patrick.net

Dont attack Ukraine, then will not need to beg for negotiations, main reason of which is to stall and rebuilt Russian army stronger and then attack again.

How exactly is "West tearing apart the CCCP"? They were safe in their internationally-recognized borders since 1991. I'm pretty sure they will be safe in their 1991 borders once again if they go home, pay reparations and extradite all war criminals who particupated in this illegal imperialistic war.

And I even agree with Macron that CCCP should be given security guarantees. The perfect approach would be give them the same security guarantees which were given to Ukraine, Belarus and Khazakhstan in 1994 in exchange to the same assets these 3 has given up. And the perfect place to sign it would be Budapest.

RWSGFY says

How exactly is "West tearing apart the CCCP"? They were safe in their internationally-recognized borders since 1991. I'm pretty sure they will be safe in their 1991 borders once again if they go home, pay reparations and extradite all war criminals who particupated in this illegal imperialistic war.

And I even agree with Macron that CCCP should be given security guarantees. The perfect approach would be give them the same security guarantees which were given to Ukraine, Belarus and Khazakhstan in 1994 in exchange to the same assets these 3 has given up. And the perfect place to sign it would be Budapest.

Yeah we know that Macron has strongly suggested both parties to come to the table with certain guarantees for Russia. Who has refused to come to the table?

mell says

Who has refused to come to the table?

The side which has 20 pct of territory occupied by Russia. Makes sense as they have been expelling aggressor from their territories lately.

Bd6r says

Dont attack Ukraine, then will not need to beg for negotiations, main reason of which is to stall and rebuilt Russian army stronger and then attack again.

BS. With this argument you can invade and finish pretty much every country in the world which has fought illegal wars, the US, North Korea, Kosovo, Turkey, Israel, Belarus, Germany, Italy, UK, Argentina, China, Iran, the whole Middle East, etc. They all are retreating now based on the currently negotiated contracts of the current world order and are just rebuilding their armies!! They will attack somewhere again!!! It's basically minority report applied to a whole country. You are advocating total defeat, regime change, followed by some sort of a Morgenthau plan for Russia to keep it weak?

Bd6r says

mell says

Who has refused to come to the table?

The side which has 20 pct of territory occupied by Russia. Makes sense as they have been expelling aggressor from their territories lately.

The future of these regions is unclear and obviously subject to negotiations. So come to the table and state your territorial demands, even if it is "give us 100% of the 20% back", without demanding regime change, instead of wasting other broke nations money and your own People's lives.

Bd6r says

Dont attack Ukraine, then will not need to beg for negotiations, main reason of which is to stall and rebuilt Russian army stronger and then attack again.

Again, for the umpteenth time, the US attacked Ukraine by overthrowing the government, and installing the puppet dictatorship which immediately led to civil war between east and west Ukraine.

The US tried to pull the same shit in Georgia and S. Ossetia. Why do you think Mikheil Saakashvili who started that conflict, became a war criminal wanted in Georgia and somehow ended up in Ukraine?

Fucking look at what is going on. If you won't even look at it, it will just continue while you spew nonsense propaganda about the situation. If we just got rid of the sociopaths, and fucking liars in our government, there wouldn't be this dumb fucking conflict. Just imagine if the US ACTUALLY DID deal with its own internal corruption, and ACTUALLY practiced free market economics, and ACTUALLY worked to make this a better nation. If we did this, it would be PERFECTLY reasonable, and moral, to spread this around to other nations.

But we don't. The US fucks up nation after nation after nation (and they may start out pretty fucked up), then rape the corpse of it once they've killed it. This is Neocon Zionist foreign policy, and it's a FUCKING DISASTER.

It seems silly to ask, but, how exactly is Ukraine a threat to the interests of the USA?

RayAmerica says

It seems silly to ask, but, how exactly is Ukraine a threat to the interests of the USA?

It's a threat to the international crime consortium of which the foreign occupied foreign city state of Washington DC is an inexorable component.

