patrick.net

Oh, my! How to find an educational apparatus that teaches you how to think and evaluate information rather than treat you like a foie gras goose for stuffing with banal agitprop?
The impossible dream?

:
Yes, becasue we all know that the most far left whacky sjw beliefs out there were imparted to sjws by academic/teacher union driven curricula.

We also know that if you reject sjw nonsense about the patriarchy and infinite genders then then you'll fit right in with the alt right or far right.

You would so love if that were true.

marcus says

Yes, becasue we all know that the most far left whacky sjw beliefs out there were imparted to sjws by academic/teacher union driven curricula.

Exactly. It's sweet to be on the payola end of denial.

:
I see. Only if you are 100% removed from schools and teachers do you have an accurate idea of what they are like and their beliefs.

Sure some English teachers are going to somewhat on the sjw spectrum.. Same probably in Art and special ed, but less so for History. AS for Math and Science ? Pretty much not at all, or close to it.

Overall, the percentage of teachers overall that are "indoctrinating" kids as you imagine ? Very small. Now college is a bit different if you're a humanities major. Then all bets are off.

it's funny how everything gets labeled right wing when it's not full blown socialist rag with flying rainbow flags 24/7 screaming for more ass+penis.

marcus says

Sure some English teachers are going to somewhat on the sjw spectrum

And among these people, that are sympathetic to sjw points of view, most are going to be professional in that they understand that these are their personal political points of view, and not some absolute truths, and therefore not preach their political views to students. Same for very conservative teachers I know. They might bring up questions getting students thinking about issues or even have debates, but they aren't going to preach radical views. Not just becasue they know it's wrong to do this. But also becasue it can get them in big trouble with parents.

That's the reality.

marcus says

marcus says

Sure some English teachers are going to somewhat on the sjw spectrum

And among these people, that are sympathetic to sjw points of view, most are going to be professional in that they understand that these are their personal political points of view, and not some absolute truths, and therefore not preach their political views to students. Same for very conservative teachers I know. They might bring up questions getting students thinking about issues or even have debates, but they aren't going to preach radical views. Not just becasue they know it's wrong to do this. But also becasue it can get them in big trouble with parents.

That's the reality.

But that's not completely true. Some teachers don't, others do.

FortWayneIndiana says

it's funny how everything gets labeled right wing when it's not full blown socialist rag with flying rainbow flags 24/7

Well I don't like the way you put it, but I agree somewhat.

Because not only do people like NoCoup try to pigeon hole all people to the left of alt right as being sjw extremists. The SJWs do this too, as if I must agree with them or be considered right wing if I don't want to get on board with leftist identity politics.

The obvious example is far leftists railing against Jordan Peterson as being a right winger. One of the reasons I like Peterson so much as that he represents an intelligent middle ground, and he questions left wing identity politics without being right wing about it. I wish he would speak out more about some things, but it's probably intentional to pull people away from the hateful right as much as it may pull others away from the identity politics on the left.

It is understandable that far leftists hate Peterson though, for obvious reasons.

I like how they call intellectuals "Right Wing" thinkers or Alt Right now.

I was researching "Cultural Marxism" yesterday. The earliest it pops up in the MSM is in 2003, the Liberals were bemoaning Jordan Peterson for his essay on the growing degeneracy in Music, Movies and Pop Culture. He said the endgame was to create a Culture in America that would turn America upside down on its head. That's what the Socialist want, and it was how they were going to burn America down. Understand this was at least 12 years away from the Woke Culture we have now, and the outright open hostile environment in our Higher Learning institutions where Free Speech was something to be stamped out. In fact had the Left pulled their shit at this time. A lot of Motherfuckers would have went to Jail. They needed Obama to normalize Communism and to destroy the 1st@.

So now you listen to Paul Joseph Watson, and you see everything Jordan Peterson said then was exactly true.

www.youtube.com/embed/XT6hQE7W5ls

Seems like the Thugs at the Cultural Reconditioning Center had it wrong.

https://www.splcenter.org/fighting-hate/intelligence-report/2003/cultural-marxism-catching

Tenpoundbass says

Liberals were bemoaning Jordan Peterson for his essay on the growing degeneracy in Music, Movies and Pop Culture.

