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Recommendations on a SHTF gun?

By indigenous follow indigenous   2014 Jan 26, 10:08am 17,000 views   75 comments   watch   nsfw   quote   share    


I was thinking a 9 mm pistol some say a shotgun. Recommendations?

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36   SkyPirate   ignore (0)   2014 Jan 27, 2:48am     ↓ dislike (0)   quote   flag        

Assuming this is a serious topic...

1. For handguns, go with 9mm. Or 45 if you're feeling nostalgic (but 9mm is the more efficient choice). The debates over polymer vs steel frame and striker fired vs hammer fired were relevant in the 80's - 90's like the debate a thousand years ago on whether Earth was flat or round. Today, it's obvious: Polymer frame, striker fired such as Glock, S&W M&P, Springfield XD, etc... Even Sig Sauer, arguably the premier handgun manufacturer, went with a polymer frame and striker fired with the P320. Polymer is a lot lighter and still very strong. Striker fired is mechanically more simple and less prone to failure than hammer fired.

2. Shotguns are simple and good for a variety of hunting purposes. When loaded with buckshot, they serve well for home defense at short (inside home/average backyard) ranges. Remington 870 or Mossberg 500 or 590. You can't really go wrong with either, but the Remington 870's finish needs to be cared for (oil it or put a coat of Eezox) while the Mossberg arguably is a bit less mechanically robust.

3. If you're really committed to protection in even the most extreme circumstances, get yourself a semi-automatic AR-15 or AK-47. Note that these are legal in most states but are illegal or restricted in commie states such as NY, CT, MA, CA, etc.

37   anonymous   ignore (null)   2014 Jan 27, 2:53am     ↓ dislike (0)   quote   flag        

Thanks for the thread. I'm making an early start at spring clean up and have been hocking all the shit that just seems to collect dust. Ithaca 16 bore,,,next on the chop block

38   New Renter   ignore (11)   2014 Jan 27, 3:00am     ↓ dislike (0)   quote   flag        

errc says

Ithaca 16 bore,,,next on the chop block

Chopped like this?

39   lakermania   ignore (0)   2014 Jan 27, 3:31am     ↓ dislike (0)   quote   flag        

SkyPirate says

3. If you're really committed to protection in even the most extreme circumstances, get yourself a semi-automatic AR-15 or AK-47. Note that these are legal in most states but are illegal or restricted in commie states such as NY, CT, MA, CA, etc.

The AR-15 is the best selling centerfire rifle in California, but they have to be sold featureless or with a maglocked 10rd magazine. Even in my small community, the local gun shop has an entire wall of around 100 rifles consisting of nothing but AR-15s on display. You can no longer buy hi capacity magazines here though, they are legal to possess, however it is now legal for LEOs to confiscate and destroy them as a public nuisance(although I doubt this nuisance law will stand up in court at the first serious challenge).

40   New Renter   ignore (11)   2014 Jan 27, 3:47am     ↓ dislike (0)   quote   flag        

Well in all seriousness I did have this conversation with a friend of mine who has spent most of his adult life in SHTF. His recommendation was an AR-15 and a handgun that fits your hand well and you are comfortable with.

41   indigenous   ignore (0)   2014 Jan 27, 4:19am     ↓ dislike (0)   quote   flag        

New Renter says

Well in all seriousness I did have this conversation with a friend of mine who has spent most of his adult life in SHTF. His recommendation was an AR-15 and a handgun that fits your hand well and you are comfortable with.

I can't but think that this is coming more from macho than reality?

42   NoCoupForYou   ignore (5)   2014 Jan 27, 4:28am     ↓ dislike (0)   quote   flag        

Quigley says

Living in the LA area, if the SHTF for real, zombie apoc or similar, the roads would be death traps. I'd head for the marina, steal a sailboat, and head out to sea. I think a handgun would get me there, only have five miles or so to go. I have two, and a sniper rifle for yacht security once on board. Long distance is everything in sea battles.

Great idea, really a neglected concept. Sails don't run out of gas and can be made, patched or replaced with bronze age technology. Plenty of fish in the sea. Can hang off lightly populated areas to get water and wild greens, and use the dingy so the whole group doesn't have to land and expose itself to danger at once. Solar and Wind power at sea, and can use the rain catchments or the watermaker if it's too dangerous to land for a while. Can barter fish, also.

43   indigenous   ignore (0)   2014 Jan 27, 4:36am     ↓ dislike (0)   quote   flag        

thunderlips11 says

Sails don't run out of gas and can be made, patched or replaced with bronze age technology.

Except when pirates rule the seas

44   New Renter   ignore (11)   2014 Jan 27, 5:00am     ↓ dislike (0)   quote   flag        

indigenous says

New Renter says

Well in all seriousness I did have this conversation with a friend of mine who has spent most of his adult life in SHTF. His recommendation was an AR-15 and a handgun that fits your hand well and you are comfortable with.

