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26   LeonDurham   ignore (0)   2018 Oct 12, 5:25pm   ↑ like (0)   ↓ dislike (0)   quote   flag        

TwoScoopsOfSpaceForce says
Uh, Saudi Arabia embarked on a pretty aggressive reform plan starting a couple of years ago.


lol--you fell for the typical political theater. It's OK, you'll learn how these things work eventually.
27   TwoScoopsOfSpaceForce   ignore (4)   2018 Oct 12, 5:27pm   ↑ like (0)   ↓ dislike (0)   quote   flag        

LeonDurham says
lol--you fell for the typical political theater. It's OK, you'll learn how these things work eventually.


LOL - You fell for typical Political Theater. You don't understand that the Iran Deal and the Saudi Support for Trump and Criticism for the intervention against Shi'a Jihadis in Yemen and Erdogan's new pals in ISIS are all inter-related.

Now, you probably think Saudi Arabia should allow Burka-free living and legalize Gay Marriage all in one fell swoop tomorrow by 10AM, but you've never heard of reaction when you impose something people aren't ready for.
28   LeonDurham   ignore (0)   2018 Oct 12, 5:39pm   ↑ like (1)   ↓ dislike (0)   quote   flag        

TwoScoopsOfSpaceForce says
Now, you probably think Saudi Arabia should allow Burka-free living and legalize Gay Marriage all in one fell swoop tomorrow by 10AM, but you've never heard of reaction when you impose something people aren't ready for.


How about we start with no State sponsored murder of pro-reform journalists? Is that too much to ask?
29   LeonDurham   ignore (0)   2018 Oct 12, 5:39pm   ↑ like (0)   ↓ dislike (1)   quote        

anti_forum
30   LeonDurham   ignore (0)   2018 Oct 12, 5:42pm   ↑ like (0)   ↓ dislike (1)   quote        

anti_forum
31   TwoScoopsOfSpaceForce   ignore (4)   2018 Oct 12, 5:43pm   ↑ like (0)   ↓ dislike (0)   quote   flag        

LeonDurham says
How about we start with no State sponsored murder of pro-reform journalists? Is that too much to ask?


How about we start with Khashoggi with OBL?

This looks like a Tough "Democratic Reformer's" Piece: "Arab Youths Fight Shoulder to Shoulder with Mujahadeen" by Jamal Khashoggi


He's the tall guy in the middle smiling between Jihadis, cradling the Democratic Reformist Journalist's favorite unbiased journalist tool, the RPG.

33   TwoScoopsOfSpaceForce   ignore (4)   2018 Oct 12, 5:58pm   ↑ like (1)   ↓ dislike (0)   quote   flag        



The book, The Looming Tower, was published in 2006 and is about the history of Al Qaeda. This is the segment where Khashoogis friendship with OBL is discussed.

Khashoogi was sent by the bin Laden Clan, with the blessing of the Saudi Government, that if he renounced violence he could "come home". This is before 9/11, of course.

His duties as an "Envoy" to offer OBL a chance to return to Saudi Arabia if he helped distance the Kingdom from Jihadi VIolence was because he was a regime insider at the time. Not a "Democratic Reformer".

This should dispense with the bullshit that Saudis and Don Jr. are "Smearing" Khashoogi.
34   TwoScoopsOfSpaceForce   ignore (4)   2018 Oct 12, 6:04pm   ↑ like (0)   ↓ dislike (0)   quote   flag        

Khashoogi joined the Muslim Brotherhood in the 1970s.
He was a personal friend of Osama Bin Laden, and many other "Saudi Dissidents", many of whom were "Reformers" of the Religious Kind (ie Islamists)
He never criticized Erdogan, who shut down countless media outfits and imprisoned journalists, at any point.
He has heavily criticized MBS, of course.
He recently praised the Muslim Brotherhood as a WaPo Employee
He backed "Moderate Rebels" in Syria, many of which are AQ/MB affiliates.
His best friend in Turkey is part of the Turkish Branch of the MB called AKP. It was that man who told his girlfriend to call the authorities is Kashoogi did not 'emerge from the Embassy'.
35   LeonDurham   ignore (0)   2018 Oct 12, 7:49pm   ↑ like (0)   ↓ dislike (0)   quote   flag        

lol at whoever marked my last comment personal.

