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Deniers Unite!

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By Hater   Mar 15, 12:36pm   ↑ like (1)   ↓ dislike (2)   4 links   1,565 views   38 comments   watch (0)   quote  

I guess if you can't win an argument with facts and logic you can always try to suppress your opponent's speech.

Dan8267 says

Go ahead and try to refute any of my claims.

1. Rising temperatures will move the mosquito line upwards exposing millions of people to malaria.

2. Rising sea levels will endanger trillions of dollars of real estate along the coastal regions of the United States.

3. Previous productive farm land will be subjected to droughts or flooding.

4. Terrorism will increase due to the political instability created by climate change.

So Dan8267:
How far have the mosquitoes reached in their northern migration?
Are not coastlines constantly changing from storms and tidal action?
If the globe does warm, why won't more productive farmland open up?
Do you REALLY believe the pentagon?

Comments 1-38 of 38     Last »

1   YesYNot   618/619 = 99% civil   private mesage   Mar 15, 12:44pm  ↑ like   ↓ dislike   quote   top   bottom   home   share  

Mosquitoes and the diseases they carry is a real problem. There is a reason why FL was ground zero in the US for domestic Zika last year. This winter was mild, so expect mosquitoes earlier this year. Expect GW to increase the range of each type of mosquito.
There is plenty of research on the impact of global warming on agriculture. There will potentially be increase productivity in some places. It's stupid to assume that the net impact will be neutral or positive, when one can just look at a map and see where crops are grown and where they might be grown in the future, or which crops can be substituted (sorghum for corn, for instance). More important than average yields will be frequency of terrible yield years. There's a lot of uncertainty at this point. Some people don't mind rolling the dice, I guess.

2   Hater   225/225 = 100% civil   private mesage   Mar 15, 12:58pm  ↑ like   ↓ dislike   quote   top   bottom   home   share  

YesYNot says

There's a lot of uncertainty at this point.

At what point in history was there no uncertainty?

3   APOCALYPSEFUCK_is_ADORABLE   665/665 = 100% civil   private mesage   Mar 15, 1:58pm  ↑ like   ↓ dislike   quote   top   bottom   home   share  

Niceness.

It's a good thing.

4   Hater   225/225 = 100% civil   private mesage   Mar 15, 2:33pm  ↑ like   ↓ dislike   quote   top   bottom   home   share  

YesYNot says

It's stupid to assume

Yes it is

YesYNot says

More important than average yields will be frequency of terrible yield years.

Why do you assume this?

5   Ironman   1622/1681 = 96% civil   private mesage   Mar 15, 2:42pm  ↑ like (1)   ↓ dislike   quote   top   bottom   home   share  

YesYNot says

There is a reason why FL was ground zero in the US for domestic Zika last year.

Because it's the closest state to the other tropical countries that had MAJOR outbreaks...

How's that?

YesYNot says

There is plenty of research on the impact of global warming on agriculture.

Did you sell your cars yet and stop using electricity to help do your part to save the planet?

6   P N Dr Lo R   221/222 = 99% civil   private mesage   Mar 15, 3:13pm  ↑ like   ↓ dislike   quote   top   bottom   home   share  

Ironman says

Did you sell your cars yet and stop using electricity to help do your part to save the planet?

No

7   Quigley   340/342 = 99% civil   private mesage   Mar 15, 4:41pm  ↑ like   ↓ dislike   quote   top   bottom   home   share  

Ironically Dan was just complaining three days ago that people were using the ad hom button to censor his posts.
That's a pretty black kettle you have there, Dan!

8   YesYNot   618/619 = 99% civil   private mesage   Mar 15, 4:49pm  ↑ like   ↓ dislike   quote   top   bottom   home   share  

Ironman says

Did you sell your cars yet

I stopped commuting by car in 2005.

9   YesYNot   618/619 = 99% civil   private mesage   Mar 15, 4:53pm  ↑ like   ↓ dislike   quote   top   bottom   home   share  

Hater says

Why do you assume this?

It's not an assumption. If you are not familiar with it, it is surprising to see how much yield varies year to year. You can correlate yield with temp and precipitation. Then, you can look at predictions of changes in precipitation and temp due to climate change. There's a lot of uncertainty, but after looking at that data, that was my conclusion.

10   YesYNot   618/619 = 99% civil   private mesage   Mar 15, 4:55pm  ↑ like   ↓ dislike   quote   top   bottom   home   share  

Ironman says

Because it's the closest state to the other tropical countries that had MAJOR outbreaks..

It spread between continents by air travel. Proximity has little to do with it. Temp and humidity has more to do with it. There were cases all over the country, but FL was the only place it took hold.

