patrick.net

Reminds me of the coffee commercial, we switched this restaurant's regular coffee with [blank's] crystals. Watch out for the day the pharmacist counts out the wrong pills into your little bottle. At least because citalopram has a longer half-life than paroxetine, you're less likely to experience those "not habit forming" "discontinuation syndrome" withdrawal symptoms.

Pro-Tip: when swallowing your toxic SSRI placebos, always use bottled water.

Quigley says

It seems that people who are a little bit nuts and can't control their own minds prefer to think of their condition as a "chemical imbalance"

I'm lost: how is it not chemical, given that our entire bodies are chemicals?

What is known, however, is that the placebo effect is very real.

True story - anecdote, not data: the placebo effect worked on my cat.

My cat was leaking all over the place - outside the box - and the vet said "try a sliver of Prozac."

Thanks to the placebo effect, my cat thinks she's less anxious, and therefore is less anxious. Has not tinkled on the rug since then.

I am going to start taking a placebo every day.

curious2 says

Pro-Tip: when swallowing your toxic SSRI placebos, always use bottled water.

I've already proved repeatedly that SSRI's are no more dangerous than any other drug, but if you want to keep on yammerin' on about it, feel free. Just realize most people with at least some degree of intelligence will raise eyebrows.

CaptainShuddup says

The Liberals tried to convince that everyone was a winner

No, you're thinking of conservatives who tried to convince people that they will be rich if they just stick it out a little longer. Prosperity is just around the corner as it has been for 200 years. All you have to do is give tax breaks to the rich and soon you'll be one of them.

My mom swears that Kangen (TM) brand alkaline water has cured her illnesses, helped her lose weight, and helps with joint pain.
I looked this up and it was easily disproved that ingesting alkaline water has any effect at all on the body, as it's instantly titrated by stomach acid. The human body maintains a constant pH of 7.55, and any deviation of more than 0.05 will be noticed immediately. If the goal of the water was to raise blood PH by decreasing acidity, it would be doing the body harm. If your blood acidity grows, you feel a need to breathe, and exhale CO2, which is the mechanism by which the body regulates oxygen/CO2 levels. This is why if you hold your breath, you feel like your lungs are on fire and feel a strong desire to breathe, but if the cabin of a high altitude airplane is depressurized, everyone just passes out.

All this said, referenced, and based on scientific fact could not sway my mom from her steadfast belief in the miracle cure that is Kangen water.

Some people were just born to believe.

WOW! The UNtrustworthy are certainly in control of what information is apparent to the people!

Say hey! This was in the Wall Street Journal on March 30, 1999. Note "... how much it will buy."

Holy cow/interesting/compelling ...!

And where is it up to date??? Right here ... see the first chart shown in this thread.
Recent Dow day is Wednesday, April 2, 2014 __ Level is 105.5

WOW! It is hideous that this is hidden! Is there any such "Homes, Inflation Adjusted"? Yes! This was in the New York Times on August 27, 2006:

And up to date (by me) is here:
http://patrick.net/?p=1219038&c=999083#comment-999083

WOW! The UNtrustworthy are certainly in control of what information is apparent to the people!

And http://patrick.net/?p=1230886

Quigley says

The human body maintains a constant pH of 7.55, and any deviation of more than 0.05 will be noticed immediately. If the goal of the water was to raise blood PH by decreasing acidity, it would be doing the body harm.

Don't buy into the lies!

The very concepts "pH" and "buffer solution" are the creations of - yeah, you guessed it! - the scientific establishment, who are given grants on condition that their research bolsters predetermined conclusions acceptable to Big Pharma and FedGov.

Wake up, sheeple!

Quigley says

I looked this up and it was easily disproved that ingesting alkaline water has any effect at all on the body, as it's instantly titrated by stomach acid. The human body maintains a constant pH of 7.55, and any deviation of more than 0.05 will be noticed immediately. If the goal of the water was to raise blood PH by decreasing acidity, it would be doing the body harm.

There could be more to that than just belief. It could be the body's reaction to correct the ph level that may be beneficial in her case. Not everybody has too much acid, a lot of people don't make enough stomach acid (esp. after overuse of anti-acids and antibiotics or just in general), which fosters the growth of yeast and unwanted gut bacteria. You never know.. ;)

Why did you change the name?

zerohedge says

But even though so many of us are aware of what is happening to us, we just can't seem to break out of it as a nation.