@Patrick--can you share what was personal about it?
36   LeonDurham   ignore (0)   2018 Oct 12, 7:50pm   ↑ like (1)   ↓ dislike (0)   quote   flag        

MBS had a pro-reform journalist murdered.
37   Patrick   ignore (1)   2018 Oct 12, 9:04pm   ↑ like (0)   ↓ dislike (0)   quote   flag        

http://www.chicagotribune.com/news/nationworld/ct-jamal-khashoggi-investigation-20181011-story.html

The Turkish government has told U.S. officials that it has audio and video recordings that prove Washington Post columnist Jamal Khashoggi was killed inside the Saudi consulate in Istanbul this month, according to U.S. and Turkish officials.

The recordings show that a Saudi security team detained Khashoggi in the consulate after he walked in on Oct. 2 to obtain an official document before his upcoming wedding, then killed him and dismembered his body, the officials said.

The audio recording in particular provides some of the most persuasive and gruesome evidence that the Saudi team is responsible for Khashoggi's death, the officials said.
38   TwoScoopsOfSpaceForce   ignore (4)   2018 Oct 12, 10:32pm   ↑ like (0)   ↓ dislike (0)   quote   flag        

Turkey released the Pastor that was in prison today. Strange timings.
39   TwoScoopsOfSpaceForce   ignore (4)   2018 Oct 12, 11:10pm   ↑ like (0)   ↓ dislike (0)   quote   flag        

When was the last time the US Media gave a shit about RIsen or anybody else Obama pursued with the Whistleblower Act?

When was the last time large and influential Media and Financial companies boycotted a Saudi Arabian Conference based on an allegation?

https://www.aljazeera.com/news/2018/10/khashoggi-disappearance-media-companies-pull-saudi-event-181012143101742.html

Why now? Why this incident? The US Press hardly mentioned all the years Saudi Arabia was a big wig in the UNHRC, the teenage Shi'a activists they executed, etc. At best a soft sigh and mild criticism with assurance the country was reforming. Now actual groundbreaking reform confirmed by on the ground evidence is being dismissed, and criticism is bold and heavy.

My suspicion: the Sauds and Trump have a deal to do reform Globalist Institutions. WTO, GATT, etc. This is a plot to weaken Saudi's influence ahead of that.

Be very skeptical.
40   APOCALYPSEFUCKisShostikovitch   ignore (35)   2018 Oct 13, 1:01am   ↑ like (0)   ↓ dislike (0)   quote   flag        

Trump should pick up the phone and have this Woodward guy given the bone saw treatment for disrespecting the Plenipotentiary.
41   APHAman   ignore (8)   2018 Oct 13, 6:31am   ↑ like (0)   ↓ dislike (0)   quote   flag        

Strategist says
bob2356 says
Meet the new boss, same as the old boss. Nice to see the new reformed KSA is working out so well. . Yep those 15 saudi military guys that flew in and out the day he disappeared were just on quick sight seeing trip.


Look Bob, I trust Trump to deal with the Islamic threat. I never trusted Obama to do the same. It's as simple as that.


42   APHAman   ignore (8)   2018 Oct 13, 6:33am   ↑ like (0)   ↓ dislike (0)   quote   flag        

TwoScoopsOfSpaceForce says
.bob2356 says
Meet the new boss, same as the old boss. Nice to see the new reformed KSA is working out so well. . Yep those 15 saudi military guys that flew in and out the day he disappeared were just on quick sight seeing trip. Can't wait to see the televised be headings of the campaigners for women's rights.


Tell me about the sanctions the Obama administration imposed on the KSA. Oh, and did Hillary give all the Saudi campaign donations back? Or to the Clinton Foundation?

Asking for a friend.