I can't but think that this is coming more from macho than reality?

Could be some of that. But the things he's told me about aren't the kind of things most people brag about.

Here's a travel tip. If you ever find yourself in a war zone and there is a military convoy approaching or worse an EOD squad at work:

DO NOT PULL OUT A CELL PHONE!

Its amazing how many people forget this simple rule.

Better yet slowly and carefully walk away with your hands in sight at all times and pray your head is not suddenly transformed into a pink cloud.

45   indigenous   ignore (0)   2014 Jan 27, 5:18am     ↓ dislike (0)   quote   flag        

New Renter says

Could be some of that. But the things he's told me about aren't the kind of things most people brag about.

Not sure Afghanistan is the same paradigm as might be here?

46   New Renter   ignore (11)   2014 Jan 27, 6:39am     ↓ dislike (0)   quote   flag        

indigenous says

New Renter says

Could be some of that. But the things he's told me about aren't the kind of things most people brag about.

Not sure Afghanistan is the same paradigm as might be here?

Afghanistan,Pakistan, Iraq, Iran, Bosnia, Angola, Libya, Beruit, Somalia, Vietnam, Laos, Thailand, Panama its all the same when SHTF.

47   indigenous   ignore (0)   2014 Jan 27, 6:50am     ↓ dislike (0)   quote   flag        

New Renter says

Afghanistan,Pakistan, Iraq, Iran, Bosnia, Angola, Libya, Beruit, Somalia, Vietnam, Laos, Thailand, Panama its all the same when SHTF.

The one time I have seen the SHTF was in 92 in LA. The police were absent, the people who had to defend themselves were not in fire fights they were defending their property against looters.

48   New Renter   ignore (11)   2014 Jan 27, 7:09am     ↓ dislike (0)   quote   flag        

indigenous says

New Renter says

Afghanistan,Pakistan, Iraq, Iran, Bosnia, Angola, Libya, Beruit, Somalia, Vietnam, Laos, Thailand, Panama its all the same when SHTF.

The one time I have seen the SHTF was in 92 in LA. The police were absent, the people who had to defend themselves were not in fire fights they were defending their property against looters.

Losing personal property could be the least of concern when SHTF.

49   Heraclitusstudent   ignore (2)   2014 Jan 27, 7:37am     ↓ dislike (0)   quote   flag        

indigenous says

bob2356 says

Depends on where,when, and how you think SHTF will happen.

During riots and escalating looting after

That's just the first month of
If you want to survive the first year, a weapon won't help you.

There will be roaming armed bands looking for food. More than you can handle alone.

50   prodigy   ignore (0)   2014 Jan 27, 8:22am     ↓ dislike (0)   quote   flag        

This projection is wise beyond your years.
Best to occupy the worst location the world has to offer, or tunnel deep.

Heraclitusstudent says

That's just the first month of

If you want to survive the first year, a weapon won't help you.

There will be roaming armed bands looking for food. More than you can handle alone.

51   indigenous   ignore (0)   2014 Jan 27, 10:50am     ↓ dislike (0)   quote   flag        

Heraclitusstudent says

That's just the first month of

If you want to survive the first year, a weapon won't help you.

There will be roaming armed bands looking for food. More than you can handle alone.

I don't see that. No matter what you are not going to survive alone.

Being stationary makes you a target.

Best to be off the cross roads. Best to be in a community preferably with relatives.

But this would require a complete melt down. I don't see this happening. I see the dystopian scene being more likely.

So the gun would not be for TEOTWAWKI just for the latest outrage over the latest injustice. These uprisings last about 3 days then the natives calm down. But considering how many "rights" the nanny state doles out there are going to be many "injustices".

52   Automan Empire   ignore (2)   2014 Jan 27, 11:15am     ↓ dislike (0)   quote   flag        

Misread the thread title and thought, "They make STFU guns now? Cool, how does THAT work?"

53   indigenous   ignore (0)   2014 Jan 27, 11:56am     ↓ dislike (0)   quote   flag        

Automan Empire says

STFU guns

How would that be different than any gun?

54   Vicente   ignore (0)   2014 Jan 27, 11:56am     ↓ dislike (0)   quote   flag        

You need to think like James Tiberius Kirk. It's not about what you brought to the party, it's what you can improvise on the ground.

56   New Renter   ignore (11)   2014 Jan 27, 12:26pm     ↓ dislike (0)   quote   flag        

Heraclitusstudent says

here will be roaming armed bands looking for food. More than you can handle alone.

Then you should put some aside for them. Preferably in the form of long expired canned goods with a falsified expiration date. Pay your tribute then wait a few days. Presto! Gang problem goes away.