I doubt this very strongly. Can you show me this essay or where liberals were bemoaning it ?

I believe that such an essay existed, but not that Jordan Peterson wrote it.

marcus says

I believe that such an essay existed, but not that Jordan Peterson wrote it.

Do you even know who Jordan Peterson is?

Tenpoundbass says

Do you even know who Jordan Peterson is?

Yes, in fact I know his work so well, that I don't believe he wrote that essay. Just point me to the essay, or a reference to it, and I will stand corrected.

https://www.theepochtimes.com/jordan-peterson-explains-how-communism-came-under-the-guise-of-identity-politics_2259668.html
https://www.dailywire.com/news/exclusive-qa-prof-jordan-peterson-genderless-aaron-bandler
https://nationalpost.com/news/canada/chris-selley-jordan-peterson-hero-of-the-anti-pc-crowd-just-keeps-winning
https://blogs.scientificamerican.com/beautiful-minds/the-personality-of-political-correctness/

https://www.thestranger.com/slog/2019/03/25/39717444/jordan-petersons-idea-of-cultural-marxism-is-totally-intellectually-empty

FortWayneIndiana says

it's funny how everything gets labeled right wing when it's not full blown socialist rag with flying rainbow flags 24/7 screaming for more ass+penis.

I think the correct response to bogus accusations of being "racist" or "far right" is to consistently reply with accusations of pedophilia.

Bonus: it's true. The Democratic Party is actually full of pedophiles.

:
Okay 5 links, but no mention of that essay.

Tenpoundbass says

Liberals were bemoaning Jordan Peterson for his essay on the growing degeneracy in Music, Movies and Pop Culture. He said the endgame was to create a Culture in America that would turn America upside down on its head. That's what the Socialist want, and it was how they were going to burn America down.

You can't just admit that you made up the part about Jordan Peterson writing such an essay ?

NoCoupForYou says

PragerU, a growing hub of the online right-wing media machine, is using YouTube as a way to circumvent professors — and parents — to reach a new generation of studentshttps://t.co/chu4L5BZCE— The New York Times (@nytimes) January 4, 2020

"Oh no! Someone is trying to oppose our agenda! How can it be? We locked all possible media, universities and distribution channels!"

Never looked at PragerU, but the biggest deficit on the right and the left is people who actually make sense.
The left SJW arguments are fragile and vulnerable to common sense criticism. It shouldn't be a surprise that they are attacked. Polarization make both sides extreme and out of line with common sense.
Unfortunately there are few voices on the center and right that make sense and are not tainted by bad faith. The intellectual dark web is an exception. I hope PragerU is one too.

"And among these people, that are sympathetic to sjw points of view, most are going to be professional in that they understand that these are their personal political points of view, and not some absolute truths, and therefore not preach their political views to students. Same for very conservative teachers I know. They might bring up questions getting students thinking about issues or even have debates, but they aren't going to preach radical views. Not just becasue they know it's wrong to do this. But also becasue it can get them in big trouble with parents. "

Quite the opposite. SJW teachers tend to think their opinions are the absolute truth and that everyone else in the workplace shares them those same opinions. That's why when Trump was elected, I received an email from the school psychologist about how we should be making it clear "we reject sexism, racism, and homophobia, despite this election". That's why I received an email from the German teacher who thinks she's an environmentalist but has no knowledge about science at all about how amazing Greta Thunberg's speech was. The contrary, I've never seen an email from a conservative teacher. Either they know it's not appropriate, or they are afraid to voice those opinions.

marcus says

Sure some English teachers are going to somewhat on the sjw spectrum.. Same probably in Art and special ed, but less so for History. AS for Math and Science ? Pretty much not at all, or close to it.