11   Hater   225/225 = 100% civil   private mesage   Mar 15, 4:57pm  ↑ like   ↓ dislike   quote   top   bottom   home   share  

YesYNot says

You can correlate yield with temp and precipitation. Then, you can look at predictions of changes in precipitation and temp due to climate change.

Lot of assumptions there.

12   Ironman   1622/1681 = 96% civil   private mesage   Mar 15, 6:15pm  ↑ like   ↓ dislike   quote   top   bottom   home   share  

YesYNot says

Ironman says

Did you sell your cars yet

I stopped commuting by car in 2005.

I didn't say commuting, I said SELL your cars..

It is sad that the state took your license away for so long, any idea when you'll get it back?

13   Ironman   1622/1681 = 96% civil   private mesage   Mar 15, 6:18pm  ↑ like   ↓ dislike   quote   top   bottom   home   share  

YesYNot says

Ironman says

Because it's the closest state to the other tropical countries that had MAJOR outbreaks..

It spread between continents by air travel.

Exactly, the majority of cases in Florida were brought in from outside countries.

How is this a fault of global warming in Florida??

Oops....

14   YesYNot   618/619 = 99% civil   private mesage   Mar 15, 8:40pm  ↑ like   ↓ dislike   quote   top   bottom   home   share  

Ironman says

Florida were brought in from outside countries.

FL was the place it began spreading through the local mosquito population. Disease always comes from somewhere. How fast it spreads is what is important.

15   YesYNot   618/619 = 99% civil   private mesage   Mar 15, 8:42pm  ↑ like   ↓ dislike   quote   top   bottom   home   share  

Ironman says

I didn't say commuting, I said SELL your cars..

Owning a car doesn't cause global warming. Burning fuel does. Your question taken literally is irrelevant. I gave you the benefit of the doubt by assuming you meant something about how often I drove.

16   YesYNot   618/619 = 99% civil   private mesage   Mar 15, 8:43pm  ↑ like   ↓ dislike   quote   top   bottom   home   share  

Hater says

Lot of assumptions there.

Not really. I've done the work to quantify things. I've been honest about the high uncertainty. But dismissing this issue is a bad idea.

17   FortWayne   199/201 = 99% civil   private mesage   Mar 15, 8:54pm  ↑ like (2)   ↓ dislike (1)   quote   top   bottom   home   share  

Dan is a typical liberal type, he thinks everything is ad hominem if someone disagrees with him. It doesn't take much.

18   Ironman   1622/1681 = 96% civil   private mesage   Mar 15, 9:03pm  ↑ like   ↓ dislike   quote   top   bottom   home   share  

YesYNot says

Ironman says

Florida were brought in from outside countries.

FL was the place it began spreading through the local mosquito population. Disease always comes from somewhere.

Then tell me why New York had the second highest number of Zika cases to Florida? Must have been from all those tropical temperatures year round that lets the mosquitos breed and spread, right???

19   jazz music   370/370 = 100% civil   private mesage   Mar 15, 11:23pm  ↑ like   ↓ dislike   quote   top   bottom   home   share  

FortWayne says

Dan is a typical liberal type, he thinks everything ...

You are truly evil in intent, albeit feckless.

It is so top priority to get as MANY people as possible against liberal politics. As if it was about White guilt for the pretense of moral authority,

Liberal politics ALWAYS has been our only hope. Liberalism is not about LGBTQ triggly puffs, grab guns, war on Christmas, brown people and immigrants will take your job.

The real globalists are preaching the same Ayn Rand's libertarian bullshit that the Koch brothers, Rupert Murdoch and bankers spout. DEREGULATE EVERYTHING AND GIVE ALL YOUR TAXES TO THE WEALTHY SO THE GOVERNMENT IS LEFT WITH NOTHING BUT DEBT AND RICH POWERFUL PEOPLE TO ANSWER TO where they have all the money, they will take the military and the police. THAT IS WHAT THEY WANT. Exactly what Trump advertises he will do.

Locke believed that people had natural rights to “life, liberty, and property”, and that the role of government was to preserve these rights. If a government does not preserve these rights, then the people have a right to change their government.

This is what scholars refer to as the political theory of Liberalism. Liberalism in this sense differs from the way the term is used in today’s media in American politics (i.e., referring to the opposite of “conservative”).

A Liberal government’s power is limited and justified by the solemn pledge to:

~ treat individuals with respect,
~ pass laws that more effectively guarantee individual freedom and liberty, and
~ avoid unreasonably infringing upon these liberties.