57   spydah_hh   ignore (0)   2014 Jan 27, 2:30pm     ↓ dislike (0)   quote   flag        

indigenous says

Heraclitusstudent says

That's just the first month of

If you want to survive the first year, a weapon won't help you.

There will be roaming armed bands looking for food. More than you can handle alone.

I don't see that. No matter what you are not going to survive alone.

Being stationary makes you a target.

Best to be off the cross roads. Best to be in a community preferably with relatives.

But this would require a complete melt down. I don't see this happening. I see the dystopian scene being more likely.

So the gun would not be for TEOTWAWKI just for the latest outrage over the latest injustice. These uprisings last about 3 days then the natives calm down. But considering how many "rights" the nanny state doles out there are going to be many "injustices".

Personally I often wonder if we'll be a total collapse or dystopian. Hard to tell. Honestly, I've been preparing for either. Even managed to learn how to grow food and turn creek water to drinkable without the use of electricity or fire. And of course some medical stuff. You can never know what maybe in handy :).

Hell I even went as far out of the box to buying a stock loads of striking matches. I mean why not get about 1000 of them for like $2-3 in Walmart and in Wiemar Germany's hyperinflation period they were good tools to barter with.

Personally though i'll be using the flint steel and magnesium bar :).

58   indigenous   ignore (0)   2014 Jan 27, 3:00pm     ↓ dislike (0)   quote   flag        

spydah_hh says

hyperinflation period

I don't see hyperinflation happening, if they can print 6 trillion out of thin air and we still don't see it, it is not going to happen. This is probably because the credit market has shrunk so much. So the reality is that we will probably see deflation.

59   spydah_hh   ignore (0)   2014 Jan 27, 3:13pm     ↓ dislike (0)   quote   flag        

indigenous says

spydah_hh says

hyperinflation period

I don't see hyperinflation happening, if they can print 6 trillion out of thin air and we still don't see it, it is not going to happen. This is probably because the credit market has shrunk so much. So the reality is that we will probably see deflation.

Most of the money that's print is leaves the country. What happens when they came back? Plus there's still a demand for dollars at least for now.

60   indigenous   ignore (0)   2014 Jan 27, 3:22pm     ↓ dislike (0)   quote   flag        

spydah_hh says

Most of the money that's print is leaves the country. What happens when they came back?

They won't as the US is the reserve currency of the world.

Once someone excepts payment in a dollar for goods they are stuck with the dollars.

Keep in mind that the credit market dwarfs the amount of currency exchanged so it even if what you stated happened it would be a fraction of the money. Credit is money also.

61   spydah_hh   ignore (0)   2014 Jan 27, 3:29pm     ↓ dislike (0)   quote   flag        

indigenous says

They won't as the US is the reserve currency of the world.

Yes, it's the reserve currency but at some point with all the printing of money, these countries are going to realize that the U.S. never intend to pay them back with valuable dollars. Remember Saddam Hussein back in 2000 finally allowed other countries to buy oil in other currencies outside of U.S. dollars. Needless to say it didn't go to well for him but he was certainly willing to get out of dollars. It's only a matter of time before the entire world think the same.

I am guessing you're thinking we're going into deflation? I don't see deflation simply because the government won't allow it. They won't be able to service the debt that's been created without inflation. And they'll keep inflation to keep servicing the debt even if it means high through hyperinflation.

62   Reality   ignore (5)   2014 Jan 27, 3:34pm     ↓ dislike (0)   quote   flag        

The "excess reserve" at the FED is now at $2.5Trillion, more than 30 times the reserve requirement! Things can unhinge quite rapidly if and when that money gets lent out with multiplier effect in a big hurry.

63   CrazyMan   ignore (0)   2014 Jan 27, 4:04pm     ↓ dislike (0)   quote   flag        

You want something that uses .22, .223 or 9mm. Those are BY FAR the most common calibers.

I have in the 5 digits plus for each, so I think I'm set :)

If SHTF, hanging out at my house would probably be a good idea. You're all invited.

64   indigenous   ignore (0)   2014 Jan 27, 4:12pm     ↓ dislike (0)   quote   flag        

spydah_hh says

Needless to say it didn't go to well for him but he was certainly willing to get out of dollars. It's only a matter of time before the entire world think the same.

Yea but as bad as the dollar is, the world has more confidence in it than other currency.

I don't think the agreement that Nixon had with Saudi Arabia is as much of a factor as the confidence people have in the dollar.

Yea the deflation is inspite of the FED, but again it is a fraction of the credit market.

The other factor is that the demand for commodities is way down.

And that the worlds' traded balances are way out of whack. The Yuan and Germany have to change their exports as they are malinvested. This means that the US trade deficit will shrink.

