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1   Patrick   2018 Jul 15, 2:03pm  

Pretty sure that's a bad idea.

The end of the Chinese and Ottoman empires was largely due to opium addiction.

Marijuana is one thing, mostly harmless. Heroin is quite another.
2   curious2   2018 Jul 15, 2:10pm  

The drug "war" hasn't reduced addiction. Similarly, infinite subsidies to rehab modalities that have a 90% failure rate has not reduced fatal overdoses, which are increasing, partly due to infinite subsidies for Oxycontin.

Alcohol is legal, and few if any illegal drugs cause physical dependence more rapidly than SSRIs, which are inifinitely subsidized.

The opium wars happened at a time when many or most Chinese were illiterate and unfamiliar with the consequences of opium. The bigger problem now results from infinitely subsidized deceptive ad campaigns, as drug companies advertise their wares as "not habit forming." (Purdue executives admitted fraud in the case of Oxycontin. FDA ordered SSRI makers to stop saying "not habit forming" after countless adults reported SSRI withdrawal syndrome and hospitals reported neonatal convulsions among other withdrawal symptoms). If people can find and read accurate information, without it getting buried under fraudulent ad campaigns, then forewarned is forearmed.

There isn't currently a good solution to the problem of addiction, other than education/warning and encouraging people to make better choices. You can't save people from themselves. Criminalizing them merely compounds the problem, while "rehab" merely makes it more expensive.
3   Ceffer   2018 Jul 15, 3:55pm  

"And now, another exciting episode of Frozen Tundra Celebrity Rehab!"
4   PeopleUnited   2018 Jul 15, 4:00pm  

curious2 says
The drug "war" hasn't reduced addiction. Similarly, infinite subsidies to rehab modalities that have a 90% failure rate has not reduced fatal overdoses, which are increasing, partly due to infinite subsidies for Oxycontin.

Alcohol is legal, and few if any illegal drugs cause physical dependence more rapidly than SSRIs, which are inifinitely subsidized.

The opium wars happened at a time when many or most Chinese were illiterate and unfamiliar with the consequences of opium. The bigger problem now results from infinitely subsidized deceptive ad campaigns, as drug companies advertise their wares as "not habit forming." (Purdue executives admitted fraud in the case of Oxycontin. FDA ordered SSRI makers to stop saying "not habit forming" after countless adults reported SSRI withdrawal syndrome and hospitals...


There is a difference between dependence and addiction.

Many chronic pain sufferers are dependent on opioids to lead a relatively normal lifestyle. They exhibit drug seeking behavior when they get nervous that their supply may be cut off. But by and large they are not addicts. The average chronic pain patient who uses opioids to control their pain knows how to control their pain without overdosing. In other words they are not using medication recreationally despite the fact that they are dependent on the pain meds to live a normal life. Pain medications are truly a godsend and we should not vilify them for the actions of a small minority who use them inappropriately.
5   mell   2018 Jul 15, 4:52pm  

I'm for the legalization of all drugs on a federal level for adults but for consequent harsh punishment if you break the law on drugs (same as if you weren't) or offer it to minors or in general people who haven't asked for it. I would allow states/municipalities to criminalize it though, should their voters/government decide to do so. I'd assume that considering data at hand addiction will not rise significantly if at all, it may bump in the beginning and then level off or even decrease and we would end most drug-related crimes by offering regulated cheap substances. This is different from a moral go-ahead of course or a declaration of drug use being a human right (although one could make a case for it), but what we had so far failed miserably and it is a practical libertarian approach.
6   Patrick   2018 Jul 15, 6:16pm  

Aphroman says
Would you suggest sticking with the Trumpublicans Failed Loser War on Drugs then?


I definitely would not imprison addicts, except maybe long enough for them to recover, like a month.

But I would definitely imprison major opiate/opioid dealers, like the Sackler family.
7   NuttBoxer   2018 Jul 16, 1:14pm  

'Bout time. The more countries legalize, the stupider the US will look for their racist War on Us. Just ask Mary Juana!
8   Shaman   2018 Jul 16, 1:45pm  

Ok so what’s worse: addicts running about getting high on Reefer Madness or criminal gangs who supply them and create blight and violent crime?

For sure opioids are a problem, but more people overdose because of inconsistent concentrations or addition of fentanyl than because they want to die. We wouldn’t tolerate a pharmacist who makes up deadly drugs, so why should we let low life criminals be the pharmacists for so many millions of drug using Americans?

In California weed is now legal. That means I can walk into a clinic and get a safe supply of flower that has no harmful additives like shrooms or LSD or fucking arsenic that some hateful or malicious criminal might add to a blunt they sell on the street. If this matters with an incredibly safe drug like marijuana, how much more does it matter with a potentially deadly drug like heroin?
9   RWSGFY   2018 Jul 16, 2:14pm  

Canada desperately wants to become a shithole.
10   Shaman   2018 Jul 16, 4:15pm  

You want weed legal or illegal? Make up your mind Aphidman.
11   Ceffer   2018 Jul 17, 8:48am  

Drug abusers are a race now?

Evolution is a marvelous thing.
12   Patrick   2018 Jul 17, 8:49am  

"To get rid of racism, stop talking about it."

--Morgan Freeman
13   Onvacation   2018 Jul 17, 8:53am  

Patrick says

Marijuana is one thing, mostly harmless. Heroin is quite another.