A Liberal government is one whose authority is justified by its respect for human rights. Liberal democracies rely heavily on majority rule through elections and legislative decisions, but they also limit majorities by protecting individual and minority rights.

http://www.unlhumanrights.org/01/0102/0102_06.htm

20   YesYNot   618/619 = 99% civil   private mesage   Mar 16, 6:08am  ↑ like   ↓ dislike   quote   top   bottom   home   share  

Ironman says

Then tell me why New York had the second highest number of Zika cases to Florida? Must have been from all those tropical temperatures year round that lets the mosquitos breed and spread, right???

Nobody contracted Zika in NY. There were no reported mosquitoes in NY with Zika. All reported cases where people contracted Zika in the US were in FL. All travel warnings about Zika were either abroad or in FL.

21   Hater   225/225 = 100% civil   private mesage   Mar 16, 6:41am  ↑ like   ↓ dislike   quote   top   bottom   home   share  

YesYNot says

Not really. I've done the work to quantify things.

So what is the quantity of global warming you have calculated?

22   BlueSardine   380/382 = 99% civil   private mesage   Mar 16, 6:43am  ↑ like   ↓ dislike   quote   top   bottom   home   share  

When conscience beings were not around to contemplate it...

Hater says

At what point in history was there no uncertainty?

23   BlueSardine   380/382 = 99% civil   private mesage   Mar 16, 6:48am  ↑ like (1)   ↓ dislike   quote   top   bottom   home   share  

-1
the heating of the earth's atmosphere involves radiation, conduction, and convection, all occurring simultaneously. A basic tenet of meteorology is that the sun warms the ground and the ground warms the air. In this activity, we will focus on radiation, the process by which the sun warms the ground. Energy from the sun is the driving force behind weather and climate, and ultimately, life on earth.

Radiation

What do trees, snow, cars, horses, rocks, centipedes, oceans, the atmosphere, and you have in common? Each one is a source of radiation to some degree. Most of this radiation is invisible to humans but that does not make it any less real
YesYNot says

Owning a car doesn't cause global warming. Burning fuel does.

24   BlueSardine   380/382 = 99% civil   private mesage   Mar 16, 6:50am  ↑ like   ↓ dislike   quote   top   bottom   home   share  

sunlight reflection off metallic surfaces heat the atmosphere to some degree.
Therefore, a stationary metal object such as a car will contribute to global warming, even when it is parked and turned off, as long as it is exposed to sunlight.

25   BlueSardine   380/382 = 99% civil   private mesage   Mar 16, 6:55am  ↑ like (1)   ↓ dislike   quote   top   bottom   home   share  

Georgies shut down in part due to Dan's ad hominem attacks on the ex-Hooters waitresses they were bringing in to supplant those tuxedoed weirdos...
Chicks with tits represented a 30% reduction in wages...Georgies would have survived, however...

FortWayne says

Dan is a typical liberal type, he thinks everything is ad hominem if someone disagrees with him. It doesn't take much.

26   YesYNot   618/619 = 99% civil   private mesage   Mar 16, 7:18am  ↑ like   ↓ dislike   quote   top   bottom   home   share  

Macropodia says

sunlight reflection off metallic surfaces heat the atmosphere to some degree.

Therefore, a stationary metal object such as a car will contribute to global warming, even when it is parked and turned off, as long as it is exposed to sunlight

This is a terrible terrible argument. First of all, a reflective surface reduces global warming by reducing the amount of heat absorbed by the sun the earth*. Second of all, the color of the car is what matters, and what it is covering matters as well. If my car reflects more sun than the asphalt it is parked on, it is reducing global warming by some minute amount. Second of all, this effect is negligible compared to how much fuel is typically burned in the car.
Why do people keep bringing up irrelevant things? Is it honest confusion, an attempt to confuse other people, or an attempt to sound smart clever?

*edited to fix brain fart while quickly typing.

27   BlueSardine   380/382 = 99% civil   private mesage   Mar 16, 7:36am  ↑ like   ↓ dislike   quote   top   bottom   home   share  

Links please demonstrating the sun absorbs reflective heat from earthbound objects.
YesYNot says

a reflective surface reduces global warming by reducing the amount of heat absorbed by the sun.

28   Ironman   1622/1681 = 96% civil   private mesage   Mar 16, 8:20am  ↑ like   ↓ dislike   quote   top   bottom   home   share  

YesYNot says

If my car reflects more sun than the asphalt it is parked on,

Ahhh.... maybe we're getting somewhere...

How much does all the INCREASED asphalt in the country the last few decades add to GW??

