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Democrats beginning to Cave on "The Wall" and Immigration Reform.

By Goran_K following x   2018 Jan 25, 9:16am 1,391 views   27 comments   watch   sfw   quote     share    




The border wall is still a difficult conversation for Democratic lawmakers, aides, and activists—all of whom in statements and interviews made clear that they opposed its construction except as part of a generous deal for Dreamers. But their new willingness to consider it was also an acknowledgement that conservatives in Congress and the White House had succeeded in moving the terms of the DACA debate with proposals to reduce legal immigration, limit or end the sponsorship of family members, withhold federal funding for “sanctuary cities,” and make it easier for federal officials to swiftly deport undocumented immigrants.


https://www.theatlantic.com/politics/archive/2018/01/democrats-schumer-trump-border-wall-daca/551288/
1   FNWGMOBDVZXDNW   ignore (2)   2018 Jan 25, 10:15am   ↑ like (1)   ↓ dislike (1)   quote        

This is sort of old news, given that Schumer offered Trump the wall for DACA. He'll offer it again. The only reason that he pulled the offer was to start fresh, so Greedy McGreedypants doesn't decide that he can push for more. The Dems have decided that they can spend 20 billion, which is $30K per person to give DACA people a path to citizenship. It will cost more than Trump originally claimed, and we will pay for it, and it will not be a continuous wall. It will be enough of a wall that Trump can claim it is actually a big beautiful wall. It will have enough gaps and fencing that Dems will claim it's not what Trump was talking about, and that it was a waste of money but was the price that they had to pay for DACA ransom. Trump will say that Mexico is paying for it, and find some rationale to explain that.
2   Goran_K   ignore (1)   2018 Jan 25, 10:25am   ↑ like (0)   ↓ dislike (2)   quote        

FNWGMOBDVZXDNW says
This is sort of old news, given that Schumer offered Trump the wall for DACA. He'll offer it again. The only reason that he pulled the offer was to start fresh, so Greedy McGreedypants doesn't decide that he can push for more. The Dems have decided that they can spend 20 billion, which is $30K per person to give DACA people a path to citizenship. It will cost more than Trump originally claimed, and we will pay for it, and it will not be a continuous wall. It will be enough of a wall that Trump can claim it is actually a big beautiful wall. It will have enough gaps and fencing that Dems will claim it's not what Trump was talking about, and that it was a waste of money but was the price that they had to pay for DACA ransom. Trump will say that Mexico is paying for it, and find some rationale to explain that.


Schumer will cave on chain migration and the visa lottery too.

Also DACA will be a 10-12 year pathway to citizenship. I think that's more than fair.
3   Goran_K   ignore (1)   2018 Jan 25, 10:27am   ↑ like (1)   ↓ dislike (2)   quote        

Also,

Special forces have tested the wall prototypes in the South, and a US Special Forces team was NOT able to scale the wall given standard SPECOPS equipment. Not saying it's impenetrable, but your rag tag group of Coyotes won't be able to just hop over.


The noose is tightening. The Democrats will have to find a new strategy to win votes than letting illegals into the country. This is a good thing, it might improve their ideological platform to appeal to more people.
4   Hassan_Rouhani   ignore (2)   2018 Jan 25, 10:28am   ↑ like (2)   ↓ dislike (0)   quote        

I don't trust these fucks even if they pretend to cave on the border security now. They can always starve it of financing later while the damage done by amnesty would be irreversible.
5   HEYYOU   ignore (13)   2018 Jan 25, 10:30am   ↑ like (0)   ↓ dislike (1)   quote        

Trump/Republicans flip-flop & cave on Mexico paying for the wall.
Now they want hard working Rep/Con/Racist/Nazis to pay for the wall
from what the Republican govt. confiscates from their paychecks.
This is evidence that Trump & his ilk are members of the RSS(Republican Secret Society).
Their motto:
"We gonna fuck our dumb ass voters/supporters."

