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Serotonin has little if anything to do with Depression, New Meta-Study Finds


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by AmericanKulak   $0.14 total tips   💰tip   follow   2022 Jul 30, 1:07pm  

MUH CONSENSUS!!!

Last week, in a groundbreaking paper in the journal Molecular Psychiatry, authors Joanna Moncrieff and colleagues debunked the theory (or myth) of depression as a chemical imbalance of serotonin, concluding in their meta analysis of related scientific literature: “There is no evidence of a connection between reduced serotonin levels or activity and depression.”

https://www.sfexaminer.com/our_sections/now-that-the-serotonin-myth-is-over-will-a-new-age-of-depression-treatment-emerge/article_5be77a68-0cf2-11ed-9ea4-9ba7db1839ba.html

I imagine Big Pharma is having a shit fit right now! SSRIs = $$$

Or maybe, the patents have expired for most of the drugs.
1   richwicks   2022 Jul 30, 1:14pm  

AmericanKulak says

I imagine Big Pharma is having a shit fit right now! SSRIs = $$$


I don't think anything will change. The drugs will continue to be prescribed.
2   Tenpoundbass   2022 Jul 30, 1:32pm  

Basically we have a medical system, that is no better than blood letting and applying leaches.
I remember a time when I was in my 20's - 30's(late 80's through early 2000's) I was convinced that Cancer was all but cured.
Everyone I knew that got cancer beat it. It was rare to hear that the person died, usually because it was a very aggressive cancer in a sensitive place like Brain and Pancreas.
Everyone that caught it even in the 3rd stage, all fared better. As long as they caught it before it became stage 4. Both of my parents survived one or two cancer scares each.
Dad eventually died of Alzheimer, and my Mom died of a stroke a week after getting vaxxed last year.

But in the last ten years, every time someone says they got Cancer, past stage one, have ended up with grimmer and grimmer news. Most all of them have died.
My brother just died of Cancer earlier this month. Three weeks before they said it was stage 2, he said his Doctors were convinced they caught it early enough. He was cautious but not overly concerned. The Doctors treated it with a new Mononomial antibodies, they said they have had a lot of luck with it. He was on board and optimistic it would cure him. They said he he did nothing he had about 6 months to year. Three weeks later they said he had weeks to live. The treatment made his cancer more aggressive and it attacked and spread everywhere. The Doctors then told him, "Well sometimes it does this, but most of the time it works" they shrugged their shoulders and said. "I guess you're just one of those unlucky it doesn't work for."

They need to revisit what they were doing in the 90's they were more successful more often than today, that's for sure.
3   Robert Sproul   2022 Jul 30, 1:58pm  

Cancer is an industry, it is waaay too profitable to 'cure'.
4   latitude38   2022 Aug 1, 11:58pm  

The study is nothing groundbreaking or even new ,as there have been numberous studies saying essentially the same thing .There’s schools of thought that disagree with the serotonin imbalance theory just as many that would disagree . I’m sure they’ll be some that would agree w/ me ,that the use of SSRI’s can lead to violence ,aggressive behavior ,sucide and other personality disorders including the rash of mass killings associated w/people on psychotic anti-depressants .There maybe an equally amount of others that would disagree ,to those I point out the pictures of those that committed the mass-killings .These are not pictures of normal everyday people /kids .There is also a perspection when these studies come out ,that “Hey I don’t need these meds anymore I’m ok “ The problem w/ that is going cold turkey off these mess can lead to serotonin syndrome ,some just get sick ,others find they can’t deal w/ it a number of mass killers did just that or worse mixed it w/ street drugs and / or alcohol which completely changes their moods . Should Dr.’s or Psychologists be prescribing the drugs ? The study also doesn’t say what happens to a person w/ elevated serotonin levels ,or what happens if you reduce those levels .Many questions yet ti be answered
5   Ceffer   2022 Aug 2, 12:18am  

Maybe some mRNA will help.Tenpoundbass says


Basically we have a medical system, that is no better than blood letting and applying leaches.

Basically this is true for psychiatric medicine. Each patient is an ongoing experiment of cocktails that might or might not work for them, selected from a palette. Some busy shrinks and social worker types may just choose some blunderbuss. Some shrinks are more talented at directing medication, but it is hit and miss.

Of course, we know where Pharma is at: chronic medication for all for any hyped diagnosis or possibly apocryphal disease, with voodoo theories and justifications. Medication that leads to more medication is even better.
6   1337irr   2022 Aug 2, 2:51am  

Ceffer says

Maybe some mRNA will help.Tenpoundbass says



Basically we have a medical system, that is no better than blood letting and applying leaches.

Basically this is true for psychiatric medicine. Each patient is an ongoing experiment of cocktails that might or might not work for them, selected from a palette. Some busy shrinks and social worker types may just choose some blunderbuss. Some shrinks are more talented at directing medication, but it is hit and miss.

Of course, we know where Pharma is at: chronic medication for all for any hyped diagnosis or possibly apocryphal disease, with voodoo theories and justifications. Medication that leads to more medication is even better.

I disagree with that. Lithium works wonders!
7   Ceffer   2022 Aug 2, 3:16am  

1337irr says


I disagree with that. Lithium works wonders!

Not in all cases, even with indicated usage. Some people have bad side effects with lithium.

I attended a lecture given by a pretty well known psychiatrist talking about his various chemotherapies. I was certainly sympathetic with the difficult task he had with patients with extreme mental conditions. He was very clear, though, that there were not universal magic bullets and he had to assess and re-assess and change protocols with different patients and different medications to get somewhere with many of them. That is labor intensive for the psychiatrist, and becomes financially restrictive for a lot of people.

I got the distinct impressions that the psychotropics were like witches oils, and the psychiatrist was a kind of artisan with them, based mostly on observing the outcomes and changing protocols when necessary. What I am saying is that these medicaments need judgment and observation, not just an Rx pad and out the door.

I'm not claiming these medicaments are ineffective because I have friends and acquaintances who have done very well on antidepressants. My sister in law is manic depressive, but she also needed to change around, and lithium did not work well for her. She is mostly manic, an incredible chatter box.
8   WookieMan   2022 Aug 2, 4:18am  

Just don't take drugs. Kind of the opposite of what you should do when depressed is to take drugs. You need to figure out what is depressing you and solve the problem. Never become reliant on big Pharma. Ever. Unless it's provable that it helps keep you alive like an inhaler or asthma or insulin or non-fat diabetes. Depression is a mental state that is brought on by outside influences or what you're doing yourself.

Put this way, as a real estate analogy, it's the lender that gives you money to buy a house because you think that's going to make you happy. For some it works. Others will still end up in default and lose their home. Big Pharma is the lender promising you happiness through a home. If you were financially illiterate before meeting the lender, you'll foreclose. You need to figure out how to manage your money and not finance your way to happiness. That's what anti depressants are, a hope of happiness.

I've just started coming out of a 3 year funk. It was suggested I take pills for depression. I never felt depressed, was just insecure as I was mainly a stay at home dad with side gigs after a 15 year career and my wife started making bank, so didn't need to work. It was weird. This is an opinion, but depression is on the person who is labeled as depressed. Make changes. Own up to your flaws. You can't just throw pills at it. Life isn't the shit you see on a tv show or movie (stop watching). Make YOUR life what you want. And don't chase money (of course be responsible).

And yes, there are people with mental issues that do need meds. But most that take anti-depressants need to figure out their life and make changes. Go to the gym every morning and get your confidence up. Stick to a schedule. Meet with friends or family that are not destructive in your life. Go have a coffee, lunch or beer with them. Get OFF social media. Everyone showing their life looking fun is lying. One of my favorite photos of my family is at Mt. Hood, OR. My wife and I had gotten into a fight in the parking lot by a scenic overlook at the base of the mountain. We were so pissed at each other in that photo. It's the best photo of my family to so far. Regardless of what happened in that moment it makes me happy now.

I did make a big print of it to troll the wife though... lol. Probably not the smartest thing, but that's our personalities. It's also a kick ass photo. May post with faces blurred as I don't think the reverse photo searches would dox me. Jesus I'm rambling this morning..
9   Robert Sproul   2022 Aug 2, 6:44am  

WookieMan says

It was suggested I take pills for depression

My old analogy was going to a Doctor with a tack stuck in your ass and he prescribes you a pain killer. You should make every effort to pull that tack out first.
I have watched a couple of people come off of SSRI's and it was a nightmare, Paxil seems particularly bad. Doctors don't discuss that in the 15 minute appointment when they initiate this 'treatment'.
10   Robert Sproul   2022 Aug 2, 6:51am  

richwicks says

The drugs will continue to be prescribed.

The customers...err....patients, are still being advertised to and will continue to demand these drugs. At least 1/2 the women I know are on a psychotropic. That customer base isn't going anywhere.
11   joshuatrio   2022 Aug 2, 6:58am  

Anxiety/depression run pretty severely in my family and I have dealt with it off and on.

Drug wise, I tried low dose Prozac for 2 months, and had to quit taking it because it gave me severe insomnia. Later tried a low dose Paxil for about 4 months as well... Robert is right, coming off of it took about a week, and felt drunk during this time period.

I won't take meds ever again.

The best solution to date has been heavy lifting daily (not cardio), and to stay away from computer/phone screens as much as possible. After 5pm, everything is off in my house. To turn my mind off, I'll read 30-60 minutes before bed - paper books only. Supplement wise, I'll occasionally take a little bit of magnesium and taurine, or even gaba (amino acids) before bed if I need help shutting down.

Getting consistent rest seems to do wonders for mood and sound mind.

I agree with Wookie as well. Finding a sense of purpose and dealing with insecurity is huge. During the years of covid, I crushed it income wise, but then burnt out and quit everything, and spent a year traveling. The traveling was great, and I had to learn how to deal with the insecurity of not having my cash flow at the same level it was when I was working my ass off. Since then, I've reinvested into my business, bought a farm/animals, and picked up some consulting work. No idea what the future holds, but the older I get, the less I spend caring about the details.

Also, not having neighbors, and instead having a ton of green space (20+ acres) has been awesome as well.

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