65   indigenous   ignore (0)   2014 Jan 27, 4:18pm     ↓ dislike (0)   quote   flag        

Reality says

The "excess reserve" at the FED is now at $2.5Trillion, more than 30 times the reserve requirement! Things can unhinge quite rapidly if and when that money gets lent out with multiplier effect in a big hurry.

I hear you but the credit market was 50 trillion. I don't know what it is now but I'm thinking it is a fraction of what it was.

That and the fact the market has never really cleared so a I question whether there is a genuine requirement for investment.

66   CrazyMan   ignore (0)   2014 Jan 27, 4:18pm     ↓ dislike (0)   quote   flag        

The US dollar reminds me of the famous quote by a US Navy Seal.

"It's not that we're that good, it's just that everybody else sucks."

Pretty much sums up the US.

If I could get into Finland, Sweden or Norway, I would move in a heartbeat, only for my kid's sake. The only fallback I have is Japan, whose economy seems to be coupled with ours, unfortunately.

My dad was a WW2 vet. He would be ashamed of what a shitty country this has become.

67   indigenous   ignore (0)   2014 Jan 27, 4:20pm     ↓ dislike (0)   quote   flag        

CrazyMan says

If I could get into Finland, Sweden or Norway, I would move in a heartbeat. The only fallback I have is Japan, whose economy seems to be coupled with ours, unfortunately.

It seems like you would be better off in the land that you know?

68   CrazyMan   ignore (0)   2014 Jan 27, 4:22pm     ↓ dislike (0)   quote   flag        

I was born here, so I know here.

My wife is a Japanese citizen. Actually now my child is too, if she likes :)

This country is not what it used to be.

69   bob2356   ignore (4)   2014 Jan 27, 8:26pm     ↓ dislike (0)   quote   flag        

CrazyMan says

If I could get into Finland, Sweden or Norway, I would move in a heartbeat, only for my kid's sake. The only fallback I have is Japan, whose economy seems to be coupled with ours, unfortunately.

You can get in anywhere you want Depending on your situation you might have to make big sacrifices to do it.

70   spydah_hh   ignore (0)   2014 Jan 27, 9:32pm     ↓ dislike (0)   quote   flag        

CrazyMan says

The US dollar reminds me of the famous quote by a US Navy Seal.

"It's not that we're that good, it's just that everybody else sucks."

Pretty much sums up the US.

If I could get into Finland, Sweden or Norway, I would move in a heartbeat, only for my kid's sake. The only fallback I have is Japan, whose economy seems to be coupled with ours, unfortunately.

My dad was a WW2 vet. He would be ashamed of what a shitty country this has become.

I'd go Norway myself. They're much more about free market and capitalism than this country is. Plus they stuck to their roots and still have their own currency the krone.

71   New Renter   ignore (11)   2014 Jan 28, 8:05am     ↓ dislike (0)   quote   flag        

CrazyMan says

The US dollar reminds me of the famous quote by a US Navy Seal.

"It's not that we're that good, it's just that everybody else sucks."

I guess he never met a Ranger

If I could get into Finland, Sweden or Norway, I would move in a heartbeat, only for my kid's sake. The only fallback I have is Japan, whose economy seems to be coupled with ours, unfortunately.

Sweden is great for kids! If you don't mind a society which values living modestly you will like it too.

My dad was a WW2 vet. He would be ashamed of what a shitty country this has become.

He should have moved to Sweden.

72   New Renter   ignore (11)   2014 Jan 28, 9:16am     ↓ dislike (0)   quote   flag        

The Professor says

indigenous says

Recommendations on a SHTF gun?

Crossbow; silent and deadly. Cannibals are attracted to gunshot noise. The bolts are often reusable and you can always make your own.

I take it you're a fan of Walking Dead"

You only have one shot with the crossbow so you should have a M134 Minigun for backup. You'll need a lot of ammo for the minigun.

A minigun isn't the most man portable weapon around. It needs a battery for the spinning motor in addition to all that ammo.

73   APOCALYPSEFUCKisShostikovitch   ignore (49)   2014 Jan 28, 9:47am     ↓ dislike (0)   quote   flag        

In the end, a guy with an M134 and 10,000 rounds of belt fed ammo lives and cannibals with machetes fucking die.

74   New Renter   ignore (11)   2014 Jan 28, 10:36am     ↓ dislike (0)   quote   flag        

APOCALYPSEFUCKisShostikovitch says

In the end, a guy with an M134 and 10,000 rounds of belt fed ammo lives and cannibals with machetes fucking die.

Only if his battery is charged. Better remember to pack a solar panel and windmill into the survival kit.

75   Heraclitusstudent   ignore (2)   2014 Jan 28, 3:02pm     ↓ dislike (0)   quote   flag        

prodigy says

Yeah... you could clean after SHTF with that :-)

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