patrick.net

Housing is important because it has been established as the 'basis' of our economy for some years. The construction industries, the materials importers(rain forests, the laborers not getting paid, the landscaper ('entrepreneurs'), the real estate jobs for people who think getting dirty is beneath them, the advertising money (full page ads of house pictures), the roadbuilders, the municipalities being created out of bare land, the congressional redistricting, the police hired to patrol the school zones and home security companies to protect empty houses all day long.....etc.
Whether left, right or (ha) middle, most people see that housing is a picture of what America stands for (consumption).
This 'economy' is based on some pretty inane philosophy, and as such, it doesn't actually have any connection to reality (Malthusian physical needs). The result can only be an explosion of grand proportion, and everyone likes to watch stuff get blown up, regardless of how horrible the consequences (especially if it's 'someone else').
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5d5iIoCiI8g

I can see one tiny, teeny sliver of wisdom in Larry's post. I think that the rent/own issue is compelling without the strong political statements. I wonder if there would be a way of reaching a more politically conservative audience if the politics were more subtle. I have one right-wing, wing nut friend who is very well, irrational. I think she would miss the wisdom of the realestate posts because she would take one look at the political posts and leave.

She won't even watch CNN because she finds it to be too liberal. Ditto for the NY Times. It is like going into a cult to try to lead someone back to sanity. If you shock them right out of the gate, I worry that you can't reach them. You have to bring them back gently.

I wonder if the posts were more gentle, might it reach more people who need reaching. THat said, I find it hard to be as gentle as is palatable to people. That may be more of my issue than the site's issue. I pretty much agree with all of the politics that Patrick posts about lobbyists, wealth, taxes and home values.

The whole Doom thing had me worried. Glad to see the context for that comment.

larrypatrickmaloney says

If Patrick doesn't mend his ways, this site will not remain a haven for real estate watchers, and will pass away.

Cheers,

Larry

What are Larry's intentions, his impetus ?
I think he has a point. The name calling, the bitchfest is exhausting. But isn't that who we are ? Nobody wants to see a train wreck, but will we look away ?

With ongoing gubmint intervention, news of real property values will be boring for years to come.

Til then, Patrick's site will teach me allot !

You have done a good job with this site and you have made it possible to put out the truth to the best of your knowledge and that makes me put you in my good book.KEEP UP THE GOOD WORK!

Proof that the system is rigged - companies that spent the most on lobbying have returned 400X the S&P 500.

From the economist:
http://www.economist.com/node/21531014

The question is, do you just complain about it, try to change it, or buy companies in this index so you get your slice too?

I have to agree with Larry. I have been following this site since the start and used to always link to it as RE bible for the sheep who thought house prices only go up. Unfortunately as time goes on RE news is getting fewer while leftist propaganda increases.

I find myself frequenting here less and less. Traffic down since 2008? You are turning off a huge chunck of your potential readers.

the email subscribers to the links went from nothing to about 9,000 per day.

I can't speak for everyone, but one day I all of a sudden started getting your emails every morning. Did you auto-subscribe everyone with a patrick.net account? Cause I didn't sign-up. That would account for your spike.

joshuatrio says

Patrick - you could be on your way to having the same type of fan base/similar site as drudgereport, or similar high traffic news sites where people come for certain types of news.

What makes your site way better is that you have the link submission section. Not to mention, you can't stand realtards.

LOL, really?

That is impossible.

Drudge gets the following stats:

VISITS TO DRUDGE 10/14/11

031,887,754 IN PAST 24 HOURS
899,882,340 IN PAST 31 DAYS
10,014,063,001 IN PAST YEAR

Good luck with that.

the fact is, political topics generate traffic, and heated discussions. I've seen even on other non-political forums I visit.

Larry, if you don't agree with how the website is run, feel free to GTFO like you threatened to do many times. Don't let the door hit you on the way out.

Patrick

you saved my ass. If it weren't for this site I'd be 200K underwater or in foreclosure.

post kittens playing the friggin piano for all I care.

gregpfielding says

It isn't conservatism or liberalism that is screwing everything up. It's corporatism.

Truth be told.

They get the bailouts, we get the bill for it.

After a 10% chance real estate will fall another 50%, and new steady housing and tax policies are put in place where the housing sector can stabilize and grow over the next 50 years, then there will be no need for patrick.net and it will dissolve.

FortWayne says

gregpfielding says

It isn't conservatism or liberalism that is screwing everything up. It's corporatism.

