, according to CBS’ sources who were granted anonymity.

Exactly. Trump is carrying the terrorists water. Trump is saying that Islam is the enemy, and we have to keep Muslims out. Trump is demanding to use the radical Islam brand, which is designed to connect Islam to terrorism. The terrorists want it to be Islam against the West. Trump wants to give them that war. Obama chooses to claim that most Muslims are on the good team and that the terrorists are the evil ones. Obama is separating the terrorists from the larger group. Trump is trying to keep them together and marginalize the whole group. Trump is also making the outrageous accusation that Obama is on the terrorists side. He's a joke, and his poll numbers are going down because more people are appalled at his words.

2   MisdemeanorRebel   2016 Jun 15, 8:15am  

YesYNot says

Exactly. Trump is carrying the terrorists water. Trump is saying that Islam is the enemy, and we have to keep Muslims out. Trump is demanding to use the radical Islam brand, which is designed to connect Islam to terrorism. The terrorists want it to be Islam against the West. Trump wants to give them that war. Obama chooses to claim that most Muslims are on the good team and that the terrorists are the evil ones. Obama is separating the terrorists from the larger group. Trump is trying to keep them together and marginalize the whole group. Trump is also making the outrageous accusation that Obama is on the terrorists side. He's a joke, and his poll numbers are going down because more people are appalled at his words.

So what? We've been saying that since the 90s. Hasn't produced jack shit, terror intensifies. Meanwhile the #1 Terrorist Sponsor, Saudi Arabia, bribes our politicians,

I think all the rhetoric about separating Good Muslims from Bad Muslims disappears everytime a Bush-Obama drone zaps a wedding party. Or supports Muslim Brotherhood and AQ over secular dictators in Libya and Syria.

I think 2 years of Bush-Obama pablum puking about moderates is wiped out every time some Pakistani wedding is struck by a Predator drone.

Actions speak louder than words.

3   MisdemeanorRebel   2016 Jun 15, 8:19am  

Blurtman says

“When you attack one Muslim, you attack all Muslims,” the note said, according to CBS’ sources who were granted anonymity.

Or as Erdogan said, there is no Fundamentalist or Moderate Islam, only Islam. Looks like people, including Muslim leaders, aren't buying the 25+ years of pablum about moderates vs. fundamentalists.

4   Blurtman   2016 Jun 15, 8:23am  

YesYNot says

Trump wants to give them that war. Obama chooses to claim that most Muslims are on the good team and that the terrorists are the evil ones. Obama is separating the terrorists from the larger group

The endless war policies of - You Name the President - is what terrorists say is the rationale for killing Americans in the USA. Your ideas are in conflict with the statements of the terrorists. Americans are dying and will die in the USA because of our killing of Muslims in the Middle East.

5   FNWGMOBDVZXDNW   2016 Jun 15, 8:26am  

thunderlips11 says

I think 2 years of Bush-Obama pablum puking about moderates is wiped out every time some Pakistani wedding is struck by a Predator drone.

Actions speak louder than words.

Are you saying that because we create a lot of innocent casualties in our wars, that we have already made it a war against Islam? As far as Saudi Barbaria goes, that's a point that we agree on I think. Might as well address the elephant in the room, and put economic pressure on the primary exporter of fundamentalist interpretations of Islam. Carter put solar panels on the white house. The Dems have been fighting for higher fuel economy standards and funding alt energy for ages. Let's get the republicans to join them in an effort to starve the beast and stop enriching assholes who happen to live on top of oil buckets.

Just branding Islam as radical is a political talking point that is counterproductive to boot.

Ironman says

Yep, a terrorist attack on an American by a Muslim is so rare in this country:

So you agree with Trump that it's the west against Islam?

6   FNWGMOBDVZXDNW   2016 Jun 15, 8:29am  

Blurtman says

The endless war policies of - You Name the President - is what terrorists say is the rationale for killing Americans in the USA. Your ideas are in conflict with the statements of the terrorists. Americans are dying and will die in the USA because of our killing of Muslims in the Middle East.

Lots of terrorists state that it's geopolitical terrorists. Others state that it's true Islam, so geopolitical politics (wars) don't matter. I don't take terrorists at their word in the first place. In the second place, they aren't all saying the same thing. If the war against terror isn't working well enough, then starve the beast a little. Get on board with Democrats and push for alternative energy and higher cafe standards. Better yet, push for a gasoline tax.

7   NDrLoR   2016 Jun 15, 8:50am  

YesYNot says

The terrorists want it to be Islam against the West. Trump wants to give them that war.

What are their excuses for the other attacks all over the globe? It seems like every few days a car bomb goes off in some remote region--I wonder what those peoples' mistake was?