Universities rather than schools are the den of SJWs: the trigger warnings, the safe spaces, the protests for right wing speakers, etc.... Gender studies gives them a "science" varnish, and they aggressively try to spread their gospel and deny a voice to opposition. With the woke crowd around them, they have a strong presence everywhere in the media, schools, human resources, Hollywood etc... All this presented as obvious, fair and the only moral point of view.

Shouldn't be a surprise that they actually made Jordan Perterson famous and now opposition organizes on the other side. What they are saying is fragile.

theoakman says

Quite the opposite

I have conservative friends that are teachers or administrators.. They see it like you. It's very exaggerated becasue of their bias. But I get it, since a majority of teachers are liberal, they feel like they have to be careful or something, and pretty much over react to people who simply believe there's more work to be done in areas such as the environment, yes global warming, and advocating against prejudice. Most of the time it's not out of line at all (like sjws on college campuses).

marcus says

Yes, becasue we all know that the most far left whacky sjw beliefs out there were imparted to sjws by academic/teacher union driven curricula.

We also know that if you reject sjw nonsense about the patriarchy and infinite genders then then you'll fit right in with the alt right or far right.

I remember fucking the shit out of an Ed Major at UConn circa 1999, knocked her ass out and left her to stew in her own juices.

Rummaged through her books, and it was all super SJW shit above and beyond any but the whackiest Crit Lit theorists of the day. 90% of her books were about cultural "knowledge", white males are bad and need to be guided (outright hatred of male toxicity wasn't as severe back then), etc.

That was more than 20 years ago. I can't imagine what Teachers are being "Trained" to believe today.

Patrick says

I think the correct response to bogus accusations of being "racist" or "far right" is to consistently reply with accusations of pedophilia.

And "Say Islam's teachings are valid and right about homosexuality and women, or you're an Islamophobe."

We actually agree on this.

There is common ground.

marcus says

FortWayneIndiana says

it's funny how everything gets labeled right wing when it's not full blown socialist rag with flying rainbow flags 24/7

Well I don't like the way you put it, but I agree somewhat.

Because not only do people like NoCoup try to pigeon hole all people to the left of alt right as being sjw extremists. The SJWs do this too, as if I must agree with them or be considered right wing if I don't want to get on board with leftist identity politics.

The obvious example is far leftists railing against Jordan Peterson as being a right winger. One of the reasons I like Peterson so much as that he represents an intelligent middle ground, and he questions left wing identity politics without being right wing about it. I wish he would speak out more about some things, but it's probably intentional to pull people away from the hateful right as much as it may pull others away ...

marcus says

Because not only do people like NoCoup try to pigeon hole all people to the left of alt right as being sjw extremists. The SJWs do this too, as if I must agree with them or be considered right wing if I don't want to get on board with leftist identity politics.

The diversity (tm) on the right is magnitudes larger than the diversity on the left which is practically non existent. It's not about pigeon holing it's about the dire need of the moderate left to distance themselves as much as possible and as vocal as possible from the nutjobs currently dominating liberal politics.

mell says

marcus says

Because not only do people like NoCoup try to pigeon hole all people to the left of alt right as being sjw extremists. The SJWs do this too, as if I must agree with them or be considered right wing if I don't want to get on board with leftist identity politics.

The diversity (tm) on the right is magnitudes larger than the diversity on the left which is practically non existent. It's not about pigeon holing it's about the dire need of the moderate left to distance themselves as much as possible and as vocal as possible from the nutjobs currently dominating liberal politics.

It's like jordan peterson said. It is simply more challenging to draw a clear line around what is unacceptable to the left. His suggestion is to stop at equality of outcomes.

I agree w him. Pretty much the entire left, even the "moderate" left is therefore mostly over that line in attempting to force quotas and affirmative selection, anti white male everything, etc... yes the supposed moderate leftists like marcus may laugh at trannie rights nonsense, he has mentioned multiple times how he is for affirmative action for example. Affirmative action having proven itself to be a disaster, ofc

CBOEtrader says

he has mentioned multiple times how he is for affirmative action

I'm not so much for it as I understand its purpose.

I'm opposed to it in areas such as entrance in to medical school.