Fort Wayne; by george, I think you've got it. This is the 'capitalism' definition Wall Street and DC uses. For everyone else, if your investments or business fail, tough luck. For Wall Street, win or lose, they win. The cards are stacked against the 90%. Oh, and as far as breaking laws? What laws. The Democrats and Republicans give all the corporate law breakers a get out of jail free card, (not that they were ever IN jail) PLUS a free pass GO and collect 2 Billion from the middle class taxpayer card. Not a bad deal I'd say. I think some Americans are finally waking up to this reality which has been in place for 30 years now. Slow learners on the short bus.

Truth be told.

They get the bailouts, we get the bill for it.

Quality Auto Repair Since 1979

Nicely done Patrick. :)

Friday's posting has little, if any politically charged articles. Virtually all articles focus on real estate, which is what this site was created for.

Thank you for listening, and nice job. :)

Larry

corntrollio says

If you're going to make comments like that, you just might be stupid.

Typical response from an immature, socially inept moron. Please read Patrick's comments where is able to keep the discussion on the points and not resort to name calling (as I so inappropriately engaged you in above).

It's so funny. Those with that have liberal leaning (or however you would like to define it) tendencies are so quick to anger when ANYONE disagrees with anything they have to say, or has a point counter to their dogmatic agenda. .

Patrick, I understand your point about healthcare costs being too high, but you have to consider what it takes to become a board certified physician in this country, in this litigious day and age. Without that, those not in the field will perpetually think that physicians are driving up costs without considering that a pedicle screw from Synthes costs $1500, or that one zofran ODT costs $100 (ie exorbitant), or that insurance companies siphon money away from the entire system (doctors and patients alike). Doctors salaries have gone down precipitously over the last 20 years, to no fault but our own, but trust me, the last people whose salaries you want to go down are physicians. Without us healthcare doesn't work, and the best and brightest will cease to choose a profession in which 13 years of sacrifice are required. Not including the hundreds of thousands of dollars of debt almost all saddled with after.

Common Sense Citizen says

Typical response from an immature, socially inept moron. Please read Patrick's comments where is able to keep the discussion on the points and not resort to name calling (as I so inappropriately engaged you in above).

It's so funny. Those with that have liberal leaning (or however you would like to define it) tendencies are so quick to anger when ANYONE disagrees with anything they have to say, or has a point counter to their dogmatic agenda. .

Saying a particular comment might indicate you're stupid is actually not name-calling. As I've stated numerous times, I don't subscribe to any particular ideology, and I'd posit that pointing out that a comment is probably less than intelligent is not usually considered "anger."

But the point is that more than 50 Senators (including the Republican who let it get voted out of committee) and more than half of the House of Representatives agreed with me, whereas the most clever thing you can think of is saying "B. Hussein." No dogma here -- read my posts.

Common Sense Citizen says

Like I said I'm not left or right.

You're also a liar.

Common Sense Citizen says

what it takes to become a board certified physician in this country, in this litigious day and age.

By the way, your description of healthcare as being "litigious" is ridiculous nonsense perpetuated by ideologues and has already been debunked here by me and others. Which of course you'd know if you were actually a bona fide forum dweller here, rather than an interloper trying to sling mud and spew talking points.

Read my posts on this thread: http://patrick.net/?p=1058722

Why does the Right feel so besieged? As far as I can tell, they've won every major policy victory in my lifetime.

They've held the White House more often than the Democrats, and when we do get a Democrat he was a DLC triangulator, a fancy word for Republican--victory for them again. (Coincidentally, the only Democrat re-elected since FDR). Democrats can win the Presidency, and the houses of Congress, but "centrist" DINOs prevent real change. They can lose the House and be stifled by the ruthless tea-illiterati--one caucus in one branch--victory again.

Not content to stop moderate policy (preciously their own legislative goals, like HCR), they attempt to kill the already-decimated unions and go after a woman's right to medical treatment. They discourage the youth vote and suppress minority turnout. They installed regulators and Fed Chairmen who believe that markets self-regulate, and that the best Government is one that destroys itself.

So, you've won--congratulations. But with your policies come some negative consequences--like the rotten economy we're in. And despite their dominance, they'd have you believe it's the Democrat's fault. It's Barney Frank's fault. Weird worldview, that's for sure.

In this climate, the truth would indeed seem liberal since the dominant conservative answers have been and continue to be so, so wrong.

I say, keep telling the truth Patrick! Reality has a liberal bias!

Larry, you are pathetic.

You probably think Occupy Wall St. is wrong.

CL-
The right feels besieged because they are constant whiners.
Absolutely NO integrity.
Take Larry for instance, trying to mute the person that created this site.

Common Sense Citizen says

ust the other day you posted a link about how doctors make "too much money". Really? That should be on a real estate blogging website coming from someone who has zero idea about what goes into being a doctor or the sacrifices

Doc, sounds like you gotta make your own website to share your truisms about how physicians are underpaid, how NOBODY wanted Obama care, etc. Go for it!