8   Strategist   2016 Jun 15, 8:55am  

P N Dr Lo R says

YesYNot says

The terrorists want it to be Islam against the West. Trump wants to give them that war.

What are their excuses for the other attacks all over the globe?

It's Islam vs the World Plain and simple.

9   Strategist   2016 Jun 15, 9:01am  

Ironman says

Trump has said that exact same thing. The difference is, Obama thinks ALL Muslims are good and their religion just teaches "peace".

I don't think Obama has ever heard of the shariah laws.

10   FNWGMOBDVZXDNW   2016 Jun 15, 9:08am  

Ironman says

Trump has said that exact same thing. The difference is, Obama thinks ALL Muslims are good and their religion just teaches "peace"

This is clearly delusional. Trump is branding Islam as part and parcel with radical terrorism. Posters here agree with him. There are loads of quotes from people in our security apparatus that say this is counterproductive and dangerous.

Obama never said that all Muslims are good. He says that (true) Islam is peaceful. The strategy behind this is clear, and conventional.

11   Blurtman   2016 Jun 15, 9:27am  

YesYNot says

Get on board with Democrats and push for alternative energy and higher cafe standards. Better yet, push for a gasoline tax.

Hillary's pro-war and regime change record is a disqualifier. Ditto her pro-Wall Street ties. If Bernie does not make it, perhaps Jill Stein is the way to go.

12   dublin hillz   2016 Jun 15, 9:38am  

The drone strikes and foreign intervention may add fuel to the fire but they are not the primary cause of this conflict. As the anti west jihadist founder Sayyid Qutb stated himself, they have concluded that they cannot co-exist with the west because western values and culture will inevitably clash with Islam, so they have decided to transform jihad into an offensive weapon to bring "peace on earth." They view United States as the leader of the west since it's a symbol of capitalism and mcworld popular culture (i.e great satan).

A counterargument could be made, why are they not attacking other nations such as mexico, chile, etc. My answer would be that they ultimately find it meaningless to attack them as long as United States is around. But if United States were defeated, I have no doubt that they would go after them after giving them a "chance to convert."

13   FNWGMOBDVZXDNW   2016 Jun 15, 9:56am  

Ironman says

What's clearly delusional is you and your media friends trying to blame Trump, who just came on to the political scene less than a year ago, for the radical actions of these terrorists, who have been killing the infidels for centuries.

What the fuck is wrong with you. No one blames Trump for terrorists actions today or yesterday. They just state that his rhetoric is counterproductive and dangerous. You somehow think that he can't say anything counterproductive and dangerous, because he just showed up on the scene? You're an illogical lunatic.

14   FNWGMOBDVZXDNW   2016 Jun 15, 9:57am  

Blurtman says

Hillary's pro-war and regime change record is a disqualifier.

If you think we can extricate ourselves and be fine, you shouldn't vote for Hillary.

15   HEY YOU   2016 Jun 15, 10:04am  

Stupid Obama!
Why doesn't he mention the greatest terrorist attack on 9/11 under a Dumb Ass Failure Republican Administration?
Why would he keep this secret?

16   Blurtman   2016 Jun 15, 10:05am  

YesYNot says

If you think we can extricate ourselves and be fine, you shouldn't vote for Hillary.

I think we can manage the disaster and not engage in new ones. So Hillary is out.

17   FNWGMOBDVZXDNW   2016 Jun 15, 11:11am  

Ironman says

Trump's rhetoric means NOTHING in the eyes of terrorists. They already hate us, long before he came along.

Are you really so stupid that you think that is what I meant, or are you just being a rhetorical ass hat?

It is counter-productive because of it's affect on Muslims who are not terrorists. Do you want non-terrorist Muslims in our country to speak up when they see some self loathing loser becoming radicalized? If so, why do you want our government branding those would be allies as terrorists?

Does us branding Islam with radical terrorism help terrorists recruit Muslims in other parts of the world?

Declassified files from Osama bin Laden’s compound show that the Obama administration’s decision to try and separate terrorist groups from Islam had negatively impacted al-Qaida’s brand. Bin Laden wrote that Muslims were less likely to feel as if they belonged to al-Qaida because the Obama administration had "largely stopped using the phrase ‘the war on terror’ in the context of not wanting to provoke Muslims," according to the Washington Post.

http://www.politifact.com/truth-o-meter/article/2015/feb/22/punditfact-why-obama-wont-label-isis-islamic-extre/

18   Heraclitusstudent   2016 Jun 15, 11:46am  

Blurtman says

Why can't the president speak the truth - that it is our endless war policy in the Middle East that is endangering Americans in the USA?

