patrick.net

The Russians killed 3 civilians while putting out the lights in the Ukraine.

Time to call the Security Council.

Yes, hitting civilian infrastructure is a war crime. However, retaliatory measures are allowed. The Ukraine shouldn't have hit Russian infrastructure first.

Gotta feel sorry for the people though. Russia is simply mimicking our DoD talking points that we use when bombing countries about how the population should rise up against Zelenski.

https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/world/ukraine-zelenski-calls-for-urgent-meeting-of-un-security-council-after-russian-offensive-on-kiev/ar-AA14tlyD?cvid=c25108d1047a443594dcd960ec840ad1

I assume that you are referring to the attack on the Crimea bridge on 10/8/2022 when you say that the Ukraine hit Russian civilian infrastructure first.

Would there have been any Russian attack on Ukrainian civilian infrastructure before that date, what measures would have been allowed for the Ukrainians?

The EU Parliament declared Russia a State sponsor of terrorism.

Symbolic, but they decided Russia's campaign against Ukraine's power grid was excessive. They also lumped in some individual atrocities into that.

Unlike a US declaration, the EU declaration doesn't carry any penalties.

https://www.aljazeera.com/news/2022/11/24/will-the-eu-parliaments-stance-towards-russia-have-consequences

Misc says

Unlike a US declaration, the EU declaration doesn't carry any penalties.

Doesn't carry any weight. Russia hasn't done anything the US hasn't done, with the complete silence of Europe.

The FIRST thing the US does is attack infrastructure. That was "shock and awe". They are doing this to Yemen, Somalia, and Syria now.

The US has no moral authority. They abandoned this moral authority at least 20 years ago, maybe 30. Maybe it was never there. The US engaged in firebombing of Japan and that war would have never happened if the US didn't do an oil embargo on Japan, but I think Japan deserved it - what they did to the Chinese was monstrous, but what we did to Japan, equally so. We didn't have to drop nuclear weapons, but we did.

Psychopaths run our world.

The US military does not attack civilian infrastructure purposefully. "Shock and Awe" was against military targets.

Russia did not purposefully attack civilian infrastructure until after its infrastructure was attacked. Perhaps the Europeans have it correct that the Russians have gotten carried away, but considering the attack on Nordstream perhaps the devastation is acceptable. Putin has certainly been increasing the costs of war incrementally against his foes.

If todays militaries directly attacked civilians, the death tolls would be staggering.

Misc,

I am trying to understand you point of view. What was the first attack on Russia's civilian infrastructure?

yawaraf says

Misc,

I am trying to understand you point of view. What was the first attack on Russia's civilian infrastructure?

The first attack was on the Nordstream 2 (that was a major attack). There was a secondary attack on the bridge from Crimea.

Russia declared that it was the UK that launched the terrorist attack on Nordstream-2. However, a retaliatory attack against UK infrastructure could lead to a major war. So, Russia is simply using the Ukraine as a proxy. Sucks to be a Ukrainian.

Misc says

The US military does not attack civilian infrastructure purposefully.

Haha!

Ever look at pictures of Libya before and after? Or Syria? Or Iraq?

https://shootsearcher.com/post-syria-before-and-after/

It's easy to find.

Misc says

"Shock and Awe" was against military targets.

Iraq was the military target.

The US' standard operating procedure is to destroy the country, ever fucking time, everywhere.

Misc says

Russia declared that it was the UK that launched the terrorist attack on Nordstream-2. However, a retaliatory attack against UK infrastructure could lead to a major war. So, Russia is simply using the Ukraine as a proxy. Sucks to be a Ukrainian.

Russia is just going to let Europe cut its own throat. I'm surprised they haven't turned off the Turkish Stream.

Not only do psychopaths run the United States they are stupid ones too. The United States may as well have declared war on Europe when they blew up the Nordstream I and II. It's possible the British did it, but they didn't do it without the US giving a thumbs up.

