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What's the best answer for coworkers and neighbors asking if you got or when are you going to get vaccinated!

Blue says

What's the best answer for coworkers and neighbors asking if you got or when are you going to get vaccinated!

Just show them your death certificate.

Here's the group: https://www.facebook.com/groups/allvaccinesarefake

Blue says

What's the best answer for coworkers and neighbors asking if you got or when are you going to get vaccinated!

No.

from: https://www.mlb.com/giants/news/giants-oracle-park-fan-health-and-safety-guidelines

"In order to gain entry, all fans 12 years or older will be required to take a COVID-19 test with negative results or provide proof of a full COVID-19 vaccination."

We can expect more of this sort of thing.

Blue says

What's the best answer for coworkers and neighbors asking if you got or when are you going to get vaccinated!

Sometimes I think of forging a vaccination card, but not being honest enables the people pushing this crap.

What I do say is it is an experimental biologic agent whose human trials will be complete in 2023. In the mean time I will take my chances with a cold.

If it is ever proven safe and effective I still won't get it. There are many effective treatments for the cold that don't involve gene therapy.

B.A.C.A.H. says

"In order to gain entry, all fans 12 years or older will be required to take a COVID-19 test with negative results or provide proof of a full COVID-19 vaccination."

We can expect more of this sort of thing.

It's been going on for a while. I know I piss you off with my travel talk, but it's my jam/hobby.

Puerto Rico and St. Thomas have been doing it for quite some time now. My biggest concern is the vaccination for entry that is starting to creep in, not just a negative test. My health insurance covers it, so I'll go to a CVS and rub the swab on my balls and get a negative test to travel.

I'm hoping private businesses blow it off and don't cave to the vocal minority. Sports teams kind of have to after losing an entire season of revenue from tickets, parking and concessions in stadium. Opening day here in Chicago and Wrigley is at 10k ticketed fans. It's usually a sell out EVERY year even if they suck, which they mostly do.

Which brings me back to one of the horses I beat. Tax revenue is massively lower. There's going to be more money printing for muni's that are broke and weren't responsible in the first place. I may be hyperbolic, but by the end of the Biden admin I think the national debt will be north of $50T. Bold claim, but we have massive structural problems.

Blue says

What's the best answer for coworkers and neighbors asking if you got or when are you going to get vaccinated!

"I prefer not to discuss my medical issues with anyone except my doctor".

"Please tell me why we need a vaccine for something with a 99.9+% survival rate."

The flu has a higher survival rate. I still get a flu shot. And that's only like 25% effective due to how many strains of the flu there are each year.

Why?
Well first, getting the flu sucks. It knocks me on my ass for up to a week sometimes. But to be fair, I only get the flu probably every 2-3 years... so probably only 10-15 times so far over the course of my life. And I don't mean just getting sick = the flu. No.

From what I understand, Covid can be flu-like for some, and for others it can knock you on your ass. However, it IS spreading like literal wildfire. That means mutations and potentially different side effects and immunities. If you are vaccinated.. and if LOTS of us are vaccinated... that cuts down on the ability of the virus to mutate. You agree, right? It's simple math. You can show this with literal 4th grade multiplication.

Now, as to the risk side.. right here in this thread, I see people quoting that the vaccine has a 12x death rate as compared to the virus. LOL! Yeah, so 100 million people have gotten the jab, and its seeming like about 20% of the population has been infected, or 70 million. Yet here Josh is posting stories that claim a 12x death rate from the vaccine.. Like.. what!?!? a 12x death rate would mean we see 6 million people dead from the vaccine. That's literally what the news "story" posting says. Can you not see through that bullshit?!? I think we might know if 6 million people were dead from the vaccine...

So take a step back. Something is wrong with your risk analysis when you are posting stories that are clearly propoganda like that. What is going on that you are buying these outlandish risk claims...

Also, I get that anecdotal stories can be scary... "Mom got the jab, 4 days later shes dead." But did you know... statistically speaking, a bunch of people have died driving to or from getting their vaccine. Is that because of the vaccine also? Everything is a risk. Anecdotal stories can really suck. But what is the real risk?