I don't not read Patrick.net anymore, I just read it a lot less since the left wing evangelical slant started. I'm politically agnostic.

Patrick seems not to notice we have a Democratic controlled government. Anyone who buys that the left wing is "for the people" is delusional.

I have a lot of sympathy for views from both the Tea Party AND the OWS movement. It is sad to see people getting sucked into talking points as if they are facts. I have had friends recently post Facebook messages seriously comparing Obama to Jesus Christ.

I used to read this place. But the California leftist lunatics (the freaks that are like Jerry Moonbeam Union Brown breaking this state from the 5th largest economy to dire straits, total default and total insolvency and chasing away all business) took over and its barely worth looking at. It only gets a skim at this point. The namesake for this website went from a Ron Paulish type to a Big Central Government Stalinist in like a years time.

Buster says

FortWayne says

gregpfielding says

It isn't conservatism or liberalism that is screwing everything up. It's corporatism.
...
Truth be told.
...

I'll go along with that. It's no longer about Republican versus Democrat -- it's about citizens versus politicians. And, the politicians have been working too closely with Wall Street.

As for Patrick's site, I've been reading it on and off (for years?) for the real estate information. Over the last few months, I too have found it increasingly addressing other unrelated issues with lead-ins that increasingly reflect Patrick's political views. If I want that, I'll go to HuffPost on the left or DrudgeReport on the right.

What had been good about Patrick.net was that it/he was addressing an area that reflected corporatism at work, and it could attract those on the left and the right trying to diagnose the misinformation in the mainstream media to perpetuate the corporatism. Perhaps Patrick can branch out to other areas where the mainstream media blindly parrots the politicians and Wall Street. But, like it/he did in the past, I'd find it more useful if it/he stuck to the facts and maybe occasional reasoned argument rather than ideology, gut feelings or "solutions" to political problems that are presented as the only viable options.

Mick Russom says

I used to read this place. But the California leftist lunatics (the freaks that are like Jerry Moonbeam Union Brown breaking this state from the 5th largest economy to dire straits, total default and total insolvency and chasing away all business) took over and its barely worth looking at. It only gets a skim at this point. The namesake for this website went from a Ron Paulish type to a Big Central Government Stalinist in like a years time.

Yes although stalinist may be a bit harsh :-/

Perhaps We Agree says

As for Patrick's site, I've been reading it on and off (for years?) for the real estate information. Over the last few months, I too have found it increasingly addressing other unrelated issues with lead-ins that increasingly reflect Patrick's political views. If I want that, I'll go to HuffPost on the left or DrudgeReport on the right.

What had been good about Patrick.net was that it/he was addressing an area that reflected corporatism at work, and it could attract those on the left and the right trying to diagnose the misinformation in the mainstream media to perpetuate the corporatism. Perhaps Patrick can branch out to other areas where the mainstream media blindly parrots the politicians and Wall Street. But, like it/he did in the past, I'd find it more useful if it/he stuck to the facts and maybe occasional reasoned argument rather than ideology, gut feelings or "solutions" to political problems that are presented as the only viable options.

This, but better put than I was communicating.

Doc, sounds like you gotta make your own website to share your truisms about how physicians are underpaid, how NOBODY wanted Obama care, etc. Go for it!

I might. I think the general population should be more educated on what it takes to be a doctor then maybe I wouldn't need to explain why doctors are underpaid. Who do you want being compensated well for their services? Financiers? Government? Athletes? Movie stars? Celebrities? Investment bankers? Common sense.

Oh and by the way, I just saw this on Doctor Housing Bubble blog in the comments section by Laura Louzader, without any provocation.

http://www.doctorhousingbubble.com/twin-bubbles-housing-higher-education-student-load-debt-college-debt-pricing-out-first-time-buyers/

"But even if you are attending medical school at a top school, you can easily ruin your life by accumulating debt in order to do it. A medical education, for example, costs about $250K, added to the cost of your undergrad degree. You can easily end up with a balance of $400,000 to pay. It is easy to see that even with an income of $200,000 a year or more, that this will be a massive debt to pay and will mean you won’t be able get the benefit of your paycheck, because a third of it will be committed to paying off debt that, if everything goes right, you won’t be able to pay off until you’re in your late 40s. The payments will be at least $2000 a month, subject to changes in interest rates, and you will have to make that payment in addition to your housing expense, your car, your medical insurance, your food, and whatever else you might have in mind to spend your money on. And we’re talking about a high-paying profession?"

Ditto, Mick is an asshole by definition.