All these years of war is to break Eurasia into two again. If Europe wasn't run by traitors, they would have dumped their stupid alliances with the United States and shook hands with Russia 20 years ago.

Misc says

The first attack was on the Nordstream 2 (that was a major attack). There was a secondary attack on the bridge from Crimea.

Russia declared that it was the UK that launched the terrorist attack on Nordstream-2. However, a retaliatory attack against UK infrastructure could lead to a major war. So, Russia is simply using the Ukraine as a proxy. Sucks to be a Ukrainian.

There are some allegations of deliberate Russian attacks on Ukrainian health care facilities. I've linked to some which allegedly happened in March 2022, (Nordstream was blown up in September 2022). Do you consider these allegations to be true, and if so, do you still hold that is was the Ukrainans who first started attacking their enemy's civilian infrastructure?

https://reliefweb.int/report/ukraine/attacks-hospitals-and-healthcare-ukraine-joint-submission-united-nations-independent-international-commission-inquiry-ukraine-september-2022

richwicks says

Ceffer says

Bush and Clinton gifted out nuclear weapons to the Globalists for extortion purposes, so weapons provenance no longer has much of an association with perp provenance.

Nuclear weapons need regular refinement of the plutonium to function. If they aren't duds now, they will soon be.

The plutonium is constantly breaking down through nuclear fission. The fissile material must be refined repeatedly and regularly to keep it working as a nuclear weapon.

Considering how our government seems to prefer stealing money and doesn't give a fuck about winning war, I wouldn't be surprised if the US has NO operational nuclear weapons at this point.

The half-life of Pu 239 (the majority isotope) is 24,000 years, that of Pu 240 is 6500 years. It is unlikely that the Pu degrades through radioactive decay over the course of decades enough to warrant re-refining. The most likely reason for overhauling warheads is that they are boosted fission weapons, employing a small amount of tritium to juice the overall yield. Tritium has a half-life of 7 years, so this does rapidly degrade through radioactive decay. The next likely reason for re-machining is that the Pu pit is subject to some degree of liquifaction, kind of like old window glass that becomes wavy over time. This deformation of the pit could affect warhead reliability by messing with the shape/clearances of the fissile elements, especially in the case of a U235/Pu levitated core.

Basic electronics also degrade over time. I imagine radioactive environments don't help.

It was claimed that one of the remaining 'suitcase nukes' placed throughout the cities of the world for blackmail and intimidation by the various Globalists powers and entities (until Guv devised remote methods for detecting and removing them) was found in Australia in an inoperable condition, because all of the support electronics had deteriorated.

I suppose it should be good news that nukes have a limited shelf life from one cause or another.

yawaraf says

Misc says

The first attack was on the Nordstream 2 (that was a major attack). There was a secondary attack on the bridge from Crimea.

Russia declared that it was the UK that launched the terrorist attack on Nordstream-2. However, a retaliatory attack against UK infrastructure could lead to a major war. So, Russia is simply using the Ukraine as a proxy. Sucks to be a Ukrainian.

There are some allegations of deliberate Russian attacks on Ukrainian health care facilities. I've linked to some which allegedly happened in March 2022, (Nordstream was blown up in September 2022). Do you consider these allegations to be true, and if so, do you still hold that is was the Ukrainans who first started attacking their enemy's civilian infrastructure?

https://reliefweb.int/report/ukraine/attacks-hospitals-and-healthcare-ukraine-joint-submission-united-nations-inde...

The pro-Ukrainian NGOs stated themselves that only about 200 people were killed in about 500 attacks. If Russia had purposefully attacked the medical facilities of the Ukraine the death toll would have been easily in the tens of thousands. Were Ukrainian units stationed near these facilities? I would probably say yes, thus Russia was permitted to attack those military units.

