« prev   random   next »

2
0

Muslim Brotherhood

By HonkpilledMaster following x   2018 Oct 19, 7:53pm 1,067 views   6 comments   watch   nsfw   quote     share    


By Editorial Board February 9, 2017
THOSE WHO favor the United States designating the Muslim Brotherhood a foreign terrorist organization, a move being considered by the Trump administration and advanced by a few members of Congress, think it will strike a singular blow against violent extremism. But they labor under an illusion. The Muslim Brotherhood is not a single, cohesive unit, but rather a sprawling organization. It does not systematically engage in terrorism, although some parts of it have turned to violence. A blanket designation would be a mistake.

Founded in 1928 in Egypt as a religious, social and political organization, the Muslim Brotherhood has evolved over subsequent decades. After endorsing the use of violence in its early years, the Egyptian branch of the Brotherhood disowned it in the 1970s in exchange for the freedom to organize politically and socially. Following the Arab Spring uprising in Egypt, the Brotherhood moved into politics and one of its members, Mohamed Morsi, was elected president in 2012. His faltering performance led to mass protests, and he was deposed by the military a year later. Gen. Abdel Fatah al-Sissi, now Egypt’s president, has outlawed the Brotherhood, arrested its leaders and members, and pressed hard for Washington to impose the foreign terrorist designation.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/opinions/a-terrorism-label-that-would-hurt-more-than-help/2017/02/09/35978c90-ee35-11e6-b4ff-ac2cf509efe5_story.html?utm_term=.911e49ef66a7

The article goes on. It doesn't mention what happened with the Muslim Brotherhood in early 90s Algeria, and Khashoggi's first attempt at forming a "Democratic Activist Front". Strangely, Algeria and Al Qaeda is not mentioned.

Just so you can see the WP is sympathetic to the Muslim Brotherhood.
1   Strategist   ignore (2)   2018 Oct 19, 8:21pm   ↑ like (3)   ↓ dislike (0)   quote   flag        

TwoScoopsOfSpaceForce says
THOSE WHO favor the United States designating the Muslim Brotherhood a foreign terrorist organization, a move being considered by the Trump administration and advanced by a few members of Congress, think it will strike a singular blow against violent extremism. But they labor under an illusion. The Muslim Brotherhood is not a single, cohesive unit, but rather a sprawling organization. It does not systematically engage in terrorism, although some parts of it have turned to violence. A blanket designation would be a mistake.


Any organization that supports or promotes Islamic values is a major threat to non Muslims anywhere in the world. That includes the screwed up Islamic apologists who preach equality day and night for women, yet fully support Islamic values.
The Muslim brotherhood is no different than other Islamic terrorist organizations that breeds terrorism. That right hand man of Bin Laden, that doctor who was a member of the Muslim brotherhood is the perfect example.
We cannot tolerate any organization that supports Islam and it's values. I'm sorry, but those who do should be jailed for promoting human rights abuse.
2   HonkpilledMaster   ignore (5)   2018 Oct 19, 8:52pm   ↑ like (0)   ↓ dislike (0)   quote   flag        

Strategist says
Any organization that supports or promotes Islamic values is a major threat to non Muslims anywhere in the world. That includes the screwed up Islamic apologists who preach equality day and night for women, yet fully support Islamic values.


Exactly.

Now the above WaPo editorial board piece was early 2017 - just after the Transition of Administrations.

Why would the WaPo want to make excuses for the Muslim Brotherhood?

Obama and Clinton in 2010 then outlined their new and untested approach to Middle East policy in the document titled Presidential Study Directive-11. In an op-ed dated March 6, 2011, David Ignatius with The Washington Post helpfully delves into PSD-11. He writes, "This is the president as global community organizer — a man who believes that change is inevitable and desirable, and that the United States must align itself with the new forces shaping the world."

Obama then announced America's new policy during a global apology tour that U.S. protocol in the Middle East and with the Muslim world would change dramatically.

The United Arab Emirates-based publication, Middle East Briefing, in an analysis of Freedom of Information Act documents and other sources, found that under PSD-11 the State Department would lead an effort to build "civil society" — particularly nongovernmental — organizations to alter the internal politics of targeted countries.

