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US Medical Costs Thread


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2022 Jun 17, 5:14pm   663 views  28 comments

by Patrick   ➕follow (55)   💰tip   ignore  

https://markoshinskie8de.substack.com/p/the-medicalindustrial-complex-has


In college, I took a Latin American Politics and Development class. When discussing Latin American medical care, Professor Eldon Kenworthy presented a deeply countercultural idea. Echoing a journal article by the scholar, Robert Ayres, Kenworthy maintained that building hospitals there costs lives. If, instead of erecting, equipping and staffing gleaming medical centers, this same money and human effort were devoted to providing clean water, good food and sanitation, the public health yield would be much greater.

United States medical history bears out Ayres’s paradox. The biggest increases in US life expectancy occurred early in the Twentieth Century, when people had increasing access to calories and protein, better water and sanitation. Lives lengthened sharply decades before vaccines, antibiotics or nearly any drugs were available, and a century before hospitals merged into corporate Systems. ...

The American medical landscape has changed radically in the forty years since I learned of Ayres’ observation. America spends three times as much, as a percentage of GDP, on medical treatments as it did in the 1960s.

By 2020, America devoted 18% of its GDP to medicine. (By comparison, about 5% goes to the military). Adding the mega-costs of mass testing and “vaxxes,” etc., medical expenditures might now approach 20%. Although the US spends more than twice per capita what any other nation spends on medical care, American ranks 46th in life expectancy. US life expectancy has flatlined, despite growing medical spending and broadened medical access via the vaunted Affordable Care Act. ...

Med/Pharma resembles the monopolistic modern robber barons. But since all are required to medically insure and to pay taxes, one can’t simply opt out or buy only those medical services that one thinks justify their costs. With massive, guaranteed funding sources, aggregate medical revenues will continue to climb.

Thus, Medical Industrial Complex has become a Black Hole for today’s wealth. With great money comes great power. The Med/Pharma juggernaut rules the airwaves. Nonexistent until the 1990s, hospital System and drug ads now dominate advertising. By being such big advertisers, Med/Pharma dictates news content. Analysts who point out that lavish medical expenditures don’t yield commensurate public health benefit have small audiences. Med/Pharma critics can’t afford ads. ...

Medicine is the new American religion. Given such fervent belief in medicine’s importance and the sense of entitlement regarding expanding medical treatments, government and insurance money is relentlessly overallocated to medicine. ...

Further, people blindly, ardently believed in the shots simply because they were marketed as “vaccines” by bureaucrats wearing medical garb. Despite the shots’ failure and the failure of other “mitigation” measures like lockdowns, masking and testing, many refuse to concede that Med/Pharma has had much—overwhelmingly negative— influence over the society and economy and public health during Coronamania. Beyond merely failing, the shots now show signs of negative efficacy.


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1   Patrick   2022 Jun 27, 11:50am  

https://www.washingtonexaminer.com/policy/healthcare/mark-cubans-drug-company-exposes-billions-government-overspending


Mark Cuban’s new drug company exposes billions in government overspending


US "healthcare" is just another faction of the mafia.
2   AD   2022 Jun 27, 1:21pm  

Patrick says

US "healthcare" is just another faction of the mafia.


That is very true, it is along with universities and colleges within the USA.

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3   NuttBoxer   2022 Jun 27, 9:28pm  

Makes sense that whatever you put money into, that's what your going to use. If you invest in good food and clean living, that's what you'll get. If you invest in insurance, doctors and pills, then that's what you're gonna get.
4   Patrick   2022 Jun 28, 3:56pm  

https://rwmalonemd.substack.com/p/boiled-alive


We called a friend in Athens – a native of that stunning city – who met us at the dock. We drove straight to the ER of a major hospital. Because of Covid they allow just two people to enter; I waited outside while our friend escorted her. He knew his way around.

What happened next was a string of utterly incomprehensible events.

The hospital was bustling, yet my wife was seen by a physician within 15 minutes. She texted me that the doctor thought it was a torn ligament but wanted an x-ray. I reflexively settled in for a three-hour wait. We’d been wondering about the cost on the drive over and we were prepared to put thousands of dollars on a credit card, carefully taught by American healthcare to anticipate “super-bills” for later (usually futile) submission to Blue Cross. Back home, the cost of healthcare pricing radically fluctuates from modest high range to the outright gouge. I was prepared for the worst.