On the subject of liberation:

According to the Institute for the Study of War, Ukraine has now liberated 63 per cent of the territory invaded by the Russian army since the start of the invasion on February 24, or around 75,000 square kilometers (as of November 12).
The Putin-ordered invasion had enabled Moscow to secure or advance on one-fifth of Ukrainian territory by February-March 2022, or about 119,000 square kilometers. At the peak of the Russian invasion, counting the regions under its control before February 24, Russia occupied a little more than 160,000 square kilometers of its neighbor's territory. But since then, the Russian withdrawal from the northern part of the country and the Ukrainian army's counter-offensives in the east and south have enabled Kiev to recover almost half of this area (47%).

https://www.statista.com/chart/28748/ukraine-territory-control-status-distribution/

Misc says

The pro-Ukrainian NGOs stated themselves that only about 200 people were killed in about 500 attacks. If Russia had purposefully attacked the medical facilities of the Ukraine the death toll would have been easily in the tens of thousands. Were Ukrainian units stationed near these facilities? I would probably say yes, thus Russia was permitted to attack those military units.

I agree that in a single deliberate attack on a hospital there would easily be a few hundred casualties. I concede that I don't have any information so show that it was not the Ukraine that first attacked civilian infrastructure.

You use phrases such as "Russia was permitted", and, "retaliatory measures are allowed". Are these your personal beliefs, or are referring to certain treaties or other legislation?

yawaraf says

I agree that in a single deliberate attack on a hospital there would easily be a few hundred casualties. I concede that I don't have any information so show that it was not the Ukraine that first attacked civilian infrastructure.

You use phrases such as "Russia was permitted", and, "retaliatory measures are allowed". Are these your personal beliefs, or are referring to certain treaties or other legislation?

There's no rules in war.

Russia has found that time is on their side. They are apparently are going to go through a war of attrition recognizing this war is actually one against the United States and NATO.

The US commonly destroys infrastructure. The US has killed an estimated 9 million people in the last 20 years in 7 wars, which you can't even name. Russia is just going to sit back and let Europe crumble, which is the United States' mad dog. This war is likely to go on for years.

How happy is it, to Russia, that the destruction of the Nordstream I and II can be blamed on the United States, and with the stupid statements of Biden promising that those pipelines would be shut down one way or another? Russia may not only destroy NATO, but the EU itself. If the EU wasn't run by a bunch of quisling traitors, 20 years ago, Europe would have made alliances with Russia and pulled Russia into modernity and democracy, if they weren't run by traitors - controlled by the United States.

https://slaynews.com/news/european-officials-reach-limit-with-joe-biden-accuse-usa-of-profiting-from-war-in-ukraine-report/

“The fact is, if you look at it soberly, the country that is most profiting from this war is the U.S. because they are selling more gas and at higher prices, and because they are selling more weapons,” one senior official told politico.

“We are really at a historic juncture,” the official added before complaining about trade disruption from U.S. subsidies and high energy prices.

“America needs to realize that public opinion is shifting in many EU countries.”

Rockefeller stooge Biden Actor creating artificial shortages of fuel to jack up inflated, speculative prices for his masters. How sweet it is. Wouldn't want those pesky Russkie pipelines keeping the prices down.

https://slaynews.com/news/biden-admin-unable-account-20-billion-us-aid-sent-ukraine/

Biden Admin Unable to Account for $20 Billion in U.S Aid Sent to Ukraine

I bet they would find that "lost" $20 billion if they were to look in their own pockets.

Patrick says

https://slaynews.com/news/biden-admin-unable-account-20-billion-us-aid-sent-ukraine/

Biden Admin Unable to Account for $20 Billion in U.S Aid Sent to Ukraine

I bet they would find that "lost" $20 billion if they were to look in their own pockets.

