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OPEC is DEAD!

By socal2   May 18, 9:07am   2 links   1,803 views   36 comments   watch (1)   quote      

Have you hugged a fracker today? Russia, Saudi Arabia, Iran and Venezuela not so happy...

http://theweek.com/articles/699210/opec-dead

Comments 1-36 of 36     Last »

1   Straw Man   606/610 = 99% civil   May 18, 9:16am  ↑ like (2)   ↓ dislike   quote    

Yep, that's why they financed all these cheap whores who were screaming against fracking for the last decade or so.

2   HEY YOU   889/890 = 99% civil   May 18, 9:17am  ↑ like   ↓ dislike (1)   quote    

Ask those that will have to deal with polluted water from fracking, Oklahoma about it's fracking earthquakes &
Republicans who love fracked oil pipeline spills in their neighborhood how much they love big oil.

3   socal2   229/231 = 99% civil   May 18, 9:22am  ↑ like (1)   ↓ dislike   quote    

Straw Man says

Yep, that's why they financed all these cheap whores who were screaming against fracking for the last decade or so.

Any one bother to ask if Al Gore and the Global Warming cultists are in the pocket of Putin and the Saudis?

The other beautiful thing is that natural gas has less CO2 emissions than crude oil and coal. America's carbon emissions have gone down in the last few years despite a growing economy, Now that we are exporting natural gas to places like China, we will also help bring their emissions down too.

Natural gas will be a good bridge energy source for us while we continue to work on carbon free energy sources.

America is truly a blessed nation!

4   Strategist   1793/1798 = 99% civil   May 18, 9:24am  ↑ like (1)   ↓ dislike   quote    

socal2 says

OPEC is DEAD!

Love it Love it Love it.
Rot In Peace terrorists.

5   Straw Man   606/610 = 99% civil   May 18, 9:27am  ↑ like (2)   ↓ dislike   quote    

HEY YOU says

Ask those that will have to deal with polluted water from fracking

Sorry, this BS claim has been rebuffed by science. Read the fucking study, it has even been linked on this very site couple of years ago.

6   socal2   229/231 = 99% civil   May 18, 9:27am  ↑ like (1)   ↓ dislike   quote    

HEY YOU says

Ask those that will have to deal with polluted water from fracking, Oklahoma about it's fracking earthquakes &

Republicans who love fracked oil pipeline spills in their neighborhood how much they love big oil.

Better to pollute the land of those icky brown people in the 3rd world - right? Better to prop up petro-economies like the Saudis and Russians - right?

EPA has found no evidence of contaminated ground water.

And as I already pointed out, fracking and using natural gas is reducing America carbon emissions.

The U.S. Leads All Countries In Lowering Carbon Dioxide Emissions
https://www.forbes.com/sites/rrapier/2016/06/19/the-u-s-leads-all-countries-in-lowering-carbon-dioxide-emissions/#21b14b145f48

This is a win win win. But of course, unthinking liberals will find a reason to bitch and moan.

7   Strategist   1793/1798 = 99% civil   May 18, 9:29am  ↑ like (2)   ↓ dislike   quote    

Fracking is here to stay, and the technology will spread world wide. And when solar power goes mainstream, oil will be completely useless.
Saudi Arabia is desperately trying to diversify their economy, but how do you do that when the only natural skill they have is to milk camels?

8   TwoScoopsMcGee   1620/1620 = 100% civil   May 18, 9:34am  ↑ like (2)   ↓ dislike   quote    

Strategist says

but how do you do that when the only natural skill they have is to milk camels?

They actually can't even do that anymore; most Traditional Arabs are now on welfare and live in Gov Housing. Most Saudis couldn't bake a loaf of bread.

It's a country that is mostly populated by bandits and traders, who look down on any and all manual labor and has for a thousand years.

9   marcus   688/693 = 99% civil   May 18, 9:38am  ↑ like   ↓ dislike (1)   quote    

I credit Obama.

One of his many huge successes !!