In Athens, the examination, x-rays included, was $190. Fifteen minutes later, she texted that the x-ray was done – but how? How could that be true? – and an MRI was already scheduled at a different location. I thought ahead, as I’d been trained: the drive to another place, the waiting, the MRI, the more waiting... an estimation of three to four hours at the very least, that is PCSHT (Pacific Cedars-Sinai Hospital Time). Our kind friend took us to the facility, where a man in a white coat was the “guard” outside; he looked exactly like a doctor on a break. We were allowed to park in front of the building the entire time that we were inside; no glowering men in police uniforms shaming and shooing us to a dank ten-level parking structure.

After 40 minutes, we left with a CD and photographic images of the MRI results. The cost: around $275. ...

We arrived at the ER at around 830AM – and were out by lunchtime. We had our meal in a lovely restaurant in Piraeus, overlooking an azure sea. The fish was glorious; but the anger and shame of what the American healthcare “system” has become was awful.
5   HeadSet   2022 Jun 28, 5:29pm  

My father-in-law got sick a few years ago while vacationing in France. He was required to stay for two weeks in a French hospital. The bill was 1,000 Euros per night.
7   GNL   2022 Jun 28, 6:22pm  

Patrick says


https://www.washingtonexaminer.com/policy/healthcare/mark-cubans-drug-company-exposes-billions-government-overspending


Mark Cuban’s new drug company exposes billions in government overspending


US "healthcare" is just another faction of the mafia.


2 true personal Healthcare stories (just the bullet points to avoid long-windedness)...

1) I was diagnosed with a C4/C5 herniated disc. 2 surgeons said I needed surgery. I went to a chiropractor for 3 months instead. Received a $600 bill for the MRI. I sent a letter to my insurance company telling them I never wanted to see that bill again since I saved them $30K(?). I also told them I was contacting a lawyer to see if I should sue their doctors for steering me toward unnecessary surgery. The MRI bill was canceled.

2) similar situation with plantar fasciitis. Doctor said I needed surgery. I was driving through town and noticed a shoe store with "Plantar Fasciitis written on the sign. Both the store and the shoe salesman looked 100 years old. The salesman sold me a pair of corrective shoes ($150) and proceeded to cut out 2 pads using hand scissors. He kept cutting them until I said they were comfortable but still had some tiny bit of uncomfortable pressure on my insole. 2 weeks later...all better.

I was healed by a chiropractor and a shoe salesman vs. $500K/year (or more) doctors.
8   GNL   2022 Jun 28, 6:24pm  

You are your own best health advocate.
9   GNL   2022 Jun 28, 6:26pm  

Patrick says

That's super-cheap compared to the US:



https://www.peoplekeep.com/blog/infographic-how-much-does-a-hospital-stay-cost

That doesn't say how much per night/day.
10   stereotomy   2022 Jun 28, 6:46pm  

WineHorror1 says

You are your own best health advocate.


This is the truth. After a near-fatal car accident, I had to learn all about common and uncommon complications. The doctors wouldn't tell me shit. They were too afraid that I was using the internet to learn about my condition. They're just like the priests before the protestant reformation - medicine is what they say it is. Fuck them and the horses they rode in on.
11   NuttBoxer   2022 Jun 28, 8:13pm  

I found out about chiropractic and massage by providence. Just happened to be part of a Bible study where one of the guys in it was super into health. Saw me after my accident, told me I looked messed up, and gave a card for his chiropractor and massage therapist. Never needed anything else, although occasionally now I'll smoke as I tend to get headaches overnight every once in a while, and that fixes it for about a month.

Also got planter fascia from standing too long without a mat. Got a mat, learned to alternate standing and sitting, and most importantly got inserts with good arches. Never even knew until a few years ago I have a high arch. Still feel the planter fascia every once in a while, but I often don't wear shoes around the house, and will go out in sandals, or cook int the kitchen barefoot. Basically fine though.

Recently inflamed some nerves in my wrist for the first time ever in my 15 year career. Keyboard was too small and didn't realize it until after the fact. Also my standing desk doesn't come down quite as low as it should, and my chair has started sinking. Bad combo. Got a split keyboard, side positioned mouse, and have a new chair coming. Plus I've been wearing wrist braces. Felt so good at massage today I don't think I'll be back for at least a few weeks, and plan to start going without wrist brace when I'm not working.