So you’re agreeing with him. Meet the new boss, same as the old boss
43   APHAman   ignore (8)   2018 Oct 13, 6:34am   ↑ like (0)   ↓ dislike (0)   quote   flag        

LeonDurham says
personal


Mr. Whataboutism strikes again

Is censored as a personal attack

Lol @Patrick is this what your site is about now?
44   APHAman   ignore (8)   2018 Oct 13, 6:39am   ↑ like (0)   ↓ dislike (0)   quote   flag        

LeonDurham says
personal


What are you talking about? Nobody brought up Obama under your usual bit of whataboutism.


This is what you hired a team of far right wingers mods to censor from your site @Patrick?

In the name of keeping it Safe For Work?? Lmao

The same site where these same far right wingers regularly called Obama a Nigger and throw around the word Faggot?

I don’t give a fuck about PC, but I’d fire any of my employees in a heartbeat if they were seen tossing around nigger and faggot, simply because I’m a good American Capitalist and that shit is bad for business. Not nearly as bad as a once Free Speech site with liberal audience and tendencies hiring all far right wing moderators to chase off all the value adding participants, but you’re obviously not in this for the money
45   APHAman   ignore (8)   2018 Oct 13, 7:07am   ↑ like (0)   ↓ dislike (0)   quote   flag        

Patrick says
My greatest disappointment with Trump is that he does not call out the Saudis for their lack of democracy, lack of freedom of speech, lack of freedom of religion, etc etc.

Their leverage over our government is that they own a significant fraction of US Treasuries and price their oil in US dollars. They could sell the Treasuries, which would force interest rates upward. And they could choose to price their oil in some other currency, making other countries less dependent on dollars and weakening US economic power abroad.

But these are risks worth taking in defense of basic human rights.


So let’s update the Jeb Bush presidency i mean Trump.

Tax cuts
Supreme Court
Saudi Arabia

GOPe Jeb Bush presidency looks just like Donald Trump

Oh yea, and HeritageFoundationCare is still in tact, even though Republicans pretended to complain about it like they’d actually repeal and replace their own policy
46   LeonDurham   ignore (0)   2018 Oct 13, 7:56am   ↑ like (0)   ↓ dislike (0)   quote   flag        

TwoScoopsOfSpaceForce says
When was the last time the US Media gave a shit about RIsen or anybody else Obama pursued with the Whistleblower Act?


Is it possible to talk about Trump's flaws without referencing Obama?

Asking for a friend.
48   FortWayneIndiana   ignore (0)   2018 Oct 13, 8:19am   ↑ like (1)   ↓ dislike (0)   quote   flag        

Aphroman says
LeonDurham says
flag


Wow


You you are always a victim.
49   LeonDurham   ignore (0)   2018 Oct 13, 8:26am   ↑ like (0)   ↓ dislike (0)   quote        

anti_forum
50   APHAman   ignore (8)   2018 Oct 13, 10:07am   ↑ like (0)   ↓ dislike (0)   quote   flag        

This is a lesson in censorship. Now I’m intrigued and curious as to exactly what it is that must be censored

We can’t really say the same about all the generic right wing posts that are basically the same back patting nonsense over and over and over again
51   APOCALYPSEFUCKisShostikovitch   ignore (35)   2018 Oct 13, 10:55am   ↑ like (0)   ↓ dislike (0)   quote   flag        

Likely, US intelligence helped plan the execution. This guy had an attitude about Trump, right, working for the WashingtonPost cult of lies and hatred. He was asking for a flick, like all libby cunt slanderers and traitors to the Plenipotentiary.
52   Ceffer   ignore (1)   2018 Oct 13, 11:02am   ↑ like (2)   ↓ dislike (0)   quote   flag        

A codicil to the Patriot Act needs to state that we no longer need to pay for plane tickets to Saudi Arabia to have these twats tortured and killed, Saudi embassies will do.

