How not to get murdered. USA version!
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How not to get murdered. USA version!

By PeopleUnited following x   2017 Jul 9, 12:43pm 1,939 views   37 comments   watch   quote     share  


Stay out of the counties that are marked in red.

https://crimeresearch.org/2017/04/number-murders-county-54-us-counties-2014-zero-murders-69-1-murder/

As a further topic of discussion. What, if anything, does the Patnet community see about the areas in red, that can be changed or fixed to make them more like the rest of the map? In order to solve the problems of violence, the focus needs to be on the ares in red because clearly the laws are pretty much the same across the nation. Access to weapons, freedom of religion, freedom of assembly are all pretty much the same in these places, yet crime is very concentrated.

Is it the number of people that is the problem (implies that people themselves are the problem and need to be kept spread out for their own safety)?
Is it the kind of people who live in these areas that are the problem (if so what attracts the bad people to these areas, or causes them to avoid the non violent areas)?
Is it the lack of adequate police in those areas?
Is it that weapons are easier to access in those areas?
Is it a lack of self defense training, or willingness to defend one's self on those areas?
Is it that there is not enough diversity in those areas?
Who is responsible for the violence in the areas in red?
How can we end it?

1 FortWayne   ignore (0)   2017 Jul 9, 12:50pm   ↑ like (3)   ↓ dislike (1)     quote        

Russians did it

2 PeopleUnited   ignore (2)   2017 Jul 9, 12:56pm   ↑ like (5)   ↓ dislike (2)     quote        

Wow, when you overlay the map, it appears that the America that Hilary Clinton won in the 2016 election fits almost perfectly with the high crime area map from 2014. Maybe the Russians did us a favor? :)

https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2016/11/16/us/politics/the-two-americas-of-2016.html

https://crimeresearch.org/2017/04/number-murders-county-54-us-counties-2014-zero-murders-69-1-murder/

3 someone else   ignore (0)   2017 Jul 9, 1:21pm   ↑ like (8)   ↓ dislike (0)     quote        

That's because the murder rate of an area is very strongly correlated with the black population of that area.

High density of blacks = high murder rate. We can argue about the cause of this relationship, but it is nonetheless a fact that blacks commit murder at least 10 times the rate whites do.

And yes, most black people are not going to kill you, but if you know someone's race, you do know a non-trivial fact about your risk of being murdered by them.

This also explains the voting for Hillary matching the murder rate. Blacks were much more likely to vote for Hillary.

4 P N Dr Lo R   ignore (1)   2017 Jul 9, 2:55pm   ↑ like (3)   ↓ dislike (0)     quote        

PeopleUnited says

Is it that there is not enough diversity in those areas?

Probably too much--diversity by it's very nature is divisive, emphasizes differences rather than commonalities.

5 joeyjojojunior   ignore (1)   2017 Jul 9, 4:25pm   ↑ like (0)   ↓ dislike (1)     quote        

PeopleUnited says

Is it the number of people that is the problem (implies that people themselves are the problem and need to be kept spread out for their own safety)?

Is it the kind of people who live in these areas that are the problem (if so what attracts the bad people to these areas, or causes them to avoid the non violent areas)?

Is it the lack of adequate police in those areas?

Is it that weapons are easier to access in those areas?

Is it a lack of self defense training, or willingness to defend one's self on those areas?

Is it that there is not enough diversity in those areas?

Who is responsible for the violence in the areas in red?

You don't see a correlation with income/wealth?

How about we reduce inequality and see what happens?

6 HEY YOU   ignore (7)   2017 Jul 9, 4:29pm   ↑ like (0)   ↓ dislike (3)     quote        

Man kills,sometimes for no reason,as if there is one.
How many times have you intentionally stepped on a bug because it was a bug & for no other reason?
It's OK. It had no purpose.It doesn't belong here. It shouldn't intrude into your perfect life.
MUST DIE!

Republicans & Democrats just....DIE!
You are worthy of murder.

7 komputodo   ignore (0)   2017 Jul 9, 4:38pm   ↑ like (4)   ↓ dislike (0)     quote        

Patrick says

That's because the murder rate of an area is very strongly correlated with the black population of that area.

8 komputodo   ignore (0)   2017 Jul 9, 4:40pm   ↑ like (0)   ↓ dislike (0)     quote        

HEY YOU says

Man kills,sometimes for no reason,as if there is one.

Johnny Cash killed a man in Reno, just to watch him die.

9 komputodo   ignore (0)   2017 Jul 9, 4:43pm   ↑ like (0)   ↓ dislike (0)     quote        

joeyjojojunior says

You don't see a correlation with income/wealth?

How about we reduce inequality and see what happens?

Sure, you, dan, and iwog should form a committee and get right on that.

