patrick.net

There is a partial solution to the problem: carpooling. Nothing wrong with it. Done it before, may wind up doing it again.
I know lotsa folks who do it, and even more who could, and maybe would, if they thought they had to.

It's more than just saving gas. It's reducing the stress of daily driving, reducing wear and tear (and ownership cost) on one's own vehicle, grounding us in the reality that we live in society and not in a bubble.

Ever hear the story of the Bay Bridge Casual Carpooler who met their spouse that way?

The United States wants access to Osama bin Laden's three widows and any intelligence material its commandos left behind at the al-Qaida leader's compound, a top American official said in comments broadcast Sunday that could add a fresh sticking point in already frayed ties with Pakistan.
Information from the women, who remained in the house after the commandos killed bin Laden, might answer questions about whether Pakistan harbored the al-Qaida chief as many American officials are speculating. It could also reveal details about the day-to-day life of bin Laden, his actions since the invasion of Afghanistan in 2001 and the inner workings of al-Qaida.

source: news.yahoo.com

sybrib says

I have a cool-and-hip-tech-job in Silicon Valley and live in suburban sprawl. My partner and I own free and clear four vehicles, but I take public transit to work because it is faster than sitting in traffic, and more flexible than having a carpool partner. Besides I don’t need a carpool partner to get access to the carpool lane anyway as two of my vehicles have the carpool lane stickers, and one of them is NOT a hybrid so its sticker is not set to expire soon.

That's an exception to the rule, not the rule. Out here in LA transportation is horrible. Most people do need cars to work. And if you go out into more rural areas it's even more of a must.

Zlxr says

The idea behind the Smart Meters is that eventually we are supposed to pay according to the time of day we use electricity with basically 8 a.m. - 6p.m. or so being the most expensive time of day.

Expect "time creep", with the utilities changing the time period for cheaper electricity to later and later into the evening.

YesYNot says

kiatoa, I don’t think taxing oil sounds crazy - I’ve been rooting for that to happen for years. Driving is way too heavily subsidized in the US.

I am in favor of taxing imported oil and eliminating domestic oil subsidies.

I'm in favor of declaring California as America's France.

MarkInSF says

Almost all of it. Most post-WWII cities were designed with an automobile as the assumed mode of travel. It’s why I personally can’t stand most of America, and choose to live in San Francisco. I really don’t understand the appeal of sitting in traffic for an hour a day, and at both ends of the commute being a cultural desert.

Um, only the people living outside large cities like San Francisco are sitting in traffic for a long time. People who don't live or work in huge cities have no traffic problems, and don't pay to live in one of the most overpriced cities in America. But hey, San Fran is the greatest city ever, right? You just keep drinking that Kool-Aid!

StoutFiles says

People who don’t live or work in huge cities have no traffic problems, and don’t pay to live in one of the most overpriced cities in America.

You need to consider the fact of finding jobs. Yes, one doesn't need to spend in traffic where jobs hardly exist. Chicago metro, Sf bay area, LA/OC, San diego, NY metro, Boston, etc--all these job centers have traffic problems.

John, us cityfolk like our cars when cars do better, and like our public transit when it does better. We like to have it both ways. And, even though we like our cars, we don't depend on them. They are a luxury, a discretionary expense, a toy. But we don't depend on them nor on the friggen enemies of the US who sell petrol to us.

thunderlips11 says

Sounds weird but there is a great spiritual/emotional/mental aspect to living in pedestrian-based cities.

yup. It's nice having streetscapes exist for people and not cars.

Feels like Disneyland for a while.

My first full day in Japan was spent in this locale:

http://goo.gl/maps/G8YN

Busy suburban city, ~100M from the train station. Nary a car on the road. It was awesome & I'd love to go back there again.

sybrib says

John, us cityfolk like our cars when cars do better, and like our public transit when it does better. We like to have it both ways. And, even though we like our cars, we don’t depend on them. They are a luxury, a discretionary expense, a toy. But we don’t depend on them nor on the friggen enemies of the US who sell petrol to us.

We buy their oil because they stupidly sell it to us. Once they're out, they're out...and we have huge natural reserves as well as plenty of untapped oil. Plus, what the government won't tell you is that they want gas prices to stay just high enough to not break the economy because they want people out there buying new, full-efficient cars. Buying foreign oil is a win-win.

no free parking? Why do we pay so much for gas tax, car registration, sales tax on your car, etc. Thats what should be paying to maintain roads and parking lots. There are plenty of FEE parking sites, especially in cities. But I shouldn't have to pay to park at a grocery store or post office....

its scary when people really start thinking about this garbage

ih8alameda says

Our gas costs have gone from $100 to $400 a month in about a yr.

