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Why navies are obsolete...

By Heraclitusstudent following x   2018 Apr 11, 5:17pm 700 views   21 comments   watch   sfw   quote     share    


Any aircraft carrier group buyer remorse?... Aquatic drone swarms on the way.

https://www.engadget.com/2018/04/11/aquabotix-aquatic-drone-swarm/


www.youtube.com/watch?time_continue=89&v=94KWh0W1h-A


1   Hassan_Rouhani   ignore (2)   2018 Apr 11, 5:19pm   ↑ like (0)   ↓ dislike (0)   quote        

Any second now...
2   TwoScoopsOfDragonEnergy   ignore (1)   2018 Apr 11, 5:28pm   ↑ like (0)   ↓ dislike (0)   quote        

There's one type of vessel that isn't obsolete, but is deadlier and harder to find than ever, and can strike land or sea from a thousand miles or more.
3   Heraclitusstudent   ignore (1)   2018 Apr 11, 5:48pm   ↑ like (1)   ↓ dislike (0)   quote        

The same is true for the air force. If you can build an autonomous car, there is no reason you can't build swarms of autonomous aircraft fighters.
I pity the poor fools still fighting 20th century's style.
4   Hassan_Rouhani   ignore (2)   2018 Apr 11, 6:22pm   ↑ like (1)   ↓ dislike (0)   quote        

Heraclitusstudent says
If you can build an autonomous car


Not there yet.
5   Hassan_Rouhani   ignore (2)   2018 Apr 11, 6:33pm   ↑ like (0)   ↓ dislike (0)   quote        

Didn't Nikita Khruschev declare surface fleets, aviation and artillery oblsolete "because missiles"? Boy, how time flies: 50 years later here we are with all three still around and kicking.
6   TwoScoopsOfDragonEnergy   ignore (1)   2018 Apr 11, 6:58pm   ↑ like (1)   ↓ dislike (0)   quote        

Satoshi_Nakamoto says
Didn't Nikita Khruschev declare surface fleets, aviation and artillery oblsolete "because missiles"? Boy, how time flies: 50 years later here we are with all three still around and kicking.



Aircraft Carriers haven't fought in Major Power Wars since WW2. So no idea. Vietnam, Iraq War against 3rd world countries with WW1 C3 systems don't count.
7   TwoScoopsOfDragonEnergy   ignore (1)   2018 Apr 11, 7:00pm   ↑ like (1)   ↓ dislike (0)   quote        

Satoshi_Nakamoto says
Didn't Nikita Khruschev declare surface fleets, aviation and artillery oblsolete "because missiles"? Boy, how time flies: 50 years later here we are with all three still around and kicking.


Kruschev also declared 90% Russian and 400 years part of Russia (by right of conquest) Crimea to be part of the Ukraine (for the first time in history) by fiat. Ukraine was Polish or Tartar fiefdom and played no role in the reconquista of Crimea from the Tartar and Turk.

Ha, the USAF declared "Because Missiles", ended up having to adopt the USN F-4 and put guns on them because the Sparrow blew against export grade Soviet Fighters. I won't even get into the F-104 Runwaycrasher or F-105 Thunderthud (or it's successor, the F-35 Triple Thud) and the rest of the Century of Wasted Dollars Series.

They went in claiming 70%, went out with about 7% kill rate.

The USN should be in charge of picking planes for the USAF. Remember, the F-16, F-15, and A-10 were in spite of, not because of, Air Force Brass. Actually we should bring back the USAAF and reduce the USAF to ICBMs and Bombers so they can indulge in their deep strike-to-the-exclusion-of-every-thing-else fantasies.
8   HeadSet   ignore (1)   2018 Apr 12, 6:59am   ↑ like (1)   ↓ dislike (0)   quote        

Actually we should bring back the USAAF and reduce the USAF to ICBMs and Bombers so they can indulge in their deep strike-to-the-exclusion-of-every-thing-else fantasies.


Air Force did a good job with Air Refueling, though.
9   Reality   ignore (5)   2018 Apr 12, 8:05am   ↑ like (1)   ↓ dislike (0)   quote        

What's the range of those aquatic drones? If it has to carry enough fuel to travel multiple hundreds of miles, the drone is not going to be small. The future of naval warfare might belong to submarine carriers of drones.

