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15   LeonDurham   ignore (0)   2018 Jul 16, 9:14am   ↑ like (0)   ↓ dislike (0)   quote   flag        

CovfefeButDeadly says
t’s absolutely a lie due to what the statement ignores and omits. Mr Magic’s verifiable facts delineate why.


No, Mr. Magic has posted no relevant facts. That's why I don't bother responding to him.

The fact is that Trump's tax breaks are greatly skewed to the rich. They benefit proportionally more than the other taxpayers.

The only false propaganda is being spread by you. Well, you and Magic.
16   CovfefeButDeadly   ignore (4)   2018 Jul 16, 9:49am   ↑ like (0)   ↓ dislike (0)   quote   flag        

LeonDurham says
CovfefeButDeadly says
t’s absolutely a lie due to what the statement ignores and omits. Mr Magic’s verifiable facts delineate why.


No, Mr. Magic has posted no relevant facts. That's why I don't bother responding to him.

The fact is that Trump's tax breaks are greatly skewed to the rich. They benefit proportionally more than the other taxpayers.

The only false propaganda is being spread by you. Well, you and Magic.


How is it they benefit rich taxpayers? IE what is the basis upon which the rich receive a greater benefit?
17   HEYYOU   ignore (20)   2018 Jul 16, 10:00am   ↑ like (0)   ↓ dislike (0)   quote   flag        

Mueller's not finished.

Just saw Trump & Putin.Trump is still talking about how he won/beat Clinton & "There was no collusion."
Trump is scared to death of Mueller's evidence?
Trump doesn't have to collude to investigate Russia's collusion with others,collusion can lead to criminal acts.So once again President Coward is saying things he can't back up. Normal Rep/Con shit talking.
Trump kept the queen waiting 15 minutes,Putin kept Trump waiting 1 hour. Funny stuff!
Of course Trump will wait for his boss,who's military attacked America's election.
"None Dare call it Treason"

CovfefeButDeadly says
“Trumps tax breaks are for the rich” is a monstrous propaganda lie due to its omission of tax breaks for the middle class(that are proportionally large) and its ignorance of the fact that poor and lower middle class families don’t pay federal income tax.

A tax increase on one is a tax increase.
Trump raised taxes on ~ 7,000,000.
I'm wrong again!
His tariffs/taxes raised prices for everyone. There goes a lot of income tax breaks.
Redistribution Socialist will get one's money one way or the other.
Does he have the balls to raise tariffs on China another $500,000,000,000?
Americans will pay for it.

.....

Brainwashed,Liberals & Conservatives are what made America what it is,a political fubar.
Everyone applaud your side,your ignorance is awesome.
18   LeonDurham   ignore (0)   2018 Jul 16, 10:08am   ↑ like (0)   ↓ dislike (0)   quote   flag        

CovfefeButDeadly says
How is it they benefit rich taxpayers? IE what is the basis upon which the rich receive a greater benefit?


Here is some reading material for you:

https://itep.org/finalgop-trumpbill/





19   Quigley   ignore (0)   2018 Jul 16, 10:35am   ↑ like (1)   ↓ dislike (0)   quote   flag        

That second chart is a factual lie. The tax cut EXPIRES in 2027. It doesn’t raise taxes then on middle class. It just stops lowering taxes then! I’m sure that’s in there as incentive to keep on hiring MAGA people for government so our taxes won’t go up like they did when the W tax break expired and we all paid a lot more in taxes under Obama’s reign of terror. Even though he promised our taxes wouldn’t go up unless we made over $250k! I sure paid a lot more. I don’t think I got a refund for like six years. In fact I had to pay extra in April.

When I get my taxes done next April, I bet I get a refund.
20   CovfefeButDeadly   ignore (4)   2018 Jul 16, 10:51am   ↑ like (0)   ↓ dislike (0)   quote   flag        

what do you omit information?
21   CovfefeButDeadly   ignore (4)   2018 Jul 16, 10:54am   ↑ like (2)   ↓ dislike (0)   quote   flag        

I received a tax cut that amounts to appx 20%. I am middle class.

How’s that for a factual basis?
22   Lorinaught   ignore (0)   2018 Jul 16, 11:06am   ↑ like (0)   ↓ dislike (1)   quote   flag        

I watched today as Donald Trump stood next to a KGB agent and attacked the United States. Strangely enough he attacked institutions Trump was technically in charge of. The way I see it, you can love your country or you can love Donald Trump but you cant do both.
23   LeonDurham   ignore (0)   2018 Jul 16, 11:16am   ↑ like (1)   ↓ dislike (0)   quote   flag        

CovfefeButDeadly says
I received a tax cut that amounts to appx 20%. I am middle class.

