patrick.net

As I recall, , Section 8 housing must be inspected and pass health and safety codes before the tenants are permitted to move in. The government will guarantee the rent and most likely will be paying a large part of it, so there will be a paper or electronic trail.

What Mikey said.

I worked for a housing authority; they issue tax notices and everything must be inspected. The housing authority also makes interim inspections to make sure it's all up to code. So, I'd look for another renter.

mikey, elliemae - thank you both. We'll look for another renter. Everything is built up to code. But permits were never filed. That's all.

Can you get permitted now? some places you can. The thing about S8 is that you are guaranteed payment and you often get a good renter who's happy to be in a safe, affordable home. Could be the other way, but you have a good chance of it being good.

...and I don't think that you suck. It seemed to be a legitimate question. After all, how many people claim their rental income?

In laws are not separate units so they will never qualify for section 8. You can't install stoves unless it is separate. They're call inlaws for a reason..

elliemae says

you often get a good renter who’s happy to be in a safe, affordable home.

I would want to personally verify this claim. I'm guessing that deadbeats like Section 8 people are horrible tenants.

zzyzzx says

elliemae says

you often get a good renter who’s happy to be in a safe, affordable home.

I would want to personally verify this claim. I’m guessing that deadbeats like Section 8 people are horrible tenants.

Why would you assume that? Is it just because they are poor?

My experience with helping people get into Section 8 housing is that they are so grateful to have housing that they can afford, they make sure they do whatever they can to keep their housing. That means that they are normally clean and quiet tenants who like to stay under the radar.

And landlords who welcome Section 8 renters are usually glad to have guaranteed rental income.

I'll say this we have I think two S8 renters (I know 1 for sure) in our neighborhood. Since their arrival our neighbor has had frequent visits by the police. One day an officer got upset because he was tried of all the frequent visits to the two houses. The neighborhood hasn't been the same since. Hell we even had a bounty hunter arrive and took someone in the wagon... That's the first time I've ever seen that happening, at least in person.

I am not saying all S8 renters are bad though.. But in my case they are and they leave the house a mess with cars parked all over the place and even cars that I know don't run or work. Just makes out neighborhood look junky.

simchaland says

zzyzzx says

elliemae says

you often get a good renter who’s happy to be in a safe, affordable home.

I would want to personally verify this claim. I’m guessing that deadbeats like Section 8 people are horrible tenants.

Why would you assume that? Is it just because they are poor?
My experience with helping people get into Section 8 housing is that they are so grateful to have housing that they can afford, they make sure they do whatever they can to keep their housing. That means that they are normally clean and quiet tenants who like to stay under the radar.
And landlords who welcome Section 8 renters are usually glad to have guaranteed rental income.

Yeah, and you won't feel the same when you live next to them. Just like another poster in this thread said, usually, the cops end up outside their houses on a regular basis. Of course all of them are not bad but a large portion of them are nothing but trouble.

I have neighbors who have Section 8. My neighborhood is peaceful.

I think the issue here is that you don't know who exactly has Section 8. The quiet ones who cause no problems would slip under your radar entirely. The bad apples (and there are those in every bunch) tend to stand out and we get focused on them.

Having worked for a housing authority, I saw my share of S8 renters. I saw them thru the application process, walking from a bus stop a couple of blocks away to wait in line in the hot sun for hours (Vegas - 105 degrees is a cool day in the summer). Then they had the pleasure of picking up an application, getting an appt time, and returning another day to meet with an apathetic POS with a water cooler & air conditioning in their office. One woman was forcibly removed by the cops after she insisted they give water to her young children and was told to sit down & shut up.

Then they had the pleasure of checking in every 6 months until their number came up in about 5 years (in Santa Monica, CA it's about 8-10 years for a senior unit in a building on 7th st & Wilshire). Once they were awarded their S8 certificate or voucher, they had to find a place that would rent to them. They had to come up with deposits for utilities and rent (some public programs helped), and then they had to arrange for their moving day. This doesn't even take into account the costs and trouble of registering their children into a new school.

S8 people aren't always deadbeats - often they're people who desperately need a break from horrible housing situations. The idea behind S8 is to assimilate into neighborhoods and live like "normal" people, to raise their children in safe areas and give them a chance to be something more than a gang member from a poor neighborhood.

I'd say that, for the most part, S8 recipients are people who are poor and want to have a safe place to live in a neighborhood that will accept them without knowing they're on the public dole. Bad neighbors can happen anywhere, and certainly poverty creates problems. But if you have to work so damn hard to get a unit, you probably value it quite a bit.

------------------------------
Are you aware that there are public housing programs that take people out of the projects (called "developments), move them to neighborhoods and then subsidize the shit out of them? These are probably the people you're speaking of - the housing authorities even do their yard work.

Admitting to a crime (tax evasion) over the internet is just dumb. I hope you did this from some internet cafe public computer at least.

bob2356 says

Admitting to a crime (tax evasion) over the internet is just dumb. I hope you did this from some internet cafe public computer at least.