It really does seem like most people are walking around in a fog these days.

Maybe the fact that 70 million Americans are on mind-altering drugs has something to do with it.

Or maybe a bunch of middle-aged guys are confusing the deterioration of their bodies and minds for deterioration in society at large, as middle-aged guys are wont to do.

Quigley says

My mom swears that Kangen (TM) brand alkaline water has cured her illnesses, helped her lose weight, and helps with joint pain.

Ahhh.. I see what you did there. So basically you mention how you disproved how quack medicine ( alkaline water) doesn't cause people to lose weight and therefor that totally makes your previous point about SSRI's valid. Brilliant!

You know what? I read an article that cigarettes are good for you. I know you might find it hard to believe, but I'm not one to believe mountains of scientific and medical facts which claim otherwise. You see, I never went to medical school and so I can with confidence say I know a lot more than they do and so whatever I say here on this forum is true.

I see, thanks

This whole Obamacare is a bad joke on America.

It bears repeating what corntrolio said: Allocated is not the same as Spent.

Only dishonest right-wing propagandists would make the "mistake" of equating the two words or concepts.

OK, so if you only believe the manufacturer of your toxic SSRI placebos, here it is from the horse's mouth, the citalopram prescribing information including the black box warning mandated by FDA:

"Suicidality and Antidepressant Drugs

Antidepressants increased the risk compared to placebo of suicidal thinking and behavior (suicidality) in children, adolescents, and young adults in short-term studies of major depressive disorder (MDD) and other psychiatric disorders... (See WARNINGS: Clinical Worsening and Suicide Risk, PRECAUTIONS: Information for Patients, and PRECAUTIONS: Pediatric Use.)
***
Pooled analyses of short-term placebo-controlled trials of antidepressant drugs (SSRIs and others) showed that these drugs increase the risk of suicidal thinking and behavior (suicidality) in children, adolescents, and young adults (ages 18-24) with major depressive disorder (MDD) and other psychiatric disorders.
***
During marketing of Celexa and other SSRIs and SNRIs (serotonin and norepinephrine reuptake inhibitors), there have been spontaneous reports of adverse events occurring upon discontinuation of these drugs, particularly when abrupt, including the following: dysphoric mood, irritability, agitation, dizziness, sensory disturbances (e.g., paresthesias such as electric shock sensations), anxiety, confusion, headache, lethargy, emotional lability, insomnia, and hypomania
***
SSRIs and SNRIs, including Celexa, may increase the risk of bleeding events."

Those are just the parts that relate directly to the OP. There's lots more, including that even the manufacturer's own data (see above about "rescue countries") found those pills were twice as likely to cause nausea as benefit, but at least citalopram isn't as bad as its more popular cousin paroxetine (advertised on TV as Paxil). Also, you seem to misunderstand the word toxic, so you might want to look that up. I'd link to a definition but, this being a forum, you wouldn't believe me.

Call it Crazy says

What Happens When "The Workers" Just Don't Care Anymore?

You consume a lot more bodily fluids, especially if you're rude and/or don't tip well.

Somehow your sites always show that google screen saying something about unusual traffic.

edvard2 says

Whatever "studies" these are I would dearly love to see.

Well, there are a number of them. Here is one, published in JAMA, that got a lot of attention a few years ago:
"The magnitude of benefit of antidepressant medication compared with placebo increases with severity of depression symptoms and may be minimal or nonexistent, on average, in patients with mild or moderate symptoms"
http://jama.jamanetwork.com/article.aspx?articleid=185157
Hey, if the placebo works and the side effects are manageable (no homicidal or suicidal ideation, or severe libido decline, I hope) I say go for it.

SSRIs work on inhibiting seratonin reuptake by the cells, i.e. making more of it available at synapse. However, issues such as anxiety/depression have more going on than simply low levels of seratonin. There are a myriad of nuerotrasmitters that may be at play such as dopamine, gaba, etc. SSRIs don't do anything for those and some other substances that target dopamine have many deleterious side effects. In fact even SSRIs have been linked to suicidal tendencies in teenagers so they are not really "safe" from holistic perspective. And the fact that they must be taken for life is outright frightening.

sbh says

Nuthin' wurth lernin' ever comithout a beatin'.

