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Really ? No threads about Net Neutrality in the past couple weeks ?

By marcus following x   2017 Nov 26, 9:23pm 2,924 views   21 comments   watch   sfw   quote     share    


Shouldn't Twoscoops or one of the other Trump bots have posted something about how wonderful it will be when the FCC has it's way, with destroying Net Neutrality ?

I will say this. I'm starting to see Patrick's wisdom in making this more of a right wing forum. Hopefully AT&T and Verizon and the other internet rulers will look favorably on Patrick.net after our internet becomes more like China's. And let's face it, as the low income folks become greater in number, we're going to need to have greater control over how much of a voice they have. We've seen the power of the internet. It's not going to be possible to have a successful authoritarian regime that is supposedly democratic if internet neutrality survives.

Reddit has had thousands of posts on this topic in recent weeks. I guess the right wingers of Patrick.net are having a tough time finding a way to spin it as more Trumpian brilliance. I have faith in twoscoops though. He'll come up with an angle. At a minimum he shouldbe able to change the subject to how the libruls are really to blame for all the negative aspects of the internet.

"How Trump Will Turn America’s Open Internet Into an Ugly Version of China’s"
https://www.thedailybeast.com/how-trump-will-turn-americas-open-internet-into-an-ugly-version-of-chinas
https://www.nytimes.com/video/us/100000005564560/what-is-net-neutrality.html
https://www.nytimes.com/2017/11/21/technology/fcc-net-neutrality.html?_r=0
https://www.thenation.com/article/if-trumps-fcc-repeals-net-neutrality-elites-will-rule-the-internet-and-the-future/
#scithech
2   justme   ignore (0)   2017 Nov 26, 9:43pm   ↑ like (0)   ↓ dislike (0)   quote   flag        

Right on, Marcus. Net neutrality is a huge topic.
3   marcus   ignore (4)   2017 Nov 26, 9:53pm   ↑ like (0)   ↓ dislike (0)   quote   flag        

Can we count on the add ons being this cheap ?

5   Goran_K   ignore (1)   2017 Nov 26, 10:12pm   ↑ like (0)   ↓ dislike (0)   quote   flag        

This is a topic I agree with the left about.

Can anyone on the right tell me why I may be wrong to agree with leftist on net neutrality?
6   marcus   ignore (4)   2017 Nov 26, 10:20pm   ↑ like (1)   ↓ dislike (0)   quote   flag        

Maybe it's not about right vs left. It's about right vs wrong.

Many think the courts will prevent it if congress doesn't. But considering citizens united, and the more corporate friendly (right leaning) supreme court, I wouldn't count on it. https://www.nytimes.com/2017/11/22/opinion/courts-net-neutrality-fcc.html

On the bright side, look at verizon stock. It's price seems to reflect it not happening. If and when it appears that Trump's FCC will get away with this crime, we should see an instantaneous 20% bump in telecom stocks, at least.

Hey why should ISPs just be about providing internet service, when the internet access they are providing is:

1) So full of other business opportunities (and they could have so much control over internet traffic).

2) Something the government will be willing to pay (in one way or another) to have more control over
7   marcus   ignore (4)   2017 Nov 26, 10:35pm   ↑ like (2)   ↓ dislike (0)   quote   flag        

Goran_K says
Can anyone on the right tell me why I may be wrong


Shouldn't the question be, ""can anyone tell me why I wasn't wrong about Trump."

Trump isn't about conservative policy. Half the Obama policies he has undone (or tried to undo) weren't especially liberal or against libertarian or conservative points of view. Trump's just a hater, it's payback. That's how he is. But there is a substantial segment of his base (the kind of assholes that some call "deplorable" or worse) that love that stuff. Hey, if it pisses off the hated liberals, that's more than enough of a reason right there. It doesn't need to be good policy.

You know it's true.

Although in this case it's more simple. It's moving things away from internet freedom and enriching the telecoms.I wonder if Pai still has some verizon options he hasn't exercised yet.
9   HEYYOU   ignore (18)   2017 Nov 26, 11:20pm   ↑ like (1)   ↓ dislike (0)   quote   flag        

HEYYOU says
,one vote at a time


Make that 265 "bought" votes at a time.
10   anonymous   ignore (null)   2017 Nov 27, 7:34am   ↑ like (1)   ↓ dislike (2)   quote   flag        

@Marcus try to stay on topic. The Trump = bad spin really takes away from the conversation, while making you appear petty as F.