Under PSD-11, the Obama administration deliberately pivoted from a strategy that focused on maintaining stability in the Middle East to a strategy emphasizing U.S. support for regime change — regardless of the impact it might have on the region's stability. That is why we have gone from a general state of stability in the region in 2009 to the Middle East chaos we have now. Officials did not concern themselves with questions over whether new regimes would be allies or foes of the U.S. – or U.S. intelligence agency warnings about the jihadist chaos such regime change might unleash. They chose to believe the few rosy sunglass analyses.

Ignatius referred to intelligence analysts who said at the time, "…Islamic extremists don't seem to be hijacking the process of change." He quotes one intelligence analyst who discounted the threat from the Muslim Brotherhood. The West had previously ostracized the movement over its violent tendencies.

Individuals who reviewed documents released under FOIA concluded that State believed "that the Muslim Brotherhood was a viable movement for the U.S. to support throughout North Africa and the Middle East." As a result, "American diplomats intensified contacts with top Muslim Brotherhood leaders and gave active U.S. support to the organization's drive for power in key nations like Egypt, Libya, Tunisia and Syria…" It represented a major shift in decades long U.S. policy.

In the ensuing months, the Obama-Clinton administration then abandoned Iraq and prioritized promoting regime change in Egypt, Tunisia, Libya, Yemen, Saudi Arabia, Bahrain and Syria above stability in the Middle East. It engaged with the Muslim Brotherhood, al-Qaida elements and other syndicates that it naively considered harmless and erroneously believed would foster democratic reforms.

Today the countries that America deserted or knocked over — Iraq, Yemen, Libya and Syria — are failed states. Tunisia remains a work in progress, and Egypt is slowly recovering from its disastrous experiment with Muslim Brotherhood leadership.

PSD-11 and the resulting decisions based upon it reshaped the Middle East substantially. Its flawed and naive analysis and the policies that sprang from it created conditions that fostered the rapid expansion of Islamist terror, specifically ISIS, and have sent the Middle East into barbaric turmoil.

https://www.washingtonexaminer.com/obama-rolls-dice-on-foreign-policy-in-secretive-presidential-directive
That's where ISIS came from folks. That's how ISIS got into Mosul and all over Iraq, not to mention most of Syria. That's why there is Al Qaeda in the Sinai, and attacks on Copts in Egypt.

Most Political Islamist groups are connected to the Muslim Brotherhood, from Hizbt-al-Tahrir to Al Qaeda to CAIR.

And the State/Intel Establishment connected to the Deep State paper of record (since the 60s at least) Washington Post still thinks Muslim Brotherhood is worthy of support.
3   HonkpilledMaster   ignore (5)   2018 Oct 19, 8:55pm   ↑ like (0)   ↓ dislike (0)   quote   flag        

Trump must criticize the handling of Khashoggi - then declare the Muslim Brotherhood a terrorist organization. No member can immigrate to the US, get a visa, etc.
4   Strategist   ignore (2)   2018 Oct 19, 9:01pm   ↑ like (1)   ↓ dislike (0)   quote   flag        

TwoScoopsOfSpaceForce says
Trump must criticize the handling of Khashoggi - then declare the Muslim Brotherhood a terrorist organization. No member can immigrate to the US, get a visa, etc.


I thought the Muslim Brotherhood was already designated a terrorist organization.
Shame on Obama, and shame on Trump.
5   curious2   ignore (0)   2018 Oct 19, 11:25pm   ↑ like (2)   ↓ dislike (0)   quote   flag        

TwoScoopsOfSpaceForce says
declare the Muslim Brotherhood a terrorist organization. No member can immigrate to the US, get a visa, etc.


That would constitute a good step towards the ban the President campaigned on.

I feel dismayed watching the virtual canonization of Saint Jamal Khashoggi, whitewashing his membership in the Muslim Brotherhood and his support for Hamas among others.

