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Bitcoin and Crypto-currency


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2017 Nov 5, 3:36pm   106,067 views  521 comments

by BayArea   ➕follow (1)   💰tip   ignore  

#investing

Hi guys,

I'd like to start a conversation on crypto-currency, particularly Bitcoin.

What do you all think about it from an investment point of view today? I have some buddies in the finance world who are quite bullish on it and claim we are just scratching the surface. Judging by the recent performance, they may be right.

For people who are investing in Bitcoin, what are you using to invest and what recommendations do you have for a new investor?

Also, how are gains taxed compared to typical stock market gains?

I read this week that over 100,000 merchants in the USA are accepting Bitcoin today.

At the same time, digital currency does scare me a bit as it seems so abstract. Curious what PatNet thinks.

Thanks guys!

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236   anonymous   2018 Feb 27, 2:48pm  

Of course I cash out. So far every time one of my coins mooned I took profits. I am fine with 4-5x on my initial investment. Sure 10x would be better but it’s also riskier.
237   WookieMan   2018 Feb 27, 3:41pm  

anon_52590 says
Yea, to me it’s not gambling. It made me a lot of money.


I'll disagree with the gambling part here. It truly is gambling. As I've always said, make money on this where you can. I don't begrudge anyone that can and does.

anon_52590 says
As of now the marketcap is not even close to the stock market cap during the dot com bubble. This baby has legs.


Not sure what the dot com bubble has to do with made up currencies. Make money, but when I hear "this baby has legs" I tend to run the other direction from the person that said this. It means nothing. It's made up jargon that people think makes them look smart about something they know nothing about. And this is 100% of people talking about crypto currencies. 100%. So I'm not talking about a user here.

anon_52590 says
If you don’t believe in the tech and rather invest in stocks that is totally fine. I am not a financial advisor. Just a happy crypto investor. It’s exciting and very profitable


This is one of the more candid cypto bull lines I've seen here at least. You've hit the nail on the head. It's exciting. And if you're happy congrats. You at least acknowledge that the market is totally hinged on excitement and that's really it. This is the case in many markets of course. Most have some other backing or support as to why someone would be excited about it though. New product. Increasing sales. Warren Buffet bought X number of shares.

You don't have to believe my patnet persona, but I will be retired by 48 with plenty of money without jumping into the crypto pool. 80-90% of people will fail if given or have invested and gained fuck you money through crypto. The money will gained will be lost. Isn't it funny that Harvard, Yale, etc are such great schools? Why don't we just send everyone there and everyone will just be smarter? We all know it doesn't work that way. You can shoot to the moon with crypto and you'll likely crash and burn shortly after. This is just the reality.

Have fun, but there's a reason certain people/families get rich and stay that way. Luck can be a part of it, but maintaining and increasing wealth once you have it isn't luck.
238   anonymous   2018 Feb 27, 10:02pm  

My prediction for the next years: I sell after parabolic run ups and wait for a correction/crash to buy back in. Each time it goes down the haters and perma bears come out in droves and scream I told you so. Bitcoin is dead. Slowly those voices fade as big daddy starts running up again. Then they tell you how successful they all are without crypto and how they all retire early. Same spiel over and over. Works for me.
239   WookieMan   2018 Feb 28, 4:14am  

anon_3a1a3 says
I sell after parabolic run ups and wait for a correction/crash to buy back in.


This sounds like a logical plan... for almost any stock. Why will there be continued parabolic run ups in crypto though? Is there any technical data or research to support that it will continue this way? Why do you assume you'll always be on the winning end of this massive volatility as well? If crypos gain popularity more and more, why would governments with their own currencies just let that happen? Essentially assisting in their own country's demise? How many coins are in circulation and aren't forever lost or stolen? What institutions are holding and how much?

I've got a laundry list of questions, almost all of which can't be answered by the crypto bulls. And please don't say "big daddy" either. This thread reeks of the content on a pinkie forum with some of the lingo being tossed about like it makes someone knowledgeable about something they're not. There's not one person on this planet that can predict what is going to happen with crypto unless it's someone in the US, Chinese or Japanese government for the most part.
240   anonymous   2018 Feb 28, 6:39am  

Cause people like to invest in it. Why wouldn’t there be run ups. It comes down to Fomo and FUD.
It worked for me in the past. See no reason for it to stop.
The FUD about governments banning it will never get old. Good for me as I like to buy the dips.
US regulators like blockchain. The need for regulations will justify bigger budgets for their departments. Win-win. And The IRS likes the increase in tax revenues due to crypto. All these existing crypto projects/start ups create jobs.
2008: we have an app for it
2018: we have an ICO for it
The rest of your questions seem a bit useless. I don’t care what coins are stolen or lost. Lost coins are a bullish sign as these coins can’t be sold.
More and more institutional money will enter the space. ETFs will be huge for crypto. Imagine the crypto ETFs become part of the investing mix in the US. I think we have seen nothing yet.
241   Onvacation   2018 Feb 28, 7:43am  

anon_3a1a3 says
I think we have seen nothing yet.

