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Good source of historical data for RE sales/trends?

By mostly reader follow mostly reader   2022 Mar 6, 8:23pm 465 views  26 comments           share      

Greetings. I figured, I may as well ask it here.
Can anyone recommend a good source of historical data for RE sales? Something detailed and thorough. Emphasis would be on Montana market, but country-wide is ok too. Subscription/fee-based is ok, as long as it's worth it. Analytics is a plus but not a must, just raw data works too.
Before someone asks, I'm aware of Zillow, it doesn't fit the bill.
Thanks.
1   Hircus   2022 Mar 6, 8:38pm  

I've had difficulty getting RE data in the past.

I think the realtor mafia conspires to keep this data locked down and difficult to get.
2   Patrick   2022 Mar 6, 9:11pm  

The Case-Shiller index might be of use.

The realtor mafia definitely conspires to keep the public in the dark.

So if you really want data, you could get a license and work as a realtor for a while.

Or you could try to get a job in the relevant county's records office.
3   mostly reader   2022 Mar 6, 9:13pm  

Hircus says
I've had difficulty getting RE data in the past.

I think the realtor mafia conspires to keep this data locked down and difficult to get.
That's what I'm discovering. It's public data damn it, yet I'm not finding a service which would just sort it and deliver it to consumer.
4   NuttBoxer   2022 Mar 6, 9:26pm  

Zillow and Redfin are good for when you see something you like, as they give the info on how long it's been listed, how many times it was re-listed, price changes, etc.
5   Eman   2022 Mar 6, 9:35pm  

Propertyradar.com. Unfortunately, they only have data for the 3 states, CA, NV and AZ I believe.

I’ve heard of Propertyshark.com, but have never used it and have no idea which states it covers.

You can get some data for free by signing up with Redfin.

Good luck.
6   mostly reader   2022 Mar 6, 10:10pm  

I'm signed up for Zillow APIs and Redfin, neither one provides historical data in the format which can be analyzed (as far as I figured)
Case-Shiller index is the right idea, but it lags a bit too much to be useful.
Propetyshark.com - looked promising until it turned out that they don't serve Montana. They serve almost all states, but not Montana
Propertyradar.com - Just got a trial account with them, it seems that their data goes beyond those 3 states. They may have expanded, I'll check out what's up with that.

Thanks to all who provided info!
8   clambo   2022 Mar 7, 7:44am  

Doesn’t the Federal Reserve have such information?

I saw somewhere that Montana had similar % rise as Florida last year.
9   DooDahMan   2022 May 13, 1:17am  

@mostly reader

mostly reader says
Emphasis would be on Montana market,


Q1 2022 GARDNER REPORT - Montana - Real Estate Market Update

Montana Home Sales

❱ In the first quarter of the year, 1,137 homes sold, which is a 35% drop from a year ago and 23.2% lower than in the final quarter of 2021.

❱ The lower number of sales can be blamed on the lack of homes for sale: inventory was down 37.7% from a year ago and was 31.7% lower than the previous quarter.

❱ The small county of Jefferson saw sales increase from a year ago, but all other markets pulled back. Compared to the final quarter of 2021, sales were lower across the board.

❱ Pending sales increased by a solid 18.8% quarter over quarter, suggesting that second quarter numbers should show growth.

More Stuff in the link: https://www.windermere.com/market-update/montana?source=patrick.net

Hope that helps you
10   DooDahMan   2022 May 13, 1:20am  

@mostly reader

This next link is much more detailed - you can pick from cities and towns alphabetically in Montana

https://www.movoto.com/mt/market-trends/?source=patrick.net
11   mostly reader   2022 May 13, 6:37am  

> DooDahMan

Thanks! Good sources.
12   DooDahMan   2022 May 13, 7:09am  

@mostly reader

If you need more, let me know. I just did a quick look around but there is more out there. That second link was quite interesting compared to the first one
13   Tenpoundbass   2022 May 13, 7:10am  

