patrick.net

Ethics courses are about as effective as Abstinence courses.

Waste of money.

You can't just unleash ethics on Realtors! It would be like that scene in Raiders of the Lost Ark when they open the Ark.

They know what they are doing is wrong, they don't care when dollar signs shine in their eyes. It's not lack of ethics courses, it's lack of morality in our nation.

Ethics courses are about as effective as Abstinence courses.

Waste of money.

You're right about ethics. You're wrong about abstinence courses.

Realtors need to disappear from the face of the earth.

APOCALYPSEFUCK says

It’s like giving dining room etiquette courses to Jeffrey Dahmer.
Sure, makes perfect sense!

Gosh, I want a text message every time you post a comment. :)

ha ha ha ha halol!

"Another thing I'm getting tired of is when after six policemen get arrested for sticking a floor lamp up some black guy's ass and ripping his intestines out, the police department announces they're going to have "sensitivity training"

I say "Hey, if you need special training to be told not to jam a large, cumbersome object up someone else's asshole, maybe you're too fucked up to be on the police force in the first place."

-George Carlin

lol classic

They take ethics courses because they become unethical involuntarily due to poor training.

I don't think it's involuntary. The nature of the realtor "profession" is to make money by manipulating emotions, hiding critical information, and getting people deeply into debt.

They're trained to do exactly those things.

I guess there was a bit of sarcasm in me when I made that statement. What I meant to say was these training courses act as if the agents WANT to do the right thing, and teaches them how. But the sad truth is that they know very well what their actions mean sometimes, and choose to do it for financial gain.

The nature of the realtor “profession” is to make money by manipulating emotions, hiding critical information, and getting people deeply into debt.

This is 100% truth right here. To quote the broker who taught my RE license course:

"Your job, before and after a contract has been ratified, is to keep your buyer in 'the bubble'. Keep them emotionally invested, but removed from the details [which you the valuable realtor are equipped to handle]. Don't let them out of that bubble, or it will complicate the transaction."

She was as non-subtle as she could be about how these piss-ant clients need to be kept in the dark. God forbid they use their brains and realize they're making a huge mistake. That might jeopardize their chances of obtaining the American Dream.

vain says

I guess there was a bit of sarcasm in me when I made that statement. What I meant to say was these training courses act as if the agents WANT to do the right thing, and teaches them how. But the sad truth is that they know very well what their actions mean sometimes, and choose to do it for financial gain.

The training classes are like a shield for realtors. For one, they can say that, like lawyers or brain surgeons, they spent time in class. Also, they're trained in how to BEND and break the rules. So when the state REB says its RE licensees cannot make financial recommendations or promise insinuate future profits from buying/owning, the future realtors are learning that these are things that nobody except realtors know, which can (and ultimately they'll learn SHOULD) be told over the phone or in person when nobody else is around. It's like telling a financial accountant or stock trader that inside trading is illegal. Code: don't do it openly, but it's the best way to succeed in your business. The difference is that the public knows that inside trading is illegal, and the public isn't exposed to those cockroaches like they are realtors.

This is why there really needs to be a public awareness campaign. If Patrick, Larry (IHB), and Morgan Spurlock joined forces, they could put together a very compelling message for the American public. Some sort of easily-consumable public message needs to be made available and entertainingly popular (in demand) so that some trusting young couple has another source of information besides their realtor when they go to buy their first house. I'm disappointed that Penn and Teller haven't highlighted NAR's utter bullshit on their show. It's one of the most expensive scams in existence, and it needs to be exposed.

APOCALYPSEFUCK says

This is as good an idea as training necrophiliacs to be undertakers.
Sure, makes perfect sense!

Realtor's response to required ethics training: Over my dead body!

Necrophiliacs, vampires, realtors; they’re all the same to me.

Edzakory says

vampires, realtors; they’re all the same to me

No they are not. Vampire kills you in minutes,realtors extend that to years and extend to other family members and the nation and beyond. :)

this is the most entertaining thread in a long time.

EncinoMan says

this is the most entertaining thread in a long time.

+1

hiding critical information

This is one of the biggest items. Realtor associations' statistics always show it's a good time to buy. MLS is meant to hide lots of information from buyers. What we need is likely a government-based alternative to MLS that's more like an exchange -- it should be a fully open market, and all bids should be open.

I want to do it myself, and I'm pretty sure I could -- if sellers would list their properties on Patrick.net.

But I'm pretty sure they won't, once they realize that I refuse to alter their past asking prices to hide failures to sell.

How could I make something really open that sellers would still want to use?

But I’m pretty sure they won’t, once they realize that I refuse to alter their past asking prices to hide failures to sell.

How could I make something really open that sellers would still want to use?

Well, with massive data of housing sites on the internets, this wouldn't be that hard to do with enough resources. Effectively with Google's caching (at least until realtors figure out the game), you can figure out some past prices of houses already. If, in real time, you pulled all sale prices from Zillow/Redfin/etc, you could do it, but it'd be a big endeavor. Someone with deep pockets like Google would have little trouble.

I think Zillow/Redfin/etc all prohibit large-scale scraping.

I want to do it myself, and I’m pretty sure I could — if sellers would list their properties on Patrick.net.
But I’m pretty sure they won’t, once they realize that I refuse to alter their past asking prices to hide failures to sell.
How could I make something really open that sellers would still want to use?

Only show their current asking price. If someone else wants to show their past asking prices, they can tap into your DB or track all the listings. Craigslist doesn't show past asking prices, but it's easy to track stuff that shows up repeatedly.

I think Zillow/Redfin/etc all prohibit large-scale scraping.

It could be done on a per-query basis too. For example, when someone inputs 1147 Sanders in Moraga, you could see what Zillow/Redfin and the massive number of MLS-repeating sites say.

OK, I'll only show the current asking price -- except in the case of people who have subscribed to my database for $7 per week. Those people can see the histories.

Most people won't subscribe, so maybe the sellers will be happy enough to list.

Now how should I go about asking sellers to list on Patrick.net? Maybe just give the latest ads free home page space?

Note that I will not get any commission on any sale. I just want the data: addresses, asking prices, dates, etc.

corntrollio says

I think Zillow/Redfin/etc all prohibit large-scale scraping.

It could be done on a per-query basis too. For example, when someone inputs 1147 Sanders in Moraga, you could see what Zillow/Redfin and the massive number of MLS-repeating sites say.

Hmmm, yes, maybe some kind of on-demand search.

I think Trulia is a scaping site - has old data + FSBO.

realtors along with flippers need to take ethics courses.