I doubt the IRS is trolling this board - but if it is, I'll visit him in prision. ;)

elliemae says

After all, how many people claim their rental income?

I am just guessing, but I would say a good portion pay taxes on their passive income, but that leaves way too many that don't. The ones I know at least, including myself, have management companies taking care of everything so a statement is generated on the first of every month and then a week later the checks start arriving with all of that identifying information. I was just having a conversation last week about this topic. I was suggesting that the state bring back a a very simple renters credit like we had way back when (The last time I rented an apartment was in 1983 so I don't know when things changed) so that when the tenant files his or her taxes, he or she is raising a red flag on rental property owner tax evaders to the California State Franchise Tax Board (For those out of state, that's what the CA tax man is called). As I recall, it was very simple to do on the CA state tax form....Check the box and place the name and address of the person that you were paying your rent to. It should be a blanket credit for anyone renting regardless of income, number of dependants and all of the other twists and turns so that it is very simple for everyone to claim, just by checking a box and putting the landlords information in the box provided. Maybe folks should lobby their state senator and assemblyman/woman here in CA to get a very easy and simple version of this. I suspect that this easy, check the box on the 540EZ tax credit wouldn't cost the state that much money compared to the taxes they would collect when they get landlords to pay their fair share of taxes.

Addendum: I just went to look up renter tax credit info and there is an entire page of instructions on claiming a renters tax credit, so I would say it's not easy enough. You must have lived in the place 6 months, certain income requirements, the place could not be exempt from taxes for 6 months, can't be claimed as a dependent, blah, blah, blah,.........I wonder how many renters are not eligible or dissuaded from claiming a renters credit which requires that the filier give the name and address of the landlord and then trigger a red flag at the Franchise Tax Board? Here is the renters credit link for filing out the 540EZ, it's on the last page, page 12 http://www.ftb.ca.gov/forms/2008/08_5402ezins.pdf

bob2356 says

Admitting to a crime (tax evasion) over the internet is just dumb. I hope you did this from some internet cafe public computer at least.

I never said anything about not paying taxes.

And this is the first S8 renter I've come across. I never had any opinions of S8. But we liked her as a tenant which is why I was considering. But you are all right. We cannot take this tenant in an in-law.

Elliemae, I don't think it is an option for us to file permits after completion here.

Vain, you said right on the top

"We have a rental unit that we normally rent out for cash, and it’s under the table so we do not report it in our income taxes."

Isn't that saying the same thing? The IRS does not care whether it is warranted or not. Income are reportable unless othewise exempt.

There's usually three scenerios with reporting rental income.

For units such as in-laws and room share, they are usaully not reported at all.

For separate legal units, taxpayer skimp the top line, inflate the expenses. Without 1099 automated cross check, the IRS is not in the position to audit rental income, nor is it worthwhile.

Then there are people those that just let their bookeeper and rental management take care of everything by the books. In this case the owner have $$ and doen't care.

SF ace says

Vain, you said right on the top
“We have a rental unit that we normally rent out for cash, and it’s under the table so we do not report it in our income taxes.”
Isn’t that saying the same thing?

Kinda. But I guess it's how you define under the table. I could mean we are renting out an unwarranted unit :)

But I guess to be safe, I'll edit the post.

elliemae says

bob2356 says
Admitting to a crime (tax evasion) over the internet is just dumb. I hope you did this from some internet cafe public computer at least.
I doubt the IRS is trolling this board - but if it is, I’ll visit him in prision.

Don't be so sure about who is "trolling" the boards part of that post......I know of at least 3 law enforcement officers that I have turned onto this site the past few years and enjoy reading it, and one of them is a a fellow pilot at my local airport that is an IRS Special Agent (not examiner, law enforcement). So you just don't know who is reading these posts. Patrick.net has a lot of followers.

99.99% don't go to jail over tax, especially on matters such as rental income, if caught they pay the principle, interest and penalty.

SF ace says

99.99% don’t go to jail over tax, especially on matters such as rental income, if caught they pay the principle, interest and penalty.

This is true, but it should serve as a reminder that the web is a big public square and people from all professions and walks of life read this stuff.

rob918 says

elliemae says

bob2356 says
Admitting to a crime (tax evasion) over the internet is just dumb. I hope you did this from some internet cafe public computer at least.
I doubt the IRS is trolling this board - but if it is, I’ll visit him in prision.

Don’t be so sure about who is “trolling” the boards part of that post……I know of at least 3 law enforcement officers that I have turned onto this site the past few years and enjoy reading it, and one of them is a a fellow pilot at my local airport that is an IRS Special Agent (not examiner, law enforcement). So you just don’t know who is reading these posts. Patrick.net has a lot of followers.

The IRS here? Well, then. I'd like to clarify some statements I've made in the past.

1) When I said I make cash by working under the table, I meant that I clean the office at night and pick up the change the workers drop.
2) All that talk about money laundering and off-shore banks was what I got off of a Miami Vice rerun.
3) I didn't enjoy prison that much and really don't want to go back.

Yep, that just about sums it up.