Biden looks inside pocket: oh how did all this money get here?

https://zero-sum.org/us-aid-to-ukraine-invested-in-crypto-ftx-scheme/

Nobody has even commented on Ukraine in 2 days and it's no longer in the "news". Almost like it's yet another US war for money laundering that will drag on for a few years, if not decades.

richwicks says

Nobody has even commented on Ukraine in 2 days and it's no longer in the "news". Almost like it's yet another US war for money laundering that will drag on for a few years, if not decades.

The establishment is trying to figure a way to appease the peasants after proclaiming that the Ukrainians are winning since the military operations started.

They may be in negotiations with the Russians about ending the conflict, but since that would be admitting that the Russians get to keep territory, it wouldn't play well for the TV audience. They gotta get it out of the news for a while for them to spin it properly.

Misc says

They may be in negotiations with the Russians about ending the conflict, but since that would be admitting that the Russians get to keep territory, it wouldn't play well for the TV audience. They gotta get it out of the news for a while for them to spin it properly.

The US will drag this war out for as long as possible - for at LEAST 6 more months if not years, and when it ends, I bet there's barely a mention of it in "the news". The US will claim "Ukraine won" (no matter WHAT happens to Ukraine) and that "Russia lost" and the US "news" media will parrot that bullshit endlessly

https://babylonbee.com/news/absentminded-joe-biden-accidentally-mails-stimulus-checks-to-defense-contractors-instead-of-americans

https://babylonbee.com/news/zelensky-seen-sitting-on-mall-santas-lap-asking-for-another-50-billion

Duh, the reasons are that Ukraine:

1. is useful for money laundering "aid" back to Democrats' pockets
2. has strong evidence of the Biden Crime Family's corruption
3. has evidence of US bioweapons production

https://www.thegatewaypundit.com/2022/12/ukrainian-president-zelenskys-wife-goes-paris-begs-money-goods-reportedly-goes-40000-euro-shopping-spree/

Ukrainian President Zelensky’s Wife Goes to Paris and Begs for Money and Goods Then Reportedly Goes on 40,000 Euro Shopping Spree

https://notthebee.com/article/reports-show-that-very-little-of-the-aid-sent-from-the-united-states-and-europe-to-ukraine-is-getting-to-its-intended-recipients-including-weapons

To date, the United States, the European Union, and a handful of other countries have sent $100 billion in aid to Ukraine, including weapons and "other" aid like piles of cash. According to a "sensitive but unclassified" cable from the United States embassy in Kyiv, reported on by Politico, there's been some difficulty tracking where all this aid is going.

U.S. Ambassador Bridget Brink, who sent the cable, says that chaos on the ground and a history of corruption makes wars like the one in Ukraine very expensive and difficult to track.

In April, Jonas Ohman, the president of an organization moving aid into Ukraine, said that only 30-40% of aid was making it to its intended destination.

African nations have complained that weapons the West has sent to Ukraine to aid in its fight against Russia have started to pour into their nations via Ukrainian arms dealers.

Nigerian President Muhammadu Buhari warned,

Regrettably, the situation in the Sahel and the raging war in Ukraine serve as major sources of weapons and fighters that bolster the ranks of the terrorists in the region.

He is referring to the Boko Haram terrorists eradicating Christians across the region for those keeping track.

Stinger and Javelin missiles sent to Kiev are being sold on the black market in Albania and Kosovo.

The Finnish National Bureau of Investigation said intelligence suggests that some of the weapons sent to Ukraine had made their way to Finland, Sweden, Denmark, and the Netherlands and were being used by motorcycle gangs.

https://www.politico.com/news/2022/12/14/us-ukraine-aid-cable-00073803

Patrick says

https://www.thegatewaypundit.com/2022/12/ukrainian-president-zelenskys-wife-goes-paris-begs-money-goods-reportedly-goes-40000-euro-shopping-spree/

Ukrainian President Zelensky’s Wife Goes to Paris and Begs for Money and Goods Then Reportedly Goes on 40,000 Euro Shopping Spree

“Reliable store clerk” (with no name) - that's solid evidence right there! Right on par with "safe and effective vaccine".