Don't get me wrong. I ask these same questions with the stupid public health policies we are putting in place. Lockdowns as implemented are moronic. There is a definite risk profile of who we have seen getting severe side effects or death, so those people should be warned to isolate, the rest of us should take precautions that have a shown efficacy, but we should generally go about our business without shutting down businesses. The stupidest thing I have seen yet is outdoor camping in the desert shut down.

And it is a true fact that suicides are up BECAUSE of the lockdown. I'm not sure what the % is per age range vs covid mortality though, but I also haven't seen a single point of data on how the actions we are taking are affecting the mortality rate "are restrictions working?". Despite all of this public policy stupidity, the vaccine makes sense.

Zak says

Also, I get that anecdotal stories can be scary... "Mom got the jab, 4 days later shes dead." But did you know... statistically speaking, a bunch of people have died driving to or from getting their vaccine. Is that because of the vaccine also?

The same can be applied to all the Covid death anecdotes, no?

WookieMan says

but by the end of the Biden admin I think the national debt will be north of $50T. Bold claim, but we have massive structural problems.

$60T, It has doubled with every president.

WookieMan says

Sports teams kind of have to after losing an entire season of revenue from tickets, parking and concessions in stadium. Opening day here in Chicago and Wrigley is at 10k ticketed fans. It's usually a sell out EVERY year even if they suck, which they mostly do.

Speaking of sportsball, looks like the NFL has extended their season from 16 to 17 games. Wonder why that could be...

@Onvacation: "If it is ever proven safe and effective I still won't get it. "

So this doesn't make a lot of sense to me. BUT I do respect that you have the RIGHT to not be forced to take a medication. And I think that should mean government can't do anything other than screen for actual sickness at any public facility like an airport or courtroom, or city hall, or public school. Public facilities should be constitutionally barred from denying any access based on a vaccine requirement. I think the same should be the case for public schools, even if parents want to be stupid about not getting their kids vaccinated.

That said, I honestly think that it's really too bad that even with a healthy mistrust of government, you can't see the benefit both short and long term of participating. Not for any kind of social cohesion or political bullshit either. The first people getting the polio vaccine were probably also pretty scared. And there have been some other medical missteps along the way causing birth defects, etc... I totally get that. And you only get one life.. I get that too.

In some ways, I guess it's kind of like laser eye surgery. You have the risk of going blind. But you can do 1 eye at a time (Still a risk of both eyes blindness). You literally could die from it in some remote possibility (but I'm sure there is 1 anecdote somewhere). And you could have a negative outcome like dry eyes or blurry vision. But you also have the opportunity to make your life better with a pretty low risk.

I guess its also like car insurance. Most people never have a significant car accident. But we all pretty much benefit from everyone having car insurance. And it's cool. We still reserve the right to people to walk or bicycle or even ride a horse to get around without buying car insurance. And we all still get in cars and ride around despite the fact that a lot of people die because of it.

Zak says

@Onvacation: "If it is ever proven safe and effective I still won't get it. "

So this doesn't make a lot of sense to me

Because I am not afraid of the flu or cold. I am healthy, I eat fairly well, I exercise regularly and I have a strong immune system. Need I say more?

If the disease probability was worse than the experimental biologic agent possibilities I might get it. But it is not.

Zak says

In some ways, I guess it's kind of like laser eye surgery. You have the risk of going blind. But you can do 1 eye at a time (Still a risk of both eyes blindness). You literally could die from it in some remote possibility (but I'm sure there is 1 anecdote somewhere). And you could have a negative outcome like dry eyes or blurry vision. But you also have the opportunity to make your life better with a pretty low risk.

Great analogy. You have a minor inconvenience of wearing glasses on one hand and some non-zero risk of going blind on the other. Some people won't put themselves in a situation of non-zero risk of major life-changing event in order to get rid of some minor inconvenience. The downside is too big for some even if not very probable.

Zak says

even if parents want to be stupid about not getting their kids vaccinated.

Would you give your children an experimental biologic agent? It's not a vaccine.

Zak says

That said, I honestly think that it's really too bad that even with a healthy mistrust of government, you can't see the benefit both short and long term of participating. Not for any kind of social cohesion or political bullshit either.

OK I'll bite.
Give me one short term and one long term benefit of taking an experimental biologic agent?