Aircraft carriers have been the equivalent of WWII battleships for decades now: good for bombarding land, but highly vulnerable to submarine attacks.
10   Heraclitusstudent   ignore (1)   2018 Apr 12, 9:58am   ↑ like (0)   ↓ dislike (0)   quote        

Reality says
What's the range of those aquatic drones? If it has to carry enough fuel to travel multiple hundreds of miles, the drone is not going to be small. The future of naval warfare might belong to submarine carriers of drones.

Exactly, they could be carried by submarines.

Also you can imagine that they could have solar panels and batteries and float around to recharge, then dive when needed.

You could have thousands of these spread in the oceans, or have them follow targets, or have them sink at the bottom in strategic locations waiting for a signal or a target to go through. You could have various versions, some more like torpedoes: fast and loaded with explosives, some more like smart mines, some small and slow and hard to detect for detection purpose, etc....

Just let your imagination run.
11   Heraclitusstudent   ignore (1)   2018 Apr 12, 10:00am   ↑ like (1)   ↓ dislike (0)   quote        

Satoshi_Nakamoto says
Heraclitusstudent says
If you can build an autonomous car


Not there yet.


Yes but driving a drone in the ocean is arguably much more simple than driving a car in a city.
12   Feux Follets   ignore (1)   2018 May 9, 5:33am   ↑ like (0)   ↓ dislike (0)   quote        

Gerald R. Ford Aircraft Carrier Suffers New Failure at Sea !

By Tony Capaccio (Bloomberg) — The Gerald R. Ford, the U.S. Navy’s costliest warship, suffered a new failure at sea that forced it back to port and raised fresh questions about the new class of aircraft carriers.

The previously undisclosed problem with a propulsion system bearing, which occurred in January but has yet to be remedied, comes as the Navy is poised to request approval from a supportive Congress to expedite a contract for a fourth carrier in what was to have been a three-ship class. It’s part of a push to expand the Navy’s 284-ship fleet to 355 as soon as the mid-2030s.

It was the second failure in less than a year with a “main thrust bearing” that’s part of the $12.9 billion carrier’s propulsion system. The first occurred in April 2017, during sea trials a month before the vessel’s delivery. The ship, built by Huntington Ingalls Industries Inc., has been sailing in a shakedown period to test systems and work out bugs. It’s now scheduled to be ready for initial combat duty in 2022.

‘Manufacturing Defect’

The Naval Sea Systems Command said the Ford experienced “an out of specification condition” with a propulsion system component. Huntington Ingalls determined it was due to a “manufacturing defect,” the command said, and “not improper operation” by sailors. The defect “affects the same component” located in other parts of the propulsion system, the Navy added.

Navy officials didn’t disclose the problem during budget hearings before Congress in recent weeks, and House and Senate lawmakers didn’t ask about it.

Shelby Oakley, a director with the U.S. Government Accountability Office who monitors Navy shipbuilding, said the latest part failure was “unfortunate, but this and other ship quality issues are not surprising. The Navy has had issues with the extent of its inspections prior to delivery from the shipbuilder.”

The Navy is seeking approval in the fiscal 2019 defense request to accelerate purchase of the fourth Ford-class carrier by bundling it in a contract with the third. It expects to request congressional support over the next month or two for what’s now an estimated $58 billion program.

Trump’s Promise

President Donald Trump promised the “12-carrier Navy we need,” up from 11 today, when he stood on the Ford’s vast deck during a visit in March 2017 to Newport News, Virginia, where Huntington Ingalls built the ship and is headquartered.

The Ford’s propulsion system flaws are separate from reliability issues on its troubled aircraft launch and recovery system and less publicized delays with its 11 advanced weapons elevators for moving munitions, which are not yet operational.

Much More: http://gcaptain.com/gerald-r-ford-aircraft-carrier-suffers-new-failure-at-sea/

When can we get into our next war and see how great these things really are ? How about we stuff it full of F-35s ?

That will really scare the crap out of our enemies won't it ? That along with Potus's tweets ! Boy will they be sacred...they won't have to do anything, just let us use our best and latest equipment and let if fail all by itself.

Winning You Can Count On !

MAGA on believers, MAGA on.....

Meanwhile....