You will. Give it time.
242   WookieMan   2018 Feb 28, 9:18am  

anon_3a1a3 says
The rest of your questions seem a bit useless.


Silly acronyms aside, you addressed none of the questions. So I suppose they were useless. Or couldn't be answered, as most crypto bulls can't.

IF cryptos are sooooo valuable, why does every single coin have a conversion to dollars? Hell, bitcoin is valued in dollars to Americans. I'll ask this of the gold and silver bugs too, what kind of society do you think we have where bitcoin, gold or silver would be a means to complete transactions? Unless you're uber wealthy (with dollars of course) or have a massive arsenal of weapons, you'd be dead. You do understand that we intentionally kill innocent people to keep the $ as the worlds reserve currency, right?

For some reason crypto currencies will be allowed to grow enough in popularity to knock off the dollar? As I've said in other comments, you're rooting for your own countries demise if you want cryptos to succeed. Most of these are coins started in Asia. You think they want to keep the status quo with USA being top dog? You don't think there are foreign government with their hands in these crptos already? As a citizen, I'm actually pissed more hasn't been done to knock the shit off. Obama and Trump have been asleep at the wheel on this in my opinion. And I could give zero shits about tax revenue. Crypto is a raindrop in the Pacific.

Also, lost coins can be found and sold. What would you do with 1M bitcoin right now if you were presented with a hard drive containing them? I'm sure you'd just hold onto them, wait for big daddy to get legs and sell them at $20k. Oh wait, did I just put a dollar sign in front, whoops. You see, there's ZERO value in bitcoin until you convert it to..... DOLLARS!

Everyone has to stop with the blockchain bit too. The analogy in this article is that it's basically a fucking google sheets document. This is somehow earth shattering tech? https://blockgeeks.com/guides/what-is-blockchain-technology/ The fact is, cryptos don't have to exist for the good 'ole USA to use blockchain. Certain people WANT them to exist and blockchain is the reason, I guess?

As usual with my comments, I have no problem with you trading (stop saying investing) and making money. You can harm society worse in other ways when compared to trading in bitcoin. So I don't have a problem with it. That said, cryptos honestly have a very cultish feel to them if that makes sense. Just remember that some people are able to get out of the cult, but a lot don't make it.

HYHFTB (Hope You Have Fun Trading Bitcoin) AMOLAK (And Make Out Like A King). Acronyms are cool! I know, I know, usually A doesn't get included in acronyms. This A had some serious FOMO so I figured I'd include him.
243   anonymous   2018 Feb 28, 12:15pm  

Lol, you really like to get into it. Sry I’m not your guy to go back and forth. Invest in it or don’t. Big daddy is going to rock this year :) my bet is it will reach 30k and we will see 1trillion market cap for crypto!
244   anonymous   2018 Feb 28, 12:40pm  

What's the only thing worse than buying Bitcoin with a credit card? How about selling Bitcoin to someone in a credit card transaction. Here's The Woz's tale of woe.
“Somebody bought them from me online through a credit card and they cancelled the credit card payment. It was that easy. And it was from a stolen credit card number so you can never get it back.”
245   anonymous   2018 Feb 28, 6:42pm  

That’s seems dumb. Why use credit cards? Just buy big daddy via bank transaction and sell it back once it pulls a 3-4x.
246   WookieMan   2018 Feb 28, 7:07pm  

anon_d3fde says
Lol, you really like to get into it.


I do. Admittedly I'm long winded. Sorry.

anon_d3fde says
Sry I’m not your guy to go back and forth.


That's fine, the questions can go unanswered as they always do.

anon_d3fde says
my bet is it will reach 30k and we will see 1trillion market cap for crypto


My best wishes to you. Seriously. Some of my sarcasm above can be misinterpreted. If you can make a lot of money, fucking do it. As I've said, I don't begrudge anyone making money on crypto. Not my game to play. Nothing to hide on my end.