Why burden GITMO with treacherous scum providing them with free room and board when we have dissident vego-matics in every Saudi consulate and embassy.
53   Patrick   ignore (1)   2018 Oct 13, 11:25am   ↑ like (2)   ↓ dislike (0)   quote   flag        

100% guarantee: if you can stick to the point and not attack the person then that comment will be very welcome and always visible.
54   TwoScoopsOfSpaceForce   ignore (4)   2018 Oct 13, 1:10pm   ↑ like (0)   ↓ dislike (0)   quote   flag        

The source for the Khashoggi was murdered story is this guy, Saffuri.

https://web.archive.org/web/20070911022431/http://findarticles.com/p/articles/mi_m1571/is_2004_March_1/ai_113363777

Saffuri is a "Palestinian Refugee" He was buddies with Abdurahman Alamoudi who is currently serving 23 years in prison for financing the assassination of a Saudi Prince with Islamic Radicals. Alamoudi was Saffuri's former employer at the American Muslim Council.

Saffuri is a Muslim Brotherhood sympathizer, as was Alamoudi, and Khashoggi was also a member dating all the way back to the 70s.

The Taliban are also "Reformers". And just like you can have the US as a Representative Democracy where personal freedoms and mob impulses are protected and restrained by a Constitution, the Muslim Brotherhood is fine with elected governments, so long as they are strictly limited by Sharia Law, which must be supreme. Iran has democratic elements but has a higher religious council and mandates Shar'ia law over any legislature.

Also, one of the two journalists involved in breaking this hit piece/story is Michael Isikoff whose name should ring some bells in Democratic Party circles, who once wrote a book with David Corn blasting Bush and the Iraq War. He's be on Democracy Now!

Finally, Isikoff wrote the Yahoo! News article that the FBI used to justify getting a FISA on Carter Page in Summer 2016.

Anybody think Isikoff is Trump Friendly?
55   TwoScoopsOfSpaceForce   ignore (4)   2018 Oct 13, 1:19pm   ↑ like (0)   ↓ dislike (0)   quote   flag        

LeonDurham says
Is it possible to talk about Trump's flaws without referencing Obama?


I'll compare and contrast the two to my heart's content, thanks. Despite what you think, making comparisons and contrasts isn't automatically whataboutery.
56   APHAman   ignore (8)   2018 Oct 13, 1:23pm   ↑ like (0)   ↓ dislike (0)   quote   flag        

Patrick says
100% guarantee: if you can stick to the point and not attack the person then that comment will be very welcome and always visible.


How can you be transparent about this. With the recent history, it’s impossible for anyone to simply take you at your word. You keep saying you’re all about Free Speech, so how can you (blockchain) prove it?

Maybe have a log/record visible to the public that shines some light on who/what is being censored
57   APHAman   ignore (8)   2018 Oct 13, 1:25pm   ↑ like (0)   ↓ dislike (0)   quote   flag        

TwoScoopsOfSpaceForce says
LeonDurham says
Is it possible to talk about Trump's flaws without referencing Obama?


I'll compare and contrast the two to my heart's content, thanks. Despite what you think, making comparisons and contrasts isn't automatically whataboutery.


Right. However, the claim is that Trump is different. Constantly comparing him to Obama et al, and claiming that he’s only doing what Hillary/Obama does, is arguing contrary to your point: that Trump is different
58   TwoScoopsOfSpaceForce   ignore (4)   2018 Oct 13, 1:32pm   ↑ like (0)   ↓ dislike (0)   quote   flag        

Uncovering more fun stuff.

Guess who Jamal Khashoggi's Uncle is?

Adnan Khashoggi, world famous Arms Dealer worth billions. Songs have been written about his massive yacht.

Read more about the lifestyle of this incredibly Wealthy Arms Dealer
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Adnan_Khashoggi

The Khashoggis are also related by marriage to Hussein bin Talal.
59   TwoScoopsOfSpaceForce   ignore (4)   2018 Oct 13, 1:35pm   ↑ like (0)   ↓ dislike (0)   quote   flag        

Aphroman says
Right. However, the claim is that Trump is different. Constantly comparing him to Obama et al, and claiming that he’s only doing what Hillary/Obama does, is arguing contrary to your point: that Trump is different


When somebody complains that USMCA/NAFTA is not much, it's perfectly legit to point out that the previous President:

