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Save money. Don't buy vitamins

By tovarichpeter follow tovarichpeter   2013 Jul 20, 5:01am 9,004 views   120 comments   watch   nsfw   quote   share    


http://www.theatlantic.com/health/archive/2013/07/the-vitamin-myth-why-we-think-we-need-supplements/277947/

Nutrition experts contend that all we need is what's typically found in a routine diet. Industry representatives, backed by a fascinating history, argue that foods don't contain enough, and we need supplements. Fortunately, many excellent studies have now resolved the issue.

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81   puhim   ignore (3)   2013 Jul 20, 12:08pm     ↓ dislike (0)   quote   flag        

http://orthomolecular.org/history/index.shtml

Orthomolecular Hall Of Fame

The importance of diet in relationship to optimal health has been understood throughout recorded history. Hippocrates regarded food as a primary form of medicine more than 2,500 years ago. Records from ancient Egypt as far back as 5000 BC show the use of specific foods to treat various conditions.

82   puhim   ignore (3)   2013 Jul 20, 12:09pm     ↓ dislike (0)   quote   flag        

The first person to show a direct link between disease and a lack of a specific nutrient was James Lind, a physician in the British navy, who discovered that sailors on long voyages without rations containing citrus fruits developed bleeding gums, rough skin, poor muscle tension, and slow-healing wounds, all symptoms characteristic of scurvy. In 1757, in one of the first controlled medical experiments, Lind demonstrated that when sailors were supplied with lemons, limes, and oranges, scurvy could be prevented. As a result of his findings, Captain James Cook made it mandatory that every English sailor be supplied with rations of lemons and limes, enabling to sail around the world scurvy-free, as well as supplying them with the nickname "limeys." Today, it is well known that scurvy is due to vitamin C deficiency.

83   puhim   ignore (3)   2013 Jul 20, 12:09pm     ↓ dislike (0)   quote   flag        

Christiaan Eijkman
1858-1930

Christiaan Eijkman, a Dutch physician, is famous for his nutritional research. In 1893 he discovered that a diet of polished (overkvernet) rice causes beriberi, and was able to produce the disease experimentally in birds. He discovered vitamin B.

In 1897, Christiaan Eijkman proved that an element in unpolished rice was essential to proper functioning of the nervous system and carbohydrate metabolism, and that a deficiency in that ingredient could cause beriberi and other diseases. In 1929, his research resulted in him sharing the Nobel Prize with British biochemist Sir Frederick Gowland Hopkins for physiology and medicine.

84   Bigsby   ignore (10)   2013 Jul 20, 12:10pm     ↓ dislike (0)   quote   flag        

puhim says

Bigsby says

I laugh when you reference research from the 1930s and an alternative medicine news service. It's hardly the BMJ, is it?

Realy, you dumbass

http://www.orthomolecular.org/library/jom/editors.shtml

Is it or is it not an alternative med site? Are you arguing it is the equivalent of something like the BMJ?

85   puhim   ignore (3)   2013 Jul 20, 12:10pm     ↓ dislike (0)   quote   flag        

But these guys know nothing right!

86   puhim   ignore (3)   2013 Jul 20, 12:11pm     ↓ dislike (0)   quote   flag        

Abram Hoffer, M.D., Ph.D.
1917-2009
Hall of Fame 2006
Abram Hoffer was an internationally recognized physician, author, medical researcher and pioneer in the use of vitamins and nutrients to treat disease. Dr. Hoffer has spent the past five decades conducting research related to the practice of orthomolecular medicine, which emphasizes the use of nutrients in optimum doses for the treatment of a wide range of diseases. His medical discoveries have been the topic of more than a dozen books and literally hundreds of research papers.

In 1952 he and his colleagues began developing a more effective treatment for schizophrenia that involved a biochemical hypothesis. They tried two nutrients: vitamin C and vitamin B3. He found that we could halve the two-year recovery rate of patients just by adding these vitamins to the program. This was the first major systematic attempt to use large dosages of vitamins therapeutically. In 1955 he also discovered that niacin lowered cholesterol levels.