10 joeyjojojunior   ignore (1)   2017 Jul 9, 4:45pm   ↑ like (0)   ↓ dislike (2)     quote        

komputodo says

Sure, you, dan, and iwog should form a committee and get right on that.

Sounds good. Vote us into office and we'll get it done.

11 Quigley   ignore (0)   2017 Jul 9, 5:33pm   ↑ like (3)   ↓ dislike (0)     quote        

joeyjojojunior says

Sounds good. Vote us into office and we'll get it done.

Ain't nobody wants to see you with more power than a dog catcher.

12 Goran_K   ignore (0)   2017 Jul 9, 7:25pm   ↑ like (6)   ↓ dislike (0)     quote        

joeyjojojunior says

Sounds good. Vote us into office and we'll get it done.

You don't have to run for office. You, iwog, and others can go to a poor black community, find out who you think suffers from the most wealth inequality, and give them money until you believe the inequality is eliminated. If you want people to vote for you and respect you, you should prove that you stand behind your own supposed value system.

13 komputodo   ignore (0)   2017 Jul 9, 8:07pm   ↑ like (0)   ↓ dislike (0)     quote        

joeyjojojunior says

komputodo says

Sure, you, dan, and iwog should form a committee and get right on that.

Sounds good. Vote us into office and we'll get it done.

I think you should start a grass roots committee to create "awareness", then once you see some "green shoots", you'll get some donations from "special interests". Then you'll have the funding to do your "good work for the community". Oh damn, but then you'll owe favors to the "special interests"....Hmm, I have to rethink this.

14 komputodo   ignore (0)   2017 Jul 9, 8:08pm   ↑ like (4)   ↓ dislike (0)     quote        

Goran_K says

You don't have to run for office. You, iwog, and others can go to a poor black community, find out who you think suffers from the most wealth inequality, and give them money until you believe the inequality is eliminated.

But he doesn't want to give them his own money, he wants to give them OTHER PEOPLE'S MONEY.

15 BlueSardine   ignore (1)   2017 Jul 9, 8:09pm   ↑ like (3)   ↓ dislike (0)     quote        

Why would I want to raise you up and put myself down???

joeyjojojunior says

You don't see a correlation with income/wealth?

How about we reduce inequality and see what happens?

16 joeyjojojunior   ignore (1)   2017 Jul 9, 8:38pm   ↑ like (0)   ↓ dislike (2)     quote        

Goran_K says

You don't have to run for office. You, iwog, and others can go to a poor black community, find out who you think suffers from the most wealth inequality, and give them money until you believe the inequality is eliminated. If you want people to vote for you and respect you, you should prove that you stand behind your own supposed value system.

Unfortunately, that's not how it works. In order for inequality to be tackled, it must be done at a Federal level with changes to laws. But, I will absolutely stand behind my value system once it is enacted.

17 joeyjojojunior   ignore (1)   2017 Jul 9, 8:40pm   ↑ like (0)   ↓ dislike (0)     quote        

komputodo says

But he doesn't want to give them his own money, he wants to give them OTHER PEOPLE'S MONEY.

A one time infusion, while nice, wouldn't fix the issue. Structural changes are needed.

But, I would happily pay more once a more progressive tax system was implemented.

18 joeyjojojunior   ignore (1)   2017 Jul 9, 8:41pm   ↑ like (1)   ↓ dislike (0)     quote        

BlueSardine says

Why would I want to raise you up and put myself down???

Funny. I find that trolls typically aren't high earners.

19 PeopleUnited   ignore (2)   2017 Jul 10, 7:20pm   ↑ like (1)   ↓ dislike (1)     quote        

joeyjojojunior says

Goran_K says

You don't have to run for office. You, iwog, and others can go to a poor black community, find out who you think suffers from the most wealth inequality, and give them money until you believe the inequality is eliminated. If you want people to vote for you and respect you, you should prove that you stand behind your own supposed value system.

Unfortunately, that's not how it works. In order for inequality to be tackled, it must be done at a Federal level with changes to laws. But, I will absolutely stand behind my value system once it is enacted.

We need to know what precisely laws need to be changed. Till then you are just blowing hot air. So put up the solution or shut up.

joeyjojojunior says

BlueSardine says

Why would I want to raise you up and put myself down???

Funny. I find that trolls typically aren't high earners.

You called BlueSardine a troll and implied he is not a high earner. Shame on you. BlueSardine, if you like I will ban him from the thread. This guy claims to believe in eliminating inequality, but yet he wants to belittle others. What a fine example he sets! I suppose he will argue like he did above (when challenged to put his money where his mouth is and use his own wealth to fight inequality, he basically said "you first"), he will stop calling people names and ad hominem attacks when everyone agrees with him. Lets hope he sees the error of his ways and apologizes.

