patrick.net

Mild stretching is good. I agree that most people don't stretch correctly and probably harm themselves in the process.

treatmentreport says

I am not criticizing the scientific method. What I am saying is that if 40% of the medical studies are biased, then doctors should not rely on them to give medical advise.

Perhaps, but 100% of "evidence" provided by chiropractors, acupuncturists, homeopathic doctors, astrologers, etc. is bias. Yes, I agree that they should not be relying on that evidence to provide advice, medical or otherwise.

OK, maybe 100% was a little harsh as they do sometimes cite actual scientific studies. So, it is more like 98% biased information.

WAIT! no, it is 100% bias, because they only pick the studies that supported their preconceived notions and ignore anything contrary.

leo707,

please read some of the research that John has done http://med.stanford.edu/profiles/John_Ioannidis before you hyperbole the argument back to homeopaths.

treatmentreport says

Homeboy,

I am not criticizing the scientific method. What I am saying is that if 40% of the medical studies are biased, then doctors should not rely on them to give medical advise. Bias is many times intentional to get the desired results.

That makes no sense. Of course you are criticizing the scientific method. You just claimed that 40% of medical studies are wrong and that doctors should ignore them.

Again I will ask you: If not scientific studies, then what? How do you propose people should obtain knowledge about medicine, without using scientific studies?

treatmentreport says

Mild stretching is good

I don't stretch, and I have never had to visit a chiropractor. You stretch, and you have had to visit chiropractors multiple times. What is your evidence for believing stretching is good?

I think most suck for many reasons, most of which have been discussed above. The good ones will not claim to be able to cure the common cold, do not pressure you to visit them on a regular basis, spend a substantial amount of time with their patients, and recommend other methods - - - yoga, pilates, swimming, etc. Unfortunately, the good ones are hard to find.

There are plenty of crappy "real" doctors out there too. My brother is an anesthesiologist, and he says he wouldn't let some of the surgeons he works with anywhere near him if he needed surgery.

Homeboy says

I don't stretch, and I have never had to visit a chiropractor. You stretch, and you have had to visit chiropractors multiple times. What is your evidence for believing stretching is good?

Stretching is good because if FEELS good to do it. What more "evidence" do you need than what your body is telling you? Have you never stretched in the morning after waking up? It feels great to stretch! It is a natural, human thing to do. Everyone stretches! Animals stretch. You feel less tense after stretching. You feel more relaxed.

This is one of the many issues with Allopathic or western medicine: It promotes the disconnection of the mind from the body, such that you get people who don't stretch, and actually believe that stretching hurts you. Unbelievable.

Indiana Jones says

Stretching is good because if FEELS good to do it. What more "evidence" do you need than what your body is telling you?

It feels good to fart, but it wouldn't make me any healthier to pump air up my ass all day just so I can fart more. Doing stretches beyond what your body naturally does when you have been immobile for a long period does NOT feel good. You have just convinced yourself that it does because a long time ago someone came up with a theory that you would injure muscles if you didn't stretch them first. Problem is, there is zero evidence to support that theory.

Have you never stretched in the morning after waking up? It feels great to stretch! It is a natural, human thing to do. Everyone stretches! Animals stretch. You feel less tense after stretching. You feel more relaxed.

This is one of the many issues with Allopathic or western medicine: It promotes the disconnection of the mind from the body, such that you get people who don't stretch, and actually believe that stretching hurts you. Unbelievable.

This is the problem I have with the "alternative medicine" crowd. You can't discuss anything without throwing in jargon and nonsense talking points you memorized.

I said stretching CAN hurt you, and treatment report agreed, so that's 2 opinions against your one. Studies have shown that stretching doesn't do any good, and can cause harm if done wrong. What's your basis for your belief that stretching makes you healthier? Because you "feel" that it does? Sounds more like religion than medicine.

Homeboy says

Again I will ask you: If not scientific studies, then what? How do you propose people should obtain knowledge about medicine, without using scientific studies?

Look up Model-Based Inquiry as a step in the right direction away from the traditional Scientific Method.

Indiana Jones says

Homeboy says

Again I will ask you: If not scientific studies, then what? How do you propose people should obtain knowledge about medicine, without using scientific studies?

Look up Model-Based Inquiry as a step in the right direction away from the traditional Scientific Method.

I didn't ask you. Also, if you have a point to make, then make it. I'm not going to "look up" anything for you.

Homeboy says

Studies have shown that stretching doesn't do any good, and can cause harm if done wrong. What's your basis for your belief that stretching makes you healthier? Because you "feel" that it does? Sounds more like religion than medicine.

How is feeling something in my body religious? This is a very practical matter. Stretching (when I find time to do it), helps my body to feel better. This is based on my own, direct experience and awareness of what makes my body feel better, or worse.

Maybe stretching for you makes your body feel worse. That is your personal experience. This does not mean that for anyone else, stretching in itself is a "waste of time", or that if you stretch, this means you will need to go see a chiropractor.

Homeboy says

I didn't ask you. Also, if you have a point to make, then make it. I'm not going to "look up" anything for you.

I didn't write that for your benefit.

Indiana Jones says

This does not mean that for anyone else, stretching in itself is a "waste of time", or that if you stretch, this means you will need to go see a chiropractor.

Strawman. I did not stretching will make you need to see a chiroprator. You twisted my words around.

Two people here suggested that it is healthy for EVERYONE to stretch. Therefore, it is contingent on those making the claim to support it with evidence. The fact that something makes you "feel good" does not mean it is making you healthier. Eating ice cream makes me feel good, but if I did it constantly it could have a bad effect on my health.

Besides, I don't believe that stretching intrinsically makes people "feel good"; Perhaps it does for you, or perhaps you have convinced yourself that it does because you want to believe that. Either way, it doesn't make it true for everyone.

Indiana Jones says

I didn't write that for your benefit.

You quoted me and responded directly. If you want to play games, please go somewhere else.

Homeboy says

You quoted me and responded directly. If you want to play games, please go somewhere else.

This is no game. This is a very public forum. All comments will be read by many others. In some instances I am responding directly to you as you are also directing your comments to me. Other times, it is just general information for anyone to read. I sometimes quote a comment to help others to link the line of thought. Many of the posts on this forum are not directed toward anyone in particular.

Indiana Jones says

This is no game. This is a very public forum. All comments will be read by many others. In some instances I am responding directly to you as you are also directing your comments to me. Other times, it is just general information for anyone to read. I sometimes quote a comment to help others to link the line of thought. Many of the posts on this forum are not directed toward anyone in particular.

Dodging my question, I see. Nice chatting with you. *yawn*

robertoaribas says

failed studies provide important statistical infomation, and hiding them is tantamount to research fraud. ALL accuratly performed studies should have to have their results entered into a database, so that as a scientific society we could have the best information.

Absolutely. Studies should be repeated, and if the results cannot be duplicated, those conclusions should be discarded. If researchers are not correctly following the scientific method, we should strive to correct that. But under no circumstances should we discard science altogether and subscribe to non-scientific , so called "alternative" belief systems.