patrick.net

We live in Sonoma and have looked closely at suburb locations around Santa Rosa and Petaluma and I have to agree, many of the older neighborhoods built in the 60's and 70's have a slum appearance and these older developments are generally next door to the newer developments of the 80's and 90's which still have a fresher appearance. These outlining suburbs have a transportation disadvantage given that country public transportation is poor and getting worse with the recession so automobile use and up keep significantly add to the living cost.

Newer developments with a "fresher" .... "appearance".

Those new neighborhoods sound a whole like the old ones that they share the same geography with.

The suburbs in So Cal are still in high demand primarily because of the better schools.

An "aging" development these days could be one that's less than 10 yrs old. Those are the developments built during the bubble. They have quite a few foreclosures, and owners who are underwater in the loan, plus the quality of construction is poor. The more of a housing boom you're in, the worse the quality. Shortcuts and defects, leaks, foundations that fail even within a couple of years sometimes, rising HOA fees controlled by the builder, unfinished roads, long commutes, and houses too big for most people to be able to afford to heat and cool. Recourse--legal or otherwise--is slim. Some are just walking away. Some builders walk away, too, leaving the land scraped bare to erode. There were early warnings about that stuff, too, but the industry responded with its usual denial and occasional frivolous SLAPP lawsuit to silence critics.

There are developments still trying to sell in my state that are at least an hour's drive from any job in the metro area. And there are very, very few jobs out there that far. Absolutely no builder claiming to be "green" should be building so far out that everyone has to drive an hour to work.

Yup, many newer developments particularly out in the burbs, ARE going to become slums. And even less green idea is that these shoddy, oversized homes where no one can find close-by work, will just end up abandoned and in a landfill. What a waste of lumber.

Drill baby drill!

High paid City Jobs? Who, when, where ?

You got to be kidding! Not around here!

lineup32 says

We live in Sonoma and have looked closely at suburb locations around Santa Rosa and Petaluma and I have to agree, many of the older neighborhoods built in the 60’s and 70’s have a slum appearance and these older developments are generally next door to the newer developments of the 80’s and 90’s which still have a fresher appearance.

When people left SF prime so San Mateo and Sonoma back inthe 50-60s, SF fell into a slum.
Walk down Mt Street in SF anyday and you pretty much see its still looks pretty bad. Burbs are still much better than the city.

"Walk down Mt Street in SF anyday and you pretty much see its still looks pretty bad. Burbs are still much better than the city."

Market Street has not been better. Embarcadero to Fifth Street (Bloomingdale) mall is totally walkable. Fifth Street to Vanness still has the Stripclub and some crazy people, but way less than it used to be. Orhpeum theater is right in the middle of it and there is a hotel bar and a pretty good nightclub in those 5 blocks or so, so totally fine as well. Between Vanness and Castro is walkable as well.

White Flight: guess where Bay Aryans are moving (note: cities with large enough populations have 2008 estimates).

This economist said in his testimony to Congress, which is in the link, that the oil shock in 2008 caused the economic collapse. Probably it was set up to happen anyway, but the high energy prices was the "last straw that broke the camel's back".

I always figured that those high commute costs were really just housing costs in disguise. But a lot of people did not see it that way, especially people who paid too much for houses that are too big that are located too far away; nor did the enablers who loaned them the mortgages: commute cost IS part of the housing cost for those who choose to buy homes out there in places like Fairfield or Brentwood or Hollister; but unlike if they were going to try to qualify for a more expensive home closer to work in the Bay Area, the commute cost was not figured in the PITI, so "you're in !"

The economist mentions this, that housing was more stressed further out than in the urban core.

Happy commutes.

http://www.econbrowser.com/archives/2009/05/Hamilton_JEC_2009_05_20.html

Of course, Marcus.

The biggest reservoir of untapped oil is the inefficiency and waste of drivers in places like the USA, Canada, Australia, etc.
We can consume half as much by leaving the SUV in the driveway and using the small car instead, by consolidating trips around town and by carpooling and vanpooling.

It will be more challenging when the purchasing power of our wages goes down versus China's, when China's demand for petrol rises at the same time.

SF ace says

Market Street has not been better. Embarcadero to Fifth Street (Bloomingdale) mall is totally walkable. Fifth Street to Vanness still has the Stripclub and some crazy people, but way less than it used to be. Orhpeum theater is right in the middle of it and there is a hotel bar and a pretty good nightclub in those 5 blocks or so, so totally fine as well. Between Vanness and Castro is walkable as well.

Compare that to the photos back in the 50s and 60s. You know what im talking about. Orhpeum theather smells like a sewer hole. There isnt anything charming about it at all.

thomas wong, the reason it smells like a sewer is because it is a sewer: in San Francisco, the storm drains that are vented at the curbs and some places under the sidewalks, are more than just the storm drain, they are also the sewers: in SF unlike San Jose, there is just one system. (In San Jose the storm drains run off into creeks).

I absolutely see the trend that urban core is becoming less slum while the suburbs, particularly far away suburb with crappy schools are attracting slums. I see it from two perspective. I live in the West Portal area of San Francisco, a white collar town traditionally, my neigbors are post office worker, IRS agent and even safeway cashier. However, the people who moved in the past 8 years are pretty safe bet 200K annual salary professionals with huge 401K and banked money.

On the other hand, I also own a home in Hercules for rental. It is not a bad town aestheically, close to the bay, golf course, natural trails and 25 miles to downtown San Francisco. 9 out of 10 rental applicants are pretty much paycheck to paycheck type with more debts than asset. The worst thing is the most vunerable also have to pay the most. For every 5 people who thinks your rent is too expensive, I have to turn down just as many who are simply too risky. That town has definitely gotten worse from people's perspective while SF has gotten better.

E-man says

Nomograph says

E-man says

this makes a case for drilling in the ANWR

You think that the worst oil spill and perhaps the largest ecological disaster in history makes a case for drilling in ANWR? Not sure about your logic there.

So you think drilling off-shore is better than drilling on land? My logic is that it’s much more controllable on land. If you have better option, I’m all ear.

The entire ANWR estimated oil reserves amounts to, best case scenario, less than 1 years oil for the US. A couple months supply worldwide. There is no way onshore drilling can produce more than a fraction of the oil needed at current consumption rates. The bulk of know oil reserves are now offshore.

Actually Canada's bitumen is an immense store of available hydrocarbons, and at $30/bbl recovery rate there's over 3,000X the oil that the Deepwater Horizon was going after, about 20 years of US consumption.

Only problem is you've got to burn half of it to get the other half . . .

We may have to put some nuke plants up there to assist in the processing.

SF ace says

However, the people who moved in the past 8 years are pretty safe bet 200K annual salary professionals with huge 401K and banked money

Kind of hard to swallow since many people dont walk around with their w-2 stamped on their head. Who and how much any one has in salary, savings, 401K isnt public information.

Barbagalata pretty much monopolize 94127. Buyers are mostly lawyers, bankers, mid level from salesforce pge mckesson and other professionals, all of which pay good salary and retirement.