87   Bigsby   ignore (10)   2013 Jul 20, 12:12pm     ↓ dislike (0)   quote   flag        

puhim says

But these guys know nothing right!

They seemingly don't know enough to get themselves published in respected journals.

88   puhim   ignore (3)   2013 Jul 20, 12:12pm     ↓ dislike (0)   quote   flag        

Bigsby says

Is it or is it not an alternative med site?

No it is not an alternative med site. Not by a mile.

90   Bigsby   ignore (10)   2013 Jul 20, 12:13pm     ↓ dislike (0)   quote   flag        

puhim says

Bigsby says

Is it or is it not an alternative med site?

No it is not an alternative med site. Not by a mile.

What is it then? And don't lie...

91   puhim   ignore (3)   2013 Jul 20, 12:14pm     ↓ dislike (0)   quote   flag        

NOTE: Four decades of papers from the Journal of Orthomolecular Medicine are now online for you to read.href="http://orthomolecular.org/library/jom/" http://orthomolecular.org/library/jom/ The JOM Archive is a free service with no advertising.

92   Bigsby   ignore (10)   2013 Jul 20, 12:15pm     ↓ dislike (0)   quote   flag        

puhim says

http://orthomolecular.org/index.shtml

it is peer-reviewed

By people who believe in the same thing.

93   puhim   ignore (3)   2013 Jul 20, 12:15pm     ↓ dislike (0)   quote   flag        

Bigsby says

What is it then? And don't lie...

Do some reading. You may find it informative.

94   Bigsby   ignore (10)   2013 Jul 20, 12:16pm     ↓ dislike (0)   quote   flag        

puhim says

NOTE: Four decades of papers from the Journal of Orthomolecular Medicine are now online for you to read.href="http://orthomolecular.org/library/jom/" http://orthomolecular.org/library/jom/ The JOM Archive is a free service with no advertising.

You haven't answered my question.

95   puhim   ignore (3)   2013 Jul 20, 12:17pm     ↓ dislike (0)   quote   flag        

http://orthomolecular.org/resources/omns/v06n03.shtml

OMNS, January 15, 2010) Did you know that there are "good" medical journals, and that there are "naughty" medical journals?

It is a medical journal. peer reviewed.

I guess self described as "NAUGHTY"?

96   Bigsby   ignore (10)   2013 Jul 20, 12:17pm     ↓ dislike (0)   quote   flag        

puhim says

Bigsby says

What is it then? And don't lie...

Do some reading. You may find it informative.

I have. It is a website for alternative medicine based on nutrition. It isn't a mainstream medical journal or website.

97   Bigsby   ignore (10)   2013 Jul 20, 12:19pm     ↓ dislike (0)   quote   flag        

puhim says

http://orthomolecular.org/resources/omns/v06n03.shtml

OMNS, January 15, 2010) Did you know that there are "good" medical journals, and that there are "naughty" medical journals?

It is a medical journal. peer reviewed.

And there you have it.

98   puhim   ignore (3)   2013 Jul 20, 12:19pm     ↓ dislike (0)   quote   flag        

Bigsby says

I have. It is a website for alternative medicine based on nutrition. It isn't a mainstream medical journal or website.

no, it is a medical journal.

I love how your opinions don't allow you to think beyond "MAINSTREAM" regardless if you have not read anything on the medical journal.

99   puhim   ignore (3)   2013 Jul 20, 12:21pm     ↓ dislike (0)   quote   flag        

Bigsby says

And there you have it.

of course, that's why i posted it. i think they have amazing content all peer reviewed, even some from Harvard, but MAINSTREAM MEDIA, well that WOULD NEVER BE BOUGHT AND PAID FOR!

Use your brain!