20 PeopleUnited   ignore (2)   2017 Jul 10, 7:25pm   ↑ like (1)   ↓ dislike (1)     quote        

Patrick says

That's because the murder rate of an area is very strongly correlated with the black population of that area.

High density of blacks = high murder rate. We can argue about the cause of this relationship, but it is nonetheless a fact that blacks commit murder at least 10 times the rate whites do.

And yes, most black people are not going to kill you, but if you know someone's race, you do know a non-trivial fact about your risk of being murdered by them.

This also explains the voting for Hillary matching the murder rate. Blacks were much more likely to vote for Hillary.

@Patrick you are definitely on to something here. However it clearly is not just a problem in one ethnic group. California and the Southwest are diverse in other ways, yet have a ton of violent crime. There is definitely something very different culturally though in the red areas/Clinton areas. What other ways can we describe the different cultures (I am not talking about ethnic culture here, rather a mindset, a philosophy, a paradigm)? They way people think in the Clinton/red areas is generally quite different from the rest of the nation.

21 Strategist   ignore (0)   2017 Jul 10, 7:47pm   ↑ like (0)   ↓ dislike (0)     quote        

joeyjojojunior says

Unfortunately, that's not how it works. In order for inequality to be tackled, it must be done at a Federal level with changes to laws. But, I will absolutely stand behind my value system once it is enacted.

People have different skills, talents and abilities. They can never be truly equal. What can be equalized is opportunity, and that is what we should aim for.

22 joeyjojojunior   ignore (1)   2017 Jul 10, 8:02pm   ↑ like (1)   ↓ dislike (0)     quote        

Strategist says

People have different skills, talents and abilities. They can never be truly equal. What can be equalized is opportunity, and that is what we should aim for.

I agree we should aim for equal opportunity. But it's not a matter of fairness or morals. It's pure practicality--the economy runs great with lower levels of inequality, and basically stops functioning when inequality levels get too high. I don't care much about fairness. I care about having a strong economy.

23 Strategist   ignore (0)   2017 Jul 10, 8:08pm   ↑ like (0)   ↓ dislike (0)     quote        

joeyjojojunior says

Strategist says

People have different skills, talents and abilities. They can never be truly equal. What can be equalized is opportunity, and that is what we should aim for.

I agree we should aim for equal opportunity. But it's not a matter of fairness or morals. It's pure practicality--the economy runs great with lower levels of inequality, and basically stops functioning when inequality levels get too high. I don't care much about fairness. I care about having a strong economy.

That was awesome, Joey. I could not agree more. Democracy can easily solve inequalities of wealth by death taxing the hell out of those who have a net worth of $100 million+

24 MMR   ignore (0)   2017 Jul 10, 8:40pm   ↑ like (1)   ↓ dislike (0)     quote        

joeyjojojunior says

How about we reduce inequality and see what happens?

Yes, start by allowing the black kids access to the upper middle class neighborhood public schools

but that won't happen because rich democrats are all about "got mine fuck you" ...b b but, they assuage guilt by giving to charity and supporting welfare

25 MMR   ignore (0)   2017 Jul 10, 8:43pm   ↑ like (1)   ↓ dislike (0)     quote        

MMR says

joeyjojojunior says

How about we reduce inequality and see what happens?

Yes, start by allowing the black kids access to the upper middle class neighborhood public schools

but that won't happen because rich democrats are all about "got mine fuck you" ...b b but, they assuage guilt by giving to charity and supporting welfare

It will be a cold day in hell when people from Westfield allow busing in of kids from east orange and/or Newark

Btw...any southsiders coming to school in your uppity ass Chicago neighborhood? Is that in the works...eh didn't think so for reasons everyone here already knows about.

26 Strategist   ignore (0)   2017 Jul 10, 8:53pm   ↑ like (1)   ↓ dislike (0)     quote        

MMR says

joeyjojojunior says

How about we reduce inequality and see what happens?

Yes, start by allowing the black kids access to the upper middle class neighborhood public schools

Please elaborate. We already have the system to allow anyone to rise to the top. e.g. Obama.

27 PeopleUnited   ignore (2)   2017 Jul 10, 11:51pm   ↑ like (0)   ↓ dislike (0)     quote        

joeyjojojunior says

Strategist says

People have different skills, talents and abilities. They can never be truly equal. What can be equalized is opportunity, and that is what we should aim for.

I agree we should aim for equal opportunity. But it's not a matter of fairness or morals. It's pure practicality--the economy runs great with lower levels of inequality, and basically stops functioning when inequality levels get too high. I don't care much about fairness. I care about having a strong economy.

You sound just like this guy.

I'm glad to hear you starting to make some sense.

28 ThreeBays   ignore (0)   2017 Jul 11, 4:09am   ↑ like (0)   ↓ dislike (0)     quote        

Would be more useful to see per-capita. This map is comparing apples and oranges.