1. Campaigned in front of the AFL-CIO and in other Forums on immediately renegotiating NAFTA
2. Did nothing for his entire 8 years,
2b Whcih has nothing to do with Republicans, since the President has the power to (re-)negotiate any Treaty. The Senate's only role is to vote them up or down after they've been negotiated.
60   APHAman   ignore (8)   2018 Oct 13, 2:00pm   ↑ like (0)   ↓ dislike (0)   quote   flag        

TwoScoopsOfSpaceForce says
Aphroman says
Right. However, the claim is that Trump is different. Constantly comparing him to Obama et al, and claiming that he’s only doing what Hillary/Obama does, is arguing contrary to your point: that Trump is different


When somebody complains that USMCA/NAFTA is not much, it's perfectly legit to point out that the previous President:

1. Campaigned in front of the AFL-CIO and in other Forums on immediately renegotiating NAFTA
2. Did nothing for his entire 8 years,
2b Whcih has nothing to do with Republicans, since the President has the power to (re-)negotiate any Treaty. The Senate's only role is to vote them up or down after they've been negotiated.


So why is Trump not protecting our Sovereignty?

The FDA stands with Real Americans in descheduling CBD, rightfully so, our Veterans and sick children need their Plant based medicine. Yet Trumps DEA is siding with foreigners and treaties while leaving our Veterans and kids to suffer unnecessarily.

Care to address my point, or just stick to the usual script of assigning a few phony strawmen?
61   Ceffer   ignore (1)   2018 Oct 13, 2:22pm   ↑ like (1)   ↓ dislike (0)   quote   flag        

Bin Talal paid off Harvard Law to get legend ObamFuck accepted.
62   Gary Anderson   ignore (0)   2018 Oct 13, 2:58pm   ↑ like (0)   ↓ dislike (0)   quote   flag        

Patrick says
My greatest disappointment with Trump is that he does not call out the Saudis for their lack of democracy, lack of freedom of speech, lack of freedom of religion, etc etc.


Patrick:

You are so naive. Saudi Arabia uses Israeli technology. Saudi Arabia is a Zionist state. What do Zionist states care about democracy, or freedom of speech, or freedom of religion?

I warned you, Patrick, to see this all in a Zionist setting. Donald Trump bully's everyone. When have you seen him bully Israel? Won't happen. Read this and weep for your nation and our involvement in the middle east, Patrick:

https://www.presstv.com/Detail/2018/09/21/574734/spyware-saudi-arabia-uae-israel

You really need to take the blinders off, Patrick.
63   TwoScoopsOfSpaceForce   ignore (4)   2018 Oct 13, 6:01pm   ↑ like (0)   ↓ dislike (0)   quote   flag        

Aphroman says
So why is Trump not protecting our Sovereignty?

The FDA stands with Real Americans in descheduling CBD, rightfully so, our Veterans and sick children need their Plant based medicine. Yet Trumps DEA is siding with foreigners and treaties while leaving our Veterans and kids to suffer unnecessarily.

Care to address my point, or just stick to the usual script of assigning a few phony strawmen?


Aphroman, I'm talking about renegotiating NAFTA, something Obama promised multiple times to do, but only Trump actually promised and executed.

You're bringing up drug regulation and enforcement, an entirely separate issue from a continental free trade agreement, so I'm both amused and confused that you're accusing me of "sticking to the script of assigning a few phony strawman" since it's not the topic under discussion.
64   bob2356   ignore (3)   2018 Oct 13, 7:53pm   ↑ like (0)   ↓ dislike (0)   quote   flag        

TwoScoopsOfSpaceForce says

How about we start with Khashoggi with OBL?


OMG a journalist working on a story knew the guy he was doing the story on and even met him. How fucking bizarre is that? No one has ever seen that done before or since. and it happened only 30 short years ago. . ROFLOL. The saudi apologists come up with some really funny shit.
65   bob2356   ignore (3)   2018 Oct 13, 7:56pm   ↑ like (0)   ↓ dislike (0)   quote   flag        

TwoScoopsOfSpaceForce says
The source for the Khashoggi was murdered story is this guy, Saffuri.


Of course he wasn't murdered, he's off cavorting a a brothel some where. Saudi's would never murder anyone. The nerve of people publishing such obviously fake news.

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