100   puhim   ignore (3)   2013 Jul 20, 12:23pm     ↓ dislike (0)   quote   flag        

trust me you are not smart enough to even start to debunk anything on that site.

but they all must be lying to us!!!

thats why 70-80% of all Americans suffer with Vitamin deficiencies.

keep thinking you are eating a healthy diet.

101   puhim   ignore (3)   2013 Jul 20, 12:24pm     ↓ dislike (0)   quote   flag        

http://orthomolecular.org/history/myths/index.shtml

Myth: Vitamins are dangerous.

Truth: In over the past 10 years, no one has died from taking vitamin supplements.
According to the "2001 Annual Report of the American Association of Poison Control Centers Toxic Exposure Surveillance System," the number of deaths resulted from taking vitamins is ZERO.

Myth: No one is deficient of essential nutrients.

Truth: According to the "USDA's Continuing Survey of Food Intakes by Individuals", a major amount of people do not consume enough essential vitamins and minerals in their diets compared to the Recommended Dietary Allowances (RDAs). Below are some statistics from the survey which list the percentage of people (age 20 and over) who do not meet the RDAs for:

Vitamin A:
Males: 60.9%
Females: 59.6%
Vitamin E:
Males: 64.4%
Females: 73.0%
Vitamin B6:
Males: 52.6%
Females: 64.2%
Calcium:
Males: 55.4%
Females: 78.0%
Magnesium:
Males: 65.7%
Females: 75.7%
Zinc:
Males: 67.6%
Females: 82.6%

103   puhim   ignore (3)   2013 Jul 20, 12:27pm     ↓ dislike (0)   quote   flag        

You still think you are eating a healthy "ENOUGH"diet?

104   Bigsby   ignore (10)   2013 Jul 20, 12:33pm     ↓ dislike (0)   quote   flag        

puhim says

Bigsby says

I have. It is a website for alternative medicine based on nutrition. It isn't a mainstream medical journal or website.

no, it is a medical journal.

I love how your opinions don't allow you to think beyond "MAINSTREAM" regardless if you have not read anything on the medical journal.

And I love how you take medical views expressed on an alternative medicine website as gospel because they are reviewed by people who also believe in this particular area of alternative medicine. You aren't Bgamall/The Professor are you because your argument seems to be the medical equivalent of their 9/11 spiel. 'Don't believe the 9/11 story? Then look at the 'proof' on this website.'

105   Bigsby   ignore (10)   2013 Jul 20, 12:36pm     ↓ dislike (0)   quote   flag        

puhim says

You still think you are eating a healthy "ENOUGH"diet?

Since when did anyone argue that nobody was deficient in vitamins. Do your websites enjoy refuting myths that never existed in the first place?

106   puhim   ignore (3)   2013 Jul 20, 12:36pm     ↓ dislike (0)   quote   flag        

Bigsby you cannot claim to even be in a conversation when you cannot open your own mind beyond what is considered "MAINSTREAM", when the fact is that this site is peer reviewed way beyond your understanding and
education. The reason I posted the press release showing how "MAINSTREAM" ignores them was to show how pathetic the "MAINSTREAM" are, how bought and paid for by the BIG PHARMA the so called "MAINSTREAM JOURNALS ARE". Even studies from Harvard and a lot more are deemed "NAUGHTY"

So shut it!

It shows your true ignorance to information so my mission is complete.

107   puhim   ignore (3)   2013 Jul 20, 12:40pm     ↓ dislike (0)   quote   flag        

Bigsby your an ASKHOLE IGNORAMOUS

108   puhim   ignore (3)   2013 Jul 20, 12:41pm     ↓ dislike (0)   quote   flag        

that is Bigsby you are someone who asks like a dick for evidence of something and then denies what is in-front of him

109   Bigsby   ignore (10)   2013 Jul 20, 12:45pm     ↓ dislike (0)   quote   flag        

puhim says

Bigsby you cannot claim to even be in a conversation when you cannot open your own mind beyond what is considered "MAINSTREAM", when the fact is that this site is peer reviewed way beyond your understanding and

education. The reason I posted the press release showing how "MAINSTREAM" ignores them was to show how pathetic the "MAINSTREAM" are, how bought and paid for by the BIG PHARMA the so called "MAINSTREAM JOURNALS ARE". Even studies from Harvard and a lot more are deemed "NAUGHTY"

So shut it!