29 joeyjojojunior   ignore (1)   2017 Jul 11, 4:59am   ↑ like (0)   ↓ dislike (0)     quote        

"You sound just like this guy."

I wish that were true. I've yet to hear Trump speak on the problems in inequality, and he appears set to make the tax code worse.

30 joeyjojojunior   ignore (1)   2017 Jul 11, 5:05am   ↑ like (0)   ↓ dislike (0)     quote        

"Yes, start by allowing the black kids access to the upper middle class neighborhood public schools

but that won't happen because rich democrats are all about "got mine fuck you" ...b b but, they assuage guilt by giving to charity and supporting welfare"

lol--you're lost in your own world. I've asked you multiple times to present a solution to the problem of how to allow kids from poor neighborhoods to go to middle class neighborhood schools. I'm all ears. How do you cap the enrollment? Lottery? How do you get the kids to school? Do you bus them from every different part of town? Who pays for this? Do middle class kids get to pick their school as well? Do you pay to bus the middle class kids to whatever school they want to go to? This is just a very small subset of the practical questions that arise from such a proposal.

31 PeopleUnited   ignore (2)   2017 Jul 11, 5:20am   ↑ like (1)   ↓ dislike (1)     quote        

joeyjojojunior says

"You sound just like this guy."

I wish that were true. I've yet to hear Trump speak on the problems in inequality, and he appears set to make the tax code worse.

Well you are going to have to define it more specifically then. What inequality is it that you think Trump and the Feds need to focus on?

32 PeopleUnited   ignore (2)   2017 Jul 11, 5:35am   ↑ like (2)   ↓ dislike (1)     quote        

joeyjojojunior says

"Yes, start by allowing the black kids access to the upper middle class neighborhood public schools

but that won't happen because rich democrats are all about "got mine fuck you" ...b b but, they assuage guilt by giving to charity and supporting welfare"

This is a rabbit hole, MMR's valid point however is that high crime areas are also Democrat strongholds. Despite urban Democrats desire to promote better schools for all, most of them are much happier to have their kids go to schools that are less diverse. In other words, they want their kids to be more equal than other people's kids. Funny how that works.

So to recap, Democrats control the politics in high crime areas. This means the for the most part they control the local government and even state government in many places where violent crime is the worst. Despite this control they have by and large been unable to curb the violence in their own backyard through local government. And yet they want take control of the Federal government and put the policies that failed at the local level in force across the entire country? It is lunacy. Nice try Joeyjojojunior. Put forth a model that works by implementing it in your own location before we give Democrats a chance to force an unproven solution on the whole nation. We are still waiting for the answer on how you are going to solve inequality.

33 joeyjojojunior   ignore (1)   2017 Jul 11, 5:44am   ↑ like (0)   ↓ dislike (0)     quote        

"Well you are going to have to define it more specifically then. What inequality is it that you think Trump and the Feds need to focus on?"

The kind that causes an economy to stop functioning. Like in 1929.

34 joeyjojojunior   ignore (1)   2017 Jul 11, 5:49am   ↑ like (0)   ↓ dislike (0)     quote        

"We are still waiting for the answer on how you are going to solve inequality."

It's not a secret. I've posted it on here many, many times. I'm sure most are tired of hearing it.

Unearned income should be taxed (much) higher than earned income.
Raise inheritance taxes
Strengthen the power of labor vs. owners through new laws
Revise corporate board structure and make them accountable to shareholders
Strengthen oversight of Wall St. and banks.

This is just a small start.

35 joeyjojojunior   ignore (1)   2017 Jul 11, 5:53am   ↑ like (0)   ↓ dislike (0)     quote        

"Despite urban Democrats desire to promote better schools for all, most of them are much happier to have their kids go to schools that are less diverse. In other words, they want their kids to be more equal than other people's kids. Funny how that works"

Why do you guys continue with the nonsense like:

1. If I'm in favor of better schools for all, that means my kids should go to the crappiest school in the city?
2. If I'm in favor of reducing inequality, that means I should give all my money to poor people.

It's not at all hypocritical to want all schools to be great, but send you kids to the local school or even a private school.

36 BlueSardine   ignore (1)   2017 Jul 11, 7:21am   ↑ like (0)   ↓ dislike (0)     quote        

Nah no bans..
I made a funny and triggered joeyjojo at the same time.
That in itself is worth absorbing the return fire...

PeopleUnited says

joeyjojojr said: Funny. I find that trolls typically aren't high earners.

You called BlueSardine a troll and implied he is not a high earner. Shame on you. BlueSardine, if you like I will ban him from the thread.

37 joeyjojojunior   ignore (1)   2017 Jul 11, 7:30am   ↑ like (0)   ↓ dislike (0)     quote        

BlueSardine is a self avowed and proud troll. I don't think calling him such is an insult to him.


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