How’s that for a factual basis?


That's called an anecdote. It's not data.

And you haven't paid your 2018 taxes yet, so not sure how you know what your cut will be.
24   LeonDurham   ignore (0)   2018 Jul 16, 11:21am   ↑ like (0)   ↓ dislike (0)   quote   flag        

Quigley says
That second chart is a factual lie.


It's amazing that people can post on here with such veracity but clearly have no idea what they're talking about. The study that those charts come from was clearly linked so anyone who had questions about the data would be easily able to dig in and learn.

Yet the poster obviously didn't feel the need to spend the 2 minutes necessary to answer their question, but instead assumed they were correct.

Quigley says
he tax cut EXPIRES in 2027


No, parts of the cut expire in 2025, parts are permanent. This is by design and IS part of the law.
25   MrMagic   ignore (11)   2018 Jul 16, 11:32am   ↑ like (0)   ↓ dislike (0)   quote   flag        

LeonDurham says
https://itep.org/finalgop-trumpbill/


LeonDurham says
It's amazing that people can post on here with such veracity but clearly have no idea what they're talking about. The study that those charts come from was clearly linked so anyone who had questions about the data would be easily able to dig in and learn.


Yep... linked.... and learned...

So, what do we know about The Institute on Taxation and Economic Policy:

...."ITEP, as well as the associated Citizens for Tax Justice, has been characterized as liberal.[16][17][18]"
...."Like BTC, ITEP is a left-wing research institution."



Ahhh Geez, please stop linking and quoting known lefty, liberal, data sources... It's destroys all credibility.
26   LeonDurham   ignore (0)   2018 Jul 16, 11:35am   ↑ like (0)   ↓ dislike (0)   quote   flag        

MrMagic says
Ahhh Geez, please stop linking and quoting known lefty, liberal, data sources... It's destroys all credibility.


So, I'm assuming you can show where this liberal leaning institution has misrepresented the facts? Please show their errors.
27   MrMagic   ignore (11)   2018 Jul 16, 11:39am   ↑ like (1)   ↓ dislike (0)   quote   flag        

LeonDurham says
So, I'm assuming you can show where this liberal leaning institution has misrepresented the facts?


Sure, as soon as you answer the dozen or two questions posed to you in the above thread.
28   MrMagic   ignore (11)   2018 Jul 16, 11:47am   ↑ like (1)   ↓ dislike (0)   quote   flag        

LeonDurham says
No, Mr. Magic has posted no relevant facts. That's why I don't bother responding to him.


Just facts that blow up the Liberal narrative.


LeonDurham says
The fact is that Trump's tax breaks are greatly skewed to the rich. They benefit proportionally more than the other taxpayers.


It's because they PAY more proportional amounts of the taxes in the country. We've been over this again, and again, and again.

Who would benefit more from a reduction in federal taxes due, a McDonalds worker or a V.P. of Sales at a big corporation?



Common sense would tell MOST people that if a 5% tax reduction was passed on income, higher income people would get a bigger benefit from it, because they pay the MOST in taxes.

Why is that such a difficult math concept?
29   LeonDurham   ignore (0)   2018 Jul 16, 12:42pm   ↑ like (0)   ↓ dislike (0)   quote   flag        

MrMagic says
Common sense would tell MOST people that if a 5% tax reduction was passed on income, higher income people would get a bigger benefit from it, because they pay the MOST in taxes.

Why is that such a difficult math concept?


Except that the top 1% is getting a more than proportional savings and the rest is getting less than proportional.

As the chart I posted shows.
31   MrMagic   ignore (11)   2018 Jul 16, 2:49pm   ↑ like (1)   ↓ dislike (1)   quote   flag        

LeonDurham says
As the chart I posted shows.


MrMagic says
Ahhh Geez, please stop linking and quoting known lefty, liberal, data sources... It's destroys all credibility.


Try posting FACTS from a NON Liberal, lefty, partisan knowledgeable tax site, then we'll consider it.

After all these years, the Liberals still haven't learned, when you use a known Lefty, radial Liberal source to support a Democrat narrative, you've already lost the argument.
32   LeonDurham   ignore (0)   2018 Jul 16, 4:20pm   ↑ like (1)   ↓ dislike (0)   quote   flag        

MrMagic says
Try posting FACTS from a NON Liberal, lefty, partisan knowledgeable tax site, then we'll consider it.


A fact is a fact no matter who posts it.