Russia’s Vladimir Putin watched advanced jets carrying a hypersonic missile he has touted as invincible scream over Red Square on Wednesday, days after the start of his fourth presidential term.

https://www.reuters.com/article/us-ww2-anniversary-russia-parade/putin-newly-inaugurated-reviews-russias-invincible-weapons-on-red-square-idUSKBN1IA1AT

Russia says it has successfully tested advanced hypersonic missile

https://www.cnn.com/2018/03/11/world/russia-says-it-has-tested-successfully-advanced-hypersonic-missile/index.html
13   HeadSet   ignore (1)   2018 May 9, 6:08am   ↑ like (0)   ↓ dislike (0)   quote        

All targets have countermeasures

The invention of arrows, and later on bullets, did not make soldiers obsolete

The invention of anti-aircraft artillery, and later SAMs (even shoulder fired), did not make airpower obsolete

The invention of naval cannon, and later torpedoes and anti-ship missiles, did not make warships obsolete

The invention of depth charges did not make submarines obsolete

The invention of anti-tank grenades, bazooka, or TOW type missiles, did not make tanks obsolete.

The modern day soldier, warship, tank, sub, and aircraft have evolved (tactics and technology) to deal with the threats.
14   Hassan_Rouhani   ignore (2)   2018 May 9, 7:09am   ↑ like (0)   ↓ dislike (0)   quote        

Heraclitusstudent says
Satoshi_Nakamoto says
Heraclitusstudent says
If you can build an autonomous car


Not there yet.


Yes but driving a drone in the ocean is arguably much more simple than driving a car in a city.


The carrier will have his own swarm of hunter drones. Now what? Is it OK to postpone our surrender?
15   Feux Follets   ignore (1)   2018 May 9, 7:52am   ↑ like (0)   ↓ dislike (0)   quote        

HeadSet says
All targets have countermeasures


How about something as basic as actually working as designed and not breaking down ?

Is that a counter measure ?
16   HEYYOU   ignore (13)   2018 May 9, 10:39am   ↑ like (1)   ↓ dislike (0)   quote        

Stupid 2nd Amendment gun nuts are idiots.
Once again they are left with nothing except their love of death,too bad it will be their death.
17   Heraclitusstudent   ignore (1)   2018 May 9, 10:44am   ↑ like (0)   ↓ dislike (0)   quote        

HeadSet says
All targets have countermeasures

The invention of arrows, and later on bullets, did not make soldiers obsolete

Cannons made medieval castles obsolete.
Aircraft carriers made battleships obsolete.
etc...
18   Heraclitusstudent   ignore (1)   2018 May 9, 10:46am   ↑ like (0)   ↓ dislike (0)   quote        

Satoshi_Nakamoto says
The carrier will have his own swarm of hunter drones. Now what? Is it OK to postpone our surrender?


Yes and you get a battle of drones, and if you lose your navy is a sitting duck meaning it's not needed in any case.
19   Heraclitusstudent   ignore (1)   2018 May 9, 10:53am   ↑ like (0)   ↓ dislike (0)   quote        

Feux Follets says
President Donald Trump promised the “12-carrier Navy we need,”


We really need it because it's not enough that the US navy as it stands could easily destroy all the navies of all the rest of the world put together.

Feux Follets says
Russia’s Vladimir Putin watched advanced jets carrying a hypersonic missile


That's an other "aircraft carrier" killer: supersonic missiles able to track moving targets. Aircraft carriers are expensive sitting ducks.
20   Hassan_Rouhani   ignore (2)   2018 May 9, 10:54am   ↑ like (0)   ↓ dislike (0)   quote        

Heraclitusstudent says
Satoshi_Nakamoto says
The carrier will have his own swarm of hunter drones. Now what? Is it OK to postpone our surrender?


Yes and you get a battle of drones, and if you lose your navy is a sitting duck meaning it's not needed in any case.


Aircraft carrier is a platform. For manned aircraft, for unmanned aircraft, for drones, for whatever comes next. To declare navy a "sitting duck" based o some theoretical future "drones" is just silly: nobody precludes us from developing our own drones. Again, Nikita Khruschev was singing exactly this song about "death of aviation and surface fleets" but giving a slighlty different reason - missiles. That was 50 years ago. Both are still alive and kicking ass.
21   Feux Follets   ignore (1)   2018 May 10, 2:49am   ↑ like (0)   ↓ dislike (0)   quote        

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