ZIllow is a shell of its former self. It used to be bare naked view of the Real Estate market, now it's very controlled RE advertising and nothing more.
14   DooDahMan   2022 May 13, 7:12am  

Tenpoundbass says
ZIllow is a shell of its former self


Yes but there are other sources to work from/with. Mostly reader was looking for Historical Sales Data in Montana and that is what I posted.
15   mostly reader   2022 May 22, 9:50am  

DooDahMan says

@mostly reader

If you need more, let me know. I just did a quick look around but there is more out there. That second link was quite interesting compared to the first one
I'll be more specific. I have a nice chunk of land in prime area in Big Sky, and now deciding what to do with it. May put some infrastructure in place and sell for profit, or go the whole builder route. The question is one of timing. It seems that construction got a bit more expensive, while I'm betting that the RE prices are taking a bit of downturn. That market is the opposite of mid-500K markets of Florida/Vegas/etc, so I doubt that the downturn will affect that particular place much, but it's still a consideration. Started looking at upscale prefabs, some look like a possibility - emphasis on "upscale", the area is mostly 4-5K sq.f. houses priced around 5M)
I'd appreciate any genuine thoughts and ideas.
16   DooDahMan   2022 May 22, 9:52am  

mostly reader says
I'd appreciate any genuine thoughts and ideas.


This may take a bit but I will see what if anything I can find later today and or this evening when I have some time.

For some stupid reason the grass keeps growing and demands to be cut and I hate when that happens.
17   mostly reader   2022 May 22, 10:08am  

Thanks!
18   DooDahMan   2022 May 22, 10:12am  

mostly reader says

Thanks!


I will get back to you within 24-36 hours.
19   DooDahMan   2022 May 22, 4:34pm  

@mostly reader

Here are a few things I found so far - they seem to fall in line more or less with your thoughts. I am not sure how this first link affects you if at all but it caught my eye because of potential downside risks. Also do you know what your water rights are if any ?

BUYING LAND WITHOUT MINERAL RIGHTS? 11 THINGS YOU (2022) NEED TO KNOW

https://gokcecapital.com/buying-land-without-mineral-rights/

The Hidden Costs of Development

https://buildingadvisor.com/buying-land/budgeting/

The Land Development Process In 6 Steps

https://www.fortunebuilders.com/raw-land-investing/

Stats and Trends: Market statistics and trends related to the Montana land market.

https://mtlandsource.com/news-events-categories/stats-and-trends

Housing Development Trends in Montana ( a bit dated but usefull)

https://www.imegcorp.com/housing-development-trends-in-montana/

These are also worth a look since I do not know where the property is - there are some interesting things going on there however from a tech business investment

Study argues pro-duplex zoning would ease Montana housing crunch

https://montanafreepress.org/2022/03/03/study-argues-pro-duplex-zoning-would-ease-montana-housing-crunch/

$20M Hyundai Motor Group R&D Center set to open in Bozeman

https://www.krtv.com/news/montana-and-regional-news/20m-hyundai-motor-group-r-d-center-set-to-open-in-bozeman

Then again it may be worthwhile to sit tight and wait

Land values rising rapidly

https://www.thesheridanpress.com/news/regional-news/land-values-rising-rapidly/article_49ad317e-a606-11ec-82a1-0bf71988aaf8.html

Last but not least - do not forget about these people

How Billionaires Helped Kill A Housing Development In A Montana Ski Town

https://www.forbes.com/sites/giacomotognini/2022/02/16/how-billionaires-helped-kill-a-housing-development-in-a-montana-ski-town/?sh=5ed34b51d4b7

I will be doing some more digging in the next 24 hours so hopefully I can find something better.