It's not a threat to the Republic, it is a threat to our criminal political class and occupiers.

richwicks says

Again, for the umpteenth time, the US attacked Ukraine by overthrowing the government,

You have no proofs of that.

mell says

. With this argument you can invade and finish pretty much every country in the world which has fought illegal wars, the US, North Korea, Kosovo, Turkey, Israel, Belarus, Germany, Italy, UK, Argentina, China, Iran, the whole Middle East, etc. They all are retreating now based on the currently negotiated contracts of the current world order and are just rebuilding their armies!! They will attack somewhere again!!! It's basically minority report applied to a whole country. You are advocating total defeat, regime change, followed by some sort of a Morgenthau plan for Russia to keep it weak?

No one will invade Russia as long as it has nukes. No one has invaded Russia since 1991.

What I or you advocate does not matter. What I think is that if Russia continues this war, there is a chance of an internal revolt, country splitting into 10 fiefdoms with nukes, followed by the Chinese taking over parts of Siberia which is not a good prospect yet entirely brought about by this war of aggression.

Bd6r says

richwicks says

Again, for the umpteenth time, the US attacked Ukraine by overthrowing the government,

You have no proofs of that.

Yes, we do. Jesus Christ. It is so stupid of people to deny this and tiresome. I have pointed this out NUMEROUS times, so I'll do it again.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MSxaa-67yGM#t=89

That is Victoria Nuland talking to Geoffrey Pyatt discussing who the next puppet of Ukraine is going to be. She picked Arseniy Yatseniuk. This was posted on February 4th, 2014 so the phone call was made either on that date, for before it.

Viktor Yanukovych was removed from power in Ukraine on February 22, 2014.

So, (at least) 18 days in advance Victoria Nuland was deciding on who should be the next leader of Ukraine, who happened to become the next leader of Ukraine once Yanukovych was removed from power.

This is the most obvious coup in all of history, because the entire thing was recorded before it happened, and published, before it happened.

@Bd6r - when people just deny reality it's irritating, because I don't know if they are really so fucking stupid that they believe the bullshit, or do you think I'm so fucking stupid I should believe your bullshit, which you know is bullshit? Stop insulting my intelligence. I'm sick and tired of people lying to my face, OR being so HORRIFICALLY uneducated about a situation that they can't do basic, simple research or can't seem to remember being corrected a 1/2 dozen times already.

The US OBVIOUSLY overthrew Ukraine, and if you can't see that, you're either pretending not to see it, or you're incredibly stupid and I don't think you're incredibly stupid. I think you're actively dishonest, and that's kind of disgusting and loathsome. Be a better person, try to use honesty for once. It's a shitload better and more commendable than being a propagandist for a bunch of Neocon mass murdering fuckers that are destroying this nation. You're denial of this, promotes war and death. Neocon fucks love that, why do you?

Ignorance is one thing, that's forgivable, but I don't think you're ignorant. I think you are actively lying to deceive people. Why would you do that? Are you just a piece of garbage, OR are you paid to lie to people? I'm FULLY aware of how common propaganda is on the net, and how it's literally everywhere.

richwicks says

That is Victoria Nuland talking to Geoffrey Pyatt discussing who the next puppet of Ukraine is going to be. She picked Arseniy Yatseniuk.

How do we know it is Nuland and not some impostor? There are no proofs.

Bd6r says

richwicks says

That is Victoria Nuland talking to Geoffrey Pyatt discussing who the next puppet of Ukraine is going to be. She picked Arseniy Yatseniuk.

How do we know it is Nuland and not some impostor? There are no proofs.

Because Victoria Nuland ADMITTED it was authentic, because this is the conversation that the media covered up with "Victoria Nuland said Fuck the EU!!! gasp - can you believe it??!?!?"

https://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-26079957

Here's her apology, apparently about the conversation you're not certain is real:

https://abcnews.go.com/blogs/headlines/2014/02/official-apologizes-for-f-k-eu-comment

For WEEKS all our propaganda "news" could talk about is that the cunt Victoria Nuland fuckbag used a bad word. That's all the PROPAGANDA outlets would talk about for fucking weeks, that she used a bad word! But they never mentioned what the conversation was about.