Try starting w how you define net neutrality. Move on to why this bill will threaten neutrality as you defined it.

The way I see it now, google/YouTube/facebook AND the entire EU are all deeply biased against any wrongthinkers. London police are more interested in throwing anti-terrorist voices online in prison than in policing terrorism.

We already have huge net neutrality issues coming from the anti free speech left.
11   anonymous   ignore (null)   2017 Nov 27, 7:34am   ↑ like (0)   ↓ dislike (0)   quote   flag        

marcus says

Trump isn't about conservative policy. Half the Obama policies he has undone (or tried to undo) weren't especially liberal or against libertarian or conservative points of view.


You are the one labeling trump a conservative or "rightwing". Are you wrong to label trump right wing or are you wrong that his policies are anti-conservative? Choose.
12   NuttBoxer   ignore (2)   2017 Nov 27, 12:11pm   ↑ like (0)   ↓ dislike (0)   quote   flag        

While there are many attempts to control the internet, I'd put The Pirate Bay up as a good example of how this is impossible. I did have to look through 5 proxy sites the other day to get past the 502's, but that's the most difficulty I've ever had attempting to access the biggest slap in the face to every wanna-be ruler of the internet.
14   Goran_K   ignore (1)   2017 Nov 27, 1:44pm   ↑ like (0)   ↓ dislike (0)   quote   flag        

marcus says
Maybe it's not about right vs left. It's about right vs wrong.

Many think the courts will prevent it if congress doesn't. But considering citizens united, and the more corporate friendly (right leaning) supreme court, I wouldn't count on it. https://www.nytimes.com/2017/11/22/opinion/courts-net-neutrality-fcc.html

On the bright side, look at verizon stock. It's price seems to reflect it not happening. If and when it appears that Trump's FCC will get away with this crime, we should see an instantaneous 20% bump in telecom stocks, at least.

Hey why should ISPs just be about providing internet service, when the internet access they are providing is:

1) So full of other business opportunities (and they could have so much control over internet traffic).

2) Something the government will be willing to pay (in one way or another) to have more control over


I should be clear. I don't support Net Neutrality for the reasons you're stating (prevent internet in US from turning into China's internet).

The reason I support Net Neutrality is because I see the internet like highways and roads. You can't privatize roads, it would cause far too much economic turmoil to have roads where people could just set price barriers without consequence since land is limited, and therefore there is also an optimal path to build as well which is limited by the layout of the land. As of right now technology has not progressed to a point to overcome these barriers (flying cars, etc).

The same goes for trenched wiring. You can't build a new fiber optic network from the ground up everytime an ISP wants to serve a home. So Net Neutrality in this regard makes sense (although I think Title II is over stepping by leaps and bounds and should be removed).

However, once technology becomes economically feasible so that any ISP could just sprout up and begin serving internet access to the masses without the physical barriers imposed by trenching/laying lines, I think Net Neutrality should go away. If Comcast/ATT/etc wanted to limit the speed to a certain site, then the customer could choose to go to another ISP and get their internet from there. Right now, most people living in the suburbs have maybe 1-2 choices tops in who they can choose as a provider. Hopefully technology will overcome this capital/investment block so smaller fish can compete with the big boys.
15   anonymous   ignore (null)   2017 Nov 27, 2:52pm   ↑ like (1)   ↓ dislike (1)   quote   flag        

Everything is about left versus right.

That's why they were taught to say "Libtards," to make sure they never listen to anything an honest man would ever say.
16   anonymous   ignore (null)   2017 Nov 27, 2:52pm   ↑ like (1)   ↓ dislike (0)   quote   flag        

Goran_K says
You can't privatize roads

Watch what happens: transponder auto-pay
17   Goran_K   ignore (1)   2017 Nov 27, 3:00pm   ↑ like (1)   ↓ dislike (0)   quote   flag        

anon_4460e says
Watch what happens: transponder auto-pay


Sure. Imagine one company owning all the best roads in a city. Some people aren't able to use those roads because the toll is so high so they use cheaper ones that circumvent that optimal route but it takes them 30 minutes longer to get to work.

