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1   Malcolm   ignore (1)   2018 Jul 10, 8:21am   ↑ like (2)   ↓ dislike (0)   quote   flag        

At least the interest should be. If it is too easy, banks will end up requiring the loans be secured with an asset or a co-signer, who will end up being on the hook. There is no free lunch, don’t borrow money if you aren’t sure that you can repay it.
2   Aphroman   ignore (7)   2018 Jul 10, 8:32am   ↑ like (0)   ↓ dislike (0)   quote   flag        

Malcolm says
At least the interest should be. If it is too easy, banks will end up requiring the loans be secured with an asset or a co-signer, who will end up being on the hook. There is no free lunch, don’t borrow money if you aren’t sure that you can repay it.


You can’t have Capitalism without the ability to discharge debt via bankruptcy
3   P N Dr Lo R   ignore (0)   2018 Jul 10, 9:01am   ↑ like (2)   ↓ dislike (0)   quote   flag        

tovarichpeter says
You can’t have Capitalism without the ability to discharge debt via bankruptcy
They were back in the mid to late 70's. Then the early co-hort of the Baby Boom generation jumped on the bandwagon of getting their degree, then immediately declaring bankruptcy. I can remember watching a TV news story back then while a long haired hippie type and his GF smirked at the camera and said sure we got our degree, then discharged the debt in bankruptcy. It didn't take long for the creditors to get wise to that generation.
4   Malcolm   ignore (1)   2018 Jul 10, 9:17am   ↑ like (1)   ↓ dislike (0)   quote   flag        

Aphroman says
You can’t have Capitalism without the ability to discharge debt via bankruptcy


Cool, as long as you aren't using taxpayer money, knock yourself out.
5   theoakman   ignore (0)   2018 Jul 10, 9:42am   ↑ like (0)   ↓ dislike (0)   quote   flag        

P N Dr Lo R says
tovarichpeter says
You can’t have Capitalism without the ability to discharge debt via bankruptcy
They were back in the mid to late 70's. Then the early co-hort of the Baby Boom generation jumped on the bandwagon of getting their degree, then immediately declaring bankruptcy. I can remember watching a TV news story back then while a long haired hippie type and his GF smirked at the camera and said sure we got our degree, then discharged the debt in bankruptcy. It didn't take long for the creditors to get wise to that generation.


This is a very easy fix via middle ground. You can disallow bankruptcy for a period of time (10 years maybe). Most people want to buy a home at that point.
6   dr6B   ignore (1)   2018 Jul 10, 10:05am   ↑ like (0)   ↓ dislike (0)   quote   flag        

Malcolm says
banks will end up requiring the loans be secured with an asset or a co-signer, who will end up being on the hook.

Not a bad thing. May be then students will actually start studying, as opposed to partying and complaining that professors do not beam knowledge into their heads, as co-signer will be checking on grades. Also, tuition (currently mostly used for sports and administrations) will drop as students will shop around for price.
7   P N Dr Lo R   ignore (0)   2018 Jul 10, 10:05am   ↑ like (1)   ↓ dislike (0)   quote   flag        

theoakman says
You can disallow bankruptcy for a period of time (10 years maybe)
Sounds reasonable.
8   Malcolm   ignore (1)   2018 Jul 10, 10:06am   ↑ like (2)   ↓ dislike (0)   quote   flag        

theoakman says
This is a very easy fix via middle ground. You can disallow bankruptcy for a period of time (10 years maybe). Most people want to buy a home at that point.


Really? You don’t believe that even the home lenders would then encourage people to file for bankruptcy, which would make them eligible for even more of a loan for a house because they won’t have a student loan payment and they would also be prevented from filing bankruptcy for another 7 to 10 years allowing them to be an even safer loan as they would have more equity in the house after that time?