10   Straw Man   606/610 = 99% civil   May 18, 9:40am  ↑ like   ↓ dislike   quote    

marcus says

I credit Obama.

One of his many huge successes !!

As in "he was unable to fuck it up"? Agreed.

11   Strategist   1793/1798 = 99% civil   May 18, 9:40am  ↑ like (2)   ↓ dislike   quote    

marcus says

I credit Obama.

One of his many huge successes !!

Obama opposed fracking. The credit goes to technology, and good old American Entrepreneurship.

12   Quigley   759/764 = 99% civil   May 18, 10:17am  ↑ like (1)   ↓ dislike   quote    

So fracking makes the world more free. Got it.
Also why do we need global treaties for CO2 emissions if the worst polluters (China, India) aren't going to do much about it? Also the US is already far and away the best at dropping emissions. Electric cars and more fuel efficient cars are to blame as well as a great push to modernize homes and reduce electricity needs with LED lights, better insulated windows, and solar cells on the roofs! Also the renewable energy industry is doing well, setting up tens of thousands of windmills and many solar farms.
It's all meaning that we should be far more concerned with the pollution abroad than our own declining numbers.

13   socal2   229/231 = 99% civil   May 18, 10:21am  ↑ like (4)   ↓ dislike   quote    

marcus says

I credit Obama.

One of his many huge successes !!

This guy? The guy who said "We can't drill our way to lower oil prices".

Just another example of Liberals refusing to accept science.

14   socal2   229/231 = 99% civil   May 18, 10:26am  ↑ like (2)   ↓ dislike   quote    

Quigley says

It's all meaning that we should be far more concerned with the pollution abroad than our own declining numbers.

America is going to be boosting our natural gas exports to China which will help reduce China's emissions since they mostly use dirty coal for electricity.

Russians, Democrats, Hollywood and Jihadis have done their very best to stop this progress. It is almost as if Democrats and Hollywood are in collusion with America's (and the environment's) enemies.

Trump's China Deal Boosts U.S. LNG Without Rule Change
https://www.bloomberg.com/politics/articles/2017-05-12/trump-s-china-deal-gives-u-s-lng-a-boost-without-changing-rules

15   Quigley   759/764 = 99% civil   May 18, 10:28am  ↑ like (1)   ↓ dislike   quote    

It would be the peak of irony if Trump were to be our POTUS with the best effect on the environment.

16   P N Dr Lo R   368/369 = 99% civil   May 18, 11:30am  ↑ like (1)   ↓ dislike   quote    

Strategist says

Saudi Arabia is desperately trying to diversify their economy,

It's their oil, but it was American geologists and petroleum engineers who discovered and brought the oil on line in the late 1930's as Saudia Arabia was in need of revenue as World War II loomed.

"SOCAL set up a subsidiary company, the California Arabian Standard Oil Company (CASOC) to develop the oil concession. SOCAL also joined forces with the Texas Oil Company when together they formed CALTEX in 1936 to take advantage of the latter’s formidable marketing network in Africa and Asia.
When CASOC geologists surveyed the concession area, they identified a promising site and named it Dammam No. 7, after a nearby village. Over the next three years, the drillers were unsuccessful in making a commercial strike, but chief geologist Max Steineke persevered. He urged the team to drill deeper, even when Dammam No. 7 was plagued by cave-ins, stuck drill bits and other problems, before the drillers finally struck oil on 3 March 1938. This discovery would turn out to be first of many, eventually revealing the largest source of crude oil in the world. For the king, oil revenues became a crucial source of wealth since he no longer had to rely on receipts from pilgrimages to Mecca. This discovery would alter Middle Eastern political relations forever."

Legend has it that the geologists were tipped off to the possibility of large volumes of petroleum by the Biblical story of Moses in the bullrushes where pitch (tar) was used to caulk his basket so it would float.

17   Strategist   1793/1798 = 99% civil   May 18, 11:50am  ↑ like   ↓ dislike   quote    

P N Dr Lo R says

For the king, oil revenues became a crucial source of wealth since he no longer had to rely on receipts from pilgrimages to Mecca. This discovery would alter Middle Eastern political relations forever."