How did you learn about sex?

New Renter says

Call it Crazy says

What Happens When "The Workers" Just Don't Care Anymore?

You consume a lot more bodily fluids, especially if you're rude and/or don't tip well.

http://www.youtube.com/embed/tSWnmOvgyKc

dublin hillz says

the fact that they must be taken for life is outright frightening.

Especially since the price (including the required Rx) has been increased artificially to levels that most people can't even afford, thus converting the addicts into compulsive advocates for mandatory subsidized insurance. The more people PhRMA can put on addictive "not habit forming" pills, and the higher it can raise the prices with subsidies and "no lifetime caps," the more captive constituents it can corral into its CAFO feedlot. BTW, the increased suicidality is particularly pronounced (i.e. around double the risk compared to placebo) in the 18-24 cohort, precisely the age of many of the returning vets who are offing themselves as described in the OP.

Dan8267 says

Capitalism rewards only one thing: bargaining power. It does not reward wealth production. If you want to be rich, don't do anything productive. Get real good at playing zero-sum games, especially with other people's money. That's the way America works, so why should Americans actually do work?

This is where I had to dislike your comment. You should get a better understanding on who and what capitalism rewards. If you truly think America is capitalist country, then you clearly don't know what a capitalist economy is.

spydah_hh says

If you truly think America is capitalist country, then you clearly don't know what a capitalist economy is.

I'm not going to get into a nomenclature debate about "capitalism" vs "corporatism". Our economy is the end-result of the capitalist philosophy which is that ownership is king. The "capital" in capitalism means money. Capitalism literally means an economic system controlled by those with the most money. So, no, wealth production isn't what gets rewarded by capitalist economies.

Dan8267 says

It tastes like shit

What are you drinking?

A Margarita with Cabo Wabo pure agave silver tequila, fresh squeezed lime juice, some sugar water, and a splash of Cointreau is delicious.

curious2 says

Antibiotics and vaccines did help in reducing infant mortality,

This is the reason for our increased longevity.
American Allopathy wants you to think it is the half million (X 250 thousand bucks) bypass surgeries they scare people into every year.
A Mayo study last year found that 40 (or possibly 60) percent of current medical practices may be ineffective.
http://www.advisory.com/daily-briefing/2013/07/26/mayo-clinic-146-common-practices-we-should-reconsider

If we are slinging SSRI anecdotes, here is mine.
I watched a person very close to me come off of Paroxetine, after taking it for several years. It was wrenching, an emotional nightmare. It took months to wean off and I don't think it could have been successful if they had been trying hold a job.

This just in, we still suck...
Thank you that is all... back to doing a sucky job(whitenoise)

Dan8267 says

So, no, wealth production isn't what gets rewarded by capitalist economies.

Very true. People who produce nothing, such as many people on Wall Street, make a ton of money. Prop trading doesn't really produce anything, for example. A lot of secondary market activity is non-productive to some extent -- certainly a lot of speculation doesn't produce anything.

Similarly, the real estate business doesn't really produce anything -- it's hard to ascertain the real value provided by realtors. There's no production there, just middle-men engaging in rent-seeking. There's no such thing as money on the sidelines -- when I buy a house, the seller now has my former sideline money on the sidelines again.

That doesn't mean there aren't services that add value. For example, certain investment banking functions do actually produce something. In the real estate business, people who renovate can produce value.

Robert Sproul says

Paroxetine

That's one of the most addictive, due mainly to the short serum half-life; BBC reported on it in an extended documentary program and individual reports; other published studies have found it more addictive than heroin and similarly habit forming to cocaine. GSK advertised it on American TV as "not habit forming" until FDA made them stop.

"Paxil is Forever"

In Orwellian PhRMA-speak, "not habit forming" means incredibly addictive.

sbh says

Anarchy offers no solution

A unabomber cabin on twenty acres, and a Trader Joes an hour away is about what I need I guess.

http://www.zillow.com/homedetails/XX-Paradise-Vly-Everson-WA-98295/2109248325_zpid/

a bit scary . . .

Shoulda got this place when it came up:

http://www.zillow.com/homedetails/9375-Heady-Rd-Sumas-WA-98295/117586961_zpid/

20 acres of WA state quietude; sold for $410 a year ago.