You know it likely, but I'll say it again, just be careful. No one is coming back here to preach about their losses or on any forum for that matter. I'm not a "I told you so" guy, so if this ends up in ashes, I hope you can get out in time. And if I'm wrong long term, feel free to come back here and beat me over the head with it. If I'm wrong, I don't run from it if it can be proven.
247   WookieMan   2018 Mar 14, 4:38am  

I know this isn't the typical crypto investor they're describing in the article. But the day of reckoning is coming. Be ready. 82% of people losing money is WORSE then gambling.

The products are high risk and the entire industry has come under increasing regulatory scrutiny across Europe over the past year. The UK's Financial Conduct Authority warned in November that cryptocurrency CFDs "are extremely high-risk, speculative products" that "place you at risk of suffering significant losses." The FCA found that 82% of people who use the products lose money, suggesting CFDs are more akin to gambling than investing.


http://www.businessinsider.com/google-bans-cryptocurrency-binary-option-ads-cracks-down-on-cfd-and-spread-bet-ads-2018-3
248   MrMagic   2018 Aug 14, 9:48am  

Is it time to eject yet????

249   RWSGFY   2018 Aug 14, 10:46am  

It's a BUYING OPPORTUNITY!!!!
250   Evan F.   2018 Aug 14, 10:49am  

I made $40k on Litecoin, got out in January when things were insanely overheated. Taxes will knock that down to $20k. The hype is over, if you're mining or looking for a huge flip your wasting your time.
251   MrMagic   2019 Jan 3, 9:16am  

DASKAA says
It's a BUYING OPPORTUNITY!!!!


Still think so? Are you buying the dip?

What a difference a year makes. It was $17K this time a year ago.




Anyone still holding their BTC, hoping for miracles?
252   Ceffer   2019 Jan 3, 9:28am  

What goes up must wind up fucking you in the ass.
253   MrMagic   2019 Jan 3, 11:11am  

Ceffer says
What goes up must wind up fucking you in the ass.


Wait, is that a Dan reference?
254   RWSGFY   2019 Jan 3, 12:19pm  

MrMagic says
DASKAA says
It's a BUYING OPPORTUNITY!!!!


Still think so? Are you buying the dip?


No, I'm too dumb to understand the great technology.
255   quincybatten   2019 May 20, 10:41pm  

For those who don’t know, the blockchain ledger is upheld and propagated by nodes, which are user machines that hold a copy of the current valid Bitcoin blockchain ledger. These nodes all work together to uphold the decentralized blockchain that we’ve come to love. Nodes receive new transactions from users’ wallets, have miners validate them, then receive mined blocks from miners to add to its ledger. The nodes then also immediately propagate these validated blocks out to other nodes across the Bitcoin network.

http://net-informations.com/q/mis/block.html
256   RWSGFY   2019 May 21, 7:39am  

quincybatten says
For those who don’t know, the blockchain ledger is upheld and propagated by nodes, which are user machines that hold a copy of the current valid Bitcoin blockchain ledger. These nodes all work together to uphold the decentralized blockchain that we’ve come to love. Nodes receive new transactions from users’ wallets, have miners validate them, then receive mined blocks from miners to add to its ledger. The nodes then also immediately propagate these validated blocks out to other nodes across the Bitcoin network.

http://net-informations.com/q/mis/block.html


And this is what makes that shit so fucking slow.
257   Onvacation   2019 May 25, 11:57am  

Can anyone tell me what makes a unique string of zeros and ones intrinsically valuable? The only value left in US dollars is the faith and credit of the US government which is 20T in debt.

Bitcoin will go to infinity dollars when dollars go to zero. Until then let the fiat scam continue.
258   qroproton   2019 May 25, 12:10pm  

Hugolas_Madurez says
And this is what makes that shit so fucking slow.


Not so fast, I witnessed in real time how 600MD were transferred in 10 minutes.
259   Patrick   2019 May 25, 12:56pm  

Onvacation says
Can anyone tell me what makes a unique string of zeros and ones intrinsically valuable? The only value left in US dollars is the faith and credit of the US government which is 20T in debt.

Bitcoin will go to infinity dollars when dollars go to zero. Until then let the fiat scam continue.


Sure, what makes dollars valuable is that the US government demands that taxes be paid in dollars.

Dollars will never go to zero as long as men with guns can show up at your door if you fail to come up with enough dollars to pay your taxes.

There's a good anecdote about how the British had a hard time getting East African herders to obediently work for them until the British demanded that taxes be paid in British currency. The only way to get that was to work for British colonialists. Problem solved.

We are all the slaves of the Federal Reserve.
260   HeadSet   2019 May 25, 2:27pm  

Sure, what makes dollars valuable is that the US government demands that taxes be paid in dollars.

