Bernie Sanders on "Why we need Medicare for all"
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1 APOCALYPSEFUCK_is_ADORABLE   ignore (5)   2017 Sep 13, 9:20am   ↑ like (0)   ↓ dislike (0)     quote        

Sick people die. AMERICAN!s understand that and want the end to be as merciful as possible so they elected a PRECEDENT! who would shoot the infirm, the aged and the poor in the face, and do so at a profit. Win-win. Why does Sanders hate winning?
4 Dan8267   ignore (3)   2017 Sep 18, 5:24pm   ↑ like (2)   ↓ dislike (1)     quote        

If you don't want to be taxed heavily for health care, then take away the power of hospitals and insurance companies and make health care cheaper. Otherwise, one way or another all your wealth will be going to those companies.
5 socal2   ignore (0)   2017 Sep 18, 5:46pm   ↑ like (2)   ↓ dislike (1)     quote        

Dan8267 says
If you don't want to be taxed heavily for health care, then take away the power of hospitals and insurance companies and make health care cheaper. Otherwise, one way or another all your wealth will be going to those companies.


Is it unreasonable to ask our government to fix Medicare, Medicaid and the VA before taking over the rest of our healthcare?

BTW - was Bernie wrong here?
6 APOCALYPSEFUCK_is_ADORABLE   ignore (5)   2017 Sep 18, 9:17pm   ↑ like (3)   ↓ dislike (0)     quote        

He said if there is no commensurate establishment of cost controls attendants universal deployment of Medicare, we're fucked. Which is true. Even commercial insurers would agree prices are kind of exotic sometimes in comparison with real costs.

Of course, CANNIBAL! ANARCHY! is the cleansing inevitability that will make the world safe for those who can eat the MOSTEST! FACE!s the fastest.
7 Dan8267   ignore (3)   2017 Sep 18, 9:22pm   ↑ like (2)   ↓ dislike (1)     quote        

socal2 says

Is it unreasonable to ask our government to fix Medicare, Medicaid and the VA before taking over the rest of our healthcare?


If the cost of that is countless lives, then yes.

The bottom line is that the for-profit model does not work for health insurance or for health care. Capitalism has utterly failed at both. Nor should health care access be tied to employment.
8 Dan8267   ignore (3)   2017 Sep 18, 9:25pm   ↑ like (0)   ↓ dislike (1)     quote        

socal2 says
BTW - was Bernie wrong here?


Bernie was right and his statements still apply. And he's proposing Medicare for all, not Medicaid for all. If you don't understand the difference, that's your fault. Just because the names are similar does not mean the programs are.

https://www.fool.com/retirement/general/2015/05/19/medicaid-vs-medicare-the-key-differences-you-need.aspx
9 Blurtman   ignore (1)   2017 Sep 19, 2:24am   ↑ like (1)   ↓ dislike (0)     quote        

Dan8267 says
And he's proposing Medicare for all, not Medicaid for all


For citizens only? Illegals still flock to the ER?
10 theoakman   ignore (0)   2017 Sep 19, 5:45am   ↑ like (4)   ↓ dislike (0)     quote        

My brother's girlfriend is a painkiller addict. She's had all kinds of unnecessary surgeries just to get the prescriptions. She's hit up just about every doctor in the better part of 2 counties. Plenty of scumbags willing to operate, write prescriptions, and bill it out to the government. She's had something like 50 Ct scans in the past 2 years. All on your dime.
11 Patrick   ignore (0)   2017 Sep 19, 7:19am   ↑ like (1)   ↓ dislike (0)     quote        

Dan8267 says
If you don't want to be taxed heavily for health care, then take away the power of hospitals and insurance companies and make health care cheaper. Otherwise, one way or another all your wealth will be going to those companies.


Yes, exactly, the fundamental problem is that prices are hidden and arbitrarily high. Competition would be good for the non-emergency medical market, but it is being prevented.

APOCALYPSEFUCK_is_ADORABLE says
Even commercial insurers would agree prices are kind of exotic sometimes in comparison with real costs.


"Exotic" is a creative way to put it.
12 Dan8267   ignore (3)   2017 Sep 19, 7:51am   ↑ like (2)   ↓ dislike (1)     quote        

Blurtman says
Dan8267 says
And he's proposing Medicare for all, not Medicaid for all


For citizens only? Illegals still flock to the ER?


Yes, treat them in the ER and then deport them.
13 joeyjojojunior   ignore (1)   2017 Sep 19, 8:04am   ↑ like (1)   ↓ dislike (0)     quote        

Patrick says
Yes, exactly, the fundamental problem is that prices are hidden and arbitrarily high. Competition would be good for the non-emergency medical market, but it is being prevented.