Saint Jamal is portrayed romantically getting a document that he needed in order to get married to his fiancee. Hardly anyone mentions why: "he needed a document to say that he’s divorced his wife in Saudi Arabia, and therefore he will be able to remarry in Turkey." Saudi divorce law follows Sharia: husbands have a unilateral right to divorce, owing only 130 days of support, after which the ex-wife has no right to anything. If more feminists knew this fact, it might curb their enthusiasm for spreading Islam.

Journalists claim Saint Jamal campaigned for free speech, but somehow only in Arab countries and only recently, when his friends were no longer in charge. No one should be tortured, but that guy advocated a doctrine and regime that say gays must be killed in the worst possible way. How can people be shocked when the same thing happens to him? And how can "journalists" call KSA and Pakistan allies and ignore the executions until it happens to a journalist? Did Saint Jamal, or any of these "journalists", demand free speech in Pakistan, where blasphemy is a capital offense? No, and they don't still. If you accept the premise that you cannot criticize the dead charlatan Mohamad (piss be upon him) or his hateful fraud of Islam, then why would you expect to be able to criticize his earthly representatives who enforce his doctrine? Live by the sword of Islam, die by the sword of Islam, and don't complain when what you would do unto others is done unto you.

The worst from America's POV is the emerging fact that the USA and KSA worked hand in glove to promote Islam as a strategic measure against communism. We had seen reports previously about Afghanistan, but the self-destructive strategy was apparently global. MBS told the Washington Post: "Asked about the Saudi-funded spread of Wahhabism, the austere faith that is dominant in the kingdom and that some have accused of being a source of global terrorism, Mohammed said that investments in mosques and madrassas overseas were rooted in the Cold War, when allies asked Saudi Arabia to use its resources to prevent inroads in Muslim countries by the Soviet Union." Others are corroborating that "in addition to the economic importance of Saudi Arabia, the strategic location of Saudi Arabia, the importance of Saudi Arabia to the rest of the Muslim world in the Cold War, Saudi Arabia, and specifically its religious tradition, that is known to everybody as the Wahhabi tradition, was a very convenient ideology to counter, for example, anti-imperialist ideologies in the 1960s, Arab nationalism and also socialism. So, Islamic fundamentalism was promoted by Saudi Arabia in cooperation with the United States as a counterstrategy to all those threatening forces in the world at the time, from the perspective of both the U.S. and Saudi Arabia." CIA took pride in using jihadis against the USSR in Afghanistan, and a former acting DCI (who came out of retirement to do everything he could to get Hillary elected) suggested doing the same in Syria. The whole thing reminds me of when people thought Hitler and the Nazis would be useful against communism. Some people value property more than anything, and thus fear communism/socialism more than anything, and their fear drives them to promote much worse doctrines (Nazis, Islam). TDS operates similarly: fear of the President drives otherwise rational people to embrace Islamic Hijrah as if it were charity.
6   Strategist   ignore (2)   2018 Oct 20, 8:02am   ↑ like (1)   ↓ dislike (0)   quote   flag        

curious2 says
Saint Jamal is portrayed romantically getting a document that he needed in order to get married to his fiancee. Hardly anyone mentions why:


Muslims can have 4 wives anyway. Makes no sense at all.
Why the Turkey embassy? Why not London where he was?
Why did he go into the Saudi embassy alone, while his fiancee waited outside? Isn't it natural for both to go in together?
Why did Turkey raise a mega fuss over a missing person. What's so special about Kashoggi?
Why would the Saudis go to such great lengths to torture him for information? What did he know?
Why is Trump downplaying this assassination? Did he suddenly develop love for the Saudis and Muslims?
-------
My analysis:
Kashoggi was helping Turkey overthrow the Crown Prince. He went to that embassy to receive secret documents from a mole inside the embassy. The Saudis found out and quickly sent a team to question and assassinate him. Turkey was upset and worried about what Kashoggi told the Saudis. Turkey knew he would have been tortured for information. Trump has an agenda, he needs the Crown Prince, and does not want any disruption of his larger plans regarding the Middle East.
In the end, this will all die down as usual.Turkey loses, Saudi wins, Trump is relieved.

about   best comments   contact   one year ago   suggestions