Privatized roads and highways just don't make sense given the limits in technology. You can't really foster competition when there is only one real option. Flying cars or transporters come along, then privatized roads would work.

Same thing with the internet, the infrastructure and capital investment is simply too high right now to "start a new ISP".
18   marcus   ignore (4)   2017 Nov 27, 5:26pm   ↑ like (0)   ↓ dislike (1)   quote   flag        

anon_4480e says
@Marcus try to stay on topic. The Trump = bad spin really takes away from the conversation, while making you appear petty as F.


I don't come here as often as I used to. When I do though, I see a lot of threads in pathetic kiss ass defense of the worst and most detrimental Trump polices (or more often Trump's non policy nonsensical twitter posts). So sure, (at least in part) I'm trolling the Trump defenders about something that I don't think even they can defend.

But you are right that Trump's creating a corrupt swamp the likes of which we've never seen before is beside the point of what net neutrality is and why every sane Americans should want it.

anon_4480e says
We already have huge net neutrality issues coming from the anti free speech left.


Are you referring to the way that facebook censored all of the Russian ads supporting Trump ?

anon_4480e says
Are you wrong to label trump right wing or are you wrong that his policies are anti-conservative? Choose.


I would far rather have a true conservative, such as the vice President, than Trump. But it's not as simple as you suggest. Trump is nothing like a conservative. But plenty of "conservatives" back him, because he's the one their tribe is going with. And because they do get a kick out of certain ways he's destroying the country ( they say "Me like - it so refreshing to see him upset scientists and other elitist (read educated) libtards").

So Trump brands himself a conservative and there are plenty of people that buy it. He's mostly only a "conservative" (or what gets labelled conservative today) with respect to the worst of republican policies, such as denying climate change, putting the fox in control of the henhouse for all important fed departments and agencies, tearing apart all progress in international diplomacy becasue he thinks having globalzation progress without us is the answer to our economic challenges, blowing up the deficit and causing massive inflation if possible. I could go on.

Fortunately for Trump, and for all of us, Pai will probably not get away with this.
19   anonymous   ignore (null)   2017 Nov 27, 6:13pm   ↑ like (0)   ↓ dislike (0)   quote   flag        

Goran_K says
Sure. Imagine one company owning all the best roads in a city.

Yeah they are doing that now for diamond lane applications. Trumps infrastructure sell-off sells the most valuable assets for making money.

Why else would corporations buy up bridges and turnpikes for pennies on the dollar and fix them up?
20   TwoScoopsOfSpaceForce   ignore (4)   2017 Nov 29, 3:33am   ↑ like (0)   ↓ dislike (0)   quote   flag        

"Net Neutrality" : Google to implement algo that lowers RT/Sputnik links.
https://www.rt.com/news/410444-google-alphabet-derank-rt/
Doesn't seem quite that neutral.

“We are working on detecting and de-ranking those kinds of sites – it’s basically RT and Sputnik,” Schmidt said during a Q & A session at the Halifax International Security Forum in Canada on Saturday, when asked about whether Google facilitates “Russian propaganda.”

“Good to have Google on record as defying all logic and reason: facts aren’t allowed if they come from RT, ‘because Russia’ – even if we have Google on Congressional record saying they've found no manipulation of their platform or policy violations by RT,” Sputnik and RT Editor-in-Chief Margarita Simonyan said in a statement.

Democracy Dies in the Deep State - WaPo, Schmidt.
21   HEYYOU   ignore (18)   2018 Mar 27, 8:02pm   ↑ like (0)   ↓ dislike (0)   quote   flag        

marcus says
I'm starting to see Patrick's wisdom in making this more of a right wing forum.


Poor choice,when an old fuck,that doesn't give a damn about the Right's tender sensibilities, can make them look like fools.
The problem is that it's too easy.

Turn it into a left wing forum & I'll have them committing suicide.

Hypocrisy is not a virtue,no matter which wing one flaps.




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