29   YesYNot   618/619 = 99% civil   private mesage   Mar 16, 8:27am  ↑ like   ↓ dislike   quote   top   bottom   home   share  

Macropodia says

Links please demonstrating the sun absorbs reflective

I meant absorbed by the earth. This should be pretty clear.

30   YesYNot   618/619 = 99% civil   private mesage   Mar 16, 8:30am  ↑ like   ↓ dislike   quote   top   bottom   home   share  

Ironman says

How much does all the INCREASED asphalt in the country the last few decades add to GW?

I don't know. I don't think it makes a huge difference. It does affect the heat island effect you get around cities. This introduces an error in direct measurements, because temperatures are recorded more frequently in highly populated areas. People correct for this error when estimating global temperature increases. Misinformation fanatics usually claim that correcting for known errors is fudging the numbers, but it's actually a normal and common part of science.

31   Ironman   1622/1681 = 96% civil   private mesage   Mar 16, 8:33am  ↑ like   ↓ dislike   quote   top   bottom   home   share  

YesYNot says

It does affect the heat island effect you get around cities. This introduces an error in direct measurements, because temperatures are recorded more frequently in highly populated areas.

Maybe we're FINALLY getting somewhere...

YesYNot says

People correct for this error when estimating global temperature increases.

So, they correct with "estimating"?? Now that's really scientific!!!

YesYNot says

Misinformation fanatics usually claim that correcting for known errors is fudging the numbers, but it's actually a normal and common part of science.

Yes, garbage in = garbage out, and they can make the end data say what ever they want....

Yep, the science is settled!!!

32   YesYNot   618/619 = 99% civil   private mesage   Mar 16, 10:44am  ↑ like   ↓ dislike (1)   quote   top   bottom   home   share  

Ironman says

So, they correct with "estimating"?

You can measure the heat island effect, then use those measurements to correct. That is scientific. It is called estimating, because it's not a direct measurement. Estimation is not the same as wild as guessing.

Ironman says

Yes, garbage in = garbage out, and they can make the end data say what ever they want.

Dishonest assholes can make the data appear to say whatever they want to the uneducated audience. That is why the denier industry is so successful. Do you know who the audience is?

33   Hater   225/225 = 100% civil   private mesage   Mar 16, 12:46pm  ↑ like (1)   ↓ dislike (1)   quote   top   bottom   home   share  

YesYNot says

Dishonest assholes can make the data appear to say whatever they want to the uneducated audience.

And they do!

Ever notice how the true believers do their best to hide the fact that the temp has only gone up ONE DEGREE in the last century?

It's not about global warming, it's about global control.

34   Ironman   1622/1681 = 96% civil   private mesage   Mar 16, 1:13pm  ↑ like   ↓ dislike   quote   top   bottom   home   share  

YesYNot says

Dishonest assholes can make the data appear to say whatever they want to the uneducated audience.

Exactly, that's how they have all you Libbies believing the hoax.

YesYNot says

That is why the denier industry is so successful.

Yep, they're the ones who can see through the hoax and know how to interpret true data.

YesYNot says

Do you know who the audience is?

For believing the hoax GW bullshit?? Go look in the mirror.

35   BlueSardine   380/382 = 99% civil   private mesage   Mar 16, 8:28pm  ↑ like (1)   ↓ dislike   quote   top   bottom   home   share  

Trump meant wiretapping as all forms of spying whatsoever...

YesYNot says

Macropodia says

Links please demonstrating the sun absorbs reflective

I meant absorbed by the earth. This should be pretty clear.

36   Rashomon   266/266 = 100% civil   private mesage   Mar 16, 9:31pm  ↑ like   ↓ dislike   quote   top   bottom   home   share  

Hater says

Ever notice how the true believers do their best to hide the fact that the temp has only gone up ONE DEGREE in the last century?

Who exactly hides the facts about global warming? How is it that the people who accept the reports from the actual scientists are supposedly hiding the facts according to you, whereas all the deniers are doing what exactly? Global warming is happening and happening faster than predicted. That is the important point and not that you think a 1C rise is a trivial amount (it isn't). It seems incredibly unlikely that the rise can be contained to less than 2C, and that failure will have potentially devastating consequences.

37   Hater   225/225 = 100% civil   private mesage   Mar 20, 5:26pm  ↑ like   ↓ dislike   quote   top   bottom   home   share  

Rashomon says

That is the important point and not that you think a 1C rise is a trivial amount (it isn't). It seems incredibly unlikely that the rise can be contained to less than 2C, and that failure will have potentially devastating consequences.

So what is earth's ideal temperature? How many degrees warmer or colder than now?

What do your experts say?

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