Do you have any boots on the ground in Montana that can give you the very latest ?
20   DooDahMan   2022 May 22, 4:49pm  

@mostly reader

If I am not on the right track, send me something with @ in front of my name and I will see it in my email system and then I can adjust my work
21   mostly reader   2022 May 22, 9:33pm  

@ DooDahMan

Thanks for the links. Reading the last one, about billionaires stopping affordable housing in Whitefish, was quite entertaining - I heard about that story from a local resident. That entire area is quite intriguing. I still don't get it why Whitefish carries the price tag that it does. In that part of Montana, Flathead County looked to me like a better bang per buck than Whitefish. Area by Flathead Lake is super nice (although so is the area around Whitefish Lake)

It's quite striking how pristine Montana is. Locals apparently were brought up to respect nature. Water in those lakes near the towns - Flathead Lake, Whitefish Lake - is about as pristine as water in McDonald Lake (National Park)

My land is not there, it's in Big Sky. Big Sky is a different story altogether. It's very beautiful, and a top notch hiking/nature destination. There's no real industry to speak of in Big Sky. Just elevation, hiking, and grizzly bears. And of course that famous ski resort and bunch of NY/CA big shots who decided that they want to combine business with pleasure away from prying eyes. Prices are insane. It gets insane-er if the association has privilege to distribute passes to the mountain, including restricted parts (that's not my situation though, I wouldn't have that privilege) I didn't quite expect to see Atherton prices in Montana, but yeah, that's approximately what it is.

The process with permits is not yet complete, and meanwhile market is changing. I'm just trying to understand how much it's changing and what it means in practical terms, if anything.
22   DooDahMan   2022 May 23, 1:06am  

@mostly reader - There is not a lot out there but I did manage to find a few more things that should be of interest to you
23   DooDahMan   2022 May 23, 2:44am  

Here you go, some of this covers all of Gallatin County:

https://www.eralandmark.com/market-watch/2022-southwest-montana-housing-update/

https://www.neighborhoodscout.com/mt/big-sky

https://www.rockethomes.com/real-estate-trends/mt/big-sky

https://bigskyeconomicdevelopment.org/

This next one has info on development guidelines/permits/etc.

https://gallatincomt.virtualtownhall.net/planning-community-development

GALLATIN COUNTY SUBDIVISION REGULATIONS (not sure how much property u have)

http://www.accpg.org/docs/Undated/Galatin%20County%20Subdivision%20Regulations%202014.pdf

Big Sky Economic Development (access to report in the main link)

https://bigskyeconomicdevelopment.org/

https://www.explorebigsky.com/

https://www.explorebigsky.com/gallatin-county-advances-flatiron-development/42011

https://bigskyresort.com/2025

This last one is to confirm your comment about Atherton prices in Big Sky

How Much Do Homes Cost in Big Sky, Montana - Market Report in the Link Below

Median Price of a Single Family Home in Big Sky
$4,742,842
Median Price of a Townhome in Big Sky
$1,875,000
Median Price of a Condo in Big Sky
$1,255,000

https://bozemanrealestate.group/blog/how-much-do-homes-cost-in-big-sky-montana

Not sure how much of what I have here is new to you or old news. Based on other links which are mostly repetitive to a large degree it will take a significant economic downturn to have much impact on prices here given the clientele. The bigger concern I am seeing over and over is affordable housing for the workers and pollution of the main rivers from all of the development which are a major draw to the area

Maybe affordable rental housing for workers is a niche to look into.
24   BayArea   2022 May 23, 7:08am  

Someone on Patnet once told me years ago

A good realtor is like a good rapist
25   mostly reader   2022 May 23, 7:16pm  

DooDahMan says
Not sure how much of what I have here is new to you or old news.
Some of it is new, and the rest is cross-validation. Thanks for doing this.

Digging through regulations is fun. I've had my share of dealing with legalese in tech world, yet this seems like a different language altogether.
26   GreaterNYCDude   2022 May 23, 7:18pm  

BayArea says

Someone on Patnet once told me years ago

A good realtor is like a good rapist

The give you a jar of vasaline before they screw you over?

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