I think the poster above put it best by pointing out that the right has won every battle they have waged over the last 30 years and have gotten EVERYTHING that they wished even with Democratic support. We are now living the consequences of 30 years of right wing rule. Now all we see in folks such as the tea party is how big of a victim they can pretend to be. It would be amusing to watch if it weren't so sad and pathetic. They are only victims of themselves.

For those of you here who don't wish to look at objective truths, there is always Fox news. For all others who are genuinely trying to get a grasp on what is happening in the real world this is a great forum.

Say, what if I put some new piece of cheesecake on the home page each day? Just to get attention from the men at least, and lower the bounce rate. Actually, I've read that women also prefer to look at good-looking women:

Oh, friend. You would lose me forever. Don't do it. Don't break my heart. Don't you have any daughters? The problems of objectifying women are so many. Value us for our intellect, for our character. Don't glamorize our bodies in the absence of the rest of our existence. At the VERY LEAST. And I mean very least, put some half dressed man up there, too.

What other image would instantly grab the attention of someone who glances at the page?

Hey Patrick ! Larry is right. It is as if you designed the obsolescence.
Several (3 to 30) years from now, when real property values begin appreciating, prospective buyers will no longer google "housing bubble" to find Patrick's enlightening information.
What escapes Larry, is the gubmint imputed rules pertaining to home values. Solving that crisis involves diagnosing the interference. Separating one from the other is a love / hate relationship. Can't talk real estate without involving gubmint.
OR, CAN WE ?

I imagine one website were ALL people go down a list of line items on a daily, weekly, maybe quarterly basis.

#1. NEVER TOO BIG TO FAIL - vote yes or no
#2. CAMPAIGN CONTRIBUTIONS ARE DISTRIBUTED EQUALLY - vote yes or no
#3. CONGRESS RECEIVES SAME SOCIAL SECURITY BENEFITS - vote yes or no
#4. WOMEN CARRY THE BEER - vote yes or no

Animated picture of some kind that reflects the content of your ideas! I am not much of a designer, but I would look at the charts that are most often posted here about the price of houses overtime. Look at the most compelling ideas and think of what images they inspire. Ask your wife and children to help you design it. Make it something that reflects who you are and what you believe in.

Ideas:
Something that shows a banker taking food out of the mouth of a child.
A banker reclining comfortably in luxury perched on top of 99 people toiling and suffering.
A graphic of houses on fire as the slide down the housing graph.

Part of what I love about your site is the no bullshit layout. You don't need pretty pictures to get my attention. Your ideas and ethics win my attention.

You could post porn on the front page and get a lot of attention, but you don't want to be that guy.

Marching Cadence > Left Right Left

WHEN I WAS BORN MY DADDY LEFT! left, right, left.
LATER ON MY MOMMA LEFT! left, right, left.
I GOT DEPLOYED MY WOMAN LEFT! left, right, left.
THE ARMY THE ONLY THING THAT'S LEFT! left, right, left.
COME ON! left, right, left.
LOUDER! left, right, left.
COVER! left, right, left.
AGAIN! left, right, left.

Obviously they can figure out they have 2 feet. It doesn't look really complicated. However it tends to make the people that are normal. Feel real fuckin' dizzy.

Or another words if you assign limitless mental capicity. To people that don't really have it. You should either:

A. Walk away or give up - recommended
B. Hang around and get curious. Possibly being nice and polite
like your mother might be. Then you might because of the
repetitive world they have to live in (see above cadence)
Shift your brain down 5 gears to slow up and catch them
Then you might possibly get in line (gee that march does
look cool after all) and start singing the cadence. The only
thing that does not give away the cadence is: they don't have DUH at the end
of left, right left. Cute trick it's simple enough.

bg says

Animated picture of some kind that reflects the content of your ideas!

OK, I'd love an animated picture of a house on fire. Any graphic artists out there?

And it would be a very interesting experiment to put the image in and check the bounce rate, take it out, check it again.

I was thinking about what I said. In truth, I don't really know you. I should have said that isn't who I want you to be. I am just guessing about the rest of it. Maybe your wife would be behind the cheesecake pictures. I am just thinking that there are eye-catching pictures that reflect your ideas. That seems much better to me for such a intellectually well informed site.

OK, I'd love an animated picture of a house on fire. Any graphic artists out there?

And it would be a very interesting experiment to put the image in and check the bounce rate, take it out, check it again.

LIKE!!!

What other image would instantly grab the attention of someone who glances at the page?

boobs work

Bap33 says

boobs work

Depends on your audience and your goal!

This site has an outhouse on fire, says they're free.

Patrick,
I think your website is great, and your taste in women is fantastic. I say, include more cheesecake, and more left of center links!