And all the oil belongs to the Royal family. Nothing belongs to the commoner.
The way the Royals splurge the oil wealth is shockingly disgraceful.

18   Patrick   2083/2083 = 100% civil   May 18, 3:48pm  ↑ like (3)   ↓ dislike   quote    

Strategist says

The way the Royals splurge the oil wealth is shockingly disgraceful.

You try spending trillions. It ain't easy!

19   Strategist   1793/1798 = 99% civil   May 18, 4:40pm  ↑ like (3)   ↓ dislike   quote    

Patrick says

Strategist says

The way the Royals splurge the oil wealth is shockingly disgraceful.

You try spending trillions. It ain't easy!

My wife could.

20   BayAreaObserver   729/729 = 100% civil   May 19, 7:59am  ↑ like (1)   ↓ dislike   quote    

Don't plan the wake just yet for OPEC...

21   socal2   229/231 = 99% civil   May 19, 10:07am  ↑ like   ↓ dislike   quote    

BayAreaObserver says

Don't plan the wake just yet for OPEC...

Only if Democrats get back into power and collude with OPEC and Russia to reduce America's energy production.

22   BayAreaObserver   729/729 = 100% civil   May 19, 11:33am  ↑ like   ↓ dislike   quote    

Only if Democrats get back into power and collude with OPEC and Russia to reduce America's energy production.

Only if Trump is in power and colludes with Saudi Arabia, OPEC and Russia to reduce America's energy production.

Given his first stop is Saudi Arabia, billions in Arms Deals in the works and the celebrity reception he will be given upon arrival if there is something moving around in this visit that will benefit "Team Trump" - watch out. Besides that they are a "trusted ally". RFLMAO

Then again should the price per bbl of oil get too low with the increased fracking, the break even point for profit could result in a quick reversal of activity in this country.

Let's see what kind of "deal" comes out of this and I don't think you or I will know the full details right away.

On a side note with all of the saber rattling is going on about North Korea and the fear machine is going into overdrive about the threat they are, lets not forget those NATO nukes stored in Turkey at Incirlik Air Base since they are headed for a Theocracy fast than superman can stop a speeding bullet. A bird in the hand (90 some nukes) is worth more than two in the bush (no puns)

Let's all hope Trumpligula doesn't have a major faux pas while he's touring the region and really piss of some "allys" not to mention our enemies and turn an already bad situation much much worse - if that's possible...

23   Straw Man   606/610 = 99% civil   May 19, 11:50am  ↑ like   ↓ dislike   quote    

BayAreaObserver says

Then again should the price per bbl of oil get too low with the increased fracking, the break even point for profit could result in a quick reversal of activity in this country.

It has already happened. And then it recovered nicely. The attempt to break fracking has been unsuccessful and harmed OPEC/Russia more than it harmed US.

24   Straw Man   606/610 = 99% civil   May 19, 11:51am  ↑ like   ↓ dislike   quote    

BayAreaObserver says

Only if Trump is in power and colludes with Saudi Arabia, OPEC and Russia to reduce America's energy production.

What is the mechanism for doing that? EPA?

25   BayAreaObserver   729/729 = 100% civil   May 20, 2:37pm  ↑ like (1)   ↓ dislike   quote    

Straw Man - sorry for the delay to get back to you. As far as Trump and the Saudi's and OPEC perhaps it my nature however I am always leery and skeptical of anything involving oil, the players and the backroom deals. You are right, OPEC tried to swamp the markets and did disrupt them short term and Fracking came back.

The Saudi's still have a major price advantage along with a "tax" advantage to production. In a recent and highly informative article in Business Insider originally published in The Motley Fool and using energy industry consultant Rystad Energy research, author Matthew DiLallo shows that it costs Saudi Arabia around $9 per barrel to breakeven, Russia $19 and U.S. shale a little over $23. That said, the simple average of Saudi/Russian breakeven would be about $14, a number which can only go higher, while U.S. shale breakeven is declining significantly, with production also growing significantly. So who’s going to win this one?