I see a major moral hazard with what you’re proposing here.
9   HeadSet   ignore (1)   2018 Jul 10, 10:10am   ↑ like (1)   ↓ dislike (0)   quote   flag        

Student loans should be dischargable in bankruptcy

Absolutely not. Easy access to student loads is the main factor driving up college costs. Without these loans, colleges would have had to find ways to lower cost. As it was, too many clowns willing to rack up tens of thousands in debt for often useless degrees. Too many not-serious kids who saw college as a 4 year extension of adolescence.
10   Heraclitusstudent   ignore (1)   2018 Jul 10, 10:26am   ↑ like (1)   ↓ dislike (0)   quote   flag        

For a start, you could make these loans conditional on continuous academic success in disciplines leading to professions likely to pay enough to pay back the loans.
11   Heraclitusstudent   ignore (1)   2018 Jul 10, 10:31am   ↑ like (1)   ↓ dislike (0)   quote   flag        

But like everything other problem in this country, there are people who profit from this situation so nothing will done.
Not only that, but remember the west only functions in the globalized world because of its rising debts. So everything that helps the government load people with debts is good. Otherwise the government would have to take the debt in your name.
12   DASKAA   ignore (3)   2018 Jul 10, 10:38am   ↑ like (0)   ↓ dislike (0)   quote   flag        

Sure. The interest will adjust accordingly.
13   HEYYOU   ignore (16)   2018 Jul 10, 10:55am   ↑ like (0)   ↓ dislike (0)   quote   flag        

I don't understand that there debt & them there ekonomics.
I guess I don't have to be a'payin my debts & standen by my word. Does that bes a'making me's a FAILURE?
What happens to them folk that holds the unpaid debt?

Stupid white trash speech that makes sense?
14   Tenpoundbass   ignore (11)   2018 Jul 10, 11:55am   ↑ like (1)   ↓ dislike (0)   quote   flag        

Education shouldn't be mortgageable.
That would lower the cost of College drastically or create some work as you learn programs.
15   Aphroman   ignore (7)   2018 Jul 10, 12:03pm   ↑ like (0)   ↓ dislike (0)   quote   flag        

It’s amazing how many “Americans” desire to abandon Capitalism, especially where it’s needed most. Not surprising that they are the same people who relentlessly chide liberals while supporting Republicans. Yuck
16   Ceffer   ignore (1)   2018 Jul 10, 1:18pm   ↑ like (1)   ↓ dislike (0)   quote   flag        

Yup, allowing bankruptcy for student loans is a great way to completely dry up student loans.
17   Aphroman   ignore (7)   2018 Jul 10, 1:35pm   ↑ like (0)   ↓ dislike (0)   quote   flag        

Ceffer says
Yup, allowing bankruptcy for student loans is a great way to completely dry up student loans.


That or price them appropriately
18   SunnyvaleCA   ignore (0)   2018 Jul 10, 1:40pm   ↑ like (2)   ↓ dislike (0)   quote   flag        

When I go back to visit my high-end high school and college, I hardly recognize the places. They are like country clubs now. THAT is the problem. I'd suggest tuition, room, and board could be cut in half if the experiences there were merely a modern equivalent of like what I experienced in the 80's. Maybe, too, people would be more inclined to study if there were far fewer distractions.

Computers should be making school administration easier and thus cheaper, so why is it that administration costs are rising faster than many other categories? Why so many moronic majors? Why so much coddling of the kids? If kids need that much coddling, the aren't ready for college (or high school, for that matter).

Anyway, huge student loans just enable colleges to raise tuition that much more and waste that much more money, so anything that limits student loans would probably be a good thing. To this end, I'd say: Yes, allow new loans going forward to default. That would completely stop all student loans. I got out of school with $25k in debt (27 years ago), moved to my new job in a new city with a box of books, a box of clothes, 2 pairs of shoes, and a few thousand $ from working a summer job. Of course I would immediately have defaulted on the loans if I could have. Being silicon valley, buying a house wasn't going to happen in the first 10 years of work anyway.
19   HeadSet   ignore (1)   2018 Jul 10, 1:50pm   ↑ like (2)   ↓ dislike (0)   quote   flag        