I don't think it's the wars. When you are Muslim and live in a shit-hole while the west dominates culturally, technologically, scientifically, militarily, economically and just about any domain, you have to find a way in which you can see yourself as superior. Ah you believe in that, so this must make you better than the infidels. Military incursions in the middle-east are just the cherry on the cake, so you can feel victimized by default.

Once you focus on that, the texts give you plenty of material to act upon.

19   RWSGFY   2016 Jun 15, 12:00pm  

It doesn't really matter what is their "grievance du jour" because it's always shifting. If not "US troops on holy land", then it "Iraq". Once out of Iraq, then it's "Afghanistan". As soon as draw-down in Afghanistan is completed - it's back to "support of Israel" or some such shit. Heck, even "climate change" made it to Osama's list of reasons to attack the West.

20   FNWGMOBDVZXDNW   2016 Jun 15, 12:10pm  

Heraclitusstudent says

It's not the words. It's the strategy of deliberately denying the obvious fact that some Muslims really believe their texts and this leads to actions.

Do you really want our president going down a rabbit hole to discuss the literal and interpreted meanings of various religious texts? Obama is keeping it simple and stating that moderate Muslims have the correct interpretation and that the terrorists are wrong.

21   FNWGMOBDVZXDNW   2016 Jun 15, 1:54pm  

Ironman says

If you really think ANYTHING Trump can say today will have any effect on Muslims that aren't terrorists

I absolutely do think that is true. According to the source I cited, Bin Laden thought it was true as well. I didn't see your earlier question about how many terrorist have turned in radical ones. I'm going to assume that there have been tips, but I don't have access to a list of all tips that the FBI or other law enforcement officials have received from Muslims. There are Muslims currently fighting for us in our military and otherwise acting as productive members of society. I don't see the point of marginalizing them either, especially when it has absolutely zero upside.

22   Heraclitusstudent   2016 Jun 15, 2:15pm  

YesYNot says

Do you really want our president going down a rabbit hole to discuss the literal and interpreted meanings of various religious texts? Obama is keeping it simple and stating that moderate Muslims have the correct interpretation and that the terrorists are wrong.

You don't need to discuss interpretations. You can just state general principles that we should all believe in:
- Killing people in the name of God makes no sense.
- Respecting rules doesn't make you good. Creating suffering makes you evil.
- Hatred of others make you evil.
- etc, etc...
Establish clearly that literal interpretations of Islamic texts goes directly against these principles and therefore remind 'moderate' Muslims that it is incumbent upon them to reject such interpretations.

23   FNWGMOBDVZXDNW   2016 Jun 15, 2:16pm  

Ironman says

I see, Trump spews off some rhetoric, and Muslims go crazy.

Yes. What presidential candidates and Presidents say is heard around the world, replayed in propaganda TV & videos, and has a huge impact. This point is obvious.

But, when we drone a Muslim wedding party and kill innocent women and children, that doesn't cause any non-terrorist Muslims to get a little bit twisted, right??

Of course it does. I've argued that Muslims are rational people and geopolitical issues are why lots of them turn to terrorism. Terrorism is what you get when one side can kick the shit out of the other on a battlefield. They resort to extremes to hurt the other side. Even monkeys resort to terrorism. If a weak monkey is getting picked on by a much stronger monkey, he will hurt the stronger monkey's relative or loved one in front of the stronger monkey to let him know he has ways of getting even. I'm not excusing the terrorists, but their actions are somewhat predictable and understandable. Some people argue that it is just due to the demented religion. I think it is more than that. Religion is a tool used by Imams or terrorist higher ups to control lower terrorists and both a reason and an excuse used by terrorists and nut-jobs to justify what they are going to do.

24   dublin hillz   2016 Jun 15, 2:22pm  

YesYNot says

rational people and geopolitical issues are why lots of them turn to terrorism.

Attacks in Paris on Charlie Hebdo and Bataclan as well as the recent attack in Orlando do not appear to fit this profile and instead are consistent with the theory that they are attacking the west for its "decadence."

25   MisdemeanorRebel   2016 Jun 15, 2:31pm  

As many or more British Muslims serve in ISIS than in the British Armed Forces. "As Many" is only if you take the lowest possible estimate; the high estimate is 300% more currently in ISIS than UK Military.

Read the politfact-level spin:

http://indy100.independent.co.uk/article/have-more-british-muslims-really-joined-isis-than-the-british-army--xyyRhQiIQe

26   FNWGMOBDVZXDNW   2016 Jun 15, 2:39pm  

Rew says

The same group that says you are more likely to die in a bathtub than by a gun

Great point in general, but It's not even that statistic. They have to restrict it to accidental deaths of children. 100 times as many people die by gun wound than bathtub accidents each year. Not even close.