It shows your true ignorance to information so my mission is complete.

Yes, it says everything that needs to be said that you favour an alternative medicine website over widely respected medical journals. You are indeed a free-thinker... free of any brain cells that is.

110   puhim   ignore (3)   2013 Jul 20, 12:48pm     ↓ dislike (0)   quote   flag        

Bigsby says

Yes, it says everything that needs to be said that you favour an alternative medicine website over widely respected medical journals. You are indeed a free-thinker... free of any brain cells that is.

Your logic makes no sense. For one I never claimed that I would never reference mainstream journals. In fact even Harvard articles are left out amongst many, many other so-called "MAINSTREAM" studies.

My process was to show that you infact could not think beyond your own nose.

Gaga goo goo.

Pre-programmed zombie.

You sound like your are suffering Serious Arrested Development but I'm no doctor!
Just a well informed by stander

111   Bigsby   ignore (10)   2013 Jul 20, 12:53pm     ↓ dislike (0)   quote   flag        

puhim says

that is Bigsby you are someone who asks like a dick for evidence of something and then denies what is in-front of him

No, I'm quite happy to review evidence from respected medical journals because I have no problem taking a range of extra vitamins if it is demonstrated that I'm not getting what is needed from a good balanced diet. However, startling as it may seem, just like I don't get my facts about 9/11 from 9/11truthers.org (or whatever it's called), I don't get well supported medical information from alternative medical websites because, surprise, surprise, they aren't well-supported.

112   puhim   ignore (3)   2013 Jul 20, 12:56pm     ↓ dislike (0)   quote   flag        

Bigsby says

No, I'm quite happy to review evidence from respected medical journals because I have no problem taking a range of extra vitamins if it is demonstrated that I'm not getting what is needed from a good balanced diet. However, startling as it may seem, just like I don't get my facts about 9/11 from 9/11truthers.org (or whatever it's called), I don't get well supported medical information from alternative medical websites because, surprise, surprise, they aren't well-supported.

Do you realize how asleep you are?

Cypher: You know, I know this steak doesn't exist. I know that when I put it in my mouth, the Matrix is telling my brain that it is juicy and delicious. After nine years, you know what I realize?
[Takes a bite of steak]
Cypher: Ignorance is bliss.

113   Bigsby   ignore (10)   2013 Jul 20, 12:56pm     ↓ dislike (0)   quote   flag        

puhim says

Bigsby says

Yes, it says everything that needs to be said that you favour an alternative medicine website over widely respected medical journals. You are indeed a free-thinker... free of any brain cells that is.

Your logic makes no sense. For one I never claimed that I would never reference mainstream journals. In fact even Harvard articles are left out amongst many, many other so-called "MAINSTREAM" studies.

My process was to show that you infact could not think beyond your own nose.

Gaga goo goo.

Pre-programmed zombie.

You sound like your are suffering Serious Arrested Development but I'm no doctor!

Then why are you only referencing articles from the 1930s and an alternative med site? I'd be more than happy to read some research from the many well-respected medical journals out there - you know, the ones that scientists actually want to get published in.