Anyway, huge student loans just enable colleges to raise tuition that much more and waste that much more money,

Yep, and also encourage the student to live less frugally. College should be more Raman Noodles, bus dates, occasional pizzas, less nice cars, exotic spring break trips, fancy meals.
20   FortWayne   ignore (2)   2018 Jul 10, 1:57pm   ↑ like (2)   ↓ dislike (0)   quote   flag        

Does anyone ever think of taxpayers when they write articles like that? Or they live in fantasy world of “free everything”?
21   TwoScoopsOfSpaceForce   ignore (4)   2018 Jul 10, 4:28pm   ↑ like (2)   ↓ dislike (0)   quote   flag        

There shouldn't be student loans.

There should be a free ride for the top 5% of all students, and colleges/unis must admit them based on only academic merit. Not their race, gender, or being on the Martha's Vineyards Rowing Team.

Everybody else pays cash or gets a private loan. Go to community college and rack up half your credits first.
22   theoakman   ignore (0)   2018 Jul 10, 4:35pm   ↑ like (1)   ↓ dislike (0)   quote   flag        

I don't. If lenders want to lend money to people who filed for bankruptcy, they can suffer the consequences when they default.
23   Patrick   ignore (0)   2018 Jul 10, 4:43pm   ↑ like (2)   ↓ dislike (0)   quote   flag        

The question is really about how much we should let students fuck up their own lives. Most students are young and idealistic, and kind of clueless about how much any given degree is actually worth. A chemical engineering degree is clearly valuable. A degree in gender studies is worth nothing at all. A lot of students are unaware of these basic facts.

Maybe every student loan should come with a sheet of objective statistics about exactly how much their proposed degree is worth in future earnings potential. Loans which the bank knows are a bad deal should be harder to get.
24   MisterLefty   ignore (0)   2018 Jul 10, 4:51pm   ↑ like (0)   ↓ dislike (0)   quote   flag        

Patrick says
kind of clueless about how much any given degree is actually worth
Well meaning co-signing parents as well.
25   TwoScoopsOfSpaceForce   ignore (4)   2018 Jul 10, 4:53pm   ↑ like (1)   ↓ dislike (0)   quote   flag        

Patrick says
A lot of students are unaware of these basic facts.


At many colleges, they are deliberately misled to fill the seats. At some, they are deliberately misled to upsell a Master's or PhD later.
26   dr6B   ignore (1)   2018 Jul 10, 4:56pm   ↑ like (1)   ↓ dislike (0)   quote   flag        

TwoScoopsOfWompWomp says
At many colleges, they are deliberately misled to fill the seats.

Misleading starts at high school. They say "follow your dreams" "you can do anything you want" - neither of that is true. Universities typically keep mum about job prospects, and getting any kind of meaningful statistics from them is impossible.
27   dr6B   ignore (1)   2018 Jul 10, 4:57pm   ↑ like (0)   ↓ dislike (0)   quote   flag        

Patrick says
their proposed degree is worth in future earnings potential. Loans which the bank knows are a bad deal should be harder to get.

That leaves out student, who might be dumb and/or lazy. In engineering, ca. 40% drop out in year 1.
28   P N Dr Lo R   ignore (0)   2018 Jul 10, 5:05pm   ↑ like (0)   ↓ dislike (0)   quote   flag        

HeadSet says
Easy access to student loads is the main factor driving up college costs
Just like so many other things that started 50 years ago, this was part and parcel of the Great Society that was going to solve every problem of human existence--the Education Act of 1965:

"Other provisions of the bills included financial aid, scholarships, work study, and library enhancements"
29   SunnyvaleCA   ignore (0)   2018 Jul 10, 5:23pm   ↑ like (2)   ↓ dislike (0)   quote   flag        

Patrick says
A degree in gender studies is worth nothing at all. A lot of students are unaware of these basic facts.


Actually, it's far worse than nothing. It's a black mark against a potential hire. It's like being a community organizer for a living.




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