The lengths Trump supporters go to in order to denial reality is nothing short of ridiculous.
33   FortWayne   ignore (2)   2018 Jul 16, 4:24pm   ↑ like (2)   ↓ dislike (0)   quote   flag        

Trump is doing great. Left is suffering from TDS, constantly bashing him... sorry bunch of losers.
35   MrMagic   ignore (11)   2018 Jul 16, 6:18pm   ↑ like (1)   ↓ dislike (0)   quote   flag        

LeonDurham says
A fact is a fact no matter who posts it.


Is that what we get daily from WaPo, NYT, CNN, MSNBC, NPR, ABC, CBS, NBC, not to mention Bill Maher, Stephen Colbert, The View, etc.???

The FACTS??
36   CovfefeButDeadly   ignore (4)   2018 Jul 16, 6:21pm   ↑ like (1)   ↓ dislike (0)   quote   flag        

MrMagic says
LeonDurham says
A fact is a fact no matter who posts it.


Is that what we get daily from WaPo, NYT, CNN, MSNBC, NPR, ABC, CBS, NBC, not to mention Bill Maher, Stephen Colbert, The View, etc.???

The FACTS??


Well from them we get a twist on the facts, much like Leon's postings in this thread that omit and ignore "pesky" facts that shed a different light on his/her position.
37   LeonDurham   ignore (0)   2018 Jul 16, 6:49pm   ↑ like (0)   ↓ dislike (0)   quote   flag        

MrMagic says
Is that what we get daily from WaPo, NYT, CNN, MSNBC, NPR, ABC, CBS, NBC, not to mention Bill Maher, Stephen Colbert, The View, etc.???

The FACTS??


You have to be more specific. Most print media outlets contain factual stories and opinion pieces. I would hope you could distinguish between them.
38   LeonDurham   ignore (0)   2018 Jul 16, 6:53pm   ↑ like (0)   ↓ dislike (0)   quote   flag        

CovfefeButDeadly says

Well from them we get a twist on the facts, much like Leon's postings in this thread that omit and ignore "pesky" facts that shed a different light on his/her position.


Nope. I don't ignore, just correct.
40   APHAman   ignore (8)   2018 Jul 16, 9:08pm   ↑ like (0)   ↓ dislike (0)   quote   flag        

Heraclitusstudent says


That sums it up quite nicely

There’s at least two sides to every story.

The side that tends towards voting Democrat, maybe watches CNN, thinks Trump is an asshole. They don’t like what he stands for. I can see how that comes to fruition. It’s an easy sell

The other side that votes Republican, likes Breitbart and Foxnews, thinks Trump is beyond reproach. They can literally excuse away anything and everything about Trump. To the point that they fight and argue that they know for certain that Trump dinndu nuffin, miffs me. How can you know anything about Trump and not at least leave the door open to possibility that he’s broken some rules and laws? Everything is Fake News? I don’t get it. I don’t understand the desire to idolized Trump, and the strange motherly protection the Trump cucks blanket over poor victim Trump. He likes them and they like him and that’s all that matters. It’s like a POS Mom defending her POS alcoholic deadbeat son, who can do no wrong, every time he does wrong. Gaslighting endlessly, unrelenting whataboutisms.

I guess it might just be as simple as the cartoon. He drives libruls nuts and that’s good enough for me!
42   WookieMan   ignore (0)   2018 Jul 17, 8:10am   ↑ like (1)   ↓ dislike (0)   quote   flag        

@Patrick - I recall in the past there was a way to see different aliases if a user changed their name. Anyway to reimplement that? Not going to point out specific people, but I can identify at least 4 in this thread that have changed their username multiple times. Not sure why that would be necessary. Been enjoying my summer and not spending a lot of time here, but when I come back and everyone has different names it's a little confusing.

Regarding the OP. The tax situation is way more complicated then people even understand. Certain rich people will enjoy a nice windfall come tax time. Others (IL, CA, NJ, NY, etc) will take a beating if they're high income and high property tax individuals. The intent of certain portions of the tax bill was to hurt certain high income people, in specific blue states to get them to flip to the other side. There's nothing else to this. The rich in the blue states will make up a lot of the reduced tax revenue for those that got cuts.
43   LeonDurham   ignore (0)   2018 Jul 17, 8:39am   ↑ like (0)   ↓ dislike (0)   quote   flag        

WookieMan says
There's nothing else to this.


No, that's wrong. There is much more to the tax law than that.
44   CBOEtrader   ignore (2)   2018 Jul 17, 8:48am   ↑ like (0)   ↓ dislike (0)   quote   flag        

LeonDurham says
CovfefeButDeadly says
You are welcome to respond as long as it’s not a non sequitar. In the meantime you should probably stop mouthing off with the lie that Trumps tax cut is for the wealthy.