114   puhim   ignore (3)   2013 Jul 20, 12:58pm     ↓ dislike (0)   quote   flag        

Bigsby says

because, surprise, surprise, they aren't well-supported.

http://orthomolecular.org/resources/omns/v06n05.shtml

FOR IMMEDIATE RELEASE
Orthomolecular Medicine News Service, January 21, 2010

How to Fool All of the People All of the Time:
US Taxpayers Fund Library Censorship

(OMNS, January 21, 2010) At a recent emergency meeting of the World Headquarters Of Pharmaceutical Politicians, Educators, and Reporters (WHOPPER):

"Ladies and gentlemen, we have a slight problem. The public is beginning to complain about how the US National Library of Medicine censors nutritional research. This is embarrassing, as the last thing we want is for taxpayers to question how their tax money is spent. It is none of their damn business. But it is definitely a matter of business, big business, for WHOPPER.

"Up until now, when people write to complain about journal censorship ( custserv@nlm.nih.gov ) , we've managed to get away with NLM sending out this form letter reply: 'The National Library of Medicine (NLM) uses a 15-person advisory committee of health professionals and librarians to recommend titles to be indexed. This committee uses guidelines, available to the public on our website, such as scientific merit, importance of the content to the scientific community, and editorial processes to assist it in making recommendations. Additional information about journal selection is available at http://www.nlm.nih.gov/pubs/factsheets/jsel.html '

"The beauty of this is that we do not have to follow the published guidelines. We control the National Library of Medicine so skillfully that we got Medline to index publications that are not medical journals at all. We are enormously proud to say that Medline indexes Time magazine, Newsweek, US News and World Report, and Consumer Reports. But not the peer-reviewed Journal of Orthomolecular Medicine, continuously published for more than 40 years, nor the peer-reviewed journal Fluoride, also published for decades.

"Yes, there are about 2,000 indexed articles on Medline/PubMed just from Time magazine. Here: see for yourself what a great job we've done. Go to Medline ( http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed ) and do your own two-second search for "time magazine". Then try Newsweek: over 1,900 Medline responses. US News and World Report: over 2,000 articles indexed by Medline. Medline also indexes several hundred articles from Consumer Reports. Check and see. It is quickest if you search Medline/PubMed by putting quotes around the magazine's name.

"Medline even indexes two dozen articles from Reader's Digest. (search for "read dig.")

"Isn't this terrific?

"While it is embarrassingly obvious that these are not medical journals, there is nothing the public can do about it. Medline indexes what its Literature Selection Technical Review Committee tells it to. The committee's members are all appointed; none are elected. They meet behind closed doors. No public input is accepted. (1) No taxpayer can communicate with them or attend hearings, because there aren't any hearings.

"Quite a system, isn't it? But hey, even Al Capone knew that a picked jury guarantees the verdict. We have a good little racket going here, and we are not about to change it for 150 million silly vitamin-pill-popping voters. They will read what we decide they should read.

"Some WHOPPER members are concerned that, after this story broke on the internet, a few nutritional crackpots are writing to their Congressperson and Senators and demanding action. We understand that questions being asked include, 'Why is there journal censorship in a public library? Why the secrecy? Why is an unelected 'advisory' committee making decisions, in private, about what the public has access to on the National Library of Medicine's tax-funded Medline service? Should a select small group, an elite, control a public library in the Land of the Free?'

"Now to reassure you: if you are worried about pressure from the House and the Senate, relax. The people have better things to do with their time than to really push their elected representatives for action on something as small potatoes as the First Amendment. It is true that American patriot Samuel Adams said, 'When arbitrary rulers are put over them, when government is secret, the people become alarmed.'

"But don't worry. He's dead."

References:

(1) Correspondence received from Medline: "If the (journal review) meeting were open to the public, word could circulate about a committee recommendation before a final determination was made . . . While names of review committee members are public information, NLM never discloses names of primary and secondary reviewers for specific journals. Observers could obtain that information and it could affect the openness of discussion and might result in contact with specific reviewers after the meeting. It is NLM's policy to prevent unnecessary contact with specific reviewers."