If heroin were legal would you try it? I wouldn't.
I have read that the worst part of heroin addiction is the fact that is illegal and you have to pay exorbitant prices for dangerous crap.
Decriminalize all drugs and let crack hoes give presentations on high school career day. That will scare the kids straight.
14   Onvacation   2018 Jul 17, 9:11am  

Aphroman says

Would you suggest sticking with the Trumpublicans Failed Loser War on Drugs then?

Trump did not start the failed war on drugs. Unfortunately he probably wont stop it. A self proclaimed teetotaler Trump is heavily addicted to caffeine in the form of diet coke.

Addiction and its consequences can be horrendous; witness the junkies shooting up openly in SF. Much of the horror is caused be the illegality of the substances some poor souls find necessary to maintain their daily life.

Diet Coke addicts have no problem with supply. Meth heads have to buy poison that rots their teeth and causes boils on their skin.

Stop the war.
15   Ceffer   2018 Jul 17, 9:44am  

I didn't know Trump was a caffeine head. That explains the hair.
16   NuttBoxer   2018 Jul 17, 10:45am  

Quigley says
In California weed is now legal. That means I can walk into a clinic and get a safe supply of flower that has no harmful additives


This is patently false. I have yet to find a dispensary where the workers have any real knowledge of cannabis that goes beyond the typical stoner. Testing is rarely done, and when it is, it's for THC content, not for mold or non-organic compounds. The industry is still largely for profit, and will remain that way until consumers demand more than high THC.
17   NuttBoxer   2018 Jul 17, 10:49am  

Ceffer says
Drug abusers are a race now?


No. My reference to Mary Juana was to WRH and others enacting the first drug laws in response to Mexicans entering our country. Yes, industrial hemp was also a big part of it, but the slang name was to sow fears among the population about invading hoardes destroying our country with their pot.

Wait! Using illegal immigrant propaganda to scare people into shit they would never otherwise agree to... This sounds familiar...
18   Patrick   2018 Jul 17, 6:38pm  

Aphroman says
Patrick says
"To get rid of racism, stop talking about it."

--Morgan Freeman


Does this apply to James Damore? If he would just stfu about anti diversity, would it go away?


To say James Damore is "anti-diversity" is to prove one has not actually read the memo that got him fired.
19   mell   2018 Jul 18, 10:29am  

Onvacation says
Trump did not start the failed war on drugs. Unfortunately he probably wont stop it. A self proclaimed teetotaler Trump is heavily addicted to caffeine in the form of diet coke.


Trump already signaledhe will not stand in the way and treat it as a states rights issue which it should be - if communities can completely outlaw smoking tobacco they should be able to outlaw weed (or everything should be legal and communities and states have no rights to overturn). It's up to congress to pass legislation, Trump will sign it.
20   HeadSet   2018 Jul 22, 8:31pm  

Marijuana is one thing, mostly harmless

Hmm, no such thing as a burnout? Memory loss and lack of ambition are part of harmless? Compared to meth, maybe. Using that logic, I guess tobacco and alcohol are "harmless" as well.

Maybe we will soon hear about pot being the new miracle cure drug. Don't get me wrong, I believe the Constitution's Article 10 grants each state the ability to legalize any recreational drug. Recreational drug use may be a right, but it ain't harmless.
21   HeadSet   2018 Jul 22, 8:37pm  

Patrick says
"To get rid of racism, stop talking about it."

--Morgan Freeman


Morgan Freeman is correct. But do not expect "racism" to go away, as there is too much to be gained from victimhood. Expect "racism" to be defined down to the level of any activity or action that has even a paltry negative effect on a non-white, regardless of intent.
22   Patrick   2018 Jul 22, 9:03pm  

HeadSet says
But do not expect "racism" to go away, as there is too much to be gained from victimhood.


Yes, there is a whole victimization industry now, and entire departments at universities. The funding depends on finding, creating, or imagining victims.

Aphroman says
If he would just stfu about racism and sexism against white males, would it go away?


@aphroman The racism and sexism against white males is due to black people and women being encouraged by the victimization industry to discriminate against them.
23   Patrick   2018 Jul 23, 7:34am  

Aphroman says
For what reason are you unwilling to discuss my question?

How would we get rid of racism simply by stopping talking about it?

Can this work for any other issues, or for everything else is it better to always tell the truth?



Quoi? We are discussing it.

The continuous harping on ancient history inflames current tensions for the benefit of no one but the victimization industry. As Morgan Freeman points out, if you stop talking about it, you stop the inflammation.

This could perhaps work for some other issues. The truth is great, but it is not always necessary or wise to say everything that pops into your head. Maybe your wife's new dress is awful, and that's the truth, but better left unsaid.

God, grant me the serenity to accept the things I cannot change,
Courage to change the things I can,
And wisdom to know the difference.
24   NuttBoxer   2018 Jul 23, 9:37am  

Patrick says
The continuous harping on ancient history inflames current tensions for the benefit of no one but the victimization industry.


Not everyone is aware of the history of illegal drug laws. There is a large amount of propaganda and dis-information out there that lead people to believe it's all about saving the children, and that smoking cannabis will make you kill your mother with a frying pan.

There's a difference between harping and reminding/informing people of the history on a subject. And out of all the MANY ways racism is constantly thrown in our faces, the War on Us isn't really one of them.
26   NuttBoxer   2018 Jul 25, 11:50am  

Hassan_Rouhani says
that smoking cannabis will make you kill your mother with a frying pan.


With a knife, not a frying pan


I was referencing the classic Reefer Madness.

I'm gonna guess the knife guy has some psychological issues. I'm a fairly stable guy, but I still won't smoke if I'm in a bad place. His inability to make a safe choice was the root cause, not cannabis.

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