No, the fundamental problem is that health care doesn't exhibit many of the prerequisites needed for a free market. It has very inelastic demand. It has very specialized knowledge that most consumers cannot take the time to learn. Supply of many services is limited.
14 theoakman   ignore (0)   2017 Sep 19, 8:24am   ↑ like (0)   ↓ dislike (1)     quote        

joeyjojojunior says
Patrick says
Yes, exactly, the fundamental problem is that prices are hidden and arbitrarily high. Competition would be good for the non-emergency medical market, but it is being prevented.


No, the fundamental problem is that health care doesn't exhibit many of the prerequisites needed for a free market. It has very inelastic demand. It has very specialized knowledge that most consumers cannot take the time to learn. Supply of many services is limited.


Somehow, Singapore managed to overcome that problem
15 joeyjojojunior   ignore (1)   2017 Sep 19, 9:32am   ↑ like (1)   ↓ dislike (0)     quote        

I think we could learn a lot from Singapore:

https://www.hsph.harvard.edu/news/features/singapores-health-care-system-holds-lessons-for-u-s/
"Singapore has a range of policies that support health care, Haseltine said. For example, Singaporeans are required to have a health savings plan, called Medisave, that works like a 401K retirement savings plan in the U.S; the government sets both policies and prices for private insurance companies; health care costs for services and procedures must be completely transparent; there’s a minister of “wellness” who emphasizes the importance of a healthy diet and exercise and works to curb smoking; there are high health care subsidies for those with low incomes; and the government invests heavily in medical education."

"He thinks that Singapore’s emphasis on “social harmony”—on ensuring that everything in society works well and smoothly—is a key factor in that nation’s health care achievements. “They believe that nobody in their country, even a foreigner, will go without health care,” Haseltine said during a January 15, 2014 talk at Harvard School of Public Health (HSPH), where he served as a professor from 1976-92. “If they have to put more money into it to help to help the vulnerable population and the very old population, they do it.”

"Haseltine acknowledged that the Singapore government’s heavy hand in the marketplace and in society wouldn’t go over well in the U.S"
16 Ceffer   ignore (1)   2017 Sep 19, 9:53am   ↑ like (2)   ↓ dislike (0)     quote        

We need to prop up the geeks and piss poor protoplasm with IVs and millions of dollars apiece of support medical services, threatening doctors with live flaying and perpetual litigation if they don't transform this piss poor protoplasm into happy, joyous health!

Bernie is a genius! He deserves a fourth home at taxpayer expense.
17 errc   ignore (2)   2017 Sep 19, 10:06am   ↑ like (1)   ↓ dislike (0)     quote        

Somehow, Singapore managed to overcome that problem

---------------

Does their government use propaganda like the Food Pyramid, to encourage that the citizenry eat themselves sick, with a toxic diet? That alone is likely responsible for at least 50% of our obscene health care costs/waste.

What this country needs is Nutrition re-education. Not the nonsense Heritage Foundation scheme to extort the last of whatever value remains in Labor, in this Lemon Socialist Failed system.
18 theoakman   ignore (0)   2017 Sep 19, 6:19pm   ↑ like (0)   ↓ dislike (0)     quote        

joeyjojojunior says
I think we could learn a lot from Singapore:

https://www.hsph.harvard.edu/news/features/singapores-health-care-system-holds-lessons-for-u-s/
"Singapore has a range of policies that support health care, Haseltine said. For example, Singaporeans are required to have a health savings plan, called Medisave, that works like a 401K retirement savings plan in the U.S; the government sets both policies and prices for private insurance companies; health care costs for services and procedures must be completely transparent; there’s a minister of “wellness” who emphasizes the importance of a healthy diet and exercise and works to curb smoking; there are high health care subsidies for those with low incomes; and the government invests heavily in medical education."

"He thinks that Singapore’s emphasis on “social harmony”—on ensuring that everything in society works well a...


The government of the US has a much heavier hand in the healthcare system than singapore.
19 joeyjojojunior   ignore (1)   2017 Sep 19, 6:44pm   ↑ like (0)   ↓ dislike (1)     quote        

theoakman says
The government of the US has a much heavier hand in the healthcare system than singapore.


You've provided such a convincing argument with all the supporting facts and data.
20 Booger   ignore (0)   2017 Sep 19, 6:48pm   ↑ like (2)   ↓ dislike (0)     quote        

Dan8267 says

Yes, treat them in the ER and then deport them


It would be cheaper to just deport them without treatment.
21 Dan8267   ignore (3)   2017 Sep 19, 9:09pm   ↑ like (0)   ↓ dislike (0)     quote        

Not after the lawsuits.

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