For free access to over 600 full-text papers from the Journal of Orthomolecular Medicine:
http://orthomolecular.org/library/jom/

For access to Fluoride's free online archive:
http://www.fluorideresearch.org/backissues.pdf

Nutritional Medicine is Orthomolecular Medicine

Orthomolecular medicine uses safe, effective nutritional therapy to fight illness. For more information: http://www.orthomolecular.org

The peer-reviewed Orthomolecular Medicine News Service is a non-profit and non-commercial informational resource.

Editorial Review Board:

Carolyn Dean, M.D., N.D.
Damien Downing, M.D.
Michael Gonzalez, D.Sc., Ph.D.
Steve Hickey, Ph.D.
James A. Jackson, PhD
Bo H. Jonsson, MD, Ph.D
Thomas Levy, M.D., J.D.
Jorge R. Miranda-Massari, Pharm.D.
Erik Paterson, M.D.
Gert E. Shuitemaker, Ph.D.

115   Bigsby   ignore (10)   2013 Jul 20, 12:59pm     ↓ dislike (0)   quote   flag        

puhim says

Bigsby says

No, I'm quite happy to review evidence from respected medical journals because I have no problem taking a range of extra vitamins if it is demonstrated that I'm not getting what is needed from a good balanced diet. However, startling as it may seem, just like I don't get my facts about 9/11 from 9/11truthers.org (or whatever it's called), I don't get well supported medical information from alternative medical websites because, surprise, surprise, they aren't well-supported.

Do you realize how asleep you are?

Cypher: You know, I know this steak doesn't exist. I know that when I put it in my mouth, the Matrix is telling my brain that it is juicy and delicious. After nine years, you know what I realize?

[Takes a bite of steak]

Cypher: Ignorance is bliss.

Yes, yes, I'm asleep because I prefer to put my trust in the very best scientists who get published in the best medical journals rather than those who can only get published on alt med sites. How foolish I am.

116   puhim   ignore (3)   2013 Jul 20, 1:01pm     ↓ dislike (0)   quote   flag        

Bigsby says

No, I'm quite happy to review evidence from respected medical journals

slap, wake the fuck up! seriously ... open your eyes! you might learn something.

117   Bigsby   ignore (10)   2013 Jul 20, 1:04pm     ↓ dislike (0)   quote   flag        

Your posts are a nonsense. How about the possibility that the research you reference doesn't get published because it doesn't meet the standards required? Or do you think the entire medical establishment is working a grand conspiracy to deny the possibility that mega doses of vitamin supplements may have some beneficial effects? If it is clearly proven that they do and that taking X amount doesn't have any dangerous consequences, then exactly who loses? Unfortunately for you and your ilk, actual respected research on the issue has drawn rather different conclusions to the line you are peddling. To you that is a conspiracy, to the rest of us, it is called widely accepted scientific research.

118   Bigsby   ignore (10)   2013 Jul 20, 1:06pm     ↓ dislike (0)   quote   flag        

puhim says

Bigsby says

No, I'm quite happy to review evidence from respected medical journals

slap, wake the fuck up! seriously ... open your eyes! you might learn something.

Eh? What exactly is your argument? That I should rely on an alt med site ahead of the most respected med journals? I think you need to wake the fuck up and try and understand that your megadose vitamin spiel is seen as quackery by the overwhelming majority of doctors and nutrionists.

119   puhim   ignore (3)   2013 Jul 24, 11:56am     ↓ dislike (0)   quote   flag        

The article from the Atlantic is the dumbest thing you will ever read.

Absolutely ridiculous don't buy Vitamins, how idiotic.

Only a total moron believes the shit they are shoveling.

Total hit piece on your health. You should be outraged.

120   mell   ignore (4)   2013 Jul 24, 12:03pm     ↓ dislike (0)   quote   flag        

robertoaribas says

Eat shit! 500 trillion flies can't be wrong!!!

They aren't! Fecal transplants are an excellent treatment not only for chronic digestive issues such as IBS/chronic gut infections but also for potentially life threatening acute gut infections. Now we just need to wait for a first-hand experience report here on patnet - who's it gonna be? ;)

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