Cited Article: http://www.businessinsider.com/how-much-it-costs-both-saudi-arabia-and-the-us-to-produce-oil-2017-3

OPEC has diminished influence for now, no doubt. Long term calling them dead and done would be very premature in my thinking, that has been called in one from or another in the past.

A bigger concern for me is what the current administration does on the environmental front and tax front where domestic production is concerned. What price (financial and environmental) will the citizens be willing to pay - someone always pays - taxes cut from one area show up somewhere else and the environment should be preserved but we know when oil and gas is involved how that works.

Here is something of interest from the Sstate of Colorado which should have everyone concerned...

Colorado’s Republican attorney general Thursday appealed a state appeals court decision requiring the state’s oil and gas commission to protect public health and safety, defying Democratic Gov. John Hickenlooper and siding with the oil and gas industry a day and a month after a faulty gas line killed two men in a home north of Denver.

Cynthia Coffman, whose political career has benefited from industry funding, filed the appeal with the Colorado Supreme Court on behalf of the Colorado Oil and Gas Conservation Commission, the body appointed by the governor that historically has been tasked with balancing oil and gas development with public safety, health and environmental concerns.

http://www.ibtimes.com/political-capital/colorado-ag-defies-governor-appeals-oil-gas-safety-ruling-state-supreme-court.

While fracking is getting profitable at lower and lower prices it still can not compete head on with the Saudis, they have control of the largest refinery in the U.S. right now - just count me in as being very leery of what transpires down the road. Too many moving parts right now to call OPEC dead...but that's just me.

26   socal2   229/231 = 99% civil   May 22, 10:04am  ↑ like (2)   ↓ dislike   quote    

OPEC’s Coffers Are Drying Up
"OPEC’s members brought in less cash from selling oil in 2016 than in any of the past dozen years. That grim reality comes to us courtesy of the U.S. Energy Information Administration (EIA): Members of the Organization of the Petroleum Exporting Countries (OPEC) earned about $433 billion in net oil export revenues in 2016, the lowest since 2004. In real dollar terms, the 2016 revenue represents a 15% decline from the $509 billion earned in 2015, mainly because of the fall in average annual crude oil prices and, to a lesser extent, because of decreases in OPEC net oil exports."
https://www.the-american-interest.com/2017/05/21/opecs-coffers-are-drying-up/

Less money to spread mischief around the globe.

27   socal2   229/231 = 99% civil   May 22, 10:09am  ↑ like   ↓ dislike   quote    

Worst OPEC Cheater Will Get Harder to Ignore as Curbs Falter
"OPEC’s second-biggest producer is also its biggest cheater.

And if past is prologue, that lengthens the odds the group will be able to squeeze too many more price gains out of its output cuts.

Iraq pumped about 80,000 more barrels of oil a day than permitted by Organization of Petroleum Exporting Countries curbs during the first quarter. If that deal gets extended to 2018, the nation will have even less incentive to comply because capacity at key southern fields is expanding and three years of fighting Islamic State has left it drowning in debt."
https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2017-05-22/opec-s-worst-cheater-will-get-harder-to-ignore-as-curbs-falter

U.S. Shale is a game changer. This is perhaps the biggest story and geopolitical realignment since the implosion of Communism at the end of the Cold War.

28   Quigley   759/764 = 99% civil   May 22, 10:18am  ↑ like (4)   ↓ dislike   quote    

Energy needs are increasingly supplied by alternative sources. And as mentioned oil production has gone way up domestically. Add to this the rise of electric vehicles, push for efficiency in electric use, and you have a recipe for a Saudi slide to irrelevancy.
It really couldn't happen to a nicer bunch of total assholes.

29   Patrick   2083/2083 = 100% civil   May 22, 10:47am  ↑ like (1)   ↓ dislike   quote    

Sorry about the blurry image.
Looks like solar is going to be cheaper than anything else soon.