How is that possible? Let's assume a year ago that gas prices in the Bay Area were $2.50 and now they are $4.50 (actually lower than that now). If you drive, let's say, 25K miles a year between the two cars, and average 28 mpg, then that's 893 gallons. At $2.50, that comes to $2232. At $4.50, it's $4018. The difference is $149/month, which is half what you quoted.

StoutFiles says

We buy their oil because they stupidly sell it to us. Once they’re out, they’re out…and we have huge natural reserves as well as plenty of untapped oil.

Stupidly sell it to us? Is it stupid to sell a commodity if you pay $100/barrel for it when it costs $20-30 to produce? Maybe we're the stupid ones for not taking advantage if we have such huge natural reserves, which doesn't seem to fit with the facts.

StoutFiles says

Buying foreign oil is a win-win.

I don't think any economist agrees with that. Right now, it produces massive trade imbalances.

corntrollio says

Stupidly sell it to us? Is it stupid to sell a commodity if you pay $100/barrel for it when it costs $20-30 to produce? Maybe we’re the stupid ones for not taking advantage if we have such huge natural reserves, which doesn’t seem to fit with the facts.

Guess how much our oil will be worth when there's hardly any left? Plus, you always want a lot of oil in case something were to happen that would halt trading, like a world war. We pay a premium now for both security and for a future monopoly.

StoutFiles says

Guess how much our oil will be worth when there’s hardly any left?

Please. If it made economic sense for Exxon to sell more domestic oil, they would be doing it. The fact is that we can't produce that much more under current conditions, and it has very little to do with security. Nice trolling, sir.

StoutFiles says

Guess how much our oil will be worth when there’s hardly any left? Plus, you always want a lot of oil in case something were to happen that would halt trading, like a world war. We pay a premium now for both security and for a future monopoly.

No one could be that clueless about oil production, could they?

"The fact is that we can’t produce that much more under current conditions, and it has very little to do with security."

That is complete nonsense.

B.A.C.A.H. says

Damn.
I drove past a filling station near my home with a sign showing 4.00.9 per gallon of 87 octane, on my way to Arco station with $3.89.9 per gallon. My running fuel expense is up to $349 for the past thirty days. That’s for three drivers, includes a Prius and a natural gas Honda ($2.37 per gallon on this morning’s fillup), no commuting outside of our city, and one commuter who commutes on public transit instead of driving… and it added up to $349 just for fuel for the past 30 days.
Damn.

Today a week later the price was up to $4.05.9 at the same Chevron. A regressive tax on people who must drive to work for their jobs, at a time when wages are stagnant. Sure is what it feels like.

I don't see the big deal. When I started driving I got about 15 highway MPG, spent $1.10 a gallon in nominal dollars or $2.04 in 2012 dollars, and was spending $0.136 per mile in current dollars. My current car gets 29 highway MPG, gas is $4, and I'm spending $0.138 per mile.

That's business as usual.

We chose a small home centrally located for work, bike a lot, and in the last 30 days spent $52 on gas for my wife and I.

B.A.C.A.H. says

The third one cannot use public transit, but that commute is only about 15 miles roundtrip (bicycling is not really practical as the commute includes driving over some very substantial hills- in the MidWest they'd probably call it a mountain.)

One week I rode 418 miles from Grand Junction, CO to Golden, CO with 30,000 feet of climbing over real mountains between them. It felt great.

5 x 15 miles = 75 total in a week is not a big deal even with some real mountains in the middle.

drew_eckhardt says

B.A.C.A.H. says

The third one cannot use public transit, but that commute is only about 15 miles roundtrip (bicycling is not really practical as the commute includes driving over some very substantial hills- in the MidWest they'd probably call it a mountain.)

One week I rode 418 miles from Grand Junction, CO to Golden, CO with 30,000 feet of climbing over real mountains between them. It felt great.

5 x 15 miles = 75 total in a week is not a big deal even with some real mountains in the middle.

+1.

My roundtrip bike commute is about 17 miles (short way), and 23 the long way. I do this minimum 3 days a week. Hills/mountains and all.

Even if you don't ride every day, start with 1-2 days a week, and gradually build up. It's hard, but once you get in the habit, you'll never want to be back in your car again.