No surgery for any of these situations. All fixed without missing much if any time from work, all relatively low cost preventative solutions.
12   Patrick   2022 Jun 30, 9:34pm  

El Salvador is way ahead of the US in promoting the interests of its citizens instead of the interests of the medical mafia.

13   Patrick   2022 Jul 22, 6:18pm  

https://patriotpost.us/articles/89993


Everything is more expensive these days, from gas to groceries. But lost in the headlines are the skyrocketing cost of ObamaCare, its impact on inflation, and the fact that Democrats want even more control over our nation’s healthcare system despite their record of miserable failure.

Consumers were famously and repeatedly promised lower costs with ObamaCare, but there was little attention paid to the fact that the Affordable Care Act could only function with a steady stream of billions of dollars in government subsidies. The corrupt corporate media hasn’t mentioned it much in recent years, but it’s still there, and it’s going to have a big impact on November’s congressional elections.

Why? Democrats want to increase those subsidies to prop up ObamaCare and — here’s the outrageous part — to fight inflation. If you’re thinking more government spending causes inflation, you’re right. Leave it to the Democrats to create a bad situation and make it worse.

To keep the money flowing into ObamaCare, President Joe Biden signed the American Rescue Plan Act into law in 2021. According to the Congressional Budget Office, the massive spending package includes subsidies that will “cost a whopping $30 billion in 2022, an amount 50% above the amount CBO projected one year earlier. Obamacare’s total subsidy cost will be about $90 billion in 2022 — $60 billion for the original and $30 billion for the expanded component.”
14   komputodo   2022 Jul 22, 10:42pm  

I call bullshit on this thread...everything in the USA is the best...Better than any other country...that's why everyone hates us...because we are better and also for our freedoms!!!
15   komputodo   2022 Jul 23, 9:36pm  

I remember when a cancer diagnosis was a bad thing...chemo, loss of weight, loss of hair, etc. Now it seems like i see people who are diagnosed with cancer and don't lose any weight, no hair loss, maybe a quick operation and 1 day recovery and 2 weeks later as if nothing happened at all. Is it possible that these cancer diagnosis's are fake just to generate money?
17   stereotomy   2022 Aug 5, 11:28am  

Patrick says


El Salvador is way ahead of the US in promoting the interests of its citizens instead of the interests of the medical mafia.



I'll object to the saturated fat slagging. Granted, some people won't do well with saturated fat, but saturated fat is not the devil.

As someone descended from Northen European stock, I've found out that saturated fats, 100% grass-fed beef, milk and milkfats are my friends. Gluten-saturated industrial bread, omega-6 industrial oils, HFCs, grain-fed meat, and sugar are the real enemy.

People grow up thinking that they're immortal. They don't realize that once they pass through their 20's, their bodies lose vitality. The "Things I Used to Do" no longer apply. Through happenstance, I had to rediscover what my body needed in my mid-30's. It turned out to be the exact opposite of what I had been consuming when I was younger.

I see it all the time at work now. All these foolish women who went vegan but now admit that they have to supplement their diet with fish or someorother.

My advice to anyone thinking of raising a family is to make sure that you can source the best quality real food that you can, both for yourselves and your children. This means real meat, fermented dairy (cheese, eggs, yogurt, butter), heirloom vegetables (stuff that actually tastes delicious), and anything else that you can think of.

We've been deceived and lied to for more than half a century. We see the health crisis that's nearly universal in western countries
19   NuttBoxer   2024 Feb 13, 3:06pm  

Even dental and vision insurance have a questionable value at this point. Vision only covers shitty chains like Pearl Vision and Walmart. Paid like $300 for a deep cleaning, WITH insurance. Would have been cheaper in Mexico. Likely going to drop dental insurance and just pay cash.
20   GNL   2024 Feb 13, 4:24pm  

I paid $600 for a deep cleaning without dental insurance.
21   mell   2024 Feb 13, 4:43pm  

Most dental insurances cover 2 basic cleanings per year for free with in network dentists. That being said, it's quite annoying when you switch insurance how a relatively affordable no frills dentist suddenly becomes out of network. On the search for a replacement one I came across a practice that only accepts one specific plan by a single insurance. Pretty nuts, the system is broken.
22   AD   2024 Feb 13, 4:53pm  

.

We pay about $42 a month for MetLife dental insurance. We get two free cleanings per year and one free x-ray examination per year.

We end up paying about $400 for a crown procedure with this insurance coverage and about $100 for a dental cavity filing.

.
23   stereotomy   2024 Feb 13, 5:25pm  

I've been using this stuff for the last 10+ years. Context: brush once a day in the morning during the workweek, then skip weekends. No flossing.

https://getlivfresh.com/

I found about this stuff from one of the founders on iTulip. It dissolves the biofilm bonds that allow plaque to form. Use this every other day, and you won't have any gum bleeding.

I go to the dentist, and I somewhat dread it. They don't see any plaque and so they dig really deep into my gums just to try and find something that isn't there. When they test the pockets, my gums are all pretty much 1 or 2 around each tooth. Remember, I brush at most 5X a week, no floss.

I have the worst fucking teeth imaginable - massive fillings, yellow, cracked enamel. Then again, I cut way down on carbs and sugar. Still, I recommend this stuff. It's fantastic for kids with braces - the crap just sloughs off.
24   WookieMan   2024 Feb 13, 6:11pm  

I don't get how people have so many ailments. I don't go to the doctor for anything. I did have a seizure recently, but it's that and I fractured a heel a couple years back, summer 2020. I don't take anything and eat and do what I want. I'm not 20 anymore, but I feel pretty damn good. No longer have any heart burn. Eat what I want. I'm at a decent weight for my age and activity.

I'm convinced fasting is the way to go health wise. I'm a white guy, but I just Ramadan it 365 days besides when I travel. If you think about it you don't see that many fat Muslims if any. I just don't think people need to eat as much as they do and then have to work out to burn it off. Seems counter intuitive. Almost every American could got 20-30 days without food and live. Just go 20 hours a day without it and pound whatever you want to eat.

Beer is my one vice, but it's light beer. I get a bit tanky at times, but I'm getting better. I don't do sugar so my teeth have been great. Not the whitest, but not disgusting and no cavities in my lifetime. Only other thing was a gall bladder and that was misdiagnosed by the doctors. Still pissed about that.
25   AD   2024 Feb 13, 6:30pm  

WookieMan says

I don't do sugar so my teeth have been great.


The big thing is to wash the mouth out at least with water and a little hydrogen peroxide. Try to get the water solution moving fast in the mouth to shake any food and sugar loose from the teeth and gums. Don't let the sugar settle on the teeth or gums for too long.

For me I'll brush once in morning and in the evening and use antiseptic mouth wash also.

.
26   stereotomy   2024 Feb 13, 7:04pm  

WookieMan says

I don't get how people have so many ailments. I don't go to the doctor for anything. I did have a seizure recently, but it's that and I fractured a heel a couple years back, summer 2020. I don't take anything and eat and do what I want. I'm not 20 anymore, but I feel pretty damn good. No longer have any heart burn. Eat what I want. I'm at a decent weight for my age and activity.

You're "only" 40. Things go downhill rapidly once you hit your 50's. Small wounds heal in weeks, not days. Your immune system goes to shit. Your body readily catabolizes or eats itself if you don't provide it sufficient nutrients.

Don't ever stop moving at least 1-2 hours a day once you hit the "golden years." Otherwise, your joints, tendons, ligaments, muscles will atrophy away until you're one of those "I've fallen and I can't get up!" peeps. It only takes a few years of inactivity, and BAM.
27   NuttBoxer   2024 Feb 14, 6:45am  

I see a slow down already in the 40's. But my immune system won't be going anywhere in 10 or 50 years. Preventative/healthy living. Plan on being one of those Arizona elderly I see still hitting the gym and trails at well into retirement.
28   WookieMan   2024 Feb 16, 8:25am  

NuttBoxer says

I see a slow down already in the 40's. But my immune system won't be going anywhere in 10 or 50 years. Preventative/healthy living. Plan on being one of those Arizona elderly I see still hitting the gym and trails at well into retirement.

I don't have a slow down so far. I'm athletic and can still beat a 25 year old athlete in almost any sport. I'm sore more so afterwards than at a younger age, but I still can perform pretty damn well. I'll be sore after activity for 2 days instead of 1 day though. So it's hard for me to do activities everyday. I did 3 days in a row in Montana with 2 big hikes and a snowboard session in the middle.

Feeling the age to an extent, but it's more recovery and not performance is my point. Pick a sport and I can likely beat anyone on this forum competing. I got a 4 miler coming up during spring break in FL. Ain't training today. Have some highs of 40-60ºF weather coming up here though. Need to get out and run.

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