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Extract 190K from my fourplex to an offshore Swiss account
invite response
2011 Oct 14, 5:25am 4,245 views 13 comments
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bighorse
2011 Oct 14, 5:59am
Take the Heloc if you can, move it overseas in chunks smaller than $10,000 each transfer. Sign 1 year leases with tenants on the quadplex, and take a large security deposit. Keep collecting rent while neglecting maintenance. When the foreclosure day comes, run.
About legality... I have no idea.
Beyond the legality issues (consult a lawyer because it sounds like you're comfortable doing shady things), if you're in a non-recourse state, one question would be whether your current mortgage is non-recourse. If so, walk away, especially since your HELOC will be recourse debt.
Also, what about using the $190K to make the repairs?
From what I have read, my state is a "one action" state. Meaning the lender can come after me one time for the money owed from the foreclosure.
Also, I will not rip off my renters in any way. They will get security deposits back and at least 30 days notice to move. I would just rip off the bank. Yes, it's shady, I know.
If I pay for repairs from my heloc, I am only further underwater and will still lose the fourplex sometime soon. At least it would be reapired when it's returned to the lender, I guess.
Well it seems like you are more comfortable doing something fraudulent/quasi-fraudulent than just walking away. Don't really think we should be providing you advice on that. You made a bad business decision, and now it's time to pay the piper. I'm sorry you're in a tough situation, but that doesn't mean you should now go rip other people off.
By the way, one-action is different from recourse vs. non-recourse.
PockyClipsNow
2011 Oct 14, 8:33am
Be advised this conversation may be pointless.
I have read where a HELOC when you actually write that check is then denied after the bank does a current appraisal. Checks can take 10 days to clear or longer in the best case right?
Why not cash that check and put into your own bank to see if it clears and report back to us? I think you might be surprised that they are shutting off these 'bubble helocs' but of course anything can happen our country is falling apart.
Assuming you could get the 190K, I was under the impression that Swiss banks would not allow american citizens to open an account due to IRS reporting requirements...
bubblesitter
2011 Oct 14, 1:29pm
Assuming you could get the 190K, I was under the impression that Swiss banks would not allow american citizens to open an account due to IRS reporting requirements...
Yeah,move it to China instead cuz all of our money goes to China anyways.
Vicente
2011 Oct 14, 2:57pm
Move to a non-recourse state, buy property and occupy it there. However I think they are still going to be able to come after you for the HELOC money you took out. So you're gonna get screwed but perhaps to a lesser degree.
Apocalypse, your comment rang true. I want to do the right thing and I've decided not to go through with this crazy idea.
Wells Fargo holds the note, to answer your question.
I've decided to let the repairs go for awhile, try to keep it rented, and hope for rents to increase over time. In the end I may lose this fourplex but there is also a chance of keeping it, and I want to strive for that small chance rather than give up prematurely and do something unethical instead.
I am barely getting by, owner occupying my fourplex. It needs a lot of repairs and I can't afford them. My investment is draining me, and within a few years I will either lose the place to a foreclosure/short sale or declare bankruptcy. I don't see a way out unless I can get a high paying job to afford the repairs, which isn't likely.
BUT, I still have a $190,000 heloc on my fourplex from "the boom years" when my fourplex was worth double what it is now.
I could borrow $190,000, put it into a Swiss bank account, then at least I may have some money after I lose my fourplex. I have always "played by the rules" and this feels wrong but I am still considering it as a way to get back some of the cash I've put into my fourplex.
Or, I could borrow $190,000 and buy a duplex here in the US. But would I lose it, too, when my current fourplex is foreclosed?
Also, will I go to jail for moving this money to an offshore account? Is this fraud? How bad is this? Will the bank even notice what I've done with the heloc, or will it just go into the huge pile of foreclosures? Would it be better to do a short sale and lose what I put into my fourplex?
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