30 miles to the Trader Joes in Bham; perfect for a Leaf, though the energy budget for EVs maybe works better to be driving uphill on the outbound and downhill on the return -- nothing uphill of this place but wilderness.

Dan8267 says

spydah_hh says

If you truly think America is capitalist country, then you clearly don't know what a capitalist economy is.

I'm not going to get into a nomenclature debate about "capitalism" vs "corporatism". Our economy is the end-result of the capitalist philosophy which is that ownership is king. The "capital" in capitalism means money. Capitalism literally means an economic system controlled by those with the most money. So, no, wealth production isn't what gets rewarded by capitalist economies.

No our economy isn't the end-result of capitalism. The people or the market has lost control of the money since 1913 and along with it definition of capitalism. What we have is not capitalism but just a small shadow of it, if anything we're closer to socialism. The capitalist theory does not involve with the money supply being in the hands of government. He who controls the money supply controls the economy.

I encourage you to go read and understand what capitalism is about so you won't rant and give the wrong impression to others what capitalism is about. because like I said if you continue to call our economy a capitalist economy you clearly don't know what capitalism is. Capitalism is not quasi-capitalism or crony capitalism, it's capitalism or not.

I bet all the people who signed up were NWA types just standing in line because they thought there was FREE DRUGS at the end.

Fox News done tole me.

And 2% of $500,000 is still a lot of money.

0'rsbh says

Anarchy offers no solution, just dissolution of the present and a future built around the "notness" of what got burned to the ground. When the fires start the anarchists just sit and watch, enrapt, enthralled, complete. Or, some one would pay the fire department not to extinguish the fire in the house of the guy he hates. All it takes is the money. It's worse than what we have now.

WTF are you talking about?

The point is that we need a smaller government. Your conjecture is irrelevant.

sbh says

Every counterpoint to our current system that you ever make is pure conjecture. You have every right to be wrong and you never fail to be so. It's when you bust yourself in the chops by doing precisely as you berate others of doing that you just exemplify how pointless and deluded you are.

You are pontificating, what I'm talking about is simple and true.

Don't hire an agent. Do it yourself. It's easier than you think, or should I say easier than the real estate agents want you to think.

Dan8267 says

Call it Crazy says

Maybe the fact that 70 million Americans are on mind-altering drugs has something to do with it.

150 million Americans are on mind-altering drugs. The majority of adult Americans drink alcoholic beverages. Alcohol is a mind-altering drug. That's the whole point of it. It tastes like shit, so the only reason to drink it is to alter your mind.

Two points for Dan

Dan8267 says

Call it Crazy says

The level of sloth, laziness and apathy that we are witnessing in this country is absolutely mind-numbing.

The grunt worker knows the system is rigged and no matter how much he wealth he produces, he won't get ahead. What did you expect to happen?

Capitalism rewards only one thing: bargaining power. It does not reward wealth production. If you want to be rich, don't do anything productive. Get real good at playing zero-sum games, especially with other people's money. That's the way America works, so why should Americans actually do work?

Three points for Dan.

indigenous says

The point is that we need a smaller government

I was going to argue, but a ~$17,000 per-capita gov't expense is somewhat ridiculous.

http://research.stlouisfed.org/fred2/graph/?g=vHT

real per-capita total govt expense

Well, I still argue I guess, for without government redistribution I think the 99% is totally fucked in this country going forward.

Conservatives want to neuter "government", but by doing so they neuter democracy and thereby empower wealth -- "privilege" -- even more.

The wealthy of the UK, Sweden, etc did not like the outright punitive taxation levels of the 1960s and 70s.

Plenty of mistakes were made by the leftists running these socialist experiments (confiscatory taxation was one), but even as it stands now the average guy in UK and Sweden has a better deal than here, now.

http://www.theguardian.com/business/2013/may/28/worlds-happiest-countries-oecd-australia

We don't need more government per se, but we do need better government. For what our government is spending on healthcare we could have the Canadian or Swedish systems for free -- their per-capita expenses are less than half ours.

It'd be good to cut the DOD in half, too, but we can't do that in isolation, not that democratic governance will ever be able to cut back a gravy train (so critical to local economies) like that.