Plus, government benefits and remits for goods and services are paid in dollars.
261   RWSGFY   2019 May 25, 7:27pm  

0ba4 says
Hugolas_Madurez says
And this is what makes that shit so fucking slow.


Not so fast, I witnessed in real time how 600MD were transferred in 10 minutes.


600 Macedonian Denars in 10 minutes? This is supposed to be impressive somehow?
262   BayArea   2019 May 26, 7:24am  

3-5% of my portfolio will continue to be crypto.
263   Eric Holder   2019 May 27, 9:38pm  

Newbie123 says
That was an epic buying opportunity, no? Well, Yes.... for me :)


Yawn: there's always somebody coming out of the woodwork after shit goes up to claim he "loaded up" when the shit was down.
264   WookieMan   2019 May 28, 5:09am  

Eric Holder says
Newbie123 says
That was an epic buying opportunity, no? Well, Yes.... for me :)


Yawn: there's always somebody coming out of the woodwork after shit goes up to claim he "loaded up" when the shit was down.


Yup. And I'm sure he didn't buy any when it was $15k or higher either.... just non-stop great picks... never loses.

What I never get with the coin pumpers is, just show us your account or transactions you've made to show your track record. I thought one of the pros of bitcoin and others was the "safety" and "security" of it. There should be no way anyone could take it if you show us the account. I mean, I've never, ever heard of crypto coins ever being stolen...
265   EmilyKlark   2019 May 28, 5:56am  

spam
266   Onvacation   2019 May 28, 10:17am  

Newbie123 says
Big Daddy and the Alt's go parabolic.
Onvacation says
Can anyone tell me what makes a unique string of zeros and ones intrinsically valuable?
267   joshuatrio   2019 May 28, 11:51am  

Anyone think it's going parabolic again? With BTC back at $8700, it could be ramping up to run again... or dump. Temping to buy a couple coins.
268   WookieMan   2019 May 28, 12:55pm  

joshuatrio says
Anyone think it's going parabolic again? With BTC back at $8700, it could be ramping up to run again... or dump. Temping to buy a couple coins.


I don't claim to know it at all. And I'm cool with people that can make money off of it. If you can do it. There's not one person though that can give you actual advice that seriously knows what they're talking about. Play with fun money, but anyone telling you it's gonna do this or that is just throwing darts, blindfolded, trying to hit a dime from 30' away after spinning for 5 minutes.
269   Onvacation   2019 Jun 1, 8:12am  

Newbie123 says

Hell yes its going parabolic

Can you tell me why a string of zeros and ones has any intrinsic value?
270   Eric Holder   2019 Jun 1, 8:40pm  

Newbie123 says
...mainstream will buy in when big daddy hits 10k. CNBC and Co. will cover it non stop.


... and then it will crash again, the sheep will be fleeced again, rinse, repeat....
271   CBOEtrader   2019 Jun 1, 8:56pm  

Newbie123 says
Eric Holder says
Newbie123 says
...mainstream will buy in when big daddy hits 10k. CNBC and Co. will cover it non stop.


... and then it will crash again, the sheep will be fleeced again, rinse, repeat....


crash....a retracement..... a correction....a buying opportunity! even if you would have bought at the last peak (19.9k) it will look cheap when Big Daddy reaches a 100k.


For anyone paying attention, we haven't been above 10k in Bitcoin for a while. I'm probably gonna wait and see if it breaks through 10k to buy into a trend, may wait till it sets a new high.

As an investment, my sources tell me ripple (sp?) is the way to go, w all the instant currency exchange infrastructure they are building.
272   Onvacation   2019 Jun 2, 11:27am  

Newbie123 says

Why dont you ask google for the intrinsic value of BTC?

All it has is the extrinsic value of a software constrained supply and "greater fool" demand.

Blockchain has uses but bitcoin is a fools game. There will be winners, but a lot more losers.
273   RWSGFY   2019 Jun 3, 6:26am  

Newbie123 says
You let us make a killing


Sure. You go right ahead, buddy.
274   WookieMan   2019 Jun 3, 8:07am  

Newbie123 says
How about this: You let us make a killing with Bitcoin and we let you make up excuses not to buy the best performing asset in 2019, deal?


There are better performing options out their chief. You've got Bitcoin blindness going on. ANYONE, ANYTIME can make up a crypto currency. I could create ASSMONEY tomorrow and rip everyone off and it will all be stored on my digital wallet/spreadsheet. You have to understand you're being played by people that are substantially smarter than you.
275   Onvacation   2019 Jun 3, 10:29am  

Newbie123 says
Bitcoin is barely in the first inning. This bull cycle will be epic.

Do you consider bitcoin an asset or a currency?

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