This is an authentic phone call. That fucking Neocon CUNT Nuland has admitted it.

I am tired, sick and tired, of people playing stupid about this. I'm tired of it. We have direct proof and an admission from Nuland, and you STILL lie about it. Stop it. Stop carrying water for these assholes that have created a war that is likely going to destroy Ukraine and is now hurting Europe. Quit being their bitch, please. Get some self respect.

If you have to prostrate yourself to a person or a group, don't do it to literal the scum of our government. That's what the Neocons are. They are the most degenerate group in this nation, and their leadership has destroyed this nation. Don't carry water for them.

richwicks says

?!?!?"

https://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-26079957

Here's her apology, apparently about the conversation you're not certain is real:

https://abcnews.go.com/blogs/headlines/2014/02/official-apologizes-for-f-k-eu-comment

We don't believe the news and journalwhores, do we? Does not matter if they are US, European, or Russian. Hence, proofs not real.

Bd6r says

We don't believe the news and journalwhores, do we? Does not matter if they are US, European, or Russian. Hence, proofs not real.

No, WE don't.

That's why I go to direct sources and provide them. I can find the videos of Victoria Nuland's talking about the conversation that was recorded:

https://youtu.be/L2XNN0Yt6D8?t=97

That woman is so fucking stupid, she doesn't realize that it's all digital. Of course the audio is clear, dumb bitch. This isn't 1970 any more.

You won't find a SINGLE fucking "news" source actually point out that in the conversation she, along with Geoffrey Pyatt were picking out the next leader of Ukraine. That's why you ignore "news" sources, because there's no fucking news in the west. just propaganda.

Most obvious blatant fucking coup in history, and YOU apparently can't seem to wrap your head around it. Are you in league with the prestitutes and whoreaspondants?

I don't have low standards of evidence and as a result I have come to realize something, our government lies constantly, and its media, is just public relations for it. I know the futility of trying to talk to a journalist to "correct" them. They aren't wrong, they are liars. They aren't making mistakes.

Let's see if you keep making this "mistake" that Ukraine had a revolution in 2014.... I bet you will.

Finally, after 10 months of getting their teeth kicked in on the battlefield the Red Army is ready to decide the whole thing once and for all!

Russia’s Lavrov issues ultimatum to Ukraine: ‘For your own good’
Russian Foreign Minister Sergey Lavrov has given Ukraine an ultimatum: Fulfil Moscow’s demands — including surrendering Ukrainian territory that Russia now controls — or the Russian army will decide the fate of Ukraine.

Speaking a day after Russian President Vladimir Putin once again said he was open to peace talks — and which the United States has described as disingenuous — Lavrov told Kyiv that it should, for its “own good”, comply with Moscow’s wishes.

“Our proposals for the demilitarization and denazification of the territories controlled by the regime, the elimination of threats to Russia’s security emanating from there, including our new lands, are well known to the enemy,” state news agency TASS quoted Lavrov as saying late on Monday.

“The point is simple: Fulfil them for your own good. Otherwise, the issue will be decided by the Russian army,” Lavrov said.

SURRENDER NOW OR WE'LL KEEP ADVANCING (to the rear)!

PS. Notice how Red navy and air force (THAT'S AIR AND SPACE FORCE YOU BOOB YOU!!!) are conspicuously absent from the list. Coming fresh on the heels of a third drone attack on their strategic bomber bases 600 miles deep into CCCP territory and the fire which finished off their one, only, first and last aircraft carrier.

richwicks says

That's why I go to direct sources and provide them. I can find the videos of Victoria Nuland's talking about the conversation that was recorded:

Its on youtube, which is under government control. Does not count as evidence.

It really looks like the Russians are on the backfoot. Logistics? ATGM teams trained? US Mercs?

By sheer weight of numbers the Russians should have conquered everything East of the Dneipr at bare minimum.

AmericanKulak says

It really looks like the Russians are on the backfoot. Logistics? ATGM teams trained? US Mercs?