But firemen ? I'm okay if affirmative action becomes almost as big a pull in hiring firemen as say family or friend connections or patronage.

CBOEtrader says

It is simply more challenging to draw a clear line around what is unacceptable to the left.

His point is to challenge the left. What is too far ?

The fact is, so far you haven't seen full fledged equality of outcome win out, nor will you any time soon in the U.S. But sure, there are clueless people in humanities depts at colleges advocating for it. Why not ? They're trying to make English degrees worth more than they are these days.

marcus says

there are clueless people in humanities depts at colleges advocating for it.

These are the people the left should be standing up to. Not Trump.

marcus says

I'm not so much for it as I understand its purpose.

I understand its purpose too. It hasnt worked.

What is has done is open the door to quotas and judging people based on physical qualities they were born with rather than character.

Its time to end theexperiment, imo. BUT AA is level 1. Our msm and leftists echo chamber have moved passed that, and straight into hate for while males.

If we cant stop this now, it can quickly escalate. History is very clear that our current path laid out the left is a violent disaster in waiting. It's already starting, ofc, but the left doesnt care about violence against anyone white or wearing a red cap.

The comment section on the NYT article is pure gold.

joshuatrio says

The comment section on the NYT article is pure gold.

Lol yeah.

"Danger, DANGER!!!

“unapologetically conservative” Gasp!

There's actually a person, Dennis Prager, who seems not to know that diversity, pluralism, and the like allow, even promote “self-criticism,” that is, the wide-open, free, no-holds-barred discussion, debate, and dissent regarding how to be better partisan leftists; let a hundred PC left-liberal flowers bloom!

Just because 99.99999% of academia is leftish, don't think for a moment that Prager and his ilk pose no threat. Dissent within bounds (Fabianism through Marxism and Maoism) is fine, but Prager respects no such safe, reasonable, inclusive limits. Shockingly, he actually thinks it's OK question the sacred canons of orthodox PC dogma; it's the thinking of those irredeemable deplorables who actually believe they have the right to not just survive but to vote.

His apostasy must be crushed, not simply criticized; one conservative voice is one too many. Fortunately our beloved media will expose this existential threat and oppose it without concern for actual free speech, freedom of conscience, journalistic standards, or other silly, antiquated bourgeois values."

CBOEtrader says

His apostasy must be crushed, not simply criticized; one conservative voice is one too many

Yep, pure Marcuse

He advocated Repressive Tolerance - what I call "Fake Tolerance" - to undo the "Repression" (particularly of the libido) brought about by "Advanced Industrial Economies".

Explains why the Left is demanding that every fetish and perversion be immediately satisfied, and why inability to do so is an indictment of the repressive system.

It's why they've eventually push to increasingly decriminalize more and more things. Next I imagine will be Teen-Adult sex. "Love has no age". Mostly to allow Gay Men to indulge in chasing young teen boys. This could be a fault line since it will be hard for them to decriminalize that without also decriminalizing heterosexual adult-teen sex in general. Then it'll be decriminalization of pedophilia, beastiality, etc.

https://www.theamericanconservative.com/dreher/sjw-herbert-marcuse-tolerance-monsters/

NoCoupForYou says

CBOEtrader says

His apostasy must be crushed, not simply criticized; one conservative voice is one too many

Yep, pure Marcuse

Lol, nah

“Tolerance is extended to policies, conditions, and modes of behavior which should not be tolerated because they are impeding, if not destroying, the chances of creating an existence without fear and misery. This sort of tolerance strengthens the tyranny of the majority against which authentic liberals protested… Liberating tolerance, then, would mean intolerance against movements from the Right and toleration of movements from the Left.” - Marcuse, Repressive Tolerance, 1965.

Real Tolerance to Marcuse is "Repressive Tolerance"
Fake Tolerance/Liberating Tolerance - repressing conservative or traditional ideas - is the only way to create the Utopia.

marcus says

I see. Only if you are 100% removed from schools and teachers do you have an accurate idea of what they are like and their beliefs.

It works for atheists in their perspectives on Christians and their churches.