Zak says

And we all still get in cars and ride around despite the fact that a lot of people die because of it.

A lot more than die from the Wuhan.

Your body your choice.

Zak says

the vaccine makes sense.

But it's not a vaccine. What do you mean by "makes sense"?

https://www.ibtimes.com/who-gregory-michael-doctor-dead-after-covid-vaccine-wife-says-it-destroyed-beautiful-3116594?fbclid=IwAR0hLzba5T9k3D6soVIW3KQLxfgTPYQuaV4AqEK2kY0wAVx13JTlWhTW2rE

I saw a You Tube video of an internist who was a pro-vaxxer, had videos promoting and he took it himself. He described very bad reaction to both first and second, second he wasn't able to do anything for three days, says he 'recovered' after about five. However, in 'post-vax' You Tube vid he looks like hammered shit and talks like he has the 'brain fog'. What's interesting, you can view his vids before he took the vax and see he was clearer, healthier, and much crisper in his speech and responses. I didn't download the site and can't remember his name.

Here's facebook's knee jerk fake news post on the vaccine complications site:

The vaccines aren't FDA approved yet.
They gave them emergency approval.

"Give me one short term and one long term benefit of taking an experimental biologic agent?"

Short term benefit - mRNA stimulated antibodies protect you from contracting a virus. Not a maybe virus.. a real virus. studies DO show a highly effective protection from contracting said virus. Do you dispute this?

Long term benefit - reduced population transmitting virus lowers the number of virus replications by billions of times. Each virus replication is an opportunity for mutation to a vaccine(biological agent in your terms) resistant state, AND to a potentially more lethal state. Thus the long term odds of mutation to a more dangerous strain are reduced DRASTICALLY. Again, this is layperson level science, shown and proven, and easily understood... Do you dispute this?

Risk: short term allergic type reactions to a small pct of the population. Probably a very tiny risk of death (as with all vaccines) . Drastically lower chance of death than contracting the virus. Do you dispute this? Possible long term other risk factors .. cancer .. reproductive impaction.. general health or cognitive impact . .0000000001 % risk : secret government mind control protocol in effect Also: this might cause aliens to birth from your skull.

Blue says

What's the best answer for coworkers and neighbors asking if you got or when are you going to get vaccinated!

BTW, if somebody asks you that at work - report their ass to HR.

@clambo.. a couple things... is the virus FDA approved? Will it meet the several layers of protocol based safety assurances that the FDA guidelines are intended to ensure?

I get it.. there might be risks. A bunch of people volunteered to be the first guinea pigs, and take a huge risk, so that you could rest easier knowing this has been tested on other humans. And despite that, there is still a risk. But now a hundred million in the US, and hundreds of million more besides that have also taken the vaccine. I'm not saying don't be careful. I'm saying statistics are hard, but actually look at them and use some basic math to try to figure out what is actually more risky. The vaccine/mRNA agent is less risky any way I have looked at it so far.

Zak says

"Give me one short term and one long term benefit of taking an experimental biologic agent?"

Short term benefit - mRNA stimulated antibodies protect you from contracting a virus. Not a maybe virus.. a real virus. studies DO show a highly effective protection from contracting said virus. Do you dispute this?

Long term benefit - reduced population transmitting virus lowers the number of virus replications by billions of times. Each virus replication is an opportunity for mutation to a vaccine(biological agent in your terms) resistant state, AND to a potentially more lethal state. Thus the long term odds of mutation to a more dangerous strain are reduced DRASTICALLY. Again, this is layperson level science, shown and proven, and easily understood... Do you dispute this?

Risk: short term allergic type reactions to a small pct of the population. Probably a very tiny risk of death (as with all vaccines) . Drastically lower chance of death than contracting the virus...

Viruses usually evolve to be less lethal so they can stay around longer, see rhino and other common cold viruses. In fact trying to eradicate a virus by vaccination is a risky endeavor for frequently mutating viruses, esp. for those vaccinated. It does work for slowly or hardly mutating viruses that are often severe. CVs are not part of that group. They are more like common cold viruses. So they will never defeat them, they will become endemic and threaten those vaccinated over the years via ADE and chronic inflammation/side effects.

Zak says

The vaccine/mRNA agent is less risky any way I have looked at it so far.