By sheer weight of numbers the Russians should have conquered everything East of the Dneipr at bare minimum.

Incompetence + lack of motivation of Russian troops fighting in a different country ( supposedly the best troops are Doneck separatists because they are fighting in their own land) + 1980s Western armaments used by Ukr are better than 1980s Soviet armaments widely used by Russians.
There are relatively few foreign mercenaries in Ukr. Best ones are supposedly from Caucasus - Georgians, Chechens, etc with blood feud against Russians. Some Poles, Balts, Belorussians

According to the Western Press: the Ukrainians have been winning the conflict from day-1, the sanctions have paralyzed the Russian economy and Putin is going to be assassinated by someone within his regime any day now.

Bd6r says

richwicks says

That's why I go to direct sources and provide them. I can find the videos of Victoria Nuland's talking about the conversation that was recorded:

Its on youtube, which is under government control. Does not count as evidence.

Oh my God. I am not going to bother with you anymore.

You're right, they didn't post it to YouTube to blow the whistle, and they didn't post to multiple places, and people (like me) didn't download it, and it's not been posted to other sites on the same day, and google didn't delete it and get called out on their bullshit.

It's all fantasy, Victoria Nuland apologized for nothing, and you are free to lie and support war criminals and through deception and dishonesty to convince others to do the same.

You're a good person, with good moral character and you should be proud of your morality and you live with dignity...

richwicks says

You're a good person, with good moral character and you should be proud of your morality and you live with dignity...

Thank you!

I hope you took your prescribed medications on time.

I also hope that you hold your sources to the same high level you hold sources of others, eg nothing in media can be considered proofs, and neither can any videos on yotube or wikipedia information as everything there is planted by gubbermints. Of course, exception is made for information which aligns with your opinions.

Bd6r says

richwicks says

You're a good person, with good moral character and you should be proud of your morality and you live with dignity...

Thank you!

I hope you took your prescribed medications on time.

You have complete autonomy to be a liar, a deceiver, and a moral reprobate.

I realize and accept you will continue to lie, and I can't prevent it, but I did want to know if you sincerely didn't know, or if you were just moral garbage. My curiosity is satisfied.

richwicks says

My curiosity is satisfied.

You are welcome.

My curiosity as to your consistency of proofs from you relative to your demand of proofs from others has also been satisfied. Keep ignoring the inconvenient facts, your track record is absolutely miserable. Last one is claiming that media made up RFSWGs posted Medvedev predictions since this did not align with your political views.

Bd6r says

My curiosity as to your consistency of proofs from you relative to your demand of proofs from others has also been satisfied. Keep ignoring the inconvenient facts.

What inconvenient facts am I ignoring? Be specific.

This is just libel from you.

You're an extremely immortal person that actively and purposely distorts information to encourage people to support a war the United States began with the same stupid assholes that got us into every war for the last 20 years, and this one might be world war III.

If people knew the truth, this bloodshed would stop, but you deceive people and deny the truth, to ensure it continues.

Garbage human beings are everywhere though. I need to accept that.

richwicks says

What inconvenient facts am I ignoring? Be specific.

You said that Medvedev predictions posted by RSFWG were made up by journalusts/CIA. Can you find your post by using your search skills?
After that RSFWG posted the link from Medvedevs personal telegram channel where he says exactly what you said was made up by cia.
Is it ignoring or avoiding the inconvenient facts or not?

After we discuss this, I might provide some more from our earlier discussions.

P.S. Not sure if persons avoiding their medication regime should be given internet access freely.

Bd6r says

You said that Medvedev predictions posted by RSFWG were made up by journalusts/CIA.

I said it doesn't matter what some asshole in the government says and I was making fun of it. It's not worth paying attention to ANYTHING some asshole government twat says.

It's as likely to be CIA garbage as it is to be FSB garbage. I don't have to source it to know it's bullshit.

Our government does the same thing every time. Remember when the Iraq War was going to be done in a few months, and it would "pay for itself"? That was TWENTY YEARS ago, why would anybody consider anything a government goon says as important to note?