27   FNWGMOBDVZXDNW   2016 Jun 15, 2:43pm  

thunderlips11 says

As many or more British Muslims serve in ISIS than in the British Armed Forces

That's interesting. Meanwhile, 3500 US Muslims serve in the US military: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Muslims_in_the_United_States_military

That's out of 1.4 million armed service members, so about 0.4% of military is Muslim. Muslims make up about 1% of our population. That's nearly a representative amount. I'm surprised that so many are in our military considering who we spend most of our time bombing.

28   MisdemeanorRebel   2016 Jun 15, 2:54pm  

Great example of Spin:
http://www.vox.com/2015/11/23/9765718/domestic-terrorism-american-citizens-omar-mateen

Their own chart shows as non-native born Americans committed terror attacks equivalent to native-born Americans, even though the former is a much, much smaller number.

By death count, it's no longer 1:1 like I said previously. Less than 1% of the population has killed twice as many for Jihadi Terror alone as the other 99% has for ALL other reasons, religious OR political (Taxes, Abortion whatever).

That's absolutely astounding.

"Leave my Open Borders alllooonnnnneeee"

29   Heraclitusstudent   2016 Jun 15, 4:49pm  

marcus says

If he knows it, and all of the intelligent people who are capable of learning know it, but some morons want war with all of Islam. It's wise to not cater to those folks (unless you're a right wing authoritarian asshole that thinks it might help you get elected.).

So in essence you are saying that non-Muslims are by nature smarter than Muslims, and therefore it is incumbent upon them to bend-over backward accommodate these lesser minds?

Not sure why you are surprised this is not the case. Yes there are "morons", in fact they are probably the majority. They will see Obama as denying the obvious reality and they will look for someone who recognizes that there is a problem. Any suggestion?

30   Patrick   2016 Jun 15, 4:50pm  

marcus says

Islam has some older translations

there are no "translations" of islam.

the koran is always in arabic and it always says the same thing.

you probably mean "interpretations" of islam.

31   MisdemeanorRebel   2016 Jun 15, 5:13pm  

Straw Man says

It doesn't really matter what is their "grievance du jour" because it's always shifting. If not "US troops on holy land", then it "Iraq". Once out of Iraq, then it's "Afghanistan". As soon as draw-down in Afghanistan is completed - it's back to "support of Israel" or some such shit. Heck, even "climate change" made it to Osama's list of reasons to attack the West.

Great point. You forgot "Inequality".

32   RWSGFY   2016 Jun 15, 5:30pm  

thunderlips11 says

You forgot "Inequality".

...and "we want Spain back".

33   marcus   2016 Jun 15, 6:11pm  

rando says

you probably mean "interpretations" of islam.

I don't know. Is King James a different interpretation or a different translation. Because most current readers don't read Greek, Hebrew or Aramaic.

Whenever something is translated, it is reinterpreted too.

But perhaps worst of all, Islamists distort their very own religious texts so as to befit this "anti-" platform. Consider the various annotations of the Muslim sacred book, the Koran. The book was originally written in classical Arabic, a rich, sophisticated language with tens of thousands of words and nuances, as well as flowing poetry. Over eighty percent of the world's Muslims don't speak or read Arabic, so the book has to be translated, requiring the addition of numerous annotations. These annotations differ depending on the edition of the text. In the case of Islamists, these are the seeds of hatred.

I was raised in Turkey and read the Koran with Turkish annotations. The first time I read an Islamist Koran was when I was 26, living in New York City. Praying at an American mosque, I came across an English-language Koran printed in Saudi Arabia, the main purveyor of Islamist texts worldwide. In its man-made annotations, this Koran preached violence and hatred towards Jews, Christians, the West and Western institutions generally.

http://www.washingtoninstitute.org/policy-analysis/view/muslims-vs.-islamists

34   Strategist   2016 Jun 15, 6:26pm  

marcus says

rando says

you probably mean "interpretations" of islam.

I don't know. Is King James a different interpretation or a different translation. Because most current readers don't read Greek, Hebrew or Aramaic.

Whenever something is translated, it is reinterpreted too.

Whatever the interpretation about Islam is, one thing is clear.....It is a horrible religion, in writing and in practice. Why can't Islam be more like Buddhism, a peaceful religion?

35   MisdemeanorRebel   2016 Jun 15, 8:35pm  

Milo and Gavin McInnes yell "Fuck Islam" and kiss.

This ain't your granddad's Nationalist sentiment.

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