30   TwoScoopsMcGee   1620/1620 = 100% civil   May 22, 10:53am  ↑ like (1)   ↓ dislike   quote    

So beautiful folks, so beautiful. We have the best fracking.

31   socal2   229/231 = 99% civil   May 22, 11:03am  ↑ like   ↓ dislike   quote    

Patrick says

Looks like solar is going to be cheaper than anything else soon.

That's good news too. Solar potential can only go up as it represents only about 0.9% of our total electricity production.
https://www.eia.gov/energyexplained/?page=us_energy_home

Solar will still be limited to sunshine states, but better and cheaper battery technology will help that along too.

There is no one silver bullet technology that will be able to get us off carbon based energy as fast as the Global Warming doom-mongers are demanding. There is simply too much oil and gas available here at home.

32   jazz_music   805/806 = 99% civil   May 22, 11:46am  ↑ like   ↓ dislike   quote    

Texas jury awards $3M to family for illnesses related to fracking
http://america.aljazeera.com/articles/2014/4/23/texas-fracking-lawsuit.html

33   errc   606/615 = 98% civil   May 22, 12:10pm  ↑ like   ↓ dislike   quote    

OPEC’s Coffers Are Drying Up
"OPEC’s members brought in less cash from selling oil in 2016 than in any of the past dozen years.

Thanks a lot, Obama!!

34   errc   606/615 = 98% civil   May 22, 12:12pm  ↑ like   ↓ dislike   quote    

TwoScoopsMcGee says

So beautiful folks, so beautiful. We have the best fracking.

You should come up to central Pennsylvania and see all the destruction it's causing

35   Fucking White Male   386/388 = 99% civil   May 22, 12:16pm  ↑ like (2)   ↓ dislike   quote    

jazz music says

Texas jury awards $3M to family for illnesses related to fracking

http://america.aljazeera.com/articles/2014/4/23/texas-fracking-lawsuit.html

Probably should check your sources Pink Panther, esp when it's Al Jizz...

https://www.law360.com/articles/545633/fracking-case-that-wasn-t-parr-v-aruba-petroleum-inc

Oh, and even if it was relevant, case was overturned a few months ago:

http://www.prnewswire.com/news-releases/aruba-petroleum-wins-appellate-ruling-in-closely-watched-nuisance-case-300402015.html

36   BayAreaObserver   729/729 = 100% civil   May 22, 4:27pm  ↑ like   ↓ dislike   quote    

All those cheering OPECs supposed demise seem to forget you are in a country where the newly elected CiC and his administration are in overdrive to take us back to the 1950s in terms of energy production and use of fossil fuels. Anyone in California should be aware by now of how hard PG&E is fighting tooth and nail and whatever else they can muster to limit or curtail use of solar to keep those profits rolling in. Same for the rest of the country in most places, except there was a small win recently in Arizona but that only involved one utility.

Take your pick from these...and while coal may be on it's way out for large scale Electrical production (electric cars need this to charge) oil and natural gas is picking up the slack. (Large Scale Production)

http://dailysignal.com/2017/04/27/congress-asked-to-eliminate-270-million-a-year-in-solar-subsidies/

https://cleantechnica.com/2017/05/01/floridas-fight-renewables-new-co-op-network-eyes-solar/

http://southeastenergynews.com/2017/05/16/as-utility-solar-grows-in-virginia-so-do-tensions-with-rooftop-installers/

The last link is interesting because someone has finally started to address "scale" in solar projects and the previously not discussed cost of transmission etc. and remember someone (customers) are going to have to pay for maintaining the infrastructure and it doesn't seem to be so cost effective as it once did.

https://ilsr.org/report-is-bigger-best/

U.S. Shale and World Wide Shale are game changers but they still have to be able to be able to produce on a profitable scale and right now that break even is about $30 BBL and as I have said previously there are still way too many moving parts to declare a winner or loser right now.

OPEC as an organization may not be brining in the same amount of past revenue but as an organization that can and will affect prices and usage I do not seem them anywhere near dead. A flesh wound perhaps - dead - no.

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