Republicans are no longer a challenge.
They only have nothing.
6   anonymous   ignore (null)   2018 Jan 25, 10:35am   ↑ like (0)   ↓ dislike (0)   quote        

Goran_K says
but your rag tag group of Coyotes won't be able to just hop over.


Won't they still be able to tunnel under? Or go around? How far into the ocean will the wall go? Wouldn't it be possible to sail around it?
7   Goran_K   ignore (1)   2018 Jan 25, 10:40am   ↑ like (3)   ↓ dislike (2)   quote        

anon_345ea says
Won't they still be able to tunnel under? Or go around? How far into the ocean will the wall go? Wouldn't it be possible to sail around it?


They could still attempt to do all of those things (the sailing part wouldn't work because they'd be immediately seen by border security, maybe a submarine?), but the cost and effort have exponentially increased.

This is what people don't realize about the wall. Leftist/Democrats have been harping for months, "It won't stop people crossing illegally", no shit. Everyone knows that. But now it will take lots of effort, and more resources to attempt a crossing. Look at it from a business perspective. Right now the only costs to coyotes is the men to lead a group, food supplies, and maybe a couple of firearms.

Now they would have to get tunneling equipment, or some sort of climbing equipment (though Special forces were not able to scale the wall with their standard equipment). They would need to avoid the infrared scanners, not trip motion alarms, and then get huge excavating tools right to the wall's edge, dig it all out without being seen by a drone, or camera, etc. This all increases the cost of undertaking an illegal crossing which will be passed to the consumer, which are illegals who are already giving up all of their savings just for the opportunity to MAYBE cross illegally.

I'll take that over what we have now which is basically an open border.
8   Quigley   ignore (0)   2018 Jan 25, 11:06am   ↑ like (2)   ↓ dislike (0)   quote        

Yep it’s not about making illegal immigration impossible, it’s about making it very EXPENSIVE and DIFFICULT. That and keeping squads of Mexican cartel soldiers from simply driving over for a shooting spree whenever they feel like it.
9   Goran_K   ignore (1)   2018 Jan 25, 11:09am   ↑ like (3)   ↓ dislike (2)   quote        

anonymous says
Amnesty Reagan Style - it worked so well then it will work so well now.

We will revisit this again in a few years after whatever is agreed or shoved down the public's throats or up other parts of it's anatomy, just like we are doing after the Reagan deal. (and what a deal it was too, notice how the problem went away and never came back)


You really think the wall, ending chain migration and the visa lottery, is just like "Reagan"?

12   Goran_K   ignore (1)   2018 Jan 25, 11:56am   ↑ like (0)   ↓ dislike (2)   quote        

anonymous says
Not going to stop it especially when most of the "missing immigrants" arrived here by plane and much like every other country we are piss poor at tracking where people go after they arrive and when they leave.



That's why we need reform. Trump is attacking the biggest holes first.
13   Goran_K   ignore (1)   2018 Jan 25, 11:57am   ↑ like (1)   ↓ dislike (2)   quote        

anonymous says
Until this country and every other country can figure out how to keep track of who enters and leaves the country legally, if they do it on time etc. - this "illegal immigration" is going to continue worldwide, not just here.

When a tracking and removal system is in place, it will still continue, people will innovate and find new and creative ways to circumvent the law just like they will do with the "wall".


That's why we can't keep an immigration system from 20 years ago. Trump is updating it to fit the times.
15   TwoScoopsOfDragonEnergy   ignore (1)   2018 Jan 25, 12:49pm   ↑ like (0)   ↓ dislike (1)   quote        

Goran_K says
That's why we can't keep an immigration system from 20 years ago. Trump is updating it to fit the times.


"We can't fight dumping, even though the EU I love imposed restrictions years ago b/c of the solar panel dumping."
"We can't restrict immigration, because illegals might find other ways..."

Can't can't can't can't can't

"The Wall won't be 100% effective."
But if it's 60% effective we saved a lot more money on welfare, criminal justice, etc.