No, that's a fact.

https://qz.com/1066112/trump-tax-reform-most-of-donald-trumps-proposed-tax-cuts-would-go-to-wealthy-households/

While some non-rich do get a small break from the Trump tax cuts, the VAST majority is going to the wealthy.


By the same logic, ending communism would benefit the rich more than the poor. Accept the facts, eh comrade?
45   Patrick   ignore (0)   2018 Jul 17, 8:52am   ↑ like (0)   ↓ dislike (0)   quote   flag        

WookieMan says
I recall in the past there was a way to see different aliases if a user changed their name. Anyway to reimplement that?


The idea for getting rid of it was to get people to read past the username and actually look at the point the user is making.

Maybe it should be possible, but slightly difficult?
46   LeonDurham   ignore (0)   2018 Jul 17, 9:16am   ↑ like (0)   ↓ dislike (0)   quote   flag        

CBOEtrader says
By the same logic, ending communism would benefit the rich more than the poor. Accept the facts, eh comrade?


Not sure what "the same logic" is. In true communism there is no rich and no poor, so your point is moot.

But, regardless, nobody is proposing Communism so who cares?
47   WookieMan   ignore (0)   2018 Jul 17, 9:52am   ↑ like (0)   ↓ dislike (0)   quote   flag        

LeonDurham says
No, that's wrong. There is much more to the tax law than that.


How so? Feel free to point out how the wealthy in the states I list won't pay more in federal income taxes. I'm not talking about people making $150k either. More then that. The wealthy in blue states (high income and property tax ones) are going to take a bath most likely when filing in early 2019. It's a drop in the bucket for most of them, but many will pay more due to the $10k cap. This isn't wrong and if it is, show me the way (Frampton).
48   LeonDurham   ignore (0)   2018 Jul 17, 9:58am   ↑ like (0)   ↓ dislike (0)   quote   flag        

WookieMan says
How so? Feel free to point out how the wealthy in the states I list won't pay more in federal income taxes. I'm not talking about people making $150k either. More then that. The wealthy in blue states (high income and property tax ones) are going to take a bath most likely when filing in early 2019. It's a drop in the bucket for most of them, but many will pay more due to the $10k cap. This isn't wrong and if it is, show me the way (Frampton).


What you say isn't wrong, it's incomplete. Implying that's all the law does is what I say isn't correct. The law does much more than just penalize blue states (many of which have already designed their own workarounds). The law basically borrows $84T from future generations and gives it to the top 1%.
49   WookieMan   ignore (0)   2018 Jul 17, 9:58am   ↑ like (0)   ↓ dislike (0)   quote   flag        

Patrick says
The idea for getting rid of it was to get people to read past the username and actually look at the point the user is making.


Totally understand and get the motive behind it. Problem is that when you put someone on ignore and they come back with a different username (email as well) it sometimes can be hard to identify the person. There's a reason they were put on ignore. There's no perfect solution obviously, but the fact people need/want to change their usernames speaks volumes to that type of person.

If you can't stand behind your history of posting here, then you probably have bigger problems. I tend to try and avoid those types of people. It's generally anonymous after all here, so I just don't get it.
50   LeonDurham   ignore (0)   2018 Jul 17, 10:46am   ↑ like (1)   ↓ dislike (0)   quote   flag        

WookieMan says
@Patrick - I recall in the past there was a way to see different aliases if a user changed their name. Anyway to reimplement that? Not going to point out specific people, but I can identify at least 4 in this thread that have changed their username multiple times. Not sure why that would be necessary. Been enjoying my summer and not spending a lot of time here, but when I come back and everyone has different names it's a little confusing.


I'll chime in--I have changed usernames. Once I forgot the password to the email account it was tied to because I no longer used it so I just created a new user here. After that, I created new users because moderators kept stifling free speech and killing my posts because I dared speak the truth about the moderators.
52   lostand confused   ignore (0)   2018 Jul 17, 8:13pm   ↑ like (0)   ↓ dislike (0)   quote   flag        

WookieMan says
The rich in the blue states will make up a lot of the reduced tax revenue for those that got cuts

But isn't that what blue states have been saying-rich have to apy their fair share?
53   gsr   ignore (0)   2018 Jul 17, 9:45pm   ↑ like (1)   ↓ dislike (0)   quote   flag        

"America first!" LOL!
More like "My ass first, and Putin owns it".
54   RafiMaas   ignore (0)   2018 Jul 18, 6:22am   ↑ like (0)   ↓ dislike (0)   quote   flag        

lostand confused says
WookieMan says
The rich in the blue states will make up a lot of the reduced tax revenue for those that got cuts

But isn't that what blue states have been saying-rich have to apy their fair share?


Im pretty sure they meant the rich in all of the states .... not just the blue states.

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