patrick.net

Quite a common problem on the Internet. Such a headache, hence why I don't interact much online. Emotionally charged discussions and those who can't stay on topic are never good things. People who shun facts are the absolute worst. Oy!

Zee says

Quite a common problem on the Internet. Such a headache, hence why I don't interact much online. Emotionally charged discussions and those who can't stay on topic are never good things.

This is a point I've made many times. Trolls violate other people's right to free speech by making productive conversations impossible.

The dilemma is that ignoring misinformation and letting it spread like cancer results in bad things like foolish policies, mob mentality, and the rise of dictators and demigods. However, you have to balance that with keeping trolls out of productive conversations and not giving them attention. Neither the all nor the nothing approach works.

Dan8267 says

Zee says

Quite a common problem on the Internet. Such a headache, hence why I don't interact much online. Emotionally charged discussions and those who can't stay on topic are never good things.

This is a point I've made many times. Trolls violate other people's right to free speech by making productive conversations impossible.

The dilemma is that ignoring misinformation and letting it spread like cancer results in bad things like foolish policies, mob mentality, and the rise of dictators and demigods. However, you have to balance that with keeping trolls out of productive conversations and not giving them attention. Neither the all nor the nothing approach works.

Oh, I've had my fair share of verbal slug fests with people online, but what can you do when someone is so adamant on insisting they're right when they're not? I'm not saying ignore problems, of course not. Spread facts. But people who super dishonest and I'm convinced like being dishonest are lost causes. Thankfully everyone isn't like. My gosh! Imagine the world if everyone had that mentality. I'd rather not. ***shudders***

Zee says

what can you do when someone is so adamant on insisting they're right when they're not?

It all depends on how they are insisting and what they are insisting. The cases are as follows... Not all cases are mutually exclusive.

1. They are right and for the right reasons.
Change your position and agree with them.

2. They are right but for the wrong reasons.
Reasons are more important than conclusions, so explain the right reasons. Sure you can still go along with the policy if it follows from the right reasons, but make sure the right reasons are know.

3. They are wrong, but have valid points.
Chances are they are still rational. Propose a counter-plan that handles their valid points and lacks the flaws of their proposal.

4. They are factually wrong.
Present clear, well-establish counter-evidence. If they reject it, they are irrational persons or trolls. Either way, expose them for the fools they are. If they accept the counter-evidence, let them make their counter-move and repeat the process of going through these cases.

5. They are logically wrong.
Illustrate and correct the logical flaw. Then follow the same path as in (4).

6. The are asserting without evidence or reasoning.
Demand justification of their position. If they refuse for any reason, discard their position. That which can be asserted without reason can be dismissed without reason. Simply inform the audience that the assertion is baseless.

7. The are contradicting, not arguing.
See (6).

8. They are spreading debunked lies.
Demonstrate that the lies have been debunked citing credible sources. Use their lies as an opportunity to make their side look bad as in both incompetent and dishonest.

9. They are expressing an opinion.
Opinions, by definition, are neither right nor wrong no matter how strongly they are held or how important they are. "Humanity should be terminated" is an opinion, and thus cannot be a correct or incorrect statement. You either agree with it or not.

You can ask justification of an opinion, and if the justification is not given or is unconvincing, then you can argue in favor of a contrary opinion, but there is no right or wrong. That said, opinions can be so morally objectionable that holding it can render a party unacceptable to society, for example, the opinion that the human race should be terminated.

10. They are making nonsensical statements.
If they are doing this deliberately, they are trolls. Use this as an opportunity to demonstrate how despicable their side it. If they are not doing this intelligently, see if you can get them to talk coherently. If not, ignore them as the idiots they are.

That's pretty much the algorithm I use on PatNet and in real life.

Dan8267 says

Zee says

what can you do when someone is so adamant on insisting they're right when they're not?

It all depends on how they are insisting and what they are insisting. The cases are as follows... Not all cases are mutually exclusive.

1. They are right and for the right reasons.

Change your position and agree with them.

2. They are right but for the wrong reasons.

Reasons are more important than conclusions, so explain the right reasons. Sure you can still go along with the policy if it follows from the right reasons, but make sure the right reasons are know.

3. They are wrong, but have valid points.

Chances are they are still rational. Propose a counter-plan that handles their valid points and lacks the flaws of their proposal.

4. They are factually wrong.

Present clear, well-establish counter-evidence. If they reject it, they are irrati...

4 & 10 is the headache. 😤 Can't reason with those who won't accept reason.

Dan8267 says

10. They are making nonsensical statements.

If they are doing this deliberately, they are trolls. Use this as an opportunity to demonstrate how despicable their side it. If they are not doing this intelligently, see if you can get them to talk coherently. If not, ignore them as the idiots they are.

You can do that with people whose particular idiocy is not too dangerous. If they teach others to kill you, then ignoring them doesn't work very long: they have a plan to find you.

Dan8267 says

Trolls violate other people's right to free speech by making productive conversations impossible.

" productive conversations" don't we think a lot of ourselves.
Everyone loves to be told what they can say by the thread God.
Some posters want everyone to follow their rules.
PATNET DON'T PLAY THAT!
No one has to respond to any comment by anyone.
Free Speech is not about one's freedom to not hear or read anything they disagree with.
Free Speech comes from the speaker not from the ear or eyes of the listener.
Ignoring is simple when one knows"You can't fix stupid."

Patrick's site is for free speech,it's the snowflake banners that can't face reality in that they don't make the rules for everyone.
Sorry asshole, Patrick makes the rules. All you've got is banning.
Accept your limitations or go away.

Trolling is not the problem.Boycott the Troll Responders.

For one final PhD lesson in expert trolling,
Fuck you losers.

Please hold the applause.

Triggered,is that the same as pointing out hypocrisy?

Looks like I've triggered bob2356 as well.

curious2 says

You can do that with people whose particular idiocy is not too dangerous. If they teach others to kill you, then ignoring them doesn't work very long: they have a plan to find you.

Islam is proof that irrationality must be opposed.

jazz_music posts video

That parrot is obviously a Trump supporter.

Just words with no derogatory intent from a bird but human's using these same words is offensive.
How shallow can fucking asshole people be?
They must be psychic to know the speakers intent.

The quality of the discussion on this thread versus the thread created by the crybaby trolls in response demonstrates exactly why those trolls were banned in the first place. There thread is nothing more than a circle jerk, which is what they try to turn all threads into.

NuttBoxer says

Look at Dan's last ad-hominem use. He is obviously triggered by me violating his safe space, and is now abusing the system.

Honey, the only people triggered are those participating in your circle jerk. I'm just applying the exact criteria Patrick intended the ad hominem feature to be used for. If you don't like that, take it up with Patrick.

However, your circle jerk of a thread does demonstrate perfectly why you and the others have been banned. It serves absolutely no purpose but to troll just like your user account. However, it even fails at trolling because it only makes you look bad. It makes me smile when you foolishly post childish things. It makes my points for me. It's like when ISIS attacks you as an infidel.