"I don't want this surgery. I will only increase the mobility in both my legs by 60%, not 100%."

Yes we can.
16   TwoScoopsOfDragonEnergy   ignore (1)   2018 Jan 25, 12:52pm   ↑ like (3)   ↓ dislike (1)   quote        

anonymous says
It wont even be 60% effective...remember walls are also good for keeping people in countries as well as keeping people out....everyone would be very well served to remember that small point.


Yes, I'm sure sometime in the future millions of Americans will try to stampede the Mexican Border for some reason.
18   bob2356   ignore (1)   2018 Feb 3, 5:42pm   ↑ like (0)   ↓ dislike (2)   quote        

Goran_K says

That's why we need reform. Trump is attacking the biggest holes first.


If trump were attacking the biggest hole first ICE would be kicking down the doors at smithfield and purdue putting ceo's in jail. No jobs, no illegals. Republicans don't want to get rid of illegals, their campaign contributors make way to much money off of them. They only want the appearance of getting rid of illegals.

Bread and circus. This thread shows how well it works.
19   anonymous   ignore (null)   2018 Feb 3, 7:33pm   ↑ like (1)   ↓ dislike (1)   quote        

If the wall does do anything to speed bump southern migrants, then the price will go up. Which means they’ll just find a couple US gov employees to pay a few bucks to let them cross through their lane at the border crossings.

The other Republican plan would be much more effective: just continue to make America so shitty that Mexico is more desirable of a place to be, then they’ll stay home. Then the walk will really fuck us when we can’t escape this shithole
20   anonymous   ignore (null)   2018 Feb 3, 7:35pm   ↑ like (1)   ↓ dislike (1)   quote        

bob2356 says
Goran_K says

That's why we need reform. Trump is attacking the biggest holes first.


If trump were attacking the biggest hole first ICE would be kicking down the doors at smithfield and purdue putting ceo's in jail. No jobs, no illegals. Republicans don't want to get rid of illegals, their campaign contributors make way to much money off of them. They only want the appearance of getting rid of illegals.

Bread and circus. This thread shows how well it works.


Republicans are ok with getting rid of illegals so long as they can replace them with equally cheap American labor. MAGA, give those shitty lettuce picker jobs to the poor broke Americans that we hate! The blacks can do that shit
22   anonymous   ignore (null)   2018 Feb 3, 8:04pm   ↑ like (0)   ↓ dislike (0)   quote        

bob2356,

how can people contact you outside of this site regarding RE investments?
25   Malcolm   ignore (1)   2018 Feb 21, 4:36pm   ↑ like (0)   ↓ dislike (0)   quote        

"Beginning to Cave?" The Democrats are all about this when it is in fashion for them. There are hilarious videos of Hillary and Schumer spouting the same rhetoric that they accuse Trump of spewing.
26   TwoScoopsOfDragonEnergy   ignore (1)   2018 Feb 23, 10:11am   ↑ like (0)   ↓ dislike (0)   quote        

And Pelosi, @Malcolm. Pelosi was famous for her anti-illegal immigration stances in the 80s and 90s.

Anyway, what haven't we heard a lot of lately, thanks to the new focus on Gun Bans?

For those of you who are still interested, the Democrats have totally forgotten about DACA. Not a lot of interest on this subject from them!

— Donald J. Trump (@realDonaldTrump) February 23, 2018

27   anonymous   ignore (null)   2018 Feb 23, 10:26am   ↑ like (0)   ↓ dislike (0)   quote        

TwoScoopsPlissken says

For those of you who are still interested, the Democrats have totally forgotten about DACA. Not a lot of interest on this subject from them!

— Donald J. Trump (@realDonaldTrump) February 23, 2018


Nobody even listens to his nonsense anymore.

Dems have brought him two different bipartisan DACA deals that he has torpedoed. Trump has no interest in a DACA deal. Everyone knows it.




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