Look at it this way: your chances of dying from the virus are approximately zero unless you are already beyond normal US life expectancy and/or obese.

But the vaccine is so unknown that none of the makers will accept any liability for it. There has not been enough time to assess the potential long-term damage the vaccine may cause. Maybe everyone who gets the vaccine will start getting auto-immune disorders next year.

"The same can be applied to all the Covid death anecdotes, no?"

Oh absolutely. And please specifically note that I did NOT say to ignore any of these as a data point. In fact, I get pissed off when I hear and see them put the anecdotal bad covid deaths up. It's a terrible way to take advantage of the way our brain deals with risk. It's propaganda. I fucking hate it. It actually makes me want to NOT follow public policy because of my anti-authoritarian/bullshit nature. It makes my lizard brain want to believe the "government conspiracies" because my lizard brain has learned to be very distrustful of anyone that tries to bullshit me.

I think you can tell.. I'm not trying to bullshit you. I see that others with an interest in the public policy aspect of this absolutely are trying to bullshit and propagandize the whole situation. There is 100% a liberal political agenda to push socialism and nanny state while riding Covid. I'm firmly in the camp of that is absolute horseshit. But that doesn't mean that Covid isn't real.The propaganda doesn't invalidate that there is a validly produced and tested scientific product that has been created to combat it. And we are very fucking lucky the lady that pioneered some of this mRNA research stuck to her guns when she was getting shit on by her university. They probably were trying to fund some social research about white male privilege destroying the country or something instead...

Patrick says

Look at it this way: your chances of dying from the virus are approximately zero unless you are already beyond normal US life expectancy and/or obese.

"About 78% of people who have been hospitalized, needed a ventilator or died from Covid-19 have been overweight or obese, the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention said in a new study Monday."
https://www.cnbc.com/2021/03/08/covid-cdc-study-finds-roughly-78percent-of-people-hospitalized-were-overweight-or-obese.html
Add that to the age angle (average age of death from Covid is 80) and the probability of Death From Covid for a lot of us is effectively Zero.
And yet here come the Covid Passports.
And vaccination of children.

mell says

Viruses usually evolve to be less lethal so they can stay around longer, see rhino and other common cold viruses.

The Spanish flu is still around.

Zak, I was just nitpicking.
I took the Moderna shot 2x. I’m not avoiding it.
They gave us a printout about the Moderna vaccine, and I saw that it is actually not approved, but has an emergency approval.
I saw a new MD today and he said he was pleased that I took it.
He is also an employee of the “medical group” so he will not differ from official approved opinions.
For the record I
Don’t believe in the tooth fairy
Don’t believe Wuhan/Corona/Covid virus is a big deal
Don’t believe Biden won

@Patrick What you say is correct. There IS a possibility that the vaccine/mRNA agent causes long term damage. So after we acknowledge it, let's try to quantify it.

1) There seem to be some cases of the Astra Zenica vaccine causing an "enhanced" immune response. I haven't seen numbers on what % of people are having this happen in the first place. I haven't seen ANY data on if there are lingering effects, or if it is a short term thing. Given that there are other options, I chose to not use Astra Zenica if it was offered to me. I think I got Pfizer, and so it didn't matter.

2) The most at risk patients were/are the elderly/obese. They have a different risk tolerance to getting covid vs getting the vaccine. In other words.. what do you care if there is a long term effect 10 years down the road if you are only expecting to live 8 years, and the virus might kill you next week if you get it.. Again, radically different risk profile to manage.

3) Since the elderly and obese are getting it first, we get to have a bit more data as the rest of the population. This is actually pretty lucky. I pointed out earlier where there are clearly charlatans claiming a 12x death rate for the elderly up to a 100x death rate for the young.. It's easy to show with simple math why this is just pure falsehood being spread around. Since it is primarily the elderly making up the current death rate, a 12x death rate on the elderly would put the vaccine deaths around 6 million in the US alone... I think we might hear something if 6 million old people had just died over the past 3 months after taking the vaccine... I mean.. fox news might be on top of that...

4) It's not just this vaccine that the makers won't accept liability for. It's all vaccines. There is literally a special vaccine court, and a special vaccine compensation fund run by the government. Vaccines literally CAN kill you. I will never dispute it, and I don't defend the special courts. But, I do think the litigious society we are in is fucking us in a lot of ways, and this is one of them.

Everybody wants "safe" but the world is not fucking safe. Instead of recognizing that shit happens, and we can't always prevent it, even when we do our very best, we sue people and prevent them from helping thousands or even millions, because one person got unlucky with the odds. To me, the bullshit rises when we try to say vaccines are safe. Sorry, but there is a small risk it will kill you. This is the deal. BTW, yellowstone has a risk of blowing up tomorrow and killing 1/3 of the US population as well.. We live with a lot of very small risks. In the end, none of us gets out. The sum total of all risks adds up to 100%, and something kills 100% of every single person on this planet.

Ok. So there are risks. BUT we are trying to work on them. Mitigating the risk that covid spreads and mutates is something we can do something about. It's not a lawsuit to prevent bad behavior with someone, its literally humanity battling with a disease that has killed a few million people now. I'm not encouraging people to blindly eat bugs to prevent covid or to do some stupid extra risky stuff.

To me, it seems like a lot of people in science have worked real hard to get something in place to try to help us as the human race. There are some risks associated with the solution they've come up with. It seems like they've tried to apply engineering principles to create something with manageable risk, working with the human body as we understand it in aggregate today. There's 3 different versions (and more in other countries) of ways people have come up with to combat this thing.

On the other side of this risk profile, we have a virus. A biological force of nature. It is shaped by nothing other than evolutionary pressure (or maybe some help from some wuhan lab guys), but it is uncontained, replicating billions of times, and just ready for its next evolutionary step. And it IS killing people. Maybe not our demographic, but for sure the demographic of many people that we know and love. And it's causing long term damage to thousands or hundreds of thousands more. We can't bitch at it and tell it that it's so mean and it should stop. We can't sue it. We can't try a different version if we find that it mutates and kills more people. All we CAN do is try to find out how it spreads, and slow that down, find treatments to prevent it from damaging our bodies if we do get it.. or try to prepare our bodies to fight it when it is encountered (vaccine/mRNA agent).

If there was a bull running through your house, you wouldn't just say "oh he's nice, he hasn't even broken anything yet" You get the bull out of the house, IF you can, and you try not to get gored doing it... but.. you might still get gored... it's a risk.

Zak says

To me, it seems like a lot of people in science have worked real hard to get something in place to try to help us as the human race.

This an altruism that sadly has to be abandoned. I would say a lot of people in science USED TO work real hard to get things in place to try to help us as the human race. That currency of trust has been spent down by the Globalists and their maniacal plans of world dominance and population control.

Psychopaths routinely will exploit altruistic motives to attain non-altruistic and evil ends. Look at all the 'inverse' naming of organizations that do nothing related to what their altruistic and high flying titles suggest. Like, the Patriot Act had nothing to do with patriotism and everything to do with removing citizen rights, after a false flag.

"This an altruism that sadly has to be abandoned"

To reject that numerous people have been involved with positive intentions, and who would fail to report nefarious behavior in the production of not just one, but three different drugs is illogical.

Suppose we want to say this follows the pattern of the Tuskeegee syphilyus experiment. The only way that breach of public trust could happen is because it was confined and limited in its exposure. These drugs have literally hundreds of millions of uses now, have been through numerous studies, and the recipients have now seen tens of thousands of GPs and specialists. If there is a secret conspiracy that can withstand that kind of exposure, then just fucking give up because they've already got you 10 other ways.

If you want to rebel, go shoot somebody at the federal reserve, because they've already got you defanged by your wallet. If you eat that without complaint, how does this even compare?

clambo says

To me, it seems like a lot of people in science have worked real hard to get something in place to try to help us as the human race.

Why are these great people ignoring the non vaccine solutions like Ivermectin and HCQ?

Zak says

All we CAN do is try to find out how it spreads, and slow that down, find treatments to prevent it from damaging our bodies if we do get it.. or try to prepare our bodies to fight it when it is encountered

Ivermectin...HCQ

Right, those treatments are effective, but not nearly as profitable by a long shot.

https://c19hcq.com/

You can actually look at all the collected scientific evidence.