Bd6r says

Is it ignoring the inconvenient facts or not?

It is stupid, profoundly stupid, to listen to anybody in a government position. All they do is disseminate propaganda. That is every one of their statements. Inflation is temporary after all, if Biden is telling the truth, and he's not.

Bd6r says

After we discuss this. I might provide some more from our earlier discussions.

I honestly think it's a complete waste of time to converse with you. You're dishonest and I also consider you morally reprehensible because you're purposely dishonest. I feel dirty just talking to you.

richwicks says

I said it doesn't matter what some asshole in the government says and I was making fun of it. It's not worth paying attention to ANYTHING some asshole government twat says.

Not really. You are demonstrably lying aka being dishonest here. This is what you said:

What dumb assholes working at the propaganda division of the CIA falsified this prediction?

They need to be fired. Of course, the name isn't given, because it's fucking ludicrous and nobody would want to attach their name to it.

Sounds different from your re-interpretation above.

Really, be a little more honest about easily checked things.

We can also look at your earlier hits such as China never took territory from Russia after 1991, Crimea is 90+% ethnic Russian, Sevastopol is the only Russian port on Black sea, there were no Russian troops in Ukraine in 2014, Russia will not attack Ukraine, etc.

But that would be too tiresome so we can return to this tomorrow with fresh energy.

Bd6r says

What dumb assholes working at the propaganda division of the CIA falsified this prediction?

They need to be fired. Of course, the name isn't given, because it's fucking ludicrous and nobody would want to attach their name to it.

Sounds different from your re-interpretation above.

I also said:

richwicks says

You're a good person, with good moral character and you should be proud of your morality and you live with dignity...

Do I need to explain sarcasm to you?

Bd6r says

There are relatively few foreign mercenaries in Ukr.

How do you know?

richwicks says

You're an extremely immortal person

Like Dracula?

Bd6r says

P.S. Not sure if persons avoiding their medication regime should be given internet access freely

That's a personal attack.

Argue ideas backed with facts, links, and evidence.

Onvacation says

richwicks says

You're an extremely immortal person

Like Dracula?

Goddamned autocorrect.

Bd6r says

We can also look at your earlier hits such as China never took territory from Russia after 1991

Still can't find info on that. Do you have direct links beyond Google maps?

I did find an agreement:
https://www.reuters.com/article/us-china-russia-border/china-signs-border-demarcation-pact-with-russia-idUKPEK29238620080721
Is this what you meant?

Not exactly stealing to sign an agreement to end a border dispute. Wouldn't you agree?

Onvacation says

Bd6r says

We can also look at your earlier hits such as China never took territory from Russia after 1991

Still can't find info on that. Do you have direct links beyond Google maps?

I did find an agreement:
https://www.reuters.com/article/us-china-russia-border/china-signs-border-demarcation-pact-with-russia-idUKPEK29238620080721
Is this what you meant?

Not exactly stealing to sign an agreement to end a border dispute. Wouldn't you agree?

More importantly, this was settled in 2008.

The start of this is me saying that China didn't screw Russia over when the USSR broke up, and they didn't - at least that I know of, or ever heard of. Russia and China have had plenty of friction, they've even militarily engaged one another a few times, but they're primarily allied with one another, as long as the alliance works in both of their interests.

Imagine that, CHINA can actually act diplomatically, even when a foe that they've been fighting forever with, is down and they didn't kick them.

But the US took no time in beating the fuck out of Russia the second they got the chance. Just imagine what kind of world this would be if we didn't have a bunch of fucking Neocon nutcases in power in the 1990s? We could have entered a golden age.

Have any of you Zelinski dick suckers figured out yet, that Ukraine and its people are just a pawn in this globalist game? Zelinski will watch Ukraine's destruction from the Four Season's penthouse on CNN on Miami Beach.

Russia could have taken Kiev and much of the Ukraine in February (but maybe not Lvov). But it would cost too much to hold the territory. Once they realized that peace was hopeless, they pivoted to reinforcing